BMW new small bike

[Chuck in Indiana]

Do you think maybe he is just not as talented a rider as you and couldn`t keep of up with your near MotoGP star like speeds?

Gotta agree. No offense to you small block guys.. I'm one of them.. but small block handling is not in the same league as a duck. That said, it's not the name on the hammer, it's the guy swinging it. 

[Kev m]

Do you think maybe he is just not as talented a rider as you and couldn`t keep of up with your near MotoGP star like speeds?

I thought maybe that post would draw you out to troll.

The primary point was, once again, that 99% of riders don't use up the capability of their bikes on the streets, ESPECIALLY the "sportbikes".

Secondary point was in support for bikes of this category, even if I don't particularly care for the looks of the BMW, but I'm sure functionally it will be a great tool.

That was all.

Now back under your bridge. 

[oldbike54]

I thought maybe that post would draw you out to troll.

The primary point was, once again, that 99% of riders don't use up the capability of their bikes on the streets, ESPECIALLY the "sportbikes".

Secondary point was in support for bikes of this category, even if I don't particularly care for the looks of the BMW, but I'm sure functionally it will be a great tool.

That was all.


Now back under your bridge. 

 Was going to comment that if I had been on that Ducati ...

  Dusty

[jcctx]

Was going to comment that if I had been on that Ducati ...

  Dusty

Hey, I was going to remark that I was a 1%er; albeit, the slowest 1%!!! Can't outrun anybody, despite what davedel says!!!!

[canuguzzi]

Good, bad or ugly, at least BMW did something and they will sell them. There is do and there is talk, they did.

Someone who gets into that small BMW is a good candidate to upsell later on. It takes sales to provide revenue so that improvements can be made. Some companies figure it out, some do not.

[Kev m]

Was going to comment that if I had been on that Ducati ...

  Dusty

I'd have purposely ridden through a patch of sand around the first corner... 

[Randown]

Guys, the Indian market is HUGE...

Oh, REGIONAL Indian.
 

[oldbike54]

Oh, REGIONAL Indian.
 

 I dunno , we do pretty good selling Indian trinkets to tourists here in Oklahoma , although unfortunately , most are now made in that other India  Geez that Colombo guy was lost 

  Dusty

[Lannis]

There is a well developed infrastructure in India to build quality  bikes.

I'm sure that's true, but up to now we haven't seen anything but low-quality, bottom-of-the-barrel, lowest-price-possible products from India, whether it be Bajaj scooters, Mahindra tractors or ... well, we won't say anything about the cars because NO ONE in the USA would put up with it.

Part of the problem is the quality specification that American retailers give to Indian manufacturers.   It's generally a three-part quality spec.   

1) Must be made as cheaply as possible.
2) Must be the lowest-cost item possible.
3) Must cost fewer dollars than any other source.

Nothing about finish, nothing about metallurgy, nothing about durability, nothing about function.   And that's generally what we get.

If Indian manufacturers can realize that Americans are not Indians, and are not desperate for the lowest-cost item they can get even if it takes a local blacksmith to keep it going, but realize that they are competing against the Japanese and Europeans for sales, then I'm sure that they can "get their minds right", put a quality product on the market, and get on with it!!

Lannis

[jas67]

I dunno , we do pretty good selling Indian trinkets to tourists here in Oklahoma , although unfortunately , most are now made in that other India  Geez that Colombo guy was lost

  Dusty

This guy?

[oldbike54]

[quotee   author=jas67 link=topic=80029.msg1259620#msg1259620 date=1447346554]
This guy?

[/quote]

 

 Even with only one eye , that Columbo guy never got as lost as the other Columbus  "Aw hell , just call it India, no one will ever know the difference" 

  Dusty

[Kentktk]

I thought maybe that post would draw you out to troll.

The primary point was, once again, that 99% of riders don't use up the capability of their bikes on the streets, ESPECIALLY the "sportbikes".

Secondary point was in support for bikes of this category, even if I don't particularly care for the looks of the BMW, but I'm sure functionally it will be a great tool.

That was all.
But you had to disrespect another rider you know nothing about to get your point across. 

