Tonti Framed Bikes - The List

[swooshdave]

I stole this table from Wikipedia.

I'm trying to identify all of the Tonti framed bikes. Is there a simple "start here:end here"?

I assume the start was the V7 Sport and maybe ending with the California III? Or are there bikes after the V11?

Model	Capacity	Production Start	Production End
Normale	498.4cc	1921	1924
Sport 15	498.4cc	1923	1928
GT "Norge"	498.4cc	1928	1930
Sport 14	498.4cc	1929	1930
Sport 15	498.4cc	1931	1939
GT 17 500cc	499cc	1932	1939
GTS	498.4cc	1934	1940
Alce	498.4cc	1939	1945
Egretta	247cc	1939	1940
Airone	246cc	1939	1957
Dondolino 500cc	499cc	1946	1951
Motoleggera 65cc	64cc	1946	1954
Astore	498.4cc	1949	1953
Falcone	498.4cc	1950	1967
Galletto 160/175/192	159/175/192 cc	1950	1966
Cardellino 65	65cc	1954	1956
Cardellino 73	73cc	1956	1962
Cardellino 83	83cc	1962	1965
Zigolo	98cc	1953	1966
Lodola Sport	175cc	1956	1966
Stornello 125/160	123.1/160cc	1960	1975
Dingo 3 marce	48.89cc	1963	1976
Dingo 4 marce	48.89cc	1963	1976
Trotter Special M	48.89cc	1966	1973
V7 700cc	703cc	1967	1977
V750 Ambassador/V750 Special	757cc	1968	1972
V7 750 Sport	748 cc	1971	1974
850 T (Interceptor)	844.05cc	1974	1975
850 T3	844.05cc	1975	1979(?)
850 Eldorado 850GT	844 cc	1972	1975
Nuovo Falcone 500	499cc	1971	1976
Le Mans 850	844.05cc	1975	1978
850 Le Mans II	844.05cc	1979	1981
1000 SP	948.8cc	1977	1985
V50	490.29cc	1977	1979
V35	346.2cc	1977	1980
V1000 Convert	948.8cc	1975	1984
V1000 G5		1979	1985
V50 Monza	490.29cc	1980	1985
Le Mans III	844cc	1981	1984
California II	948.8cc	1981	1987
V65	643.4cc	1982	1987
V35 Custom	346.2cc	1982	1987
850 T5	844.05cc	1983	1987
V65 Lario	643.4cc	1984	1989
Le Mans 1000	948.8cc	1985	1991
California III	948.8cc	1987	1993
Mille GT & Strada	949cc	1987	1991
Nevada 350	346.2cc	1991	2001
Daytona 1000 IE	992cc	1992	1999
1100 Sport	1,064cc	1995	1997*
V10 Centauro	992cc	1996	2001
Quota 1000	948.8cc	1992	1997
Quota 1100 ES	1,064cc	1998	2001
V11 Sport/V11 Le Mans	1,064cc	1998	2006

[swooshdave]

Except for the spine framers  Dave , if you are writing a book , it's already been done ...

 Dusty

Not a book, just a list. Trying to educate myself.

[Arizona Wayne]

You left out some LM IVs, LM Vs,  SPs, `75 to `80 Converts.,

[swooshdave]

From the '71 Telaio Rosso V7 Sport to 2012 California 90 in big-blocks and since Tonti designed the small-block as well, '77 to present with the "mini-Tonti".

I hear "Tonti-frame" and assume big block frame that is nearly identical to the V7 Sport from 1971. Not concerned with the min-anything.

So which of the bikes in the list post-1971 are not Tonti framed?

Anything less that 750cc.

Is that a fair assumption?

[swooshdave]

You left out some LM IVs, LM Vs,  SPs, `75 to `80 Converts.,

Converts were covered here: V1000 Convert   948.8cc   1975   1984
And is this the LM IV and V: Le Mans 1000   948.8cc   1985   1991
And the SP?: 1000 SP   948.8cc   1977   1985

[oldbike54]

 The '67-'74 Eldos and Ambos ran what is called a loop frame .

 Dusty

[Arizona Wayne]

Converts were covered here: V1000 Convert   948.8cc   1975   1984
And is this the LM IV and V: Le Mans 1000   948.8cc   1985   1991
And the SP?: 1000 SP   948.8cc   1977   1985

There is the SP `79 to `82, SPNT `83-`84, SP III `89-`91?  All were 949cc.

[swooshdave]

The '67-'74 Eldos and Ambos ran what is called a loop frame .

 Dusty

Maybe I should have said any model started after 1971 was a Tonti, less the small blocks?

[swooshdave]

There is the SP `79 to `82, SPNT `83-`84, SP III `89-`91?  All were 949cc.

You mean Wikipedia isn't always right????

Here's the list from The Old Tractor, it's pretty comprehensive.

