Rattle Left Cylinder Head

[scra99tch]

Stuck my ear right on the valve cover and its almost unmistakable that there is a slight rattle just off idle.  It is separate from the valve ticking that can be heard at idle.

Any ideas?

Timing chain tensioner, failing push rod, worn tappet?

30k 2007 Vintage.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Rocker arm moving back and forth? 
I'd probably go with earplugs for this one.. after I pulled a valve cover and had a good look. <shrug>

[scra99tch]

Seems to go away when engine heats up, been in the mid 20's here, and I've started the bike only 2 times this winter.

[pehayes]

Loose exhaust header?
Exhaust header touching the frame?

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[oldbike54]

 Why are you placing your head on the tappet cover ? Isn't that just asking for trouble ?

 "I tell ya it's makin' a funny noise Bob" 

 Dusty

[scra99tch]

I'll look, when I get home. 

[scra99tch]

Why are you placing your head on the tappet cover ? Isn't that just asking for trouble ?

 "I tell ya it's makin' a funny noise Bob" 

 Dusty

Had to heat up my ears.

[oldbike54]

Had to heat up my ears.

  What do you say judges ? OK , they accept that answer 

 Dusty

[Two Checks]

Sizzle of burning flesh?

[sidecarnutz]

I thought that in most Guzzi's, loud valves save lives?? ;-)

[pete roper]

Don't start the bike when you can't ride it in winter. It's doing it more harm than good.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Don't start the bike when you can't ride it in winter. It's doing it more harm than good.

That almost got me killed a couple of years ago.  I wanted to work on the Lario down in the shop. It was snowing and blowing up a storm. Thought, "Oh, no problem, I'll just push it. It's down hill.." Even at that, it was a long hard push. Made it to the hanger apron, and it was ice covered. Started sliding, but got the sidestand down without loosing it. Then.. I realized I was puffing and blowing like a whale. Saw a guy coming down the same path dressed in a black hooded coat. He laid his scythe on the Lario, opened his Ipad, scrolled down, and said, "Come along Mr. Stottlemeyer.." I said, no..no.. there must be some mistake. I'm not ready yet." He said, "You can't imagine how many times I've heard that." I grabbed his Ipad, said lemme see. Scrolled down, and sure enough, the name was spelled wrong. Happens all time. I said, "Stottlemyer..there's no e" He looked and said, "Oh, sorry.. you're right. Didn't mean to startle you. You should probably rethink doing what you are doing at your age, though. Have a nice day.."
True story. 

[oldbike54]

 Almost done in by a clerical error Chuckie ?

 Dusty

[Bill Owens]

That almost got me killed a couple of years ago.  I wanted to work on the Lario down in the shop. It was snowing and blowing up a storm. Thought, "Oh, no problem, I'll just push it. It's down hill.." Even at that, it was a long hard push. Made it to the hanger apron, and it was ice covered. Started sliding, but got the sidestand down without loosing it. Then.. I realized I was puffing and blowing like a whale. Saw a guy coming down the same path dressed in a black hooded coat. He laid his scythe on the Lario, opened his Ipad, scrolled down, and said, "Come along Mr. Stottlemeyer.." I said, no..no.. there must be some mistake. I'm not ready yet." He said, "You can't imagine how many times I've heard that." I grabbed his Ipad, said lemme see. Scrolled down, and sure enough, the name was spelled wrong. Happens all time. I said, "Stottlemyer..there's no e" He looked and said, "Oh, sorry.. you're right. Didn't mean to startle you. You should probably rethink doing what you are doing at your age, though. Have a nice day.."
True story. 

[Chuck in Indiana]

Almost done in by a clerical error Chuckie ?

 Dusty

It was close.. but made me think. Old farts shouldn't do stuff they did when they were in their 40s without giving it a thought.
Nevertheless,  I still hate to start an air cooled engine unless I'm going to let it get up to operating temperature.

[lorengo70]

Hi scra99tch. did you ever find out what was causing the rattling noise? My V7 II has about 26k km and its making the same noise you mentioned your bike makes (the noise started about 5k km ago). It seems like the noise (which sounds like coins being rattled in a tin box) is coming from both cylinders. The noise gets louder when I start driving at low revs (3,000 rpm or so). It disappears (or at least quiets down) after the engine gets hot. I have adjusted the valves, checked all screws and other fastenings and everything is tight. Not sure if I should just wear earplugs (i.e. ignore) or worry about it.

Any thoughts? Thanks.

[scra99tch]

Nope rode it all summer and issue was not there.  I have a hard time recollecting the actual noise I heard.

[lorengo70]

Ok, thanks for the reply. Good to hear it disappeared on its own.

