Motorcycling Death Risks

[leafman60]

I just now learned that a friend of mine and avid motorcyclist in Colorado collided with a car while on his bike. He is alive but suffers from a broken back, both broken legs and both broken arms.

This weighs on my mind along with the recent deaths of 4 motorcyclists whom I knew while they were riding. Another friend riding in a group with me recently had his left leg completely severed when he ran off the road and sideswiped a parked car.

This past Saturday another motorcyclist was killed on I-10 at about the same place and time that I was riding the same stretch back from breakfast.

Some of these accidents were probably rider error and some were others' fault and some were just haphazard occurrences.

It has all made me think long and hard about this recreation choice. People can be injured in just about anything they choose to do and if you over-think the dangers of life, you will not want to ever get out of bed in the morning. However, there is no doubt that riding a motorcycle is high on the list of personal risk taking.

I've been doing it for many years. I've had my share of accidents but I have been lucky in surviving them with few problems.

I go through periods of reflection and reconsideration of continuing to do this.

[webmost]

Anything truly thrilling, there's danger. That's the thrill.

If nothing else, you might get the gal pregnant.




Unmitigated risk aversion is the new Puritanism; complete with witch hunts, funny outfits, and humorless preachers thundering doom. The Deity is Safety; Satan is a Lawyer; but the object is the same: to suck the life out of life and tell you how to live it.

[Chuck in Indiana]

I had two nephews, one a Harley guy, the other a Goldwinger die on bikes in a 12 month period.
Anyone that says riding isn't dangerous has a serious case of denial going on. For sure, it's the most dangerous thing I've ever done, which includes test flying experimental airplanes.
I don't care. I *like* riding, and do my best to mitigate the danger.
Mike's right, though..

"Fate is the hunter"

[Lannis]

Just read on line (Herald Tribune) where many family members were killed in AZ due to a flash flood while on a family outing at a popular swimming hole.

"Fate is the hunter"

One of my favorite books from a great author.   The number of guys that died flying those old airliners and mail-planes makes motorcycling look positively safe.

I'm off to the Norton rally this morning, riding in the mountains all week, and I think about the risks every time I go out.

Like leafman60, sometimes I ask myself "Is this really worth it?"   So far it has been, but I'm not going to let some fear of being called a risk-averse Puritan keep me from doing the smart thing when the time comes .... !

Lannis

[pebra]

I think I'd rather say I'm riding for the joy of it than for the thrill.
It's a pity that consequences often are so severe if anything goes wrong, and that being careful yourself is far from sufficient.

[KiwiKev]

There's a thread about a new Geoco ? Insurance company ad featuring guzzi bikes.

Made me curious about some of their other stuff. There's an excellent safety video on their website that is well worth watching imho. P


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[Dukedesmo]

My Wife's best friend (51 yrs old and with no known health issues) suffered a massive Heart attack just over a week ago, she died a few days later having never regained consciousness, 30 years ago the same thing happened to my Mother at the age of 50. Neither of them rode bikes or engaged in any 'dangerous' activity.


My point being, you never know when your time's up so do what you enjoy and live everyday as if it's your last, because one day it will be...

[JJ]

I think about it often these days as well.  I have been riding on the street now for more 50 years. 

In all that time, I only had one (1) potentially fatal accident in all that time - - at age 27 - - where I learned I needed glasses...

Motorcycling is a "managed risk" and dangerous for sure, but for me, the rewards far outweigh the risks.

"Everybody dies...but not everyone lives..."   

[roadscum]

I think I'd rather say I'm riding for the joy of it than for the thrill.
It's a pity that consequences often are so severe if anything goes wrong, and that being careful yourself is far from sufficient.

+1 My life is too valuable to me and to those that love me to risk it for a thrill.  A hug from a loved one or a smile from a friend brings all the thrills I need. When I have the need for speed I take it to the track where I have one potential asshole to deal with.......... and he's riding my bike.

There is no substitute for safe riding and good skills. I'm a former MSF instructor/coach but stopped teaching 14 years ago when I retired to Florida. Every few year I take a safe riding course just to keep my skill fresh. Nut'n better then being coaching by a skilled, trained professional and a lot of practice.  For my own safety I only ride with others who share my view on safe riding, not the squid, not the thrill seekers, not the stupid and careless. That's how I manage the risk of riding.

I never want to give 1st aid again to a fellow rider, nope never, nor do I want to be taken out by an asshole on  two wheels or 4 for that matter. I've been riding for well over 55 years and in retirement ride  do 20-25K miles/year and can't afford to seek thrills on public roads. 

Paul

[leafman60]

Fate is the hunter??   


Then, motorcyclists are easier prey.

 .

