1977 Le Mans running and on the road

[canuck750]

A finishing touch, fitting the reproduction side covers

new badge crimp clips



gently push them flush to the outside of the cover



start the emblem, flip the cover over with the emblem on a flat bench and push the cover over the emblem pins, slowly!



Nice original emblems cleaned up nice



Now to fit the rubber grommets, problem is the fiberglass is formed 3 x as thick as it should be to allow the grommet to snap into place



out comes the dremel again, this is nerve racking, cutting enough of the fiberglass down and hoping not to hit an air bubble in the gel or crack the tab

1st to ream out the holes so to the right size



and very slowly get down to this



Only punched two holes in my thumb pressing the grommets into position with a fine flat blade screw driver





And then it binds on the brake arm



more trimming and a black sharpie to touch up the ground edge



left side went on without issues



tight carb clearance on the left



lots of room on the right



a 10 minute job that only took 2 hours

[TRw1]

Jim,

Great detail work and patience as always!

What's the deal with the reproduction cover?  Is the quality so poor that it is not manufactured to the same dimensions as the original ones were?  Is that typical of reproduction parts for the older bikes?

Ted

[Groover]

Loving that deep red color. Everything is looking great!

[canuck750]

Jim,

Great detail work and patience as always!

What's the deal with the reproduction cover?  Is the quality so poor that it is not manufactured to the same dimensions as the original ones were?  Is that typical of reproduction parts for the older bikes?

Ted

I bet the mold was taken off an original side cover and then fiberglass laid up without regard for the thickness, the top edge is thin like the original but the face and flange is very thick, typical of fiberglass reproductions, originals are plastic and on this bike (and most others probably) the tabs that hold the grommets are broken. To remove the side cover care must be taken to grasp the back side of the grommet and fiberglass and gently pull the grommet free of the steel pin attached to the frame. I have had reproduction parts for other  bikes and at best the fit is adequate, similar to the fairing one has to drill all new mounting holes and transferring the original hole locations with a paper pattern can be tough, especially on compound curves like the fairing. It would be great if the folks that made the reproductions drilled all the holes.

[TRw1]

Interesting stuff.  Thanks for the education.

[canuck750]

Fitting a pair of new petcocks, I hate risking a fire on old leaky petcocks,

I punch a mark at the OFF position and wipe a dab of red paint into the recess so there is no confusion on when the petcocks are turned off



Flip the gas tank over, wind some Teflon tape on the fuel lugs



Then with a 19mm and 22m open wrench turn the petcock nuts onto the lugs and tighten the petcock body down



A new rubber fuel tank back retaining strap



Fit the strap metal loop under the frame tab and then pinch the frame tab to close around the strap so it does not fall off when the tank is lifted off



Carefully tilt the gas tank forward and up over the front frame rubbers and tilt the tank down until it rests on the frame rubbers, pull the rubber strap up and over the gas tank tab





Repro gas tank emblem pins are too long and need a couple mm ground off,



I then add mounting tape to the back side of the emblems, I don't trust the crimp clips to hold the emblem tight



Fit the pins into the crimp clips, press firmly, you get one chance to get it right with the tape



and the other side



Polish up the gas cap



Looks the business if I do day so myself



Fitted the seat strap, right side has the removable clip



through bolt on the left



clutch perch mirror threads where stripped, drilled the hole out for a 10mm helicoil



Tap





10mm helicoil with red locktight





Helicoil seated



I had a pair of these chrome mirrors kicking around, I think chrome mirrors belong on 70's bikes



I am sure others would prefer bar end mirrors but not me





Fuel line fitted to the new tap



Now the trouble shooting, getting it running and sorted out

[Rick4003]

Hi Jim

I have to agree with you, it really does look the business!  It is most certainly better than when it left the factory 

Fuel line fitted to the new tap

Are you going to fit some sort of clamp or retainer ring on the fuel lines or will you just keep it like that? I always put hoseclamps on, although I'm not really sure if they are necessary. I just like the extra security from it.

-Ulrik

[Huzo]

It would be an insult to ask and I would not expect an answer.
Put as tactfully as I can...
To produce a result as mouth wateringly beautiful as you have, do you have to spend more than the bike will be "worth" to the fortunate new owner, or is the money spent, reflected in the enhanced value of the finished machine ?
I know that a work of art like yours is worth more than the sum of it's parts and as a step by step guide to a fabulous re birth of an acclaimed classic, your generosity in allowing us into your Alladin's cave of wisdom, patience and skil has a value for me that can't be quantified.
As I said once before, I'm about to embark on the same journey with a Mk 2, and if I fall short, (as I certainly will), of your standards, I can blame no one but myself.
Nothing you have done is "hard" if looked at in isolation, but the wholistic nature of your approach to this work is inspirational and as a guide to success is invaluable.
I will copy and print it into a manual for my journey.
Thank you very much for your willingness to share..
Huzo.

