How old is this gun and can I shoot it?

[fotoguzzi]

My son Joey (23) is really into guns and hunting.. he inherited a nice Rem 11-87 3" 30"barrel from my Dad.calls it the"cannon" and it is!
 so I'm going to buy him a rifled barrel and take him on his first deer hunt (shotgun zone).
we may hunt the rifle zone but learning to get close is part of the experience so slug it is..
I have not killed a deer since he was a baby... the two older kids didn't eat the meat..

this will be a good bonding trip somewhere in Minnesota.. (If any of you have some private land we'd love to kill a buck there, send PM) location yet to be determined, my dad owns swamp land in the corn belt near SD, they come out of there tasty! but it's a long drive from Duluth..
So, If I get out there on another stand I better have a license and gun or for sure a 20 point buck will walk right past me..
I'll use a rifled slug in this heirloom if it can shoot..













assuming I can get 16Ga slugs..
how old is it?

[Toystoretom]

That is cool.. I would have a gunsmith check it out. It may be so old it can't use smokeless powder shells, only black powder. Be safe and hang it above the fire place and buy a new shotgun. I have what is called a Zulu rifle and there is a U Tube vid of a guy firing one, he has a plexiglass shield, a face shield, and is firing it remotely from behind a little bunker and that thing is still sketchy as hell. Mine is never gonna get fired

There should be some proof marks on there, probably under the wood, that will give you a clue as to the age. You may have to Google the proof marks to identify them. There also may be some sort of serial number you can check to see what the date of manufacture was. Anything before about 1900 -1905 and it needs black powder.

[Farmer Dan]

Stevens wasn't very good with tracking serial numbers even when they did remember to use them.  The model 94A was made between 1937 to 1984 under the Stevens name and Savage.  Not a black powder gun.  If your using it for deer I would use 00 buck shot, a slug would ruin to much of the meat.  As long as it locks up tight and not rusted you should be ok to shoot it, make sure the safety still works.  Shotguns don't have the high chamber pressures that you see in rifles or hand guns.  Good luck hunting and be safe.

[akhileshb@hotmail.com]

I wouldn't shot a slug through an old gun like that.
Be very careful.
Get a modern shotgun. Just my 2 cents.
 

[rodekyll]

Somewhere it should have a choke marking.  With a 30" barrel it would probably be either full or modified choke, neither of which is a good bore for slugs.  It's not chambered for modern (3" - 3-1/2") non-lead shells.  The barrel length makes it particularly sucky.  With a 30" barrel what you've got there is an antique duck/goose gun that can't shoot a legal fowling load in any federally governed or migratory bird-frequented area.  That configuration plus the age makes it the wrong tool for any modern job.  It is however a nice piece of history, both family and firearm.

$0.02

The firearm you choose should match the terrain, cover, and distances for the size game you're targeting.  You wouldn't bring a scoped .308 for brush hunting nor a shotgun for open-rangeland longshots.  So I'd start my choosing by studying on the country I'm planning to hunt.

[wymple]

I actually have the very same gun. And in 16 gauge. Only takes a 2-3/4 inch shell. All I've ever shot with it is a couple of possums that were raiding the dog food. I see no way to tell when it was made. I have never shot a slug thru it, and I don't know if it's open choke. Kicks hard. Things tend to loosen up after a shot or 2, lol. It might be worth a hundred, I wouldn't bet on it. Some kid has put a weird paint job on the stock & forearm. I consider it a conversation piece, but a heavy shot size wouldn't scare me any. I'd hunt with it if I weren't going to be pulling the trigger too many times.

[Sasquatch Jim]

  That one says 16 gauge stamped into it.  ZThat alone tells that even though it used smokeless powder, it isn't designed for moder shotgunloads.  You may even have problems locating ammo for it.  If you hand load, don't go for the max pressure loads, stay with the more modest ones.  16 gauge  ammo is almost a collector item so if you find it the price may be high.

[rocker59]

Buck Shot for the Stevens. Should be fine for deer. Was a time when 2-3/4" shells is all there was. 

[fotoguzzi]

it's not legal to use buckshot here.. I'll have a gunsmith look at it.. plenty of 16g ammo available on line, slugs too..

I'm spending the money on his Remington slug barrel so won't be buying another gun for me, I don't need to shoot a deer Joey does, just thought I should be prepared to shoot one if a big buck walks right past me.

[not-fishing]

Look into borrowing a shotgun.  Heck I have 5 extra that could be used for deer and the slugs to go with them.  My family doesn't sell their guns we just hand them down.

Of course you can't use shotgun on deer here in California.

[charlie b]

For your stated purpose then I'd just use it.