[timonbik]

Motorcycles are safer with better handling, lights, tires, brakes etc.  Safety equipment/clothing/helmets are better.   Medical services and practices are better.   Roads are safer with better lighting, signage, engineering and surfacing.  So then why is our choice of past time considered so dangerous.  I think we all know the answer to that question.  INATTENTIVE CAR DRIVERS. 
Up here in Canada our M/C insurance rates continue to rise due to high medicals costs.   The companies cite  that they incur huge losses on M/C insurance as the death and medical payouts are substantial and with the NO FAULT system we have, these payouts are made by the motorcyclist's own policy, even if  the M/C was not at fault.  Until the insurance industry starts holding car drivers more accountable for their driving, drivers will continue to drive blissfully along  totally unaware of what is going on around them.
Cheers, Tim

[alanp]

Motorcycling is a "managed risk" and dangerous for sure,
"Everybody dies...but not everyone lives..."   

I really like both of those lines, JJ.  Motorcycling is a managed risk because the rider has significant control over the risk.  I am fully aware of the risk of riding motorcycles, but the reward is worth it to me.  I am alert and do my best to "manage the risk".  But every time I ride I see other riders in flip flops, sleeveless vests, without helmets, popping wheelies, zipping in and out of traffic without really looking and expecting the "other guy" to see you coming...they are not managing the risk. 

I actually know I am less likely to be in an accident when I am riding vs. driving because I am more alert and more focused.  But I am also aware that the risk of serious injury is greater on the bike.  Manage it to the best of your ability and enjoy!

[Denis]

Two days ago a friend was rear-ended on an off-ramp at 60mph while exiting the highway. He was wearing a full face helmet and full riding gear. He suffered a cracked collarbone and some road rash on his hand and wrist (where his glove pealed). He's lucky to have escaped with those injuries.
A couple of weeks ago his buddy was rear ended while turned off a main road in Richmond and it was captured on a traffic cam and made it to the news. The woman who rear-ended him never stopped but someone got her license plate number.

I used to ride to work all the time but with so many more people on the road here and so many of THEM doing stupid things, I mainly ride on weekends now. It's more and more tempting to move out of the city, in large part because of that. I hate that I cut back because I loved riding every day.
Crashed once, rear-ended once and hit from the side once when a car changed lanes into me, but I didn't drop it.

[Rough Edge racing]

 I stopped rising about 15 years at age 55.... I thought the thrill was gone and only the risk remained....I started rising again about 5 years ago after realizing the thrill was worth the risk....I'll admit, I ride shorter intense duration's and not interested in riding long distances...

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Riding is too much a part of my life for me to quit it. It's also the way I deal with stress, what little there is in my life. When I can't ride, I am a grumpy, irritable, unlikable person. There is nothing else that "chills" me the way riding does.

I've only been riding on the street for 38 years and consider myself lucky to have had only one "crash" and that was due to hitting a fox - no other vehicles. Where I ride most of the time, the chances of me getting taken out by wildlife (deer) is much greater than an accident involving other vehicles.

[Bill Hagan]

 
I do not mean to quibble about word choice, i.e., "thrill" v. "joy," etc.

At the same time, when I explain to non-riders -- including the sweet and attractive 30-something woman whose photo I took at the overlook near Suches yesterday  -- why I ride, I say "riding is how I pursue happiness.  It's my way of making the dream of the Founding Fathers come true."   

I mean that humorously, but also very much mean it.

As for the risk, it's undeniable.  That's why I wear ATGATT plus a Helite vest.   

Bill

[Thunderbutt]

After 34 years in law enforcement I have come to the conclusion that when your number is up your done, no mater what you are doing or where you are at, period. 
I have seen many people meet their demise just minding their own business, not doing anything other than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I thank the big guy everyday when I open my eyes and see daylight, sure beats the alternative.  Live everyday like it might be your last and enjoy those around you.

[Rough Edge racing]

After 34 years in law enforcement I have come to the conclusion that when your number is up your done, no mater what you are doing or where you are at, period. 
I have seen many people meet their demise just minding their own business, not doing anything other than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I thank the big guy everyday when I open my eyes and see daylight, sure beats the alternative.  Live everyday like it might be your last and enjoy those around you.

 I don't believe in fate because it implies I have no control over my destiny....The event or events leading to someones death while minding their own business happened because of another person's actions...Or a mechanical defect....Or standing where lightening strikes...

[Chuck in Indiana]

I don't believe in fate because it implies I have no control over my destiny....The event or events leading to someones death while minding their own business happened because of another person's actions...Or a mechanical defect....Or standing where lightening strikes...

If that's not fate, I don't know what is..

[webmost]

I don't believe in fate because it implies I have no control over my destiny....T

I don't believe in gravity cause it implies I might fall down and bonk my coconut.

[John A]

Choices, it is all choices. I prefer to live my life being able to choose. When that's done, I'm done.

