Moto Guzzi isn't Honda

[Chuck in Indiana]

Sorta like the joke about the Californians moving out of California to get away from all the BS, moving to Colorado, then immediately working to change Colorado "for the better".  Which is actually for the worse, just like the place they came from...

This thread is not about any other brand.  This thread is about Moto Guzzi being like Colorado.

Yep.

[Bonafide Bob]

Sorta like the joke about the Californians moving out of California to get away from all the BS, moving to Colorado, then immediately working to change Colorado "for the better".  Which is actually for the worse, just like the place they came from...

This thread is not about any other brand.  This thread is about Moto Guzzi being like Colorado.

If it is not about other brands, maybe Honda shouldn't be in the thread title.
Bob

[rocker59]

If it is not about other brands, maybe Honda shouldn't be in the thread title.
Bob

Geeze, Louise....   

[canuguzzi]

Oh please, the entire thread was setup as a comparison to other brands and analogies for the same.

The thread could have been one two posts long:

1. Moto Guzzi isn't a Honda.

2. No sh*t.

End of thread. If all you want is go along then there you have it, one post saying something and the next one saying yes. Then no one else needs to post anything.

[Scud]

While looking for some clutch parts I happened upon a description of a starter ring on MG Cycle's site.

http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=193&products_id=4632
 
STARTER RING GEAR, FLYWHEEL RING GEAR, MANY MODELS 1967 - 2012
"All big twins 700cc, 750cc, 850cc, most 1000cc two valve head models and 1100cc through California Vintage, substitute for 17067900. Not used on small blocks, not used on V11 Sport/LeMans, not used on Centauro/Daytona/1100 Sport/Sport 1100."

Moto Guzzi, like Harley, has an iconic engine configuration. But wow, the same part for 45 years. I haven't done my research, but I think it would be difficult to find a single part that fits the majority of motorcycle models Honda produced.

It seems that companies like Harley and Moto Guzzi benefit from their traditional engines, but that also constrains their development in some ways. Triumph had to die and be resurrected before we saw those lovely water-cooled triples.

What's the iconic Honda engine? Inline 4? Flat 6? Thumper? Their new Africa Twin (which inspires lust in my heart) uses a parallel twin instead of the V configuration of the original Africa Twin.

[rocker59]

Oh please, the entire thread was setup as a comparison to other brands and analogies for the same.
 

Nope.  Went over your head.  And some others, too.

The thread was intended to point out that it's getting real old having you, and a few others posting on this forum, constantly bitching and complaining about what Guzzi is not.

 

[Dean Rose]

Nope.  Went over your head.  And some others, too.

The thread was intended to point out that it's getting real old having you, and a few others posting on this forum, constantly bitching and complaining about what Guzzi is not.

 

Rocker, couldn't have said it better myself.


Dean

[dibble]

.
What's the iconic Honda engine? Inline 4? Flat 6? Thumper? Their new Africa Twin (which inspires lust in my heart) uses a parallel twin instead of the V configuration of the original Africa Twin.

erm...... V4......

[canuguzzi]

Nope.  Went over your head.  And some others, too.

The thread was intended to point out that it's getting real old having you, and a few others posting on this forum, constantly bitching and complaining about what Guzzi is not.

 

As much as others get tired of Guzzi is all knowing all great and just suck up what you think could be done better.

They aren't selling 7000 bikes a year because they do everything right.

John Deere makes tractors among other things. They continued to improve them. That is why they sell so.many.

Deere tractors aren't Hondas either but Honda makes tractors. Strange that Deere manages to be top dog over Honda. Must be the improvements, the quality of service and dealer support.

[PJPR01]

BROKEN RECORD
BROKEN RECORD
BROKEN RECORD

How many bloody times are you going to say the same stuff over and over!!!

Enough already...

[Chuck in Indiana]

Seriously, is it any wonder that Pete left?  :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu

[canuguzzi]

Like oil threads?

Or telling any new members that might not get it that they are morons, akin to being imbiciles, stupid, no nothings because its okay to do that?

This thread was a troll from the start. Why else was it started?

If the OP didn't want controversy or to draw people in then why did he start it?

It was done on purpose.

[oldbike54]

Oh please, the entire thread was setup as a comparison to other brands and analogies for the same.

The thread could have been one two posts long:

1. Moto Guzzi isn't a Honda.

2. No sh*t.

End of thread. If all you want is go along then there you have it, one post saying something and the next one saying yes. Then no one else needs to post anything.

 Oh how wrong you are . This is a thread about outlook and philosophy . Either one gets it , or they don't .

 Dusty

[dibble]

I must have done 250,000 miles on Hondas all year round, all roads, all weathers........

Wonderful bikes, you all should buy a VFR800 and do 5000 miles as fast as you can then you will appreciate them.

They are truly amazing pieces of engineering.

Faster than any Guzzi on any road on any day.

There's  still room for a Guzzi in my garage though

[Chuck in Indiana]

Oh how wrong you are . This is a thread about outlook and philosophy . Either one gets it , or they don't .

 Dusty

Speaking of trolls.. 

