1st Gen Norge - Year over Year differences?

[Josh1021]

Hi Guys,

I'm actively shopping 1st Gen Norge.  A few questions:

1. Are there year over year changes to the model? If so can you link me or summarize them?
2. What would you consider a deal breaker(s) when looking at a particular first gen to buy?
3. What add-ons legitimately increase the resale value?
4. Can you clarify or inform (link me if easier) of any MG software updates for first gen bikes?
5. I've read the brakes are good, but quick on initial bite (keep me honest).  Is there an aftermarket fix/improvement for this behavior?
6. What touring helmet do you favor?

[Huzo]

I bought my Norge new in '07,I've changed a few things but only 'cos I can't leave well alone. I don't reckon any of the changes "had" to be done, if you want to you can go back to Jan 24 and see "wire wheel Norge "or a bit later "huzo's mods", you may wish to use some ideas but really just ride it and service it properly. There's no shortage of free advice on the forum. Mine's done 92,000 k and hasn't done anything wrong that wasn't provoked. The initial bite of the brakes seems more pronounced if you have the front set up soft, just develop a nice smooth technique and you won't notice anything. Happy days !

[jdgretz]

1 - All first generation Norges are the same mechanically.  The big difference is a slightly larger spring on the '08s and newer and maybe a different shock, but either way, they are still lacking in suspension for anything that resembles good handling under load on a non smooth surface.  Think $1K to do the suspension right.

The '07 requires either a dipstick extension (Teo Lamers or Stucchi) or you have to pull the three lowers to check, fill, and change the oil.  In 2008 they added a big ugly plug to the left lower and a longer dipstick so you can check and fill the oil with all the fairings in place.

The other big difference is the color selections available.  Black did not become available until '08, and I don't remember when the Champagne and white came on line. Red is still the fastest color.

2 - If it is over 50,000 miles and still has the original generator belt, I'd look for a low price.  It's not all that expensive to do yourself, but will cost a couple of bills at your favorite dealer.

3 - None. GPS?  Nah - bought my Garmin 660 for $400 off Craigslist, and I'd probably keep it if I sold the bike because I bought a new one.  Top box?  Maybe $100.  Seat?  Not unless you fit that particular seat.  My custom seat from Bill Mayer Saddles was in the $400 range and is tailored to me, not a generic "better" seat from someone else who just builds them to fit the majority of riders of your weight.  How much is a seat that is built to my ass and weight worth to you??  Helibars?  $350 new, worth maybe $250 to someone else. What else could you add that you think is worth more then pennies on the dollar if you were selling?

4 - None that I know of, but I'm still running the original map, plus an O2 optimizer.  You can probably do better, or at least as good as any of the reflashes by learning to use Guzzi Diags.

5 - I haven't noticed that behavior.  I run EBC HH pads front and rear.

6 - I wear a Shoei GT-Air.  I have not used a flip up in that only one (now maybe two) are certified to full face specs, all the others are certified to open face specs as the chin bar often comes off on impact.  I prefer to do all I can to reduce the chance of bodily injury in the case of an unplanned dismount.

I bought my '07 in '09 as a new left over and it currently has 70,000 miles on the clock.  The bike has been virtually trouble free.  Yes, I've changed the suspension, but I spend a good deal of my free time in the Santa Monica Mountains (also know as the Malibu Alps), tweaked the a/f mixture (Roper disagrees that is does anything helpful, but I like it), added a custom seat, startus interruptus fix from MPH, and a GPS.  Otherwise it's a stock Norge.

YMMV

jdg

[Cool Runnings]

Looks like they added A Russell seat.

11,553 miles.

$6895

https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/mcd/5476514985.html

[OlderSlower]

There were some oil pump issues for some early bikes, so important to see if update was done or verify if that bike falls in the serial numbers of possible failure of oil pump gear.  I love my Norge!

[guzzisteve]

A few nice ones here --  http://www.mgnoc.com/classifieds.html

[PJPR01]

and a whole bunch as well on Cycle Trader...plenty of color choices/mileage options etc...

[Huzo]

Yay Older Slower, that's a great one you bring up about the oil pump, mine just misses out numbers wise, but I hope someone didn't just find one laying under a bench and shoved it in my bike regardless. Here's hoping. No dramas yet.

[Josh1021]

Great Info All - Thank You Kindly! 

@Huzo, I'll check out your threads.  I'm old enough to appreciate wire wheels, possibly not old enough to afford them.
 
@jdgretz, thanks for taking the time to provide such detail!  You've given me a leg up with specifics to research on.  I'd like to eventually bridge the gap between Gen 1 HP/FTLB and Gen 2 HP/FTLB.  The heads up on the generator belt is great wisdom.

