Harleys future?

[Lannis]

May Day is just around the corner - celebrate International Workers' Day!

I'm retired.   

[boatdetective]

I respect the history of Harley- especially after visiting the museum. I just bought a bike out of a Harley repair shop and the owner and his riding buddy "Scruffy" were GREAT guys- real old school riders.

However, I get the feeling that these two grizzled, authentic riders can get drowned out by all the poseurs.  I've gotten "Italian crap" comments and a general disdain from many Harley guys.  I suspect this behavior is from the ones concerned with image rather than road time.  As for the machines, I rented a Road King in Montana and it was a truly awful riding experience.  What an unforgivable pig.

The support network here on WG has been truly great. I stuck with the marque to a great extent because of all the help from you folks- thank you.  It's a great group.  Having said that, i went to the National rally in NH and found most of the people gathered in their own cliques and not especially friendly. Lannis was there and it was really nice to meet finally. Chuck in Ind was there with the Aero Lario and was equally pleasant. 

I sold the 1200S and just bought a BMW R1200R. So far- it's a wonderful machine.  I'm willing to sacrifice a little "exclusivity" in the name of original build quality. 

[redrider90]

In 2004 I inherited a little money. I took a small amount and started a small portfolio. The rest went into savings.
At that time a good friend's father who was a very successful retired stock broker had made up a list of 20 stocks for my friend to invest for his 2 kids for an education fund. My friend shared that list with me and HOG on the list of stocks. At the time it was going for about $55/share. As a long time biker (who also had owned 2 Harleys) In 2004 I  saw little upside in the long term for HOG as an investment. And in the long term that proved to be correct. Sure they peaked twice  Today HOG closed a $57.21. Just 2 bucks more some 13 years later. I did invest in many of the other stocks and have been fortunate to do well in that small portfolio. I am not a Harley hater and I was looking at it as an investment. I think today it's even a worse investment than it was in 2004.

[Kev m]

In 2004 I inherited a little money. I took a small amount and started a small portfolio. The rest went into savings.
At that time a good friend's father who was a very successful retired stock broker had made up a list of 20 stocks for my friend to invest for his 2 kids for an education fund. My friend shared that list with me and HOG on the list of stocks. At the time it was going for about $55/share. As a long time biker (who also had owned 2 Harleys) In 2004 I  saw little upside in the long term for HOG as an investment. And in the long term that proved to be correct. Sure they peaked twice  Today HOG closed a $57.21. Just 2 bucks more some 13 years later. I did invest in many of the other stocks and have been fortunate to do well in that small portfolio. I am not a Harley hater and I was looking at it as an investment. I think today it's even a worse investment than it was in 2004.

It was an investment in the 90's.

I believe our friends who tour on Sportsters bought them both with their gains.

[Perazzimx14]

I want a couple current production Harleys.

I wouldn't mind a couple current production Guzzis.

I think Lemmy at ZLA just reminded me that I need to pay more attention to BMW, cause Nine T Pure looks pretty good to me right now.

I wouldn't turn my nose up and a couple of Triumphs.

My garage and bank account are both too small.

I have room and play money from the sales of 4 bikes last year and still nothing. I peruse CL periodically wanting to find something that tickles my taint but nothing. Like I said with money in hand and room to spare the lowly Grom is the only thing even remotely sparking any interest. Either pretty sad or I have reached a Zen like state, 

[tazio]

I don't think Harley is going away. Ever.
The Motor Company is a national treasure for crying out loud.
The U.S. Gov't wouldn't allow it.

Anyway, make mine a Fatboy. Hell, they even named it after me..

[Kev m]

I have room and play money from the sales of 4 bikes last year and still nothing. I peruse CL periodically wanting to find something that tickles my taint but nothing. Like I said with money in hand and room to spare the lowly Grom is the only thing even remotely sparking any interest. Either pretty sad or I have reached a Zen like state, 

Call it Zen and enjoy it.

Or put in an internet order for hormones. [emoji6] [emoji12] [emoji56]

[Ncdan]

It was an investment in the 90's.

I believe our friends who tour on Sportsters bought them both with their gains.

You're right Kev. I bought some in the early 90s and nearly double my money when I sold it. To bad I didn't have that much to invest as it was a small part of my portfolio.

[redrider90]

It was an investment in the 90's.

I believe our friends who tour on Sportsters bought them both with their gains.

The NYSE was 4700 in 1990 and is now just shy of 21,000. Most people who invested in NYSE funds in the 90s did well if they left their money in the market. That is an easy one. My very frugal lower middle class parents did damn well in the 90's even with very little to invest.

[kingoffleece]

I was working at Dean Witter Reynolds when HOG went public.  IPO price was 10 bucks if I remember correct.
We got a lot of it at offering for clients.  They did really well with it way back when.