[oldbike54]

 Once again , we have made it pretty clear this isn't an anti Honda thread . Honda doesn't need to be defended being the 800 LB Gorilla in the room . We are trying to point out why some of us are attracted to MG despite their flaws . Kind of like a beautiful woman , often times it is her flaws that make her even more lovely , and trying to change her will destroy the very essence of why she was so damn alluring to begin with .

 Dusty

[keener]

I think its a great thread ....
I own a 2007 Guzzi Griso , 2005 Ducati Multistrada,1998 Suzuki Bandit, and a 1974 Z1 Kawasaki (since new)
They all mean something special to me ..especially the Z1 as it in many ways has become a friend .
I do ride the Griso the most , then the Duck, the Italian bikes offer more soul and feel for me and I love to just look at the Griso..to me its also art..
The Bandit has been almost everywhere and reliable as a stone axe , it is always ready and willing to do it again the big plus is it has killer midrange power.
they are all different , but they all put a smile on my face and that gentlemen is for me what riding is all about..

[Bonafide Bob]

  Being the humans that we are, things posted by some are likely to be interpreted differently by others. It doesn't mean those views are wrong, just different. What ever our views are they shouldn't be belittled and to do so is just bad manners. My rule is to treat people in this forum like they are sitting in my garage face to face and I won't say anything in here I wouldn't say in person.


Bob

[jas67]

What's the iconic Honda engine? Inline 4? Flat 6? Thumper? Their new Africa Twin (which inspires lust in my heart) uses a parallel twin instead of the V configuration of the original Africa Twin.

erm...... V4......

The V4 is certainly the engine configuration that Honda has made over the years that I think has the best character, esp. with an aftermarket exhaust.  It is also the current configuration used WSB.

They've had many iconic configurations.   In their early racing days, they were innovators of getting a log of HP per CC out of four stroke engine while the other Japnaese companies were concentrating on 2 stroke engines.   They did this with high RPMs, and in some cases four valves per cylinder.   They also did this by using many cylinders.    They had a 125cc five cylinder (RC148) w/ a 21,500 redline and a 250cc six cylinder (RC166), which Mike Hailwood rode to victory at the Isle of Man.  The RC166 produced 60 HP at 18,000 RPM, and had a top speed of 150 MPH.

They even had a 50cc twin that made 16 HP at 18,000 RPM.

Now, it is easy to dismiss the engines, as all high-RPM power and no torque, stating that a large, lower RPM engine would be better.   That would be true for street machines, but, these were racers, racing in classes of specific displacements, so, this got the most HP per CC.

Another amazing thing is that these ultra-high RPM machines were designed largely without the aid of computers.

Another iconic engine for Honda was the 2 stroke V3 of the NS500R GP bike (and it's street version the NS400R).

Back to street machines, Honda produced the first four stroke twin with a 180 degree crank (CB72, and CB77), which could rev higher lower vibration than traditional 360 degree parallel twins.   Counter-rotating balance shafts didn't come along until much later.

[oldbike54]

  Being the humans that we are, things posted by some are likely to be interpreted differently by others. It doesn't mean those views are wrong, just different. What ever our views are they shouldn't be belittled and to do so is just bad manners. My rule is to treat people in this forum like they are sitting in my garage face to face and I won't say anything in here I wouldn't say in person.


Bob

 Manners ? Seriously , the thread might be viewed as controversial , although a bit of controversy (why do I pronounce that in the English way in my head? ) might not be such a bad thing , it being Winter and all . The members that are seeing this as contentious tend to be that way W/O prodding , and that isn't always bad either . The deal is , being told how wrong we are for understanding the reality of Guzzi ownership does get a bit old , we are dealing with an Italian made product after all , and applying American sensibilities to a MC manufactured in Italy seems pointless. Kind of like trying to get someone born in Japan to understand why Harley Davidsons are the way they are . Now , certainly there are HD enthusiasts in Japan , and pretty much anywhere that there are MC enthusiasts , but my guess is that say a German riding a Harley accepts there limitations , and just "gets" it .

 Dusty

[Bonafide Bob]

Manners ? Seriously , the thread might be viewed as controversial , although a bit of controversy (why do I pronounce that in the English way in my head? ) might not be such a bad thing , it being Winter and all . The members that are seeing this as contentious tend to be that way W/O prodding , and that isn't always bad either . The deal is , being told how wrong we are for understanding the reality of Guzzi ownership does get a bit old , we are dealing with an Italian made product after all , and applying American sensibilities to a MC manufactured in Italy seems pointless. Kind of like trying to get someone born in Japan to understand why Harley Davidsons are the way they are . Now , certainly there are HD enthusiasts in Japan , and pretty much anywhere that there are MC enthusiasts , but my guess is that say a German riding a Harley accepts there limitations , and just "gets" it .



 I have understood the deal about this thread from it's onset, but I also understand why this thread went into the crapper like it did. 
Bob

[Daniel Kalal]

I posted this nearly ten years ago (it might have been wildgoose.com or perhaps the forum that was in play before this one).  It is still appropriate today:


July 2006

…We hold these Guzzi truths to be self-evident.

