CAD question NGC

[lucian]

I was wondering if anyone here has a recommendation for a user friendly cad program for use in the design of residential homes , additions ect. I have always done this the old fashion way on a drafting board and have a pretty thorough understanding or mechanical drawing. I have no experience with cad and am marginal at best with computer skills. Could a neanderthal like me make use of one of these programs ? I really do not have the time to take a course currently and was curios if I would be wasting my money without a better understanding of computers. TIA dave

[Chuck in Indiana]

Yeah, you can do it. I don't have any recommendations, though. It's been 19 years since I designed Castle Pretentious with the aid of a $40 program, so I'm out of date a little. 

[Groover]

SketchUp. Lots of custom content out there and lots of support. It used to be free, now it's not. I think you get 8 hours of continuous use before you need to activate it. How's that for a timed challenge on getting the plans done 

Link: http://www.sketchup.com/download

[charlie b]

It does depend on if you want a 3D program or a 2D.  I use Draftsight from Dassault for a lot of work, mainly cause it is free and it is compatible with Autocad type commands.  That can be a bad thing as well since some complain about a steep learning curve with Autocad.  And Dassault also sells Solidworks, a high end 3D system.  If you are military or a student you can get a 1yr license for next to nothing.  Learning curve is steep.

I have used 3D stuff before but still keep going back to 2D for basic structures.

Sketchup is probably one of the easier to learn 3D packages out there with a TON of plugins available in the open.  The advantage with 3D for something like a house is you can 'see' it better.  It worked well for me when I designed a trailer interior.

[Bill Owens]

For 2D check out Delta Cad

[Triple Jim]

I use Draftsight here too, because it's available for LInux, and compatible with AutoCAD files and (generally) commands.

In my experience, learning any large program takes a month of significant daily use.  Whether it's going to a different operating system, learning a programming language like C, or learning a CAD program, at first it feels clumsy, wastes time making you search for the right commands and procedures, and requires consulting help files.  Somewhere along the way it seems to start working better, you know where to look for things, and in the case of a CAD program, you actually start drawing faster and better than you can do with a pencil.  That takes about a month of significant daily use.  Hoping it will go faster just results in frustration, and often, abandonment.

[old head]

sketchup make 2016, its free does eveyrything you need to do a house.

several plugins that will do a lot of the work for you.

been using for about 10 years, great program.

 1001 tools is an excellent free plugin

Old Head

[nobleswood]

Okay I'll jump into this one.

I began drafting with pencil & drafting table, plan , elevation etc. I started using AutoCAD because I could continue drawing the way I was used to. Learning to use the icons took time but now I am faster & more professional than using a pencil.

Sketchup appealed to me but I could not figure out how to shape parts with precision rather than just 'sculpting' shapes. So I drifted away from it. Guidance here would be appreciated.

My advise is to get to your local Community College & sign up for an AutoCAD course. If you're looking at working with a CAD program it won't be wasted time because you will be learning the basic & common working methods that go along with most of the CAD programs. This will help with that steep learning curve.

Often as a student there are deals to get you started with one program or another. I believe now with online programs you can pay a monthly 'subscription', which lowers the cost of jumping in to CAD.

One of the biggest advantages for me has been the ability to 'Copy & Paste' whole sections of drawings, allowing you to explore how a variation might look without too much effort and re-use designs from past projects easily.

Good luck.

[Triple Jim]

Draftsight is free.

[oldbike54]

 Lucian , I am a complete computer dummy . Seriously , most everything I can manage on one of these contraptions is done by accident , and any kind of success is always a surprise . However , almost 20 years ago there was a GF going through drafting school , and after several missteps , a bit of colorful language , and threatening her computer with a hammer , I managed to navigate whatever autocad system we had installed . Unfortunately , I never could teach her how to use it , how she made it through 4 years of school is still a mystery . Well , actually not a mystery , she was very pretty and charming , the professors awarded the equivalent of "gentleman's C's" . Point is , if I could figure the autocad system from 20 years ago out , you can most certainly do so now .

 Dusty

[nobleswood]

Picking up on Oldbike54's comment; with AutoCAD I could continue to draw the way I was used to just using a virtual piece of paper.

For example last winter a client asked for perspective drawings of the several versions of the cabinets I was to build her so she could make her decision. I know AutoCAD can create 3D images but I don't know how to do that. So I 'drew'  with 3 vanishing points as if I was on a drafting table.

It can be frustrating learning the instructions but it is worth it

[Chuck in Indiana]

Hmmm, all this talk of Autocad.. its a steep learning curve, indeed.
Shirley there's a dedicated stand alone program strictly for designing a house?? After you get it designed, it will spit out a bill of materials, etc.?  Won't let you put in a 'fridge where a fridge won't fit? The one I used let you draw in 2D, then place a "camera" and it would show what it looked like in 3D. Dorcia, like many wimmens, can't visualize in 3D, so it was a good thing.
No, I haven't looked, but there was 19 years ago... on a floppy.

