96 Daytona Racing, CL, Santa barbara

[chuck peterson]

http://santabarbara.craigslist.org/mcd/5691610900.html

[leafman60]

Very optimistic seller!

[Murray]

He's also got a Magni Australia and a Ghezzi Brian Supertwin up for grabs. TBH 20k for a racing may be a little steep but for Number 100 of 100, I know No1# changed hands for a hell of a lot more than that its not a stretch of the imagination.

[rocker59]

 

Very optimistic seller!

Since those were not officially imported to The USA, and since they were rare as hens' teeth anyway, what would you say something like that is worth to someone who wants it ?

It may be the only one stateside.

[blackcat]

"For the world's oldest motorcycle manufacturer...."

[LowRyter]

Seemed like a good deal for $2000.

Then I looked again.............. . what?

[Mark West]

When LM-I's that were made in large quantities go for 15k, I don't think it's crazy to ask 20k for a factory limited edition bike where there were only 100.

for a collector (and this is a collector bike), its probably a bargain compared to other bikes of similar vintage and rarity.

[Tom]

As an oem modified model, it might find a home with a buyer somewhere at sometime.   

[bmc5733946]

What's up with the forks??  Were/are they upside down or not?

Brian

[Tom]

Regular forks.  They were okay.  They should have put the best suspension bits that they could have got and made it oem.

[Devildog]

As a comparison, a 'Dr John' Daytona is for sale in London, similar mileage, full documentation, for about $23k (£15.5k) asking price. It has been listed for 3-4 months but unsold. Maybe a bit more exclusive than the 'Racing'?

[bmc5733946]

My question arose because the listing says "Marzocchi upside down forks".  Obviously I can see that the forks on the bike are not.  So originally did it have them?  I think the answer is no.  If simple facts like that are wrong, what else is wrong?  Is it really a "Racing" etc.?

Brian

[guzziownr]

Almost exactly what I paid for my 2007 Hyundai minivan.  Does that help put the price in perspective?


*blasphemous photo removed - R59

[ITSec]

Almost exactly what I paid for my 2007 Hyundai minivan.  Does that help put the price in perspective?

*blasphemous photo removed - R59

Haven't you seen that Progressive Insurance ad with the guy and the minivan? 

[LowRyter]

OK, so this a special Daytona.  A special of a special?  OK

[Arizona Wayne]

The fairing says 'racing' on the nose.  I know they were raced in Europe by amateurs.  Did any street bikes have USD forks in `96?  That's 20 years ago.

[lucky phil]

OK, so this a special Daytona.  A special of a special?  OK

This stuff always makes me laugh, how "special" these Daytona's are. If you have ever been inside a Daytona engine and I currently have one on the bench for a rebuild ( plus 6 other cylinder heads)you wouldn't consider them that "special". Lets see, valve guides that wear out seemingly before you're eyes (one of my heads had a guide with 0.030" wear!!! never seen such bad guide wear in anything. ) Alloy cam drive gears that wear rapidly, oil pumps that wear rapidly and break the drive gear and trash the engine, cam followers that wear rapidly, heads that are know to crack from the guide bores, valve recession due to valve seat wear, rocker arm pin wear .
The bottom end and cylinders are fine but the rest of the engine requires some re engineering. Don't even think of buying one with more than 30 or 40,000 klms on it unless you aren't going to ride it or are prepared for a future financial hit. Parts are also getting impossible to come by, cam drive gears, lifters, and cylinder/piston kits mainly.
The Carrillo rods are an unusual version with 3/8 bolts instead of the common 8mm that most big block Guzzi's use.
So if you buy one with any real miles and you expect to put some miles on it then budget for cylinder head rebuilds a new oil pump and drive gears or convert to chain new lifters etc ( did I mention that new lifters if you can find them are $200usd each.)
Of course now there will be a raft of people coming out to tell of their high mileage Daytona/Centauro engines but its all true I'm afraid.
As one Guzzi guy I know said the Daytona/Centauro engines are a little "fragile". He's right.

Ciao         

[Old Jock]

I agree Phil the engine needs quite a bit of cash thrown at it to make it a bit less of a grenade

Get a standard early Daytona, put in a "C" kit and a rear WP shock. Presto you have that bike apart from 2 plates on the trees

The forks look like the standard Marzocchi's

The original rear shock was not that bad the original front forks (IMHO) were, they were nothing short of a disgrace, I hated them but could not afford the dosh to replace them.

Don't take my word as "Cobbie" who raced them or Amedeo of RaceCo

If it floats you boat sure, but I would far prefer a Daytona RS a far more capable bike & cheaper I would imagine

That said I know of a Dr John which went for £12k here in blighty so maybe prices are on the rise, but that is nothing special.

Maybe its just me

John

[rocker59]

The fairing says 'racing' on the nose.  I know they were raced in Europe by amateurs. 

They were also raced in AHRMA, in The USA.

Did any street bikes have USD forks in `96?  That's 20 years ago.

Ducatis, all.

[rocker59]

This stuff always makes me laugh, how "special" these Daytona's are. If you have ever been inside a Daytona engine and I currently have one on the bench for a rebuild ( plus 6 other cylinder heads)you wouldn't consider them that "special". 

Everyone knows the Daytona's frailties.  What makes the bike special is that it exists.  It's a low production street bike, based on a race bike, from a small manufacturer in Italy.

I "get it".  I also know many people don't...

