New V9 Moto Guzzi Roamer love/hate fest

[bpreynolds]

I'll take one.  Either one.  Doesn't matter.

[LongRanger]

The Guzzi will cost you less.

[Clancy]

Caption Contest:

"If only they'd used the V7 tank"

[mjptexas]

We have to be getting close to a station that sells something besides E15.

[ohiorider]

Caption Contest:"If only they had started with the Bellagio."

That would have been nice!

Bob

[canuguzzi]

Caption contest:

(Pushing it)
"I wanted a boner, they gave me a Roamer"

Or:

Why is it that they never listen, I said Stoner nor Roamer.

[ohiorider]

For your regular rider I absolutely think it's fine.  For me, well I need more testing.  It's not even remotely a "grave" concern with me and my 2015 (wet alternator?) but after addressing the tire issue (were over inflated - my fault) it's the closest thing to a concern I've had.  But as stated, I need more and better testing to see. 

On my Deal's Gap trip I started off with a fully charged battery.  I used my GPS the whole trip and the heated gear (jacket liner and attached gloves) only in mornings during the 3 days there and then only at about 1/2 to 3/4 power on dial, followed usually by lots of riding while not running it.  BUT.  BUT I SAY.  I was also stopping, taking pictures, restarting the bike sometimes 15 or more times in a day and sometimes only a mile or two or three between stops (so possibly no chance for the bike to get recharged between many of the stops until the end of the day that usually found me riding continuously for 30, 45 minutes to an hour).  At night temps dropped while the bike was outside with no charger.  On the way back to Louisville I ran the heated gear at 2/3 power and GPS as well for the majority of the 300 plus miles home and that was interstate driving at 75-85 the whole way.  Because of the latter, I expected to get back to the house, put the bike on the charger, and it barely need much time there.  Instead, it took a full 3 hours or more to get back to charged.  This surprised me A LITTLE.  But lots and lots and lots of factors here that would certainly not warrant any sort of serious concern.  AND, just to test this a bit I ran the GPS and heated gear (at 2/3) for my 17 mile commute to work and back yesterday.  Getting home I plugged the bike into the charger and the battery was more than fine, taking only about 20 minutes to get back to flashing green even.

280W is about what my old airhead alternator outputs, though that isn't at 3000rpm, but higher.  OTOH, I'm  running (cannot recall for sure) either a 24 or 26ah battery.  No issues, but if I'm doing a lot of starts and stops, and riding in slow traffic, I always put the old gal on the charger when I get home.  Sometimes the charger lite goes to green in a matter of minutes, other times quite longer.  The large battery gives me a higher level of confidence when I'm running heated vest and grips.  There are a couple of charging system upgrades for the old GS, but I've been ok with 280W (max) for 25 years, so I'll stick with a known entity.

[Sasquatch Jim]

  Old Bummer airheads always had problems keeping the battery fully charged ever since the rule that required headlights be on in the daytime.  It took Bummer a while to upgrade for that.

[ohiorider]

  Old Bummer airheads always had problems keeping the battery fully charged ever since the rule that required headlights be on in the daytime.  It took Bummer a while to upgrade for that.

Sas Jim - I think part of the issue went back to when BMW was racing the R90S, and due to crankshaft flex, the alternator rotor was actually rubbing the field windings.  So, in their wisdom, BMW decided to increase the space between the rotor and the field windings (on all their bikes) with the result being that the alternators wouldn't charge very well at lower rpm.  At least, that's the way I remember the story, from sometime in the last century!

Bob

[oldbike54]

Sas Jim - I think part of the issue went back to when BMW was racing the R90S, and due to crankshaft flex, the alternator rotor was actually rubbing the field windings.  So, in their wisdom, BMW decided to increase the space between the rotor and the field windings (on all their bikes) with the result being that the alternators wouldn't charge very well at lower rpm.  At least, that's the way I remember the story, from sometime in the last century!

Bob

 You are correct Bob , and most of the low/no charge issue with BMW's was riders coming from HD and Brit twins not running the boxers at high enough RPM's . Sound familiar ?

  Dusty

[bad Chad]

Any word on US MSRP  for the v9 series?  I'm thinking something like a Romer is in my future.

[ohiorider]

I haven't followed the V9 happenings too closely, but felt this article called out many of the changes from the V7.  Aside from styling differences, seem to be mostly electronic.  Smart phone app sounds interesting..... sort of ....
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http://www.gizmag.com/2016-moto-guzzi-v9-roamer-bobber/40643/

[JeffOlson]

It has been a few days since anyone posted in this thread, so I will.

The new Triumph Street Twin specs and US prices have been released.

It is interesting to compare a few specs between the Street Twin and the V9:

Fuel tank: 3.2 gallons vs. 4 gallons
Horsepower: 54 @ 5,900 rpm vs. 55 @ 6,250
Torque: 59.0 lb-ft @ 3,230 rpm vs. 45.7 @ 3,000 rpm
Dry Weight: 436.5 lbs. vs. "around" 441 lbs.

It looks like horsepower and weight are quite close, but the Street Twin has 29% more torque at a slightly higher rpm...