[Tom]

I'm glad that I bought my Guzzi's when they were affordable for the collection.  They have acquired value from what others are willing to pay for the older ones.  "Supply and demand".     Along the way I've acquired other bikes but Moto Guzzi are the ones that I won't sell.  I generally keep them all. 

[LowRyter]

In 2004 I inherited a little money. I took a small amount and started a small portfolio. The rest went into savings.
At that time a good friend's father who was a very successful retired stock broker had made up a list of 20 stocks for my friend to invest for his 2 kids for an education fund. My friend shared that list with me and HOG on the list of stocks. At the time it was going for about $55/share. As a long time biker (who also had owned 2 Harleys) In 2004 I  saw little upside in the long term for HOG as an investment. And in the long term that proved to be correct. Sure they peaked twice  Today HOG closed a $57.21. Just 2 bucks more some 13 years later. I did invest in many of the other stocks and have been fortunate to do well in that small portfolio. I am not a Harley hater and I was looking at it as an investment. I think today it's even a worse investment than it was in 2004.

no splits?

[Texas Turnip]

Get a life you Harley bashers. Check out Three Flags Classic, Four Corners tour and the Iron Butt for a lisgt of lots of Harley riders. You can find Guzzis that are ten years old with less miles than my mom puts on her walker.

Tex

[Perazzimx14]

Get a life you Harley bashers. Check out Three Flags Classic, Four Corners tour, the Iron Butt and predominately Starbucks for a list of lots of Harley riders. You can find Guzzis that are ten years old with less miles than my mom puts on her walker.

Tex

 

[Rebochi]

no splits?

http://getsplithistory.com/HOG

   It split a few times over the years. I paid off my house when I sold some Harley and Polaris stock during one of the peaks, Still invested in both companies  and I a positive that both will a great investment.
 
 

[bad Chad]

As some with a lot of money seem to feel the future of HD looks bright.

A local dealer outside of Chicago, Woodstock HD, had a very big shop on the well used corner of IL 47 and 14.  It was far larger than any Guzzi dealer ever.  They just folded that shop, and moved it across the street to the former Kmart location!!!  It is now beyond massive!  I assume they think this thing will last a while?

[redrider90]

no splits?

HOG has zero splits since going public.     Rebochi links 4 splits from 1990-2000
My mistake. Since 2000 HOG has had no splits. If you look at these figures HOG has had near ZERO growth since 2007.
A $10,000 investment in 2007 would yield today $10,754.88 if you reinvested dividends.

https://www.splithistory.com/hog/

Start date:    04/26/2007    
End date:    04/25/2017    
Start price/share:    $65.34    
End price/share:    $57.21    
Starting shares:    153.05    
Ending shares:    188.07    
Dividends reinvested/share:    $8.65    
Total return:    7.59%    
Average Annual Total Return:    0.73%    
Starting investment:    $10,000.00    
Ending investment:    $10,754.88    
Years:    10.01

[JJ]

Get a life you Harley bashers. Check out Three Flags Classic, Four Corners tour and the Iron Butt for a lisgt of lots of Harley riders. You can find Guzzis that are ten years old with less miles than my mom puts on her walker.

Tex

Back in my ol' Harley days, we used to RIDE to Four Corners and many of the HOG rallies around the Southwest.  It was always an adventure and a lot of fun. :1:

[LowRyter]

HOG has zero splits since going public.

whooaaa.   This caused me to remove my reply above. 

[redrider90]

whooaaa.   This caused me to remove my reply above.

My mistake.
I was wrong. HOG has Zero splits since 2000. I didn't go back far enough.
 Rebochi links 4 splits from 1990-2000
So going back just the past 10 years with no splits this is what HOG looks like.  If you look at these figures HOG has had near ZERO growth since 2007.
A $10,000 investment in 2007 would yield today $10,754.88 if you reinvested dividends.

https://www.splithistory.com/hog/

Start date:    04/26/2007    
End date:    04/25/2017    
Start price/share:    $65.34    
End price/share:    $57.21    
Starting shares:    153.05    
Ending shares:    188.07    
Dividends reinvested/share:    $8.65    
Total return:    7.59%    
Average Annual Total Return:    0.73%    
Starting investment:    $10,000.00    
Ending investment:    $10,754.88    
Years:    10.01

[Kev m]

HOG has zero splits since going public. 
My mistake. Since 2000 HOG has had no splits. If you look at these figures HOG has had near ZERO growth since 2007.
A $10,000 investment in 2007 would yield today $10,754.88 if you reinvested dividends.

https://www.splithistory.com/hog/

Start date: 04/26/2007
End date: 04/25/2017
Start price/share: $65.34
End price/share: $57.21
Starting shares: 153.05
Ending shares: 188.07
Dividends reinvested/share: $8.65
Total return: 7.59%
Average Annual Total Return: 0.73%
Starting investment: $10,000.00
Ending investment: $10,754.88
Years: 10.01

Ok so what's the BIG picture.