If it is labeled as full choke then just get some buckshot for it.  If labeled Modified or Improved Cylinder then you could get away with slugs.

PS if you can find them, use the Brenneke slugs.

[Tobit]

I wouldn't pursue a rifled barrel or slugs, or rifled slugs with that piece.  16 gauge shells are available via Cabela's online but they're very difficult to find locally in any form.

My son inherited his Godfather's Remington 870 Wingmaster in 16 gauge.  I don't recall the barrel length or choke, but we've run a few #7 and 00 buckshot through it. 

If it were me I'd keep yours as it is and try it for dove or turkey and go with a newer shotgun or 30/30 carbine for stalking deer.  My son also has a .243 Mauser American with the dreaded straight pull action that is actually a fine white-tail tack driver.

Good luck on your hunt.  Nothing like father son time in the woods or fields.  Here's my Joe last year.  In a cypruss swamp, tree stand and blind.  He's partial to using my Winchester 30/30.





Tobit

[Lannis]

My son Joey (23) is really into guns and hunting.. he inherited a nice Rem 11-87 3" 30"barrel from my Dad.calls it the"cannon" and it is!
 so I'm going to buy him a rifled barrel and take him on his first deer hunt (shotgun zone).
we may hunt the rifle zone but learning to get close is part of the experience so slug it is..
I have not killed a deer since he was a baby... the two older kids didn't eat the meat..

this will be a good bonding trip somewhere in Minnesota.. (If any of you have some private land we'd love to kill a buck there, send PM) location yet to be determined, my dad owns swamp land in the corn belt near SD, they come out of there tasty! but it's a long drive from Duluth..
So, If I get out there on another stand I better have a license and gun or for sure a 20 point buck will walk right past me..
I'll use a rifled slug in this heirloom if it can shoot..













assuming I can get 16Ga slugs..
how old is it?

"Stevens Arms" rather than "J. Stevens Arms and Tool Co." on the sideplate dates it post 1916.   

I have my grandfather's 12 gauge Model 335 side-by-side "J. Steven Arms and Tool Co." patent March 1907 (so sometime pre-1916) .     My grandfather used it from the 1920s to 1960s for unnumbered ducks and geese on Chesapeake Bay, and it's been in continuous use ever since.    The standard Stevens chokes for doubles of that era were right full, left modified.

We've shot everything through it, no problem.   Sometimes we use it just because it was Grandad's gun, not because it's the best for the job.  YMMV!

Lannis

[mjptexas]

My son Joey (23) is really into guns and hunting.. he inherited a nice Rem 11-87 3" 30"barrel from my Dad.calls it the"cannon" and it is!
 




assuming I can get 16Ga slugs..
how old is it?

Most guns did not have serial numbers prior to 1968 when the Gun Control Act was enacted.

Stevens started putting letters on their guns (the 'A' after the 94 above) in 1949 so well into the smokeless powder era.  If the gun is in good condition (locks up tight, etc.) there shouldn't be an issue shooting it with standard loads. 

They made a gazillion of these guns so parts are readily available.  I don't know if a rifled barrel is available, however rifled slugs are still available:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/413280/remington-slugger-ammunition-16-gauge-2-3-4-4-5-oz-rifled-slug-box-of-5?cm_vc=ProductFinding

I had a 410 gauge version as a kid, handed down from my Dad.  Between the two of us we shot it so much that I'm sure the bore choke went from Full to Cylinder.  I bet we put well over a 100,000 rounds through it between the two of us.

[rocker59]

it's not legal to use buckshot here.. 

That's strange.

As mentioned, if it's a full choke barrel, you don't want to run slugs through it.

Otherwise many, many deer have been taken with guns like that. 

No reason you can't use it.  The deer won't know the difference.

[rboe]

Got my only deer just outside Duluth when I lived on North Fischer Road off of Jean Duluth Road. 50 yards with a scoped 25-06. Hit a grouse a couple months earlier, iron sights, .22 pistol at 75 yards. If you want to ruin meat, the 25-06 is your gun. 

That was many moons ago so I have no idea where to send you other than to look for large meadows with attached woods. Never saw deer at deer camps (took my deer in the back yard before classes - was going to UMD at the time - there was a ten aches cleared field popular with deer).

I think western Minnesota is your best bet, but a long drive from Duluth.

[steven c]

 Cool I have the same in a 20 gage, it was my grandfathers.

[fotoguzzi]

under butt plate I found numbers, wouldn't it be simple if 5/2'37 was the build date?



no choke info on the barrel under the wood tho..

seeing my gun man tomorrow with it.

[Lannis]

....seeing my gun man tomorrow with it.

Best idea on this whole thread!