@coolrunnings,@guzzisteve,@PJPR01, thanks for the "for sale" resources.  I'm on it!

@OlderSlower, (I just told my son this morning about being a bit older/slower!  ) Great info on the oil pump.  I'll certainly be keen to that now.  I'll dig on the SN's impacted.

@jdgretz, I really like the red, especially when combined with Italian (who doesn't right?).  But I'm really digging the black ones and my dad engrained the "avoid the first model year of each generation" in me a long time ago.  After all of the information you guys have provided I'm less skeptical of 2007's so long as I do my homework.  I just may have to dig out my body shop supplies and paint gun though...

Thanks again guys!  Let me know if there is anything else a serious buyer should be keen to.

Josh

[Huzo]

Careful mate, once you try black, you'never go back !

[Huzo]

Oh, and for the record my rims are Behr, and the entire job cost me €700

[Chuck in Indiana]

From memory..   the bad oil pumps were clustered around the Nov. of 06 build.

[Huzo]

Thankyou Chuck, I hope so

[OlderSlower]

Chuck is right about the build dates on the bad oil pumps.

[Josh1021]

I called about this one this morning.  It was traded in for a new Norge in January.  By chance does anyone know whose bike this may have been?

https://www.motointernational.com/catalog/used-motorcycles-and-scooters/used-2008-moto-guzzi-norge-1200

[jdgretz]

I called about this one this morning.  It was traded in for a new Norge in January.  By chance does anyone know whose bike this may have been?

https://www.motointernational.com/catalog/used-motorcycles-and-scooters/used-2008-moto-guzzi-norge-1200

That's a pretty bike.  I like the black, and if one had been available when I purchased mine, I might have gone that way, but there wasn't and I didn't.  Moto International is one of the best dealers in the states.  I purchased my bike from Dave, sight unseen, and had it shipped down.  If I had had the time available, I would have opted for the Fly N Ride option, had them do the first service on it and then ridden back to Los Angeles.

You can pretty much bet that Dave and his crew have gone through the bike and made any adjustments needed.

For the difference in price between the silver one in MN and the Black one in WA, I'd make the trip to Moto International, stop by one of the saddle makers on the way back to where ever and be way ahead of the game.

Enjoy,

jdg

[guzzibob]

From memory..   the bad oil pumps were clustered around the Nov. of 06 build.

built
I used to maintain a detailed list of these from reports on line. I show 2 built 6/06, 4-6 10/06, 1 or 2 11/06, 1 5/07. There were maybe 2 or 3 others where it really wasn't confirmed or I wasn't sure of the build date. My bike was built 6/07 and so far so good (50k miles). Must say overall I am pretty happy I didn't wait a couple years and wind up with a flat tappet 4V. Haven't seen any new reports of oil pump failures in quite a while-but then I really haven't been looking for them. Even in the cluster months, its only a very few of them. I would think it likely that by now any that were going to fail have failed. Unless a bike has been sitting for a few years.

[Doppelgaenger]

I wholeheartedly recommend going thru Moto International. I go up there at least once a quarter to get some kind of something for the Breva 1100 (same bike, no fairings)

Every single time I go into MI for service, Dave tells me that these are some of the best bikes that guzzi ever made.

As for increasing (maintaining) the resale value... stock panniers that aren't scratched probably help. Guzzis are hard to sell used, the fact that you can get any money for them is already a good thing.

Brakes: There are two alternative sets of pads, some with more initial bite that last less; and some with less that last longer. Either way the brakes on these bikes are top quality and have the best modulation of any brembos I've ever ridden on, the rear brake is especially nice.

Somewhat of a deal breaker is a failed dash. I think it's less prevalent in the norges than the brevas, but a failed dash is going to cost you a decent amount of money to fix, especially if the bike only comes with one key. It's not really a deal breaker, but the price should be adjusted accordingly.

[Huzo]

Great Info All - Thank You Kindly! 

@Huzo, I'll check out your threads.  I'm old enough to appreciate wire wheels, possibly not old enough to afford

Hi Josh, just going over some old forum stuff, the wire wheels aren't too bad if you build them yourself. Mine now have 20,000 k and no dramas

[n9iz]

Sent you a private messages.  I might have one you'd be interested in considering.  Low miles and red!

Jeff

[Josh1021]

7.31.16 Update.  Still on the lookout.  Leaning heavily towards a black low mileage first generation.  Let me know if you have a lead on one.  Thanks!

[PJPR01]

There's also a beautiful blue one for sale on MGNOC classifieds...wish that color had been available in 2008 models...

