Uh Kev , actually you are wrong , a vehicle's ability to avoid accidents plays a large role in safety . Large vehicles really don't fare all that well in overall safety , sorry dude .
Dusty
Define avoid and show me some meaningful stats.
In my experience the AVERAGE driver is no more Ken Block than the average rider is Ricky Carmichael. When something unexpected happens that jam on the brakes and grab the steering wheel with a death grip and hope they stop in time. OR if they swerve they probably swerve into something else. What's the old advice about NOT swerving to avoid an animal (other than a Moose), don't swerve cause you're more likely to hit something more dangerous (another car, truck, tree, etc.).
1: Speeds are similar, the roads are similar. The distances may be greater but that doesn't mean a Yukon is the right tool. You talk about population density. I need to travel 100 miles. What is the best tool? A quality sedan that turns 2500rpm at 90mph while returning 30mpg? Or would it be a body on frame commercial vehicle with a trunk and leather seats with terrible mileage and dubious handling at speed?
2: We're talking family cars, not toys.
3: Rollover safety? Braking distance? Early upset in slalom maneuvers? Never heard of these issues? The only benefit to an SUV is mass. Of course this becomes an egotistical race of size as people try to get an edge on the next person and we end up with the Excursion. Again, the typical modern American approach to innovation is to use a bigger effing hammer. The more intelligent approach would be to prevent crashes in the first place and to rely on technology rather than differential mass to save the lives of ne plus ultra.
There are so many choices abroad that are not being offered to us due to inane social stigma surrounding station wagons in the USA. This is a shame because in reality they suit the need of the average family better.
1. Speeds aren't necessarily similar, roads definitely aren't similar whether we're talking the autobahn or more importantly small crowded cities whose maze of tiny streets were laid out in medieval times. There's a reason different cars are more popular in the EU than the US. To some extent the same is even true for motorcycles.
You keep using this "best" term, but without defining what qualities are necessary for BEST it's just nonsense. To many BEST might mean:
* Most quiet
* Most comfortable
* Best view
* Nicest interior features
This may include the ability to see over coupes and sedans in traffic.
What is more safe, the ability to steer more quickly around an unexpected obstacle, or to get a better view of the big picture and see said obstacle sooner.
My greatest objection to your position (other than the insulting statements that it is the only intelligent one) is that it ASSumes (drink
) too many generalizations.
2. Why do we need to limit the conversation to family cars and "not toys". Why is it somehow dumb or irresponsible to burn extra fuel in a family car when toys get a pass?
3. "Never heard of these issues?" <--- see continuing with the insults. My question to you is if you can quantify the statistical benefits from these things? I like a vehicle that handles probably better than most. But don't discount the advantages mass has in a caged vehicle.
You like a wagon, great - buy one - you can get a Volvo, A Subaru (both top names in the "safety" business so that should please you). I'm not up on BMW and Mercedes and VW's latest offerings, but when last I checked they all still had some wagons, though largely they were being replaced by SUVs dues to sale popularity.
The Mazda C-series SUVs are excellent handlers and very much still wagons more than anything else.
The Juke I just sold is more a hot-hatch in many ways, and handles as such.
I'm sorry they aren't selling whatever YOU want because you're in the minority, I can relate. I might have considered a TRUE compact truck if they sold here what they do in the EU and much of the rest of the world. But that's not what the market wants. That doesn't make the market wrong, just different from my desires.
Tobit - sorry about the hijack. Brio just rubbed me the wrong way. I didn't intend this to be pissing contest so much as to show him that his thinking isn't universally true and though he's entitled to his preferences he shouldn't think that makes him "right" or "better", the later being the crux of the discussion.
