Flat Tappet Recall for 8v - Complaint Pending with US Recall Agency

[MotoG5]

So I'll not be wingeing and whining, I'll get on with life, wait for Pete to what he does, then go and ride hard knowing the bottom end could fall out of the thing in the future.
Do I have the money to throw away on this? No! I'm a penniless preacher, but there are a whole lot more important things in life than a few hundred $s. And don't talk to me about principles, if you knew the flats had problems when you bought, suck it up and move on!! And if you didn't, suck it up and move on anyway because most of us are too old to be letting this tear our guts apart.

Just my 2 bobs worth 

 :1: and an Amen Brother!

[George_S]

Yes, the search reveals recalls for failed engine operation, not by the NTSA but that wasn't and isn't the point, the point was the recall.

No, that was the point.  That is what I was commenting on, and what you quoted in your comment to me. If you want to change the discussion more  toward a manufacturer recall, fine. But that is not the original thrust of the thread, and most of the comments.

If you are now saying that MG should institute a recall, I agree with you. 

[Vasco DG]

Oi! Larry don't you check your PM'?

Your A kit came in last week. I'm hoping to get your great turd turned over tomorrow!

Pete

[canuguzzi]

No, that was the point.  That is what I was commenting on, and what you quoted in your comment to me. If you want to change the discussion more  toward a manufacturer recall, fine. But that is not the original thrust of the thread, and most of the comments.

If you are now saying that MG should institute a recall, I agree with you.

Context is everything, go back to the post where the point about recalls because of engine operation failure was made. It wasn't specific to the NTSA, only the recalls. After that I made another post explaining where one could read about the recalls I was referring to. Then you picked up on that.

Engine operation failure recalls and NTSA recalls are separate things but can be for the same reason, safety related.

Honda and Polaris voluntarily recalled but as they were safety related as they said so themselves, they could also have fallen under the purview of the NTSA, a related point.

Either way, a recall gets the job done but like anything there can be other consequences such as those costs being passed on to customers through bike and parts sales. However, if MG is allowed to just hang the moon out of the window and dump on those below, it never gets better, it remains the same as evidenced by their behavior.

It s better to be pissed off than pissed on. It depends on which end of the line you want to be in when it comes to things like this.

[George_S]

Sure, right.

[Larry]

Oi! Larry don't you check your PM'?

Your A kit came in last week. I'm hoping to get your great turd turned over tomorrow!

Pete

Oops.
Thanks Pete. I always said you were a good man. There's not many of us left 

I'll call.

[Vasco DG]

Frogshit Larry. The vast majority of people on earth are good, decent, generous and kind. It's the assholes that give people a bad name.

Pete

[Larry]

Frogshit Larry. The vast majority of people on earth are good, decent, generous and kind. It's the assholes that give people a bad name.

Pete

That's the truth.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Absolutely.

[Dean Rose]

Absolutely.

Maggie?

[Chuck in Indiana]

 

[bad Chad]

I don't really think the vast majority are good decent people, maybe around 60%.  The other 40 are composed of complete azzholes, something like 15% and the remaining 25% can easily be swayed one way or another.

[canuguzzi]

I don't really think the vast majority are good decent people, maybe around 60%.  The other 40 are composed of complete azzholes, something like 15% and the remaining 25% can easily be swayed one way or another.

The 15% do stuff they know is wrong but do it anyway and screw others over to do it.

The 60% are the ones getting screwed by the 15%.

The remaining 25% sit idly by watching the movie until they become impacted by the 15% and then they run over to the 60% and claim they were there all along.

[normzone]

Do you guys mind holding it down a little bit ?

I'm working on statistics for on time delivery sorted by repeat build or first time build, and you're distracting me.

[rocker59]

A motorcycle relies on engine power during operation to remain upright and a failure to do so increases greatly the chances of a collision or fall.

HaHa!

Got my laugh of the day.

You post up some classic shite, NP.

Do quotes like this come to you each night in your sleep?  Or, just randomly pop into your head?

[canuguzzi]

HaHa!

Got my laugh of the day.

You post up some classic shite, NP.

Do quotes like this come to you each night in your sleep?  Or, just randomly pop into your head?

Load up your bike, passenger included, enter a sharp lean over turn and hit the kill switch as if you weren't expecting it. Make sure the turn is off camber with an incline.

Better yet, get really crossed up, you know the kind and do the same thing.

Do post a video cause I like a laugh as much as you do. Make sure to be on the nerf road when you do it.

But having read the posts here about people falling over in driveways and such with no other traffic in sight, maybe a non running engine works better for them.

If all that is too much, here is the easy way. Sit on your favorite bike, feet up, stand stads up, engine off. Take a still picture and show everyone how its done.

I can't wait.

[canuguzzi]

Do you guys mind holding it down a little bit ?

I'm working on statistics for on time delivery sorted by repeat build or first time build, and you're distracting me.

MG could use someone like you.

[BigDave in PA]

I'm not defending MG but as far as a safety issue goes all I have to say is if anyone ever crashes their motorcycle because the valve train is gradually wearing should get rid of all of their motorcycles and get one of these instead:

[canuguzzi]

I'm not defending MG but as far as a safety issue goes all I have to say is if anyone ever crashes their motorcycle because the valve train is gradually wearing should get rid of all of their motorcycles and get one of these instead:

Well, right here on WG we have people that forget to put their feet down, get off bikes without putting the stand down, plenty that can't figure out how much oil to put in, lose dipsticks and don't know where the battery is or how to charge it.

