50 worst cities in the U.S. to live in.

[Tom]

The last slide give the criteria/methodology for their choices.  What is surprising is that Ohio has many as California. 

http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/realestate/the-50-worst-cities-to-live-in/ar-AAhIkes?li=BBnbfcN&ocid=U147IDHP&page=32#page=51

[bmc5733946]

Way too hard to wade through all the crap that pops up and prevents normal navigation!!!

Brian

[Tom]

I just clicked through the slides and read if it was an area that I was interested in.  They do go through education, house prices and median income.

[Kent in Upstate NY]

Effin' clickbait. 

[canuck750]

American Home prices are a lot cheaper than those in Canada where the average price of a single family home is $509,000 CDN ($381,000 USD), with Vancouver average single family home costing $1.4 million followed by Toronto at $1.28 million.

The average family income in Canada is $76,000 ($57,000.00 USD).

On average personal taxes are a few percentage points higher in Canada and business tax a few points lower, kind of washes out.

I am always amazed at how much house you can get in the United States in comparison to Canada.

You all ain't got it so bad down there in the sunny south.

[LowRyter]

why would Miami FL be the worst city to live?

I didn't go further.

[Tom]

Combination of median income, cost of living, employment available and crime rate.

[Sasquatch Jim]

 Click bait.  excellent description

[Tom]

I forget the population base they were using then they took one city per county or something like that.

[ITSec]

American Home prices are a lot cheaper than those in Canada where the average price of a single family home is $509,000 CDN ($381,000 USD), with Vancouver average single family home costing $1.4 million followed by Toronto at $1.28 million.

The average family income in Canada is $76,000 ($57,000.00 USD).

On average personal taxes are a few percentage points higher in Canada and business tax a few points lower, kind of washes out.

I am always amazed at how much house you can get in the United States in comparison to Canada.

You all ain't got it so bad down there in the sunny south.

A couple of things to consider - the average Canadian home has MUCH better insulation, windows, roofing than the typical US home (I've owned both sides of the border). To be honest, construction quality is generally better too (except for houses built in Alberta's oil booms). Land prices can have a big influence; price per sq/ft for construction only is a better comparison point. The US has a distorted market as well, since the government (i.e., taxpayers) provides a subsidy to banks by allowing mortgage interest to be deducted from income tax - this is unique to the US, and basically encourages people to buy more house and more expensive mortgages (higher rate).

[Arizona Wayne]

why would Miami FL be the worst city to live?

I didn't go further.

Did you know Florida has lightning fires year round,  high homeowners insurance because of all the storms they have, sink holes, high humidity except in March & October?     1 of our Guzzisti here moved from the panhandle to Missouri after he couldn't take it any more.

[DanD]

Looks like every city in my state except Columbus made that list. 

No wonder the wife keeps wanting to move to Colorado. Not one city on the list was from Colorado and only two western states, WA and AZ, had a city on the list.

Well, other than California which appears to be too darn expensive for common folks to afford.  :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu

[pete roper]

And don't forget that compared to 80% of the rest of the planet even the *Worst* parts of the US are a virtual paradise. It's easy for us 'First World' citizens to find stuff to moan about. Truly we are the luckiest people ever.

[mjptexas]

Didn't see distance to the closest Guzzi dealer as a criteria.

[Dilliw]

Click bait.  excellent description

It's a strange page because it starts on page 51 of 52.  If you hit the "previous" button you actually go through the list without being annoyed like many of the new "click bait" sites.

[ohiorider]

It's a strange page because it starts on page 51 of 52.  If you hit the "previous" button you actually go through the list without being annoyed like many of the new "click bait" sites.

Noticed that.  Going "backwards" was smoother than most pages with multiple screens.

[Two Checks]

How is a tax deduction to the consumer a tax break for the banks? 

[Lannis]

Combination of median income, cost of living, employment available and crime rate.

Sort of like "What is the most comfortable bike?"  or "Who is the Prettiest Woman?", these sorts of surveys don't mean much, since people's personal preferences and personal situations rule completely, not some "scorecard".

If I'm living in ANY city, or, for that matter, ANY part of the countryside, and I have a job and am working, what does "median income" or "cost of living" or "employment available" mean to me?

Sure, if I just dropped out of the sky into a city somewhere with no home and no job, it might make a difference, but people MOVE to cities because they have a job there.   Either their company transfers them, or they answer an advert, but they move there because they have work.

"Median Income" and "Cost of Living" tend to self-align.   I could have made a TON more money in paychecks if I'd worked 25 years in New York City or Houston rather than Central Virginia, but the cost of living is correspondingly different too.   What do I care what the average person makes if I'm making $100K a year and buying a $300K house?