[Orange Guzzi]

Rod small end bearing worn and allowing the piston to slap/rock in the cylinder.  Sounds like a knock.  Happens in the lower rpm range. 

[guzzisteve]

Just a cold bike. That's all. Perfect time to put in roller rockers

[Chuck in Indiana]

I keep telling folks to wear earplugs, but no...... they gotta put their ears on the valve covers. 

[normzone]

I went through that - earplugs were my solution.

[guzzisteve]

Just noise, sounds normal if that's all you hear. Some don't own other brands.

[pete roper]

Some people are determined to find something wrong with their bikes! Why? Are your lives incomplete unless you have something to moan about???

[Orange Guzzi]

Some people are determined to find something wrong with their bikes! Why? Are your lives incomplete unless you have something to moan about???

My opinion is, if it is not broke when I get back from a ride, I did not ride it hard enough. Rev-limiters have probably extended the life of motorcycle engines more so than oil changes and other maintenance.   I ride for the fun of it.  It is all about recreational riding.  I have owned many motorcycles and have never blown one up or totally destroyed the engine.  Other parts, that is another issue.  Usually perishable parts worn out. 

My 2003, 1100 has hydro lifters.  If it starts knocking, I'm heading to the garage.  If it gets out of the low 40's f, I heading for a ride. I hate cold weather. 

[TOMB]

I had the same problem on my convert turns out it was the wrist pin bushing and the wrist pin replaced them both the bushing and the wrist pin and noise is now gone now I have to think about doing the other side.Probally rode 30k with that noise
TOMB

[yogidozer]

Seems to go away when engine heats up, been in the mid 20's here, and I've started the bike only 2 times this winter.

before you panic and start tearing things apart, what weight oil you using? you say it only happens now that temps are in the 20's, and goes away when it warms up 

[lorengo70]

Thanks for all the replies. I use the recommended oil weight 10w60. I am inclined to ignore the noise. My concern is that it wasnt there before and that it might be a symptom of something bigger (more expensive) down the road. As far as when it happens, its nothing to do with outside temperature (just engine needs to get hot for it to quiet down). I have ridden it at 30c and 5c and same noise at the start and for about 10 minutes or so after riding.

With respect to TOMB's suggestion/comment: "...turns out it was the wrist pin bushing and the wrist pin replaced them both the bushing and the wrist pin and noise is now gone now...", not sure what that means but will pass that comment along to the dealer/mechanic when I see him next.

With regards to Orange Guzzi's comment: "..Rod small end bearing worn and allowing the piston to slap/rock in the cylinder.  Sounds like a knock.  Happens in the lower rpm range". Wonder if its normal for that kind of bearing to be worn after 26k km and why it would only happen a low RPMs and why it disappears later on when the engine is hot.  Once again, will bring that suggestion over to my mechanic and see what he has to say. Btw, I have talked to my mechanic before about this and problem is bike is always hot when i get there so he cant hear the noise and i have been very impatient about leaving my bike there overnight as he is pretty far from my home and i ride my bike every day.

With regards to GuzziSteve comment: "Just noise, sounds normal if that's all you hear. Some don't own other brands." Yes, MG's are noisy engines and I am fine with that. The noise that I am concerned about, was not there for the first 20k km.

Once again, thank you all for your suggestions. Will just wear earplugs and ride. The riding season is almost over here in Toronto and will be taking my bike to the mechanic sometime in the spring. Will keep you posted as to what the diagnosis is.
Cheers.

[rodekyll]

Could be the timing chain or kickstand spring.

I have a similar rattle on the trike engine.  It's a new 1200 2-valve -- not a rebuild.  I was getting ready to tear into it at about 3k miles when I put my stethoscope on it here and there -- and discovered that the rattle is the PCV valve check ball.

Another time the same sort of thing was happening -- off-idle rattle, only sometimes, usually noticed it cold.  It sounded more like an exhaust header hammering on the frame.  In the course of snooping I managed to reproduce the rattle -- by tapping on my Nautilus compact air horn.  The plastic trumpet part had come loose and was buzzing against the metal compressor.

Then there was the time I borrowed an SP for some reason and had an annoying rattly sound that sometimes buzzed the left handlebar and sometimes just made noise.  It was unusual enough that I pulled over and gave it a good walkaround.  The left front caliper bolts were almost completely backed out.  Oddly, the brakes felt normal until I tightened it up.  Then I could feel a definite pulsation and "wheel surge" of a rotor not in-plane.  I don't know which caused which, but I got the SP back to the owner in a slow hurry.

So your noise can be anything or nothing.  Winter is a good time to look for it.

[lorengo70]

Guzzi Steve: Do V7 IIs need roller rockers?