Now back under your bridge. 

[Kev m]

But you had to disrespect another rider you know nothing about to get your point across.

And in your mind the disrespect was where exactly?

Because I was quicker than him on a stretch of road?
Because I waited for him?
Because I anonymously took some pleasure that my slower, less modern bike was quicker that day?

Perhaps you'd not jump to such silly conclusions if you had all the facts.

He came up behind me FAST and got closer than I'd typically expect a stranger. So much do that I sped up about 10 mph faster than I usually take that road. But I ALSO moved over to the right 1/3 of the lane in case he wanted to pass on the long straights. He didn't. I just maintained that pace once we hit the curves and it became evident he wasn't going to pass.

When he caught up after I stopped we chatted for a few minutes. I told him what a nice bike he had and he excitedly remarked how he rarely sees another Italian bike in the area other than a black and silver V7 with stripes and a fairing. I told him that was likely Cam. He mentioned he uses Ferracci as a dealership but doesn't like them. He was unaware of Eurosports in Coopersburg and said he would check them out (good since he was thinking about trading the Monster in a Multistrada).

No disrespect was shown except what you seem anxious to find.

 

[Rough Edge racing]

The primary point was, once again, that 99% of riders don't use up the capability of their bikes on the streets, ESPECIALLY the "sportbikes".

 That statement is also true of most cars , 4x4's and the millions of 3/4 and one ton pick up trucks that  primarily are transportation for just the driver...
 In America power is King....

[Aaron D.]

Thread drift alert, my apologies... I have yet to see a single Royal Enfield Continental GT on the road. Anyone else?

On second thought, no need to respond. Just making an observation.

We have quite a few around here in Massachusetts. It actually makes sense here along with the other Enfield models-lots of small twisty roads, mostly short hops for anyone out sport touring for a day.

[Kev m]

That statement is also true of most cars , 4x4's and the millions of 3/4 and one ton pick up trucks that  primarily are transportation for just the driver...
 In America power is King....

True, and that's fine. I'm not telling anyone what to buy.

Ironically I just had to decide between a 4x4 (Wrangler/Colorado/Taco) and a Sporty car (STI, Focus RS).

Neither set was top dogs in power, though the cars were up there.

The trucks seemed practical, but I figured I just don't use a pickup enough.

So I went with the fun option. Though it WILL see some off-road use (OBX beaches, Wharton Forest trails) it will primarily be a "Mall Crawler" which is why I went for the nice interior and toys, and not the electronically locking front and rear diffs.

[Cam3512]

And in your mind the disrespect was where exactly?

Because I was quicker than him on a stretch of road?
Because I waited for him?
Because I anonymously took some pleasure that my slower, less modern bike was quicker that day?

Perhaps you'd not jump to such silly conclusions if you had all the facts.

He came up behind me FAST and got closer than I'd typically expect a stranger. So much do that I sped up about 10 mph faster than I usually take that road. But I ALSO moved over to the right 1/3 of the lane in case he wanted to pass on the long straights. He didn't. I just maintained that pace once we hit the curves and it became evident he wasn't going to pass.

When he caught up after I stopped we chatted for a few minutes. I told him what a nice bike he had and he excitedly remarked how he rarely sees another Italian bike in the area other than a black and silver V7 with stripes and a fairing. I told him that was likely Cam. He mentioned he uses Ferracci as a dealership but doesn't like them. He was unaware of Eurosports in Coopersburg and said he would check them out (good since he was thinking about trading the Monster in a Multistrada).

No disrespect was shown except what you seem anxious to find.

 

Funny.  If his Duc was white, I saw him ride by at 532/563 while I was finishing up a ride with a buddy on his new R1200RT.  I was on the Ambo at the time, so we must have crossed paths before.

[Rough Edge racing]

True, and that's fine. I'm not telling anyone what to buy.

Ironically I just had to decide between a 4x4 (Wrangler/Colorado/Taco) and a Sporty car (STI, Focus RS).

Neither set was top dogs in power, though the cars were up there.

The trucks seemed practical, but I figured I just don't use a pickup enough.