[Huzo]

Do you mind telling me what the dayglo orange colour is on the fairing ?

[TRw1]

Jim - it is looking fantastic!  Hopefully, the troubleshooting will go well.  Those following this thread are anxiously awaiting next steps!

Ted

[Groover]

looking very very nice 

[canuck750]

Are you going to fit some sort of clamp or retainer ring on the fuel lines or will you just keep it like that?
-Ulrik

The lines are just temporary for now, I will hang a gasoline bottle connected to the carbs to fire up the bike and tune it. Fuel lines will definitely go on once the tuning is done.

I still need to install the choke cables so the tank will probably come off a couple times before I am really done.

[swooshdave]

Sorry to have to say this but those mirrors are not worthy of such a beautiful bike.

[canuck750]

It would be an insult to ask and I would not expect an answer.
Put as tactfully as I can...
To produce a result as mouth wateringly beautiful as you have, do you have to spend more than the bike will be "worth" to the fortunate new owner, or is the money spent, reflected in the enhanced value of the finished machine ?

Huzo.

This is a tough question to answer, my long winded 2 cents;

I started restoring motorcycles about 15 years ago moving on from working on cars beside my father (an autobody mechanic) since I was old enough to hold the oxy/acet torch for him. Initially I worked on tiddlers, no money, few tools and little knowledge, Honda S65, S90, Yamaha YL1,  then moving up to Yamaha 350cc twins, and a stint with Yamaha 500 singles. I never kept a single bike I rebuilt, sold it as soon as I got it sorted to fund the next project. I never made any money, it would cost me a couple hundred bucks per bike it was and is my hobby. 

A lot of people have asked me how I can sell a motorcycle restoration at a loss!! My response every time is to question them how much they get paid to golf, or fish, or play baseball, or whatever they fancy in their free time.

Back in 2011 I was looking for something new and different, wanted a cruiser to rebuild but I don't care for the metric stuff, Harleys don't interest me and I can not afford an Indian, then I saw a picture of a Moto Guzzi Eldorado and I was smitten. I bought a basket case 72 Eldorado off Ebay, shipped the wreck from Florida to my home in western Canada and over the course of a year ended up sinking in more than $10K into it. I will never get my money put of the Eldorado but it is my favorite motorcycle, I love the ride, feel and look of it and it has been very reliable.

I got hooked on Moto Guzzi but realized if I was going to  drop that kind of money into a restoration I better start with a motorcycle that in the right market can demand top dollar, at present market values I think that limits the choices to the V7 Sport, 750S, 750 S3 and the Le Mans MK I and MKII and perhaps the much newer 1000S. Same analogy as restoring a 1965 Ford Falcon or a 1965 Ford Mustang GT, both will cost the same to restore but the Mustang is 2 to 3 times more valuable on the market.

I have only sold one of my Guzzi restorations to date and my goal in that case was to recover what cash I had into the bike and a couple bucks for my labour. I think if one is very lucky finding the right buyer and the workmanship is up to scratch then recovering ones cash is possible. Having gone through half a dozen nut and bolt restorations I can safely say that at least $8K will be spent on the restoration, probably more and then add in the purchase price of the bike and it should total less than current market value, if not then just realize that when it comes time to sell there will be a loss.

Given present market values of a top flight restored Le Mans MKI being in the $16 ~ $20K USD  range, the purchase price needs to be in the $8K range to make the restoration feasible. Any Le Mans MKI is at least 40 years old and regardless of how well it was looked after it needs to completely come apart and a lot of it will need rebuilding or replacing. I don't think one can realistically expect to get top dollar for a restoration unless every single component has been addressed and there are the receipts and photographs to prove it.

On this bike I am going to break the $16K USD investment and probably get close to $18K in the end, but I have really enjoyed saving this one and I have again learned a lot more about the brand and model.

I will likely rebuild another Guzzi but at present I am interested in Benelli and Moto Morini as well and have a couple restorations projects waiting.

Cheers

Jim

[canuck750]

Do you mind telling me what the dayglo orange colour is on the fairing ?

I will ask my painter for the formula and post it here.

[canuck750]

Sorry to have to say this but those mirrors are not worthy of such a beautiful bike.

They are a 'particular' taste aren't they!

The bike came with a set of black bar ends,



I am loath to cut the handgrips though, and I  don't particularly like bar ends to begin with, need to keep looking.

[Groover]

Searched some mirror options in hopes to suggest something great, but turns out the lemans (any model) just look best without 

I spent a lot more than I was anticipating once I got into stuff when I restored my G5. I also obsessed over finding as many old stock OEM parts as I could, including many bolts, washers, rubber parts, etc. which added to the challenge of the hunt for parts and cost. I only did surface stuff to the engine though since it seemed to be still ok, and the thought of going deeper was overwhelming at that point. Decided that I�ll either never do that (lacking some confidence in that department), or save it for later on, or even let the next owner do that.