Moto Guzzi V7 Sport, 750 S, 750 S3, 850 T, 850 T3, 850 T3 California, V1000 I-Convert, V1000 G5, 1000 SP, Le Mans, Le Mans II, Le Mans CX 100, Le Mans 1000, 1000 SP III, 1000 S, California II, California III, California 1100, California Jackal, California EV, California EV Touring, California Aluminium, California Titanium, California Special, California Special Sport, California Stone-Metal, California Stone-Touring, California Classic, California Touring, and California Vintage models

[Arizona Wayne]

Maybe I should have said any model started after 1971 was a Tonti, less the small blocks?

I didn't think Tontis started until `75. 

[rodekyll]

The tonti started in '71 and ended way too soon.  RIP!

[Cam3512]

California Vintage was the last.

[Guzzistajohn]

Wikipedia list is missing the CX100

[radguzzi]

What is the note indicated by an Asterisk on the Sport line...? ? ? 


1100 Sport 1,064cc 1995 1997*

[swooshdave]

Wikipedia list is missing the CX100

Is that covered by the LeMans 1000?

[swooshdave]

What is the note indicated by an Asterisk on the Sport line...? ? ? 


1100 Sport 1,064cc 1995 1997*

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Moto_Guzzi_motorcycles#Historic_models

Just noting that the last year (97) was EFI.

[Cam3512]

Someone already mentioned the 2012 California 90 .

 Dusty

Which IS a Calvin in different paint.  Are we saying the same thing?

[redrider90]

Strada was imported in 93 and 94. It does not belong with the Mille. No Strada or Mille in US in 92. Europe had a 92 Mille.

[Arizona Wayne]

You mean Wikipedia isn't always right????

Here's the list from The Old Tractor, it's pretty comprehensive.

Moto Guzzi V7 Sport, 750 S, 750 S3, 850 T, 850 T3, 850 T3 California, V1000 I-Convert, V1000 G5, 1000 SP, Le Mans, Le Mans II, Le Mans CX 100, Le Mans 1000, 1000 SP III, 1000 S, California II, California III, California 1100, California Jackal, California EV, California EV Touring, California Aluminium, California Titanium, California Special, California Special Sport, California Stone-Metal, California Stone-Touring, California Classic, California Touring, and California Vintage models

I may be wrong but don't think the LM II(844cc) was ever sold in the USA, instead the CX100 was.  LM II was sold in Canada.  CX had the SP(949cc) motor that was cleaner running.  That was the only difference between the 2  except for maybe the headlight lense too.

[swooshdave]

I may be wrong but don't think the LM II(844cc) was ever sold in the USA, instead the CX100 was.  LM II was sold in Canada.  CX had the SP(949cc) motor that was cleaner running.  That was the only difference between the 2  except for maybe the headlight lense too.

http://www.motorcycleclassics.com/classic-italian-motorcycles/classic-moto-guzzi-motorcycles/moto-guzzi-le-mans-cx100-zmmz15mjzhur.aspx

Good call.

[Guzzistajohn]

Is that covered by the LeMans 1000?

Don't think so. 948 was on two models me thinks

[guzzista]

All the small blocks ( pre Breva 750) are also Tonti designs  therefore are Tontis. Also , notice that the " This Old tractor" list is missing the Bassa, which indeed is ...a Tonti

[JayDee24ca]

Is the '87 SPII considered a Mille? or Strada?I don't see it on the list.
JD

[Arizona Wayne]

Don't think so. 948 was on two models me thinks

None  of the Le Mans models were really 1,000cc as none of the 1,100 Guzzi models are that size(really 1064cc).  MG likes to round off displacement sizes.   

[Arizona Wayne]

Is the '87 SPII considered a Mille? or Strada?I don't see it on the list.
JD

The SP II is a different model from the Mille or Strada, though they all had the same motor but maybe different size carbs, among other things.   My memory is fading............. .The Strada was a SP III w/o the fairing basically.  The SP IIs had 16" front wheels.  Each model was a little different 1 way or another.  This is what Moto Guzzi does over time.  They come out with a model in X configuration...... .when they think it's sales run is over they take the same motor and put a new dress on it.  Kind of like what US car Co's do with X motors/frames. 

[swooshdave]

None  of the Le Mans models were really 1,000cc as none of the 1,100 Guzzi models are that size(really 1064cc).  MG likes to round off displacement sizes.   

They weren't the only ones. The displacement on a 900SS is eerily similar to an 860GT.

[swooshdave]

All the small blocks ( pre Breva 750) are also Tonti designs  therefore are Tontis. Also , notice that the " This Old tractor" list is missing the Bassa, which indeed is ...a Tonti

From what I gather Tonti = Tonti-framed big block descended from the legendary V7 Sport. It also was used to distinguish from the Loop Frame.

Someone else can catalog the small blocks. 