Let's start a list.

I think the idea is to try everything and what works, works, who cares what that is?

[canuguzzi]

Along the same line, we could say that any company that can't wire a starter the right way or make flat tappets work or sell defective ones knowing they are should not be making motorcycles and instead stick to buggies and other such things.

I mean, since we're going down this road.

[oldbike54]

 Not sure pointing out all of the mistakes made by others is such a great idea  In probably 400,000 miles on the street , and a fair few hours on a race track and in the dirt , I have never had an equipment malfunction cause me to crash , well , unless one considers a couple of personal (read as brain) malfunctions that resulted in landing upside down 

  Dusty

[lucian]

Unfortunately , or fortunately I guess, until a tappet failure causes an engine to seize and then subsequently causes a rider to crash, the scenario is a hypothetical and unlikely to carry much weight in a legal argument. But also fortunately, or unfortunately, I guess, I am not a lawyer. Lots of hypothetical scenarios can cause a crash. Not many have caused a recall.

[LowRyter]

I really don't understand why you guys are arguing with Norge Pilot.  He's the only one posting on this that has worked as a govt regulator.  Everyone is pretending to know something and one guy here has some real experience.

This recall deal might be a long shot but man, you're a bunch of naysayers. 

[canuguzzi]

Not sure pointing out all of the mistakes made by others is such a great idea  In probably 400,000 miles on the street , and a fair few hours on a race track and in the dirt , I have never had an equipment malfunction cause me to crash , well , unless one considers a couple of personal (read as brain) malfunctions that resulted in landing upside down 

  Dusty

Not sure talking about people when the subject is an effort by the OP to get Moto Guzzi to deal with what they had to know was defective components when it left the factory has to do with anything either, still it went on.

People have fallen because the engine in their bike failed, to argue that is foolishness because it has happened. The perfect people of course, never have such problems.

The thread was about the OPs effort to get MG to act like more than a DGS coalition of the uninterested. From there some decided to make it personal, be upfront about it. If one serves it up, expect to eat some.

If you need to open up the engine to check to see if the tappets are headed south before it has more than a few thousand miles on it, it is a complete POS engine and should never have seen the light of day.

So much for no stupid questions, the OP came here to tell of his efforts and instead if getting some pointers on how to make a better case or do it better, with the exception of asking the same people that are responsible for it in the first place or being told what he was trying was wrong) what came of it?

Moto Guzzi should be held to account for what they did, they screwed over everyone who bought a flat tappet 8V bike that went out of warranty while MG knew the problem existed and failing to recall those outside of warranty is shameful.

Someone asks for the 500th how much oil to put in and 50 answers get posted. How to diagnose a crappy wired starter, recommendations and offers of help.

One guy says he wants MG to ante up and fix the bikes with flat tappet problems and so many forget it all and offer virtually zero support.

The people who win are those who don't give up. I hope the OP is successful and will provide as much support as possible, because in the end, things like this should not happen, it was not a mistake it was thought out other than when first discovered.

[oldbike54]

 NP can you provide one documented case of someone falling over after an engine failure . Hell , I grenaded a Triumph motor at 75 MPH , nothing left but hot smoking metal , still didn't crash . As for folks asking what seem to you to be silly questions , that is a completely different matter that doesn't relate to the issue at hand .

  Dusty

[lucian]

I think the OP intent is admirable, I just thought it was mentioned that this particular agency only deals with safety recalls. I am wondering how you argue that when there hasn't been a documented accident or complete loss of power due to the crappy tappet design. Perhaps it is more of a consumer protection issue in a monetary sense.  I certainly agree with nothing ventured nothing gained and wish the OP luck. 

[oldbike54]

I think the OP intent is admirable, I just thought it was mentioned that this particular agency only deals with safety recalls. I am wondering how you argue that when there hasn't been a documented accident or complete loss of power due to the crappy tappet design. Perhaps it is more of a consumer protection issue in a monetary sense.  I certainly agree with nothing ventured nothing gained and wish the OP luck.

 I think we all wish the OP well .

  Dusty

[canuguzzi]

NP can you provide one documented case of someone falling over after an engine failure . Hell , I grenaded a Triumph motor at 75 MPH , nothing left but hot smoking metal , still didn't crash . As for folks asking what seem to you to be silly questions , that is a completely different matter that doesn't relate to the issue at hand .

  Dusty

I don't care what you did or what happened to you, that isn't the point or question. I know people who have fallen because their engine stalled midway in a turn.

As for documented, why not go and read about all the recalls for engine stalling or engine failure on motorcycles and instead ask those companies why they said loss of engine operation could lead to a crash? I doubt you'll bother though because your intent isn't to get information is it?

In 2008 HD recalled 47,000 bikes because a fuel filter shell could have caused a loss of fuel pressure and the engine, not getting fuel would stall. HD explicitly agreed that a stalling engine could lead to a crash. I guess HD just doesn't know what it is doing.

Who ushered in the recall? The NTSA. This was for losing fuel pressure and yes it was deemed a safety issue.

Engine failure on a.motorcycle is a safety issue. Go argue with the NTSA.

[oldbike54]

No , my intent was to prevent a misguided attempt at embarrassing other members .

  Dusty

[lucian]

So essentially someone would have to convince the NTSA that a failed tappet could stall the motor? How do you do that  without an actual case of that happening?