Also, despite the small fuel tank, the Street Twin gets 63.3 combined miles per gallon (72.8 mpg at a constant speed of 56 mph, and 52.0 mpg at a constant speed of 75 mph).

Still, I think the V9 looks better!

[jas67]

Also, despite the small fuel tank, the Street Twin gets 63.3 combined miles per gallon (72.8 mpg at a constant speed of 56 mph, and 52.0 mpg at a constant speed of 75 mph).

Imperial or US gallons?     63 UK MPG  = 52.5 US MPG, or about the same as the V7 (and likely V9).

Still, I think the V9 looks better!

The Street Twin looks WAY better than the V9 (IMHO).

[bpreynolds]

Imperial or US gallons?     63 UK MPG  = 52.5 US MPG, or about the same as the V7 (and likely V9).

The Street Twin looks WAY better than the V9 (IMHO).

Good point on that UK gallons.  And besides, I've often found manufacturers claims of mpg numbers to be significantly different than real world results. 

For me, while the new Thruxton is cycle sex personified, I cannot warm to the Street Twin's looks.  In fact, I think the old ones look better.  There's something about visually about the rear of the bike that is distracting to me and not in a good way.  It's almost like it's too long or that tire/rear fender space is throwing me off.  Not sure.  Anyhow, I just don't like it. 

And from what I've read thus far from early reviews, seems more of what you liked about the Bonnie before it - IF YOU LIKED THOSE THINGS:  "easy to ride," "flat torque on tap," "unintimidating," etc.  What I'm not reading in any of those reviews - or at least yet - is anything about a new character of the engine.  In fact, if anything it seems more refined than before.  For me personally, that's not a desirable thing per se though I can see where it is for many, maybe even the majority of riders.  But me, I already thought the previous Bonnie engine was too...well...I'm just gonna say it...dull.  Of course, there's other desirable things about the new version, but still, I guess they just lose me at the start.

[Kev m]

Jeff - FYI, we covered all this a couple of days ago here:

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=80502.0

Dry Weight: 436.5 lbs. vs. "around" 441 lbs.

Just to be pedantic, we're under the impression the V9 weight is WET, so the Bonnie may actually way a hair more instead of a hair less.

But we'll see in due time.

The Street Twin looks WAY better than the V9 (IMHO).

Really, ya know, as much as I like the Bonnies and think that the T120 and Thruxton look better than the V9, I'm not sure I agree the Street does too.

I think it largely comes down to the wheels.

As much as I prefer cast wheels the ones that Triumph has used on both the previous Base Bonnie/Bonnie SE and the new Street look wonky to me.

I think they did it to lower it for shorter riders, but it looks too squat.

I'll give MG this, on both the Bobber and the Stone they've come up with some really nice cast wheels!

[bpreynolds]

I'll give MG this, on both the Bobber and the Stone they've come up with some really nice cast wheels!

 :1:

[canuguzzi]

Sales will tell us which bikes people prefer.

I doubt many here would care too much about looks so long as it has a Guzzi engine. Everything else is stuff you grab off a shelf. The tanks and handlebars are purpose built, everything else are parts bin. The frame? Dictated by the engine.

[Adan]

The target market for both the V9 and the Street Twin are folks who aren't going to put much weight on HP or torque, because each bike has plenty enough for their purposes.  Aesthetics will probably be the #1 factor, and the cuiser-ish (is it ok to say that, KevM?) set up of the V9 vs  more standard ergos of the Street Twin will probably be a big divider. 

But also, the folks for whom these bikes are targeted are generally not DIY'ers, and they'll want professional service support.  In terms of mass appeal, that's a handicap the V9 cannot overcome.

Me, I'd choose the V9 (or a V7) in a heartbeat.  My feeling about the Bonnie has always been that I don't want to see my bike coming and going 50 times a day. 

[chuck peterson]

To me the V9 is simply a guzzi motor in a 60s Triumph, or Yamaha XS650 frame...looks great

[Kev m]

Aesthetics will probably be the #1 factor, and the cuiser-ish (is it ok to say that, KevM?) set up of the V9 vs  more standard ergos of the Street Twin will probably be a big divider. 

Call it what you want, but I don't see the ergos of the Street and V9 as being particularly different.

I don't see the ergos of the V7 (Stone/Special) and V9 as being particularly different.


None of the 3 have rearsets or forwards. I'd be surprised if the pegs on the V9 are as forward as the mid-mounts on my Sporty.

[LBC Tenni]

Piaggio couldn't manage to sell the Griso, an awesome ride and one of the most beautiful bikes ever made. So they hope to do better with another boring HD clone in a market already saturated by Japanese HD clones? Poor Guzzi. I hope they don't dumb down Aprilia too.

[JeffOlson]

I'll take one.  Either one.  Doesn't matter.

My fluttering heart tells me that is much better looking than the Street Twin.

[bpreynolds]

My fluttering heart tells me that is much better looking than the Street Twin.