So I went with the fun option. Though it WILL see some off-road use (OBX beaches, Wharton Forest trails) it will primarily be a "Mall Crawler" which is why I went for the nice interior and toys, and not the electronically locking front and rear diffs.

So you got the Jeep?   Now you need to jack up that puppy and get some big noisy tires    On bikes I like something that can accelerate briskly without full throttle and rowing through the gears.

[Kev m]

Funny.  If his Duc was white, I saw him ride by at 532/563 while I was finishing up a ride with a buddy on his new R1200RT.  I was on the Ambo at the time, so we must have crossed paths before.

Actually black with red frame. But I picked him up not far from there crossing 72 on Savoy, heading for the quarry. I was turning onto Savoy from 72 going that same direction and he crossed after me. He was on my butt till the turns at the quarry, and then again right after the stop sign, but after that he quickly disappeared for a bit.

So you got the Jeep?   Now you need to jack up that puppy and get some big noisy tires    On bikes I like something that can accelerate briskly without full throttle and rowing through the gears.

Well, it's on the assembly line. Should be here in a few more weeks.

I at least went for the 3.73 gearing and LSD rear (and of course the 6-speed, despite reports of it being antiquated).

So it should do a decent job stock, which it will stay for a while.

I get the rush of accelerating without excessive rowing. But I also like using a higher percentage of the vehicle than not (especially a bike) if that makes any sense.

It's actually part of my decision to forgoe the RS - 350 hp, AWD, with a drift mode... I'd probably get myself in trouble with that.

[oldbike54]

 Well dang , was really hoping Kev had purchased the Taco , although my understanding is that the new ones aren't built in Mexico , the plant was moved to Texas   

  Dusty

[Kev m]

Well dang , was really hoping Kev had purchased the Taco , although my understanding is that the new ones aren't built in Mexico , the plant was moved to Texas   

  Dusty

That new Taco is pretty damn nice. Have you seen it's crawl control feature? It can dig itself out of sand up to both axles. The wheels turn slowly building up sand underneath them, it's freaky.

I thought they've been made in the US for a long time.

I actually keep a spreadsheet tracking my lifetime of vehicle purchases, $ spent on domestic/domestically built products vs. imports. Separate categories for cars and bikes.

The numbers in both categories are slightly higher on domestic products. But I'm at a pivotal point in my life where the next purchase of each will sway the numbers heavily that direction, so maybe it's good I didn't go with the STI.

If I had to predict though, the bike totals will sway the other way in the next few years.

[akhileshb@hotmail.com]

I'm sure that's true, but up to now we haven't seen anything but low-quality, bottom-of-the-barrel, lowest-price-possible products from India, whether it be Bajaj scooters, Mahindra tractors or ... well, we won't say anything about the cars because NO ONE in the USA would put up with it.

Part of the problem is the quality specification that American retailers give to Indian manufacturers.   It's generally a three-part quality spec.   

1) Must be made as cheaply as possible.
2) Must be the lowest-cost item possible.
3) Must cost fewer dollars than any other source.

Nothing about finish, nothing about metallurgy, nothing about durability, nothing about function.   And that's generally what we get.

If Indian manufacturers can realize that Americans are not Indians, and are not desperate for the lowest-cost item they can get even if it takes a local blacksmith to keep it going, but realize that they are competing against the Japanese and Europeans for sales, then I'm sure that they can "get their minds right", put a quality product on the market, and get on with it!!

Lannis

Yes, what you are saying makes sense if you look at the Indian manufacturing sector up to 2005. It has come a long way since.
Rajeev Bajaj, who I went to school with, stopped making scooters several years ago, all they make now are motorcycles.
Indian made cars and motorcycles use state of the art tooling, machining and metals. They are now exported all over the world. The manufacturing there is now world class.

Indian "roads" and horrendous traffic put a strain on bikes and cars that you cannot believe. They only build small cars and bikes, because of traffic conditions and gas prices across the world markets where they export. The cars and bikes they build there would not be practical on our highways with our higher speeds.