[krglorioso]

Tobit:  Octagon barrel on the Winchester 94 your son is holding?  I have one on my Winchester 1890 .22 pump action, mfg 1906.  Classy, but kinda heavy.

Ralph

[vf84pc]

I am from upstate NY and just recently rifle became legal and my county is shotgun only. That gun was made after WWII. Looking at it I would say 60's to 80's  the wood screams 76+ and being it is a 16 gauge it should be a modified choke. Look near the chamber on the barrel you should see a marking: imp,mod or ful that will tell you what choke the barrel is.  That gun was a budget model sold by Sears,Kmart, Woolworths, etc. starting in September they could not keep them in stock. Back then people owned one gun and kept it for a lifetime and hunted everything with it.  Typically they choked 20 Guage in improved cylinder (small game) 16 Guage in Modified (Pheasant and birds) and 12 Guage in full for duck and goose. both those guns are smooth bore so you want to shoot a "rifled Slug" they are made by Remington or Federal those are the most common. I doubt you will find 16g at Walmart or Dicks you will most likely need to order those online. Test those guns out for range an accuracy I think the Stevens will be about 70 yards Young eyes with a Remington will be about 100. Try different slugs My Ithaca 37. Did not like Remington slugs but is great with Federal. It is much more of a challenge to hunt with a double barrel or a single shot so be prepared. Those guns are very safe my first shotgun is a Stevens break action (single shot) full choke 20 gauge I have taken more deer with that than any of my other guns. I still have my grandfathers Stevens bolt action 20 gauge modified choke from the 1930's.

[sign216]

Tobit:  Octagon barrel on the Winchester 94 your son is holding?  I have one on my Winchester 1890 .22 pump action, mfg 1906.  Classy, but kinda heavy.

Ralph

I've got my grandfather's Winchester 1890 pump, octagon barrel.  It is quality through and through.  Hard to get that level of bluing, polish, and mechanics today.  It's chambered in .22 long.  Not 22 long rifle, but just long.  As a youth in rural Kentucky I remember going to the hardware store and getting bullets, no questions asked.

[Lannis]

....Kmart....

Kresge's, back then ..... 

Lannis

[fotoguzzi]

my guy can't see any reason not to use it as a slug gun.. does not have a full choke, he aid IC.. so got some slugs at Fleet Farm, Federal 16GA 2 3/4in 4/5OZ Maximum rifled slug HP.. sound OK? for a try out..

My guy says use Brenneke 16 Gauge 2-3/4" 1 oz Lead Rifled Slug so I'll get that on line..

[rodekyll]

If he says IC and other wise good to go, then we won't disagree.   

The big difference between the Federal and the Brennake is the hollow point.  That's what makes the Federal lighter.  Which you use is a matter of preference -- a chunk of lead the size of either of those will drop whatever you've got inside of 50yd.  This is a limited distance proposition.  Max practical range ~80yd.  Young, lucky eyes maybe 110yd.

Good luck with it, and please post a pic.

[Tobit]

Tobit:  Octagon barrel on the Winchester 94 your son is holding?  I have one on my Winchester 1890 .22 pump action, mfg 1906.  Classy, but kinda heavy.

Ralph

Yep.  Dad bought it for me in '67.  It's the Canadian Centennial model with the maple leaf engraving and "Canadian Centenial" on the breech.  They're a maligned commemorative with a sloppy action but it's a darn fine brush gun.  It has put a lot of deer in the freezer.

Just like this one.

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Winchester-Model-Canadian-Centennial/1424604.uts

Tobit

[charlie b]

Yep, follow his advice, Brenneke slug.  I won't use anything else with a smoothbore.

[rodekyll]

Yep.  Dad bought it for me in '67.  It's the Canadian Centennial model with the maple leaf engraving and "Canadian Centenial" on the breech.  They're a maligned commemorative with a sloppy action but it's a darn fine brush gun.  It has put a lot of deer in the freezer.

Just like this one.

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Winchester-Model-Canadian-Centennial/1424604.uts

Tobit

Lever guns are sloppy by design.  My Winchester '94 is a perfect example of the most Rube Goldberg way of getting a hunk of lead from here to there.  I had a roommate once spend all night in a drunk trying to describe just how a model '94 functions.  In the end we decided it was the helicopter of firearms.  With all those moving parts there's gonna be slop. 

My Ruger '96, another lever actor, has among the fewest moving parts of any repeating rifle.  It's also very sloppy.  I can stitch a happy face in paper @100yd with either.

[fotoguzzi]

Kids about ready


opening day is next Sat.

[fotoguzzi]

plus a good omen, I saw an albino deer today.. sorry but the iphone was the only cam in hand.