"Crime Rate" is another variable thing.   Even in my little rural county here, where I've never been molested, stolen from, or been the victim of a crime, there ARE areas of the county where that would not have been true.   My brother lived for years in downtown Richmond, Virginia, a "high-crime" area - except that the crime was all drug-dealers shooting each other in their own 'hoods; six blocks in the right direction, and you could leave your bicycle in your yard and no one would take it.

So, to me, these surveys are like "Top Ten Bond Villains" or "Top 20 Retirement Areas" - just click-bait and adverts.   They don't really mean a thing except for entertainment.

Lannis

[Lannis]

And don't forget that compared to 80% of the rest of the planet even the *Worst* parts of the US are a virtual paradise. It's easy for us 'First World' citizens to find stuff to moan about. Truly we are the luckiest people ever.

Yup.   A well-fed man has LOTS of problems.   A hungry man has only one problem ....

Lannis

[Tom]

Y'ep, entertainment.    One variable to throw in that may not be true in your area.  We see an influx of people here that are homeless and have moved here with little money or a job.  Must still be the idea of moving to Hawaii and then finding a job and housing.  Most of the panhandlers are from out of state.

[ITSec]

How is a tax deduction to the consumer a tax break for the banks? 

Not a tax deduction for the banks - a subsidy. It encourages the banks to keep their interest rates higher than they might otherwise be, since the consumer just deducts that paid interest from their taxes due (i.e., the customer shrugs and pays the higher interest knowing he 'gets it back' next April). The banks collects higher interest than they might in a free market, and pays lower taxes on that income than the consumers would (given the way corporate taxes are calculated). The one who ends up carrying the majority of this transferred cost is the government - and in turn, taxpayers.

The argument was always that this deduction would encourage working class and lower middle class  people to become homeowners rather than renters - and back in the 40s, 50s and 60s, it certainly did. However, starting in the 80s, the balance had shifted to people not buying a house and staying there for 20-30 years till the mortgage was paid off, but rather turning from one home to another every 5 years or so. Combined with the growth in the McMansion market, this led to escalating interest costs (payments in early years of a mortgage are almost all interest) and an increasing shift of benefit from the government through consumers to banks.

Can you tell I studied economics in university? 

[Tom]

This would be part of the lecture where my eyes would start to glass over and start to look like a zombie. 

[JJ]

At the end of the day, it does all come down to personal preference, as there is no utopia out there! 

I have lived and worked in NY, CT, TX, (twice) northern CA, (twice), OR, AZ, and Germany for 2 years.  They all have their pros and cons, and I wound up recently moving  from the Phoenix area (could not take the heat anymore...)  to northern AZ (Sedona), which is where I will probably retire and expire.

My late father,(R.I.P.), in his infinite wisdom....used to say:  "If you have money, you can live well anywhere!" 

[Lannis]

Y'ep, entertainment.    One variable to throw in that may not be true in your area.  We see an influx of people here that are homeless and have moved here with little money or a job.  Must still be the idea of moving to Hawaii and then finding a job and housing.  Most of the panhandlers are from out of state.

An island may have a different set of problems than a continent.   Just like it's pretty easy to stay away from the meth houses and crack jungles in most cities, it's also easy to stay away from the places the "homeless" congregate. 

(The double quotes are there for a reason; some folks understand, some won't.  It's really a different problem than what it's called.)

On a tropical island, where you can stay outdoors all year, not so much maybe.

Lannis

[Arizona Wayne]

I'm retired and have found where I plan to live the rest of my life.   Been here 7 years now and no regrets.   Meets all my criteria except close twisty roads.  Everything is paid for except 1 car I bought 1 month ago and it will be  paid for soon. 

[Tom]

An island may have a different set of problems than a continent.   Just like it's pretty easy to stay away from the meth houses and crack jungles in most cities, it's also easy to stay away from the places the "homeless" congregate. 

(The double quotes are there for a reason; some folks understand, some won't.  It's really a different problem than what it's called.)

On a tropical island, where you can stay outdoors all year, not so much maybe.

Lannis

No complaint there. 

[donn]

Combined with the growth in the McMansion market, this led to escalating interest costs (payments in early years of a mortgage are almost all interest) and an increasing shift of benefit from the government through consumers to banks.

I think what you call the McMansion market, here in Seattle we would just call the market.  I've heard of houses selling for $300K more than the asking price.  Under these circumstances - or any kind of sellers' market - that deduction goes to the the seller rather than the buyer - if everyone can afford to pay $100K more, houses will cost $100K more, bet on it.

A lot of these sales are cash, though, not mortgages.  I'm not sure this is a good sign.

[Tom]

That would drive most people to the suburbs or into smaller spaces like high rise condo's.  Not that it would be a bad thing.  Portland comes to mind.