 :1:

Wait, wait, I've got it! 
Future press announcement:
In a stunning move that is shocking the motorcycle world, Moto Guzzi has agreed to give away one free female Italian model with the sale of any new V9 Roamer.  Warranty only extends to the bike and model is only free to start but you can get her serviced at any Ducati dealership nearby.   

[pyoungbl]

On my Deal's Gap trip I started off with a fully charged battery.  I used my GPS the whole trip and the heated gear (jacket liner and attached gloves) only in mornings during the 3 days there and then only at about 1/2 to 3/4 power on dial, followed usually by lots of riding while not running it.  BUT. ..................  Instead, it took a full 3 hours or more to get back to charged.  This surprised me A LITTLE.  But lots and lots and lots of factors here that would certainly not warrant any sort of serious concern. 

The dry alternator on my '13 puts out a few more watts than the wet one (Per Guzzi).  Nevertheless, I was concerned about having enough juice to power my heated gear.  After all, the fuel pump and ECU suck up quite a few of those watts so there might be little reserve.  When I put a meter on the system I found that the bike was actually over charging.  The OEM regulator was charging at more than 15 volts.  I installed an aftermarket regulator which brought the system down to about 14 volts charging and installed a voltage monitor.  Now I can see that, at idle, the system in discharging.  I do not get to positive charge until just over 2K rpm, this without any accessories running.  I cannot remember exactly what the discharge/charge point is with my heated gear but I'm guessing it's somewhere near 3.5K rpm.  At any rate, the stock battery and charging system are probably OK for normal use unless you are riding at lower rpm and running extra loads.  As the battery ages the margin will decrease.  It's probably a good idea to put a meter on the system from time to time, slowly rev the engine, and watch the voltage change.  It will be a real PITA to be on a trip, have a dead battery, and no way to start the bike.

Peter Y.

[trippah]

only a button or two to go..please.  If I win the lottery, I'll get both a V9 and Bonnie, fully accessorized and will dutifully report back to the forum.   Now, dry weight vs wet. I've got a senior citizen shower I can use to prepare for the testing.

[JeffOlson]

Apparently, this accessory comes with the Bobber:



Despite the darker appearance of the Bobber, this accessory will not require as much eye makeup as the one for the Roamer.

[Adan]

Piaggio couldn't manage to sell the Griso, an awesome ride and one of the most beautiful bikes ever made. So they hope to do better with another boring HD clone in a market already saturated by Japanese HD clones? Poor Guzzi. I hope they don't dumb down Aprilia too.

The Griso is not a good bike for new riders.  The V7 is, and so will be the V9.  Shaft drive is a godsend for folks who just want to turn the key and ride, and there's lots of those.  There's lots of folks riding around on chain-driven bikes who don't know or can't be bothered to lub and adjust.  HD's are heavy, and even the Bolt is quite a bit heavier, than the V9.  If you want a relatively lightweight, shaft-driven motorcycle with some style, the V7 and V9 are in a class by themselves.

So there's a good argument for the V9 finding a niche and having significant market appeal. 

Edit: I guess the HD 750, with belt drive and 489 lbs wet, arguably inhabits this niche.

[bpreynolds]

The dry alternator on my '13 puts out a few more watts than the wet one (Per Guzzi).  Nevertheless, I was concerned about having enough juice to power my heated gear.  After all, the fuel pump and ECU suck up quite a few of those watts so there might be little reserve.  When I put a meter on the system I found that the bike was actually over charging.  The OEM regulator was charging at more than 15 volts.  I installed an aftermarket regulator which brought the system down to about 14 volts charging and installed a voltage monitor.  Now I can see that, at idle, the system in discharging.  I do not get to positive charge until just over 2K rpm, this without any accessories running.  I cannot remember exactly what the discharge/charge point is with my heated gear but I'm guessing it's somewhere near 3.5K rpm.  At any rate, the stock battery and charging system are probably OK for normal use unless you are riding at lower rpm and running extra loads.  As the battery ages the margin will decrease.  It's probably a good idea to put a meter on the system from time to time, slowly rev the engine, and watch the voltage change.  It will be a real PITA to be on a trip, have a dead battery, and no way to start the bike.

Peter Y.

Good info and thanks for the post, Peter.  After reading around and especially your post here, I'm convinced my issue on the trip had more to do with me constantly stopping, taking pics, and restarting with the bike only really getting any sort of return on that draw at the end of the day and maybe not even that much.  By the end of the trip or at least by the day I returned I'm sure the battery was suffering as a result of 3 days of this.  On top of the gloves and liner, I was also running a GPS most of that time and I'm sure that was just added insult, though I suspect the GPS was a relatively small draw.  Or not?  Regardless, I'm now convinced it was not the bike or the gear at issue, but rather me stopping and restarting so many times.  Damn the Deal's Gap area for being so photogenic!

[Vasco DG]

Apparently, this accessory comes with the Bobber:



Despite the darker appearance of the Bobber, this accessory will not require as much eye makeup as the one for the Roamer.

So not only are we stuck with bikes built to look like anachronisms but they are going to be marketed with the same sort of half-witted sexist bullshit as was used back in the depths of time! Well done Piaggio! Way to go alienating 50% of the population and a good slab of your target market. Idiots!

Pete