[swooshdave]

If the bike is being built to sell I’d leave the mirrors off and let the new owner decide what they want. At the top dollar this bike deserves it may not see the road and mirrors would be superfluous.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Huzo]

I will ask my painter for the formula and post it here.

Thank you very much for the paint info.
Also your response is not long winded, every word a gem and I will read it over several times to digest your meanings fully.
We are fortunate to have you here...

[Groover]

If you want to touch up the side badges or any Moto Guzzi badge from that era, the best color match to the factory white I found that looked natural/factory was this:

Duplicolor BCC0407 Perfect Match Stone White

For the black, I used this:

Duplicolor BUN0100 Universal Black, but the black wasn't really hard to match anyway.

Top one is NOS OEM Moto Guzzi (not repro, the repros out there are too Arctic looking), the bottom is the BC0407 Stone White. I could have given it one more coat to thicken it up a bit looking at it again, or it would be best to find that same color in a non-aerosol can (less diluted), easier to brush on. I sprayed the paint in a cap, then brushed it on.

[canuck750]

If you want to touch up the side badges or any Moto Guzzi badge from that era, the best color match to the factory white I found that looked natural/factory was this:

Duplicolor BCC0407 Perfect Match Stone White

For the black, I used this:

Duplicolor BUN0100 Universal Black, but the black wasn't really hard to match anyway.

Top one is NOS OEM Moto Guzzi (not repro, the repros out there are too Arctic looking), the bottom is the BC0407 Stone White. I could have given it one more coat to thicken it up a bit looking at it again, or it would be best to find that same color in a non-aerosol can (less diluted), easier to brush on. I sprayed the paint in a cap, then brushed it on.

Thanks!

Great information

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Mirrors: I think mirrors like these were what most mid-late '70s Guzzi came with, possibly installed at the dealer.

http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=41&products_id=2370



I say "like" because those aren't as well made as the originals - the heads are much lighter and don't swivel the same. I put them on my Convert and couldn't see a bloody thing behind me, the mirrors shook so much. So, I used the stems from them with the heads off of the originals and *presto* a clear view.   

[canuck750]

Thanks Charlie, I put something like these on a KLR 650, shook real bad, I added the rubber isolator that Twisted Throttle sells and they are OK.

Searching the interweb for pictures of Le Mans MKI I see that most don't have mirrors, typical Italian I suppose,

" we a dona need no stinkin mirrah!"

[canuck750]

HMB is advertising new slides machined to fit he PHF 36 carbs and the ones I modified don't seem to have a lot of range to raise the slide for idle,

this is the slide I machined fully raised



I ordered a new pair from HMB and this is the difference, just under 1mm more lift



I used a trick Greg Bender shows on his this old tractor site to static set an equal slide height using a tiny drill bit. with this diameter of drill I have +/- 1mm either way to adjust the slide height for idle



I set a fine pin mark on the carb body and dab of red paint to show the static idle point on each carb



A new distributor rotor came with the slides, it doesn't fit any better than the 1st one so I got out my heat gun and warmed the plastic up as much as I could



Lots of heat later it 'just' fit over the distributor cam, not very well made IMHO



New choke cables arrived, something is not right, the cable is too long to be of any use



the choke cable end at the carb 90 degree pipe end



There is no cable adjuster on the 90m degree pipe end



Something is not adding up, maybe the wrong cables were sent??

What an I missing here?

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

New choke cables arrived, something is not right, the cable is too long to be of any use



the choke cable end at the carb 90 degree pipe end



There is no cable adjuster on the 90m degree pipe end



Something is not adding up, maybe the wrong cables were sent??

What an I missing here?

You're missing the adjuster and locknut.
http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=62&products_id=1988
http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=62&products_id=912

[canuck750]

Does the adjuster and lock nut fit between the 90 degree pipe fitting and the cast aluminum cap that bolts down onto the carb?

The carbs came without adjusters so I am not sure where they go, but can't think of where else they would fit.

Thanks

Jim

[jvb]

The parts diagram show the adjuster, lock nut then elbow covered by a rubber sleeve.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Does the adjuster and lock nut fit between the 90 degree pipe fitting and the cast aluminum cap that bolts down onto the carb?

The carbs came without adjusters so I am not sure where they go, but can't think of where else they would fit.

Thanks

Jim

It screws into the upper end of the elbow. Check out the box with nos. 44-47 in the illustration below:

[canuck750]

It screws into the upper end of the elbow. Check out the box with nos. 44-47 in the illustration below:

Thanks again Charlie!  I doubt I have any of those in my  stock, one more parts order for the LeMans coming up.

[SED]

Looks great!

"I had to carefully bend the steel ends of the tach and speedo cables to turn 90 degrees and clear the headlight bucket"

How did you do that?!  all the tubing benders I've used bend further from the end.

You're patience and attention to detail are admirable.