They've been publicly traded since the late 60's, and HOG was listed on the NYSE in 87.

So since 87 what are the numbers like?

[redrider90]

Ok so what's the BIG picture.

They've been publicly traded since the late 60's, and HOG was listed on the NYSE in 87.

So since 87 what are the numbers like?

I do not have the numbers but I'd be the farm and that HOG has under performed the Market since 1987. My god did you not just see the numbers  I put up for the last 10 years? ZERO growth in the market.
Now we are talking finances and not motorcycles here. They are a looser. Their stock is going nowhere. Now they plan on introducing what 50 new bikes in the next 5 years and let's see what they come up with. 50 new bikes in 5 years is 10 new models a year. That is going to be an amazing feat to accomplish.

[Arizona Wayne]

On making a lot of profit on stock the only way you really make a killing is if you buy it at the beginning when it's really cheap , stay with it, and if you're lucky it really grows years later, like WalMart, Apple, etc.    Or you buy it low and sell it when it get's high by watching it every day instead of doing other things like riding your MC. 

[ITSec]

I do not have the numbers but I'd be the farm and that HOG has under performed the Market since 1987. My god did you not just see the numbers  I put up for the last 10 years? ZERO growth in the market.
Now we are talking finances and not motorcycles here. They are a looser. Their stock is going nowhere. Now they plan on introducing what 50 new bikes in the next 5 years and let's see what they come up with. 50 new bikes in 5 years is 10 new models a year. That is going to be an amazing feat to accomplish.

50 new bikes in 5 years is (sort of) easy if you get to define what 'new' means. I rather expect that every model will be counted as 'new' if it gets the Milwaukee 8 added. Then count it as a model even if it's just cosmetically different but uses the same frame, engine options, etc.

Are all the 1400cc California-based Guzzis really different models? Some certainly are, as fork rake, frame changes, and other things make them distinct - they handle differently, are aimed at a somewhat different audience, and so on. But vehicle makers (automotive and motorcycle) have always been (shall we say) flexible in how they set the bar for what makes a distinct model.

[arveno]

Harleys are great bikes....

I dislike the stereotypical hd rider.... but that does not mean harley davidson are not great bikes.

sales go up and down... but they will always be there .

[redrider90]

On making a lot of profit on stock the only way you really make a killing is if you buy it at the beginning when it's really cheap , stay with it, and if you're lucky it really grows years later, like WalMart, Apple, etc.    Or you buy it low and sell it when it get's high by watching it every day instead of doing other things like riding your MC. 

I bought handful of shares of apple when it was quite expensive. It split a few months later and I am pretty happy.  Buying early is good but it is hard to do successfully.  I got a lot of green solar panel stocks that I bought early but the Chinese took down every single stock because they flooded the market with panels. I wouldn't own Walmart but I did buy Costco and it has out performed Walmart while paying its employees a living wage with benefits.

[Arizona Wayne]

I bought handful of shares of apple when it was quite expensive. It split a few months later and I am pretty happy.  Buying early is good but it is hard to do successfully.  I got a lot of green solar panel stocks that I bought early but the Chinese took down every single stock because they flooded the market with panels. I wouldn't own Walmart but I did buy Costco and it has out performed Walmart while paying its employees a living wage with benefits.

If WM didn't pay it's employees a living wage like you claim they wouldn't have such loyal employees.  How about proving what you said here. 

[Penderic]

On the road, or in the ditch ....


 

[Kev m]

I do not have the numbers but I'd be the farm and that HOG has under performed the Market since 1987. My god did you not just see the numbers  I put up for the last 10 years? ZERO growth in the market.
Now we are talking finances and not motorcycles here. They are a looser. Their stock is going nowhere. Now they plan on introducing what 50 new bikes in the next 5 years and let's see what they come up with. 50 new bikes in 5 years is 10 new models a year. That is going to be an amazing feat to accomplish.

The last 10 years have been horrible for the company (and they're not alone in that). The cherry picked start date of that is the recession. I was asking historically, and you seem to be ignoring:

http://getsplithistory.com/HOG

So 5 splits between 1990 & 2000 (1990,1992, 1994, 1997, & 2000).

Looks like that was a great time to hold that stock.

Now I'm not speculating we'll see that again from them in our lifetime, but I was simply pointing out it wasn't always like this past 10 years.

[Travlr]

I've owned two HD Sportsters.  Loved the bikes.  The average HD owner is the reason I don't (and won't) ride HD anymore.  They're owning and riding motorcycles for different reasons than why I own and ride motorcycles.

My sentiments exactly.  Good bikes, wrong culture for me.

M