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Paul, out of curiosity how many Harleys have you owned? How many have you ridden?Not the same game as Duc, gee really? You mean cruisers, touring bikes, and classic standards don't have the same handling as sportbikes?That's not the point though, when ridden on the street in even remotely responsible speeds they handle just fine and a number might surprise you.As for your generalizations and love of tech I'm not buying everything you're selling. Having ridden Harleys for almost a quarter century I wouldn't presume to know what MOST Harley riders do or don't know about technology. That said many people aren't looking for the level is tech you can find on a BMW. Safety and comfort are fine goals but if that's what you really want then at some point a motorcycle isn't the right choice.As a multi-time BMW and Guzzi owner I still seem to instead choose a Harley twice as often.
As Dusty said peak dyno numbers are much more than your Eldo.Can't say about what you rented but my new 2016 RK gets up and goes. I think stock 1/4 mile numbers are only in the 13's but hey it's an 800# bike.You obviously didn't get the comment about applying tech where it is WANTED. The options for Harley include:ABSCruiseSecurityAnd yes lighting, as I've mentioned. For $50-75 you can convert the rear turn signals to additional running and brake lights.Their catalog has LED headlights (standard on some models) and driving lights.Sure there's plenty of chrome and other crap too, so what, it's not my thing but it doesn't mean all the customers only care about that.I just don't see active suspensions or heated seats as such a big deal.Doesn't mean the suspension on my RK is poorly designed or not up to the task.<shrugs>
I'm selling nothing, just sharing my opinion Kev, it's as valid as yours We're allowed to have difference values and opinions when it comes to our rides. It's OK.My opinions are based on my experiences. here's a brief synopsis: Been riding for 55+ years, was an MSF/instructor/rider coach in NY before relocating to Fl. I've lost track of the number of bikes owned and the number of times I've ridden coast to coast. Since retiring 13 years ago I average 20-25K miles/year. From '09 to '15 I kept a bike in Europe, Heidelberg Germany and would spend 8 weeks each summer touring Europe. Spent a few years as a track junky 1st on a SV650 the a Triumph Daytona 675.My 1st H-D was an '89 FXR in 1990, then a FLHTP, 2 RK's the last an '04 Road King with a custom built motor by Cyclerama in Fl and heavily modified suspension, took it across country twice. Almost forgot the Buells, an S2 and a Uly. Last October I spent a few hours on a M8 RK and Street Glide Special when in Denver. I was considering a M8 RK but we just didn't bond. No suprise there. Instead I'll likely get a '17 V7 Special, blue of course to match the others in my garage. During most of the 90's the lady in my life owned a H-D dealership in NY. During that period I road any H-D I wanted, was active in HOG, had dinner with V. Beals, Willie and Nancy, and others on several occasions at recognition evens.(She owned a high performing dealership) Have had private tours of the assembly pant and the development center and have ridden with the executives. I think I have a fair understanding of H-D products, the business, and the culture. Paul
Fair discussion, but If Harley Offered Dynamic Stability Control and/or traction control I wonder if buyers would pay for it? I find it Ironic that most HD riders I see when in the United States (mostly AZ, NV, NM and CA) the majority are not wearing much if any protective gear and these riders would benefit more than most with more safety features engineered into the bike. Most HD riders that I see around Phoenix don't wear helmets or gloves let alone a decent jacket. 'Fashion' leather such as a snap up vest or snap up chaps seem to be the de rigour apparel. I think it may be a case that most HD riders aren't going to pay for safety / technology. I think its unfortunate that fashion and conforming to the 'look' trumps common sense.I spoke to a couple Sheriffs in Southern California last week who where on decked out Harley police bikes, the machines looked very impressive. I asked them how they liked them, I was on my old RT and they said they wished they had BMW's or the Concourse Police bike but that they do a lot of escort parade duty and in the past locals complained about the force being on foreign bikes. The Sheriffs said that the power, handling and safety features of the BMW were missed by most all of the force. Putting an officers safety at a disadvantage to appease local perception is sad.
Harleys ride like every other cruiser out there including Guzzi 1400s and that is bloody awlful, yes some are less worse than others. If that is acceptable to you great go and enjoy your motor cycle but the fantasy story that something thats has compromised dynamics all for a look is pretty good compared to almost everything else out there is just that. Its friday here BTW :P
I realized after I posted that we're largely arguing taste and that never goes anywhere. But I see from where your opinions come and if we disagree I think it's largely back to the taste thing. Though I seem to have to bow to your experience with other Harley riders. Maybe I'm a victim of coloring my perceptions too much with my optimism.But thanks for taking the time to explain it.
No problem Kev. Sorry I was so long winded, that happens to me sometimes after a few IPA's. It would be nice to swap stories with you face to face. I always enjoy a chat with an honest enthusiast. Paul
It occurs to me that we aren't really talking about motorcycles, but the difference between a motorcycle enthusiast and an adult toy collector. I know some really sharp riders and some real moto-knuckleheads. Both of these demographics spend a bunch of money on bikes/gear. Can you blame a manufacturer for marketing to both groups?
I think at the end of the day...if I were ever to buy a Ducati...it would be something like THIS!! :1:
I like it. Pretty creative.
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