[jGuz]

Be sure to check the electrical system.  I made the novice mistake of not checking the battery when I bought my 08 Norge and it was all corroded!  I replaced the battery, but still had some electrical starting issues.  I think the circuit that powers the starter has too much resistance and not enough juice reaches the starter.  Right now I'm looking into getting the MPH starter fix kit. 

Other than that, the Norge has been comfy and powerful enough. 

[Josh1021]

Finally landed a Norge yesterday!  2008 Silver (need to make it black/dk blue this winter though)  Thanks for all the help/feedback on this thread.  Prioritizing my accessories wish list now.  Bike came with Helibars (awesome) and smoke windshield (yuck) but no other add ons.  Beyond buying routine maintenance bits, thinking tank or tail bag, phone mount, better mirrors and clear windshield in the short term.  Paint and Suspension in Winter.

[OlderSlower]

Congrats Josh!  Be sure to check and clean connections at battery terminals, I wholeheartedly recommend "Startus Interruptus" upgrade too.  I love my Wolfman Tankbag.  Make sure you carry some extra 15 amp fuses just in case bike won't start.  Enjoy the ride.

[Josh1021]

Update 9.16.16.

Owned the bike just over a month.  Nearly 1000 miles since purchase.  Really enjoying it and starting to mesh with the bike.  I've been able to work on it a bit here and there between rides.  WD 40 has helped a few minor nuisances with lock cylinders, turn signal controls etc.  Took slack out of the throttle which was just the ticket!  The bike came with helibars which I really like, but it required the smallest tank bag GIVI makes that locks into the tank ring.  No biggie, its great to have storage beyond the side bags.  I need to cut the windshield down about 1.5 inches.  I haven't really read up on adjusting the suspension at all. Need to do that.  Don't want to screw it up.  So far its suspension behavior hasn't turned me off any, but maybe could be tweaked.  I won't ride two up until next season.  Got a ram mount for my Garmin which worked out nice, but might move it to the black plastic square place just below the windshield, above the gauges.  I got the all metal fuel filter installed last weekend.  This winter I plan to paint it the black/blue that was available in 2008.  When I do that I'll install the startus interuptus and check other fittings, connections, bolts yada yada.  I got the guzzidiag cables will have to read up on that too.

[ITSec]

Update 9.16.16.

Owned the bike just over a month.  Nearly 1000 miles since purchase.  Really enjoying it and starting to mesh with the bike.  I've been able to work on it a bit here and there between rides.  WD 40 has helped a few minor nuisances with lock cylinders, turn signal controls etc.  Took slack out of the throttle which was just the ticket!  The bike came with helibars which I really like, but it required the smallest tank bag GIVI makes that locks into the tank ring.  No biggie, its great to have storage beyond the side bags.  I need to cut the windshield down about 1.5 inches.  I haven't really read up on adjusting the suspension at all. Need to do that.  Don't want to screw it up.  So far its suspension behavior hasn't turned me off any, but maybe could be tweaked.  I won't ride two up until next season.  Got a ram mount for my Garmin which worked out nice, but might move it to the black plastic square place just below the windshield, above the gauges.  I got the all metal fuel filter installed last weekend.  This winter I plan to paint it the black/blue that was available in 2008.  When I do that I'll install the startus interuptus and check other fittings, connections, bolts yada yada.  I got the guzzidiag cables will have to read up on that too.

If you're going to ride two-up, the factory rear shock simply won't do the job. There are several good choices; I went with HyperPro for both shock and for progressive-rate fork springs - made a world of difference.

A Ram base can be attached to the windshield mount to place the GPS where you mentioned, but it can vibrate a bit more there than in some other locations. Unfortunately, there's nothing behind that black plastic above the instruments that can support any weight. The track for the windshield slider is further forward and difficult to access from behind. I have Ram mounts on both the clutch and brake reservoirs, as well as on the windshield support.

If you are going to ride two-up, get a trunk. Do it before you start painting so you don't have to fuss with color matching.

[Huzo]

Hi Guys,

I'm actively shopping 1st Gen Norge.  A few questions:


3. What add-ons legitimately increase the resale value?

Can't say about re sale value 'cos the bike will never be sold (by me at least) But I use a Touratech mount for my Tom Tom and find it's easy to read and sits smoothly at any revs. It's mounted on the top triple clamp.

[PJPR01]

Upgrade the shock...and leave it on when you sell

Add Heli Bars...and leave them on when you sell

Put an after market seat on...Corbin, Russell Day long...and it might my add value depending on the next riders weight and height...

Add an Agostini or other Top brand muffler, and the proper map to pair it with...

Everything else is not going to add much to resale value...

Everything else is cosmetic