There have been a number of recent folks on the forum who are interested in buying a first Guzzi, or are fairly new to ownership.    My intent with this list is to be straightforward, without any sarcasm or hyperbole.  We hold these truths that…

1. Moto Guzzi is not popular.
This means that if you buy a new Guzzi, you should not expect to sell it immediately.  And, if you do, you should not expect to recover your original purchase price or anything close to it.  You’ll find that long-term Guzzi owners buy their bikes to ride and give no consideration to resale value.  If you put 150,000 miles (or more) on a motorcycle, it hardly matters what it is worth, anyway.

2. Moto Guzzi engines take longer to break in.
While some might joke that their bike is hardly broken in at 50,000 miles, the actual number is probably around 10,000 miles, with 20,000 miles being the outer limit.  With anything below 3,000 miles you should still expect things to run better in time.  This is not really a claim for any inherent quality of the engine (it’s more likely evidence of the reverse), but it is the way it is.

3. A Moto Guzzi is not fast.
If 130 mph is scary-fast for you, then a Moto Guzzi can be made to go fast enough.  But, there many much smaller motorcycles out there that can run circles around most any stock Moto Guzzi.  A Moto Guzzi is plenty fast for what its owners want.  Forget horsepower for a moment; the power delivery and overall feel of a Guzzi engine is what makes it enjoyable.  A Guzzi is a very satisfying motorcycle, but if you want to win at the drag strip, or run with an R1, do not buy a Moto Guzzi.

4. There are not very many dealers.
If you expect to find as many dealers as with Honda, then you will be very disappointed.  What Guzzi does have, though, is a level of enthusiasm that makes up for some of this.  Overall, the Guzzi dealers are the best bunch of people you’d ever want to meet in a motorcycle shop.  It’s not likely that anybody becomes a Guzzi dealer with the intent of getting rich.  Consequently, they’re far more likely to be enthusiasts, just like you, who are in it for the love of the sport.

5. Parts are not that difficult to find.
While there are few dealers, if you are not close to one there are several very good shops that will be more than willing to work with you for the parts you need via mail-order.  It may be surprising to know that compared to an equivalent year Honda (for instance) an older Guzzi will be much easier to get parts for.

6. The support network is amazingly strong.
You’d be hard pressed to find a more eager and helpful bunch of owners willing to help you with any problem you have.  There are many long-term Guzzi owners who are fanatical about the brand, and will do what they can to keep yours going.  Is there any other brand that has the equivalent of Dave Richardson’s book “Guzziology”?

7. A Guzzi is easy to work on for most of the things that need working.
Guzzi parts are robust and easy to work on.  It’s not hard to get to most of what you’ll need to be working on, and the parts are generally well enough built that there are few throw-away things on the motorcycle.

8. The Factory and Distributor support is not large.
This is a small company.  The total Guzzi sales in the United States are likely exceeded by just a couple of Honda dealerships.  You will not find a multi-story office complex full of people in suits all working for Moto Guzzi.  You’ll find a handful of people doing their best.

9. A Guzzi is reliable.
If you’re squeamish about taking this obscure motorcycle on a long trip, don’t be.  These are very reliable motorcycles.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Thanks for that, Daniel. All very true then, and now, of course.

[lucky phil]

Or HD , or Toyota , or McDonalds , and thank goodness for that .

  Dusty

Next contestant on mastermind.....Dust y. Specialist subject.....the bleeding obvious.
Ciao

[oldbike54]

Next contestant on mastermind.....Dust y. Specialist subject.....the bleeding obvious.
Ciao

 Well , one would think that is obvious ...

 Dusty

[SmithSwede]

I love threads like this--all over the map.

The subject line states that "Moto Guzzi is not Honda."   Later it is explained that this thread is actually about "Moto Guzzi being like Colorado."

So logic tells us that Honda is not like Colorado.   I'm not sure what that means, but I think I can prove it. 

[oldbike54]

I love threads like this--all over the map.

The subject line states that "Moto Guzzi is not Honda."   Later it is explained that this thread is actually about "Moto Guzzi being like Colorado."

So logic tells us that Honda is not like Colorado.   I'm not sure what that means, but I think I can prove it.

 Isn't there Chevy Colorado ...

 Dusty

[RinkRat II]

 O K Lemme see  I think I got  this,
      Honda = Chevy
      Guzzi = Colorado

    Did I Win???

   Paul B

[oldbike54]

O K Lemme see  I think I got  this,
      Honda = Chevy
      Guzzi = Colorado

    Did I Win???

   Paul B

 Close enough , just don't expect a cash prize , it turns out WG isn't rolling in dough . LOL

 Dusty

[Scud]

O K Lemme see  I think I got  this,
      Honda = Chevy
      Guzzi = Colorado

    Did I Win???

   Paul B

Proceed to the nearest "Green Cross" to claim your prize. But wait, Durango is in Colorado... isn't that a Dodge? But the "highest" point in the 48-states is in California... This thread is getting confusing.