[lucian]

Thank's to all of you for the replies, and votes of confidence. I have heard from others in the trade that the learning curve was very steep and one guy I used to work with took a course and still ditched it. That was 25 years ago and I'm sure more user friendly programs must be available today. I actually enjoy drawing the traditional way, but I am sure I am spending way more time than may be necessary with today's technology. I figure with winter coming I may as well try learning something new. Who knows , maybe I'll even get a cell phone someday. I really appreciate all of the knowledgeable people on this board, many thanks. dave


        Guzzi's rule

[Swedemoto]

I have been doing residential design for a long time, from board to CAD. It is definitely worth your while to jump in to CAD as it while be easier to change your design as it progresses or budget limits dictate. You might want to explore a few different cad programs to see which one you like and should look to keep your drawings in a format (ex, dwg or dxf) that you can load in each one.
I just looked at Draftsight, which looks fine and similar to Autocad, especially for free. The problem with Autocad and the like is that they are vanilla and not geared for Architecture out of the box. It is a waste to have to draw in 2D and not be able to take advantage of a 3D model.
You might consider drawing a 2D floor plan and importing it into something like Sketchup Make and drawing the model. As someone already pointed, there are plenty of free add-ons geared towards Architecture.

[Groover]

if this is for hobby or just a personal project, then free or cheap software is a great option. If you are a business in building homes and want to wow your clients and be better than the competition, then look into a professional package. Autodesk is the leader on the industry (Autocad, Revit, etc) and you can always hire an entry level CAD operator, though with revit you'd need to hire above that (soneone that understand the trade, as the objects contain more than just lines). The good with professional grade software is that there are many YouTube channels dedicated to them that with enough time and patience, you can be up and running fairly quickly.

Both AutoCAD and Revit come in Architectural flavors and a lot of content is there. These packages are not cheap though, your looking at 3-8k for a single seat and you will need to upgrade eventually, hence the subscription options make sense in this case.

It all depends on your plans (no pun intended ;-) )

[AJ Huff]

What about ETeks Sweet Home 3D ? I've only dabbled with it. Nothing serious. Available in Linux or Windows.

-AJ

[Matt Story]

For example last winter a client asked for perspective drawings of the several versions of the cabinets I was to build her so she could make her decision. I know AutoCAD can create 3D images but I don't know how to do that. So I 'drew'  with 3 vanishing points as if I was on a drafting table.

in Acad, 2d can be turned 3D by 'extruding' your 2D geometry.  The actual command is 'extrude'.  Its very quick, but your geometry must be closed with perfectly trimmed intersections at the vertexes.  Also the 2D has to first be a 'polyline' or closed 'region' before extruding.  After you have 3d solids, you can then join (add) them together, subtract one from another, etc

I might design a house in Acad (or Draftsight which is nearly interchangable), but I have 25 years designing machines with it.  I don't think I would want to climb the learning curve for one project.  It might open unexpected doors though.

These days, I work almost exclusively in 3D cad environments.  I went to school learning on the board.  When I went to work there was very little pencil work and jumped right into Acad at its dawn.  When 3D became feasible software and hardware-wise, the industry began to switch over.  Now using Solidworks (not what you want) for 8+ years.  That being said there is a bit of a paradigm shift from paper to 2D and a big one from 2D to 3d from a process, usage and learning perspective.  I would counsel new students to jump right to a 3D application and skip the middle step.

I have not designed much architecture with Acad, and can't say what new programs would be best.  I wouldn't be surprised if a home building supply store sponsored one that could help with a bill of materials and costing...

Whatever program you choose, Youtube is your friend when it comes to help.  Search there for specific tutorials about the task at hand in your specific program.  You might want to search there about what software would be best for your need.

[Triple Jim]

if this is for hobby or just a personal project, then free or cheap software is a great option. If you are a business in building homes and want to wow your clients and be better than the competition, then look into a professional package.

No disrespect meant, but it sounds like you haven't used Draftsight.

[Groover]

I have not used that software.

[AJ Huff]

Here's a link http://www.sweethome3d.com/

What about ETeks Sweet Home 3D ? I've only dabbled with it. Nothing serious. Available in Linux or Windows.

-AJ

[nobleswood]

It always astounds me the range of knowledge & skills found on this website.

Matt, thanks for the tip: I will look into that.

[old head]

Autocad is on  the way out, Revit, and other BIM software is where the market is heading.  I have used Revit, autocad, sketchup, Chief Architect, and a couple other programs since I graduated with a BS in ARCH in 2010.

It really depends on what how much you are going to use it, and your tolerance for learning different systems.  I drew with parallel bars and arms for awhile in the 70's and 80's before I got out of the business.

came back to get my degree late in life, and the learning curve was pretty steep for an older student who wasn't really into computer games and such.  I did it, but it takes time.