[rocker59]

The original rear shock was not that bad the original front forks (IMHO) were, they were nothing short of a disgrace, I hated them but could not afford the dosh to replace them.
 

The WP shock is good.  I've always liked the one on my Sport 1100.

The Marzocchi M1 forks are not bad.  I added WP springs and 10wt oil to mine and really improved the performance.

The Marzocchi M1 was a very popular fork in the late '80s and early '90s.  I would not consider it a "disgrace".

[Murray]

The forks on the racings are the same as on the latter carburettor sports with six position adjustment the earlier daytonas only had three settings so yes slightly updated but I don't think they were bilt as late as 96 94/93 might be closer to the mark. Yes you can buy a daytona and bring the motor up to C kit spec, have you tried to find a C kit recently?

[Old Jock]

The WP shock is good.  I've always liked the one on my Sport 1100.

The Marzocchi M1 forks are not bad.  I added WP springs and 10wt oil to mine and really improved the performance.

The Marzocchi M1 was a very popular fork in the late '80s and early '90s.  I would not consider it a "disgrace".

Guess we shall just have to beg to differ, on that Rocker. Maybe if I had mine altered like yours it wold have been better but I just did not have the skill or knowledge to even realize these things were possible. I still maintain out the box the forks were............... .................le ts use the euphemism "wanting"

As I recall one leg was compression the other was damping, when I did an oil change on one leg the oil was like new on the other it was black. Raceco did a WP conversion but it was around 1k GBP back in 96. Amedeo was in agreement and said the Marzocchi's really let the bike down.

His bike that went BEARS racing had the WP setup. Cobbie changed his and it ran GSX forks as I recall

Guzzi themselves went to USD WPs later, I do not imagine it was just for a change, the steering damper was also pretty nasty.

The original rear shock was a Koni, I was told it was identical to an F1 car damper and when I got it resprung and the damping altered it was pretty good

It was a great bike on a fast road with long sweepers, but I could not get it to change direction at anything other than geological timescales. I do freely admit I am 140lb weakling and ride like an old woman.

Anyway that's all anecdotal, its just from what I can remember at the time.

I'd still rather have the RS, was it not C kit equipped?

[rocker59]

In addition to the springs and heavier oil, I lowered the front of mine about 20mm.

Add in a set of tires that the bike agrees with, and it can handle.

But you are correct, it can be work in the tight twisties.

[LowRyter]

Almost exactly what I paid for my 2007 Hyundai minivan.  Does that help put the price in perspective?


*blasphemous photo removed - R59

or almost today for an '08 Corvette.

[bigbikerrick]

This stuff always makes me laugh, how "special" these Daytona's are. If you have ever been inside a Daytona engine and I currently have one on the bench for a rebuild ( plus 6 other cylinder heads)you wouldn't consider them that "special". Lets see, valve guides that wear out seemingly before you're eyes (one of my heads had a guide with 0.030" wear!!! never seen such bad guide wear in anything. ) Alloy cam drive gears that wear rapidly, oil pumps that wear rapidly and break the drive gear and trash the engine, cam followers that wear rapidly, heads that are know to crack from the guide bores, valve recession due to valve seat wear, rocker arm pin wear .
The bottom end and cylinders are fine but the rest of the engine requires some re engineering. Don't even think of buying one with more than 30 or 40,000 klms on it unless you aren't going to ride it or are prepared for a future financial hit. Parts are also getting impossible to come by, cam drive gears, lifters, and cylinder/piston kits mainly.
The Carrillo rods are an unusual version with 3/8 bolts instead of the common 8mm that most big block Guzzi's use.
So if you buy one with any real miles and you expect to put some miles on it then budget for cylinder head rebuilds a new oil pump and drive gears or convert to chain new lifters etc ( did I mention that new lifters if you can find them are $200usd each.)
Of course now there will be a raft of people coming out to tell of their high mileage Daytona/Centauro engines but its all true I'm afraid.
As one Guzzi guy I know said the Daytona/Centauro engines are a little "fragile". He's right.

Ciao       

Oh Man, Phil. reading your post convinced me that I dont believe I ever want to own a 4 valve motor older Guzzi. The Centauro  has always called to me, but I dont think I could put up with those headaches, or even worrying about those issues. I guess I have gotten spoiled with the reliability of my "regular" bigblocks.
thanks for the heads up,
Rick

[Tom]

Yeah......the Daytona 1000 does well in the straights, long sweepers but is a chore in tight hairpin mountain roads.

[lucky phil]

Everyone knows the Daytona's frailties.  What makes the bike special is that it exists.  It's a low production street bike, based on a race bike, from a small manufacturer in Italy.

I "get it".  I also know many people don't...

For those of you that "get it" and those of you that don't, you have been duly informed.

Ciao

[lucky phil]

Oh Man, Phil. reading your post convinced me that I dont believe I ever want to own a 4 valve motor older Guzzi. The Centauro  has always called to me, but I don't think I could put up with those headaches, or even worrying about those issues. I guess I have gotten spoiled with the reliability of my "regular" big blocks.
thanks for the heads up,
Rick

Yes, sorry, unless you're well equipped to do your own engine work and/or have deep pockets and the desire then my advice is "stay away".
Of course if you don't really put miles on them or they are just a garage queen then you wont have any issues.

Ciao

[rocker59]

For those of you that "get it" and those of you that don't, you have been duly informed.

Ciao

And we duly appreciate it.