[swooshdave]

Is the '87 SPII considered a Mille? or Strada?I don't see it on the list.
JD

What was the start and end years for the SP II?

[Arizona Wayne]

What was the start and end years for the SP II?

I think `85-`87 in the U.S.A.

[pauldaytona]

  This will be fairly complete

ZGU       Type
ZGUVV       1000S 1989-1994
ZGUVG       1000SP 1979-1983
ZGUVF       850 LE MANS III 1981-1984
zguvd       850 T3 E DERIVATI CALIF./T4/POL./CC/PA 850 1979-1985
zguvr       850 T5 III SERIE CIVILE 850 1985-1988
zguvr       850 T5 POLIZIA 850 1994-1995
zguvr       850 T5 POLIZIA VECCHIOTIPO 850 1985-1989
zguvr400 zgrvu4000       850 T5 POLIZIA/CC/PA (NC) 850 1995-2001
zguvr3641       850 T5 POLIZIA/CC/PA/NC 850 1988-1993
ZGUKC,ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA 1100 1994-1997
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA ALUM./TIT. PI CAT. 1100 2003-2004
ZGUKDM00,ZGUKDU00       CALIFORNIA BLACK EAGLE 1100 2009-2011
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA CLASSIC-TOURING 1100 2006-2008
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA EV (V11 EV USA) 1100 1997-2000
ZGUKDC12       CALIFORNIA EV PI CAT. 1100 2003-2005
ZGUKDC11       CALIFORNIA EV/EV TOURING PI 1100 2002
ZGUKDE,ZGUKDG       CALIFORNIA EV/EV TOURING/80 1100 2001-2002
ZGUVT       CALIFORNIA II 1000 1983-1986
ZGUVW       CALIFORNIA III CARBURATORI 1000 1987-1993
ZGUVY       CALIFORNIA III CARBURATORI CARENATO 1000 1988-1990
ZGUVY       CALIFORNIA III INIEZIONE 1000 1990-1993
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA JACKAL 1100 1999-2001
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA SPECIAL 1100 1999-2000
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA SPECIAL SPORT 1100 2001-2002
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA SPECIAL SPORT/AL. PI 1100 2002
ZGUKD        CALIFORNIA STONE 1100 2001-2002
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA STONE/METAL PI 1100 2002
ZGUKD       CALIFORNIA STONE/TOURING PI CAT 1100 2003-2004
ZGUKDU, ZGUKDP       CALIFORNIA VINTAGE 1100 2006-2010 - ROYAL HASHEMITE COURT 2011

VE 11111    VE 13040   Le Mans 850.1 (1975 - 1976)
VE 13041   VE 18146   Le Mans 850.2 (1977 - 1978)
VE 18147   VE 25481   Le Mans II (1978 - 1980)
VD 11111 - VD 26537 - 850 T3 (3 disk brakes, 1975 - 1985)
VD 11478 - VD 22640 - 850 T3 California (1975 - 1983)
VD 21345 - VD 26537 850 T4 (light alloy, 1980 - 1983)
VE 11111    VE 13040   Le Mans 850.1 (1975 - 1976)
VE 13041   VE 18146   Le Mans 850.2 (1977 - 1978)
VE 18147   VE 25481   Le Mans II (1978 - 1980)
VF 11111 - VF 20700 - Le Mans III (1981 - 1984)
VG 11111 - VG 25693 -V 1000 I Convert (1975 - 1985)
VG 18744** -VG 25693 V 1000 G5 (1978 - 1985)
VG 18781**- VG 25693 1000 SP & 1000 SP-NT/80 (1978 - 1983)
VH 11111 - VH 12229 1000 SP II (1984 - 1987)
VH 30000   VH 34685   1000 GT ( 1987 - 1988)
VH 30000**   VH 34685   1000 GT - RL (1989 - 1993)
VK 11111   VK 11261   V7 Sport 'Telaio Rosso' (Red frame)
VK 11111 - VK 13842 -V7 750 Sport (1972 - 1974)
VK1 11111 - VK1 12315 750 S (1974 - 1975)
VK2 15000 - VK2 15998 750 S3 (1975 - 1976)
VN 11111- VN 11901   1000 SP III (1988 - 1996)
VN 20001   VN ...   1000 Strada RR (1994)
VN 20106   VN ...   1000 Strada RL (1994)
VR 11111 VR 13115 850 T5 frontwheel 16", rearwheel 16" (1983 - 1989)
VR 14001 - VR 14400 850 T5 frontwheel 16", rearwheel 18" (1984 - 1989)
VR 30001 - VR 36416 850 T5 P.A. (1986 - 1994)
VR 40001   VR ...   850 T5 P.A. (1995 - ...
VT 11111 - VT 20479 California II 944 cc (1981 - 1987)
VT 24596   VT ...   Mille GT(vervolg)
VT 32542   VT ...   California III (vervolg)
VU 111383   VU...   CX 100 (1980)