For houses, if you want a BIM program, Chief Architect was easier to learn and faster to get up to speed than REVIT.  Its also a lot cheaper.  chief Architect has limitations, but for doing houses it would be my choice, unless I was working with other professionals, engineers, contractors, and others.  REVIT is becoming the goto program like Autocad used to be.

Autocad is good for floor plans but is difficult to do 3d modeling compared to other programs.  I do like autocad as it can do a lot, and isn't hard to learn.

Sketchup is a great 3d modeling program, easy to use, lots of options that make modeling very easy.  Everyone uses sketchup.  I have done several houses in sketchup, and it is easy to show people what they are getting.  lots of premade components like furniture, kitchen items, materials that you can paint in sketchup to make it look photo quality with rendering. 

search for sketchup3d warehouse and take a look at what you can do, it is really amazing.

I design outdoor structures and only use sketchup.  If a customer wants to send me a DWF file, I just import it into sketchup draw on top of it, or use it as base.  sketchup creates cut sheets for our guys to cut out, and it really helps the customer visualize what they are getting.

3d is the way to go, it is steeper curve, but it will save tons of time over 2d autocad.

Old Head

[Rick4003]

I use Autodesks Fusion 360, it is very close to their Inventor program, but it is a cloud based program so you don't need to have a huge program or a very powerful computer to use it. And it is free for private persons and small startup businesses. I don't know if I would like to model a house in it but it has the capability.

I like it, but I'm no where near a pro in this stuff. Amateur at best.

-Ulrik

[lucian]

Thank's for all the great info. I spent a couple of hours on sketchup tutorials last night and actually drew my first 3d box with cad. I think I will stay with this for a while and see where it leads, a lot to learn but seems pretty intuitive once you figure out what all the tools do and how to best use them. I like the fact that all it's functions are to an actual scale in either in. or mm as some programs aren't. I have a friend that uses a version of it for cabinet design and is going to give me some help also. For now I cannot see it replacing my drafting board, but it definitely seems as though it's worth the effort to learn the basics. Again, thank's for the responses.

[oldbike54]

 Not to  :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu , but it helps in designing a house if one knows the difference twixt a joist and a rafter , the GF mentioned earlier claimed that those terms , along with other important details , like how doors are sized , were not taught in drafting school . Problem was , having read her text books and other material , yes , those terms were explained , although maybe their importance wasn't stressed enough 

 Dusty

[Triple Jim]

...but it helps in designing a house if one knows the difference twixt a joist and a rafter.

My house has purlins and girts, as well as joists.  How often do you hear about those items?   

[oldbike54]

My house has purlins and girts, as well as joists.  How often do you hear about those items?   

 Yeah , we were discussing "King Studs" on a remodel , later the female home owner mentioned that we had a very high opinion of ourselves 

 Dusty

[DonT]

My suggestion is to stick with pencil, paper, and a drafting board.  You already know how to use them.  What advantage is there to using CAD on small projects with only one person preparing the drawings?  By the time you get to your third major revision, then you start saving time with CAD.  I am a licensed architect, one man shop for 30 years.  Every few years I make another major attempt to switch to CAD.  After a couple of hours of total focus, working the commands : Line, rotate, fillet, mirror, snapping on and off etc., I do get into it, I look up and realize I could have drawn the thing my hand in about 15 minutes.  It does make nice title blocks. 

[Demar]

I was on a drafting board when I first started working. I would fill up an "E" drawing over a months time designing stamping dies. I always hated having to erase a complete view to move it over on the paper to make room for an auxiliary view I didn't know I needed until after weeks of drawing. Some guys would tape an 8 x 11 piece of vellum to the drawing to add a view. It didn't happen often but it did happen. AutoCAD was fantastic in that you could move entire views, with attached dimensions, around the sheet without having to redraw. It also made it very easy to scale views and adding a section view at a different scale was a no brainer.... copy a section at a different scale without having to redraw. Even though it was only 2D it saved a lot of time.

[lucian]

My suggestion is to stick with pencil, paper, and a drafting board.  You already know how to use them.  What advantage is there to using CAD on small projects with only one person preparing the drawings?  By the time you get to your third major revision, then you start saving time with CAD.  I am a licensed architect, one man shop for 30 years.  Every few years I make another major attempt to switch to CAD.  After a couple of hours of total focus, working the commands : Line, rotate, fillet, mirror, snapping on and off etc., I do get into it, I look up and realize I could have drawn the thing my hand in about 15 minutes.  It does make nice title blocks.

I totally understand where you are coming from. I have been drawing residential home and addition plans for 35 years on velum. The reason I have become more interested in cad is mainly that blue ray machines are non existent at local print shops anymore, and large scale copies are pricey and often lack clarity on fine details. Another benefit of cad I hoped for is the ability to take 2d elevations and convert them to iso views. Surely I am a long way from being able to fully utilize cads advantages, and I agree that in the end it may not save me any time drawing what I need for any one particular job. I will proceed with caution.

thanks for your advice