Also as I said before, I don't think the USA motorcycle market (which is shrinking BTW) matters to anyone in  India or even in Europe. The Indian manufacturers are not going to build big bikes just for a few hundred in sales every year.
Thankfully, Honda, Suzuki and Kawasaki do build big bikes because they have a tradition from the 1960-s. they have invested in the tooling. I doubt if any new venture can survive building only big bikes (and by big I mean over 500 cc).
 
Mahindra tractors sell all over the world too now, including here in the good ole USA.
You can buy them in Oklahoma. Lots of farmers here use them.
Regarding your comment that Americans are not Indians (contrary to what Columbus thought  )  and that Indians should try to figure out what Americans want, I have the following observation. I have lived in the USA more than half my life, and I regret to say that we need to get off our high horse and come to terms that we don't matter as much anymore in the world as we did say 20 years ago. All the growth in the worlds economy is in Asia and Africa.
 

[Rough Edge racing]

That new Taco is pretty damn nice. Have you seen it's crawl control feature? It can dig itself out of sand up to both axles. The wheels turn slowly building up sand underneath them, it's freaky.

 That is freaky..does it also turn the steering wheels slowly side to side using the front axle castor to raise and lower the vehicle to shift the weight? 
   

[oldbike54]

 Akilesh states , "Even in Oklahoma" , where even the Indians approve of Mahindra  Yeah , we have a couple of India Enfields here in Muskogee , and the local farmers own Mahindra tractors in fair numbers . We are still waiting on that $2K TATA however 

  Dusty

[Kev m]

That is freaky..does it also turn the steering wheels slowly side to side using the front axle castor to raise and lower the vehicle to shift the weight? 
 

Nope, just uses extremely fine wheel speed control. See for yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19BNRvuNLWE

At 1:40 he puts it in 2WD to bury the rear.
Then at 2:30 he pits it back in 4WD to bury the front.
THEN at 2:50 he activates crawl control, takes his foot off the accelerator and brake and gives control to the ECM, then the truck digs itself out.

[akhileshb@hotmail.com]

Akilesh states , "Even in Oklahoma" , where even the Indians approve of Mahindra  Yeah , we have a couple of India Enfields here in Muskogee , and the local farmers own Mahindra tractors in fair numbers . We are still waiting on that $2K TATA however 

  Dusty

Dusty, Yeah the TATA Nano costs more than $2k even in India. I think it costs around $5k. it is a very low end vehicle.
Would be useless here.
 

[oldbike54]

Dusty, Yeah the TATA Nano costs more than $2k even in India. I think it costs around $5k. it is a very low end vehicle.
Would be useless here.
 

 Kind of an Indian version of the Le Car  Still , for $5K ...maybe they could be sold at Tractor Supply .

  Dusty

[Triple Jim]

Nope, just uses extremely fine wheel speed control. See for yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19BNRvuNLWE

At 1:40 he puts it in 2WD to bury the rear.
Then at 2:30 he pits it back in 4WD to bury the front.
THEN at 2:50 he activates crawl control, takes his foot off the accelerator and brake and gives control to the ECM, then the truck digs itself out.

I'd like to see what it can do on level ground.  He got it stuck on a steep sandy uphill slope, and got it unstuck in the downhill direction, using the hill to help.  I do agree that careful, slow and steady turning of all four wheels is a great ability, but that demo was somewhat bogus.

[Kev m]

I'd like to see what it can do on level ground.  He got it stuck on a steep sandy uphill slope, and got it unstuck in the downhill direction, using the hill to help.  I do agree that careful, slow and steady turning of all four wheels is a great ability, but that demo was somewhat bogus.

True, it did help him back out at the very end. But you saw the video, it dug itself straight up and off the axles first, and THAT had nothing to do with the slope. I still think it could be pretty impressive.

Actually I think my buddy with the house (we use) in the OBX dunes should get one (he was thinking of replacing his old dune vehicle anyway).

[Rough Edge racing]

 A skilled driver using low range can do the same thing..Need to use that in mud to really test it..The key is a skilled driver and too many want to do the act without taking the time to learn...But it's still an interesting feature and a great sales gimmick...