Cal 2 timing chain tensioner...is it necessary?

[brider]

Now that I've got the timing cover off my Cal 2 (again), I ran across a Valtek Timing Chain Tensioner for Big Twins on Ebay. Is something like this desirable or necessary for my engine? I have 45k on the clock, the original rubbing block looks.......like a rubbing block, it looks like it's adjusted as far as it can go to the "tight" side, and the chain is loose to the block.

Should I call it good and just put it back together?

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I'd recommend replacing both the chain (likely stretched) and tensioner.

[Stevex]

You can replace the chain with a replacement Mercedes Benz chain with a split link installed. By doing so you only have to remove the lower oil pump sprocket. I've done it after a recommendation from this forum and fitted a Valtek at the same time. The rubber block is a guide rather than a tensioner and allows the chain to start rubbing on the crank cases eventually.
It really is an easy job; sorry can't remember the MB part number but it's on an earlier post so a search may help.

Update...found my original post, here's the info.

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=64202.0

Fyi, I ordered a replacement split link because the 'c' circlips (in the photo) are very easy to bend and that's what I did to one.
The replacement split link came with an elongated single 'c' clip that is more robust.

[BillinPA]

Definitely replace it and the chain, better performance and ....piece of mind. I did my Cal II with about 15K on the clock. Big difference afterward.

[Two Checks]

Is it needed? Is a pig's butt pork?

[brider]

Definitely replace it and the chain, better performance and ....piece of mind. I did my Cal II with about 15K on the clock. Big difference afterward.

OK now, responses here are united in changing it, but I did a search like I should've first, and overall it's 50/50 as to whether it's "needed" at 45k, or just a good idea.

BillinPA: How did you notice this big difference? My bike runs great now, and I can't detect chain noise, or maybe I just haven't listened for it. I should have phrased my question as "is reliability an issue at 45K?" instead. I truly don't want to deal with pulling an oil pump sprocket if I'm good for another 20k, when my history is that I'll have to pull the timing cover anyway for another ATF pump issue in 10k.....

I guess all that can be written on this tired subject is there for the searching, thanks, guys!

[twhitaker]

The tensioner should be replaced if you follow Charlies float test. FWIW, my bikes still have the original tensioners, u-joints, clutches, etc.

[rodekyll]

THE BOOK IS NOT THE BIKE!!!!  If the chain needs replacing, the miles don't matter.  People are entirely too hung up on published service intervals.  If the literature said you should get three hundred miles from a tank of gas but you run out at 280, do you still ride it that other 20 miles because the book said you could?

Yes, the tensioner is needed unless you go to timing gears.  I don't remember which is the current favorite design. 

[Stevex]

The pump sprocket is easy to remove, just a small nut that's not tight. Now the crank and camshaft sprockets...that's a different kettle of fish; which is why the split link option is so good.
I replaced my chain and tensioner at about 33K and it looked like it was over due then!

[pete roper]

Using a Valtech type tensioner will greatly improve chain life because it will actually tension the chain! The sliding 'Foot' type tensioner was always a cruel joke! Given the fact that your bike is thirty years old I'd definitely swap the chain out and check the sprockets for hooking if the chain has been flopping about.

As for the gear alternative? The only readily available sets are awful. I wouldn't bother. A properly tensioned chain will be good for another 100,000km in a gentle old slug like a Cali II.

Pete

[Tom]

If it's stretched and there is no further adjustment tensioning, I think you answered your question.

[Testarossa]

At this mileaqe with the original rubber-block device there's a good chance the chain has already inflicted some wear on the case. If so you may find aluminum powder in the oil filter. The Valtek tensioner is a bargain and easy to install when you replace the chain -- and you'll notice crisper engine performance.

[bmc5733946]

Main result for me in changing the rubbing block for a true tensioner (Valtek) at 20k miles, was a much steadier timing mark at all engine speeds and overall a much sweeter engine.  I did not replace the chain at that time and still have not with another 20k miles.  I've done several timing chain removals and replacements on other Guzzis for various reasons and I've never felt the need for a non-continous/split  chain.  Line up the marks slide the sprockets on, double check marks are still lined up, line up oil pump key, install nuts, torque to spec, install tensioner spring, done.  Obviously YMMV.

Brian

[Arizona Wayne]

A cam chain normally lasts 100K miles.  Add the Valtek tensioner and be done with it.  What happens if you replace parts before their wear  time?   You just spent $ needlessly.  But the results will be the same down the road.

I already did this scenario on my CX100 and had no regrets using the cam chain for 100K miles. 

[jacksonracingcomau]

Read this one
http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=82037.0

I'd definitely replace chain if I couldn't afford gears. Regularly , hate it when stuff like that happens (only once to me)
I've never seen a timing chain I'd reuse. Stretch is already self evident on OP's,

[BillinPA]

OK now, responses here are united in changing it, but I did a search like I should've first, and overall it's 50/50 as to whether it's "needed" at 45k, or just a good idea.

BillinPA: How did you notice this big difference? My bike runs great now, and I can't detect chain noise, or maybe I just haven't listened for it. I should have phrased my question as "is reliability an issue at 45K?" instead. I truly don't want to deal with pulling an oil pump sprocket if I'm good for another 20k, when my history is that I'll have to pull the timing cover anyway for another ATF pump issue in 10k.....

I guess all that can be written on this tired subject is there for the searching, thanks, guys!

The way it made a performance difference E was through a more accurate and consistent timing mark. It did not turn the 949 into a 1600 but did give better response.

[brider]

Took a REEEEEAAAAL close look at my 45k timing chain, sprockets, and engine case and timing cover. Everything, most notably the sprocket teeth, are pristine and show no visible signs of wear. Chain wrap on largest (top) sprocket was perfect, with no evidence of chain stretch along contact circumference. No evidence of chain contact with case or timing cover.

So, I'll put a tensioner in and call it a day.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Took a REEEEEAAAAL close look at my 45k timing chain, sprockets, and engine case and timing cover. Everything, most notably the sprocket teeth, are pristine and show no visible signs of wear. Chain wrap on largest (top) sprocket was perfect, with no evidence of chain stretch along contact circumference. No evidence of chain contact with case or timing cover.

So, I'll put a tensioner in and call it a day.

But you said:

the original rubbing block looks.......like a rubbing block, it looks like it's adjusted as far as it can go to the "tight" side, and the chain is loose to the block.

To me, that means the chain is stretched and should be replaced. <shrug>

[pete roper]

It's a thirty year old component that costs pennies in the scheme of things. Why not just replace it, fit the tensioner and be done with it?

Pete

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

You'd be shocked at just how worn the chain is if you took it off, extended it out into a loop and held it at the ends, pins pointed up. A new replacement timing chain might sag about 1/2", even a "low-mileage" original often sags 1.5" or more. The original chain wasn't the best quality to start with, likely from one of DeTomaso's "low bid" suppliers.

[Arizona Wayne]

You'd be shocked at just how worn the chain is if you took it off, extended it out into a loop and held it at the ends, pins pointed up. A new replacement timing chain might sag about 1/2", even a "low-mileage" original often sags 1.5" or more. The original chain wasn't the best quality to start with, likely from one of DeTomaso's "low bid" suppliers.

The difference in chain quality/wear is what the tensioner is for, to take up any play in the chain.