[unclepete]

Look where you want to go ; not where you don't want to go . Negative waves etc....
I have known many who died young of natural causes . I know plenty of guys who are sitting at home just waiting .
I get on my bike and feel good ; like a dog just let out of his yard . Price of freedom .

[rocker59]

Clotho, Lachesis, and Atropos; the Fates will decide   

[Sheepdog]

I come from a paramilitary background and did a bunch of executive protection work while working for the guh-ment. What helped me to deal with the danger was the quote by the great Japanese swordsman, Miyamoto Musashi. He said, " The way of the warrior is resolute acceptance of death." Though it sounds macabre, this is a great insight. If fear is put aside, a fighter (or rider) can focus on the really critical tasks at hand and enhance their chance of success. Besides, none of us are leaving this reality alive...

[charlie b]

"Everybody dies...but not everyone lives..."

This is one of those statements I dislike.  It is usually used to state that if you do not do something that risks life and limb then somehow you aren't enjoying life.  Totally wrong.  Everyone does live.

I can enjoy life immensely without risking my life or someone else's.

And, yes, I did quit riding due to me coming too close to that point of no return too many times.  What bothered me more was my fate was in the hands of EVERY cage driver out there.  After that I no longer enjoyed the rides.

I have found I enjoy road trips more when in the truck.

[Cage Free]

Unfortunately shit happens and people get hurt doing things they love or just sitting on the sofa. I have friends who have died on bikes and from cancer so for me its just do what you love and don't worry too much about whats going to kill you because something is going to get you in the end. When I was 17 I was shot in the back of the neck with a 38cal at a gas station I worked at after school. The bullet went in one side and came out the other causing no damage, the doctors were amazed. I was damn lucky but don't dwell on it and now at 60 figure I've had all these years that could have been taken from me so whatever has happened and will happen is all just frosting on the cake of life. Ride hard,frequently and fast.

[oldbike54]

 It's strange , I've ridden street bikes for almost 50 years now (good grief , where did the time go ) and only had a couple of really close calls . Not that one won't happen the very next ride, maybe my threshold of fear is unrealistic and there have been more close to OS moments than were recognized , dunno . Have stopped riding briefly a few times for health reasons , or simply to let the anticipation of a good long ride build up , don't really do short rides of under 75 miles much anymore, would rather save up and go somewhere . Point is , no one forces us to ride these contraptions , they are dangerous beasts , just like a horse or a speedboat . Danger lurks around every corner , whether on a motorbike or on foot . Like Kat Williams says , live your $^%@*&% life 

 

 Dusty

[ITSec]

Some interesting comments from a couple of different primary perspectives.  Sine I've worked in various forms of risk management for a long time, you can guess which camp I'm mostly in.

Yes, I do ride rather than drive because I enjoy it more. I also prefer smaller, lighter and more responsive cars to bigger, heavier and probably safer ones.

Having made that choice, I then go on to make my choice as reasonable and practical as it can be. I make my bike more visible, I choose colors for my bike and my gear that are more noticeable and that tend to match the appearance of at least some police bikes. I tend to choose bikes with equipment like ABS, oversized brake rotors and pads, better handling than average. Good factory lighting if possible, and auxiliaries to make it even better. None of these things will do the whole job, but each makes the overall level of risk that incremental bit more controlled.

But some risks I can't control. If I made my choices based on the frequency of major or fatal motorcycle accidents, I'd have to stop riding or move - southern Nevada is among the worst areas in the country.

A long time ago, I was told by a motorcycle instructor that the best way to ride was to assume that every other vehicle was out to kill you. If they turn out not to have that attention, wonderful! On the other hand, if they do you'll be better prepared. The other advice he gave me was to play those early video games like 'Asteroids' - get used to keeping attention out in all directions, and be ready to move. 

[wavedog]

Risk assessment/risk acceptance. It is something to think about and bears consideration. There are always things/events that are beyond our control. We can minimize the effects of those by training, planning, mindset and gearing up. At some point some of us will give up riding, and that's ok. Just call it a day and move on to something else and keep enjoying life. It's all good. I don't judge anyone's worth on whether or not they ride a motorcycle. Who am I kidding- yes I do- HaHa- just jerkin' ya.
 When I was in aviation those of us who had a few 'incidents' would, while looking a bit shell shocked, try to laugh it off by saying 'I would rather be lucky than good.' We all knew someone who was a good pilot or a good rider and he was dead. (Humble apologies if that appeared cold or offensive. I am not a good communicator.)
 I do appreciate the thought provoking and, for me, timely topic as I have parkinsons and will at some point call it a day.

[poorBob]

We all make our choices and I respect those who decide it's not worth the risk.

Like another member posted, I get irritable and hard to live with when I can't ride and I cannot see me making the choice not to ride.

Even those who make that decision after having ridden have lived much richer life than a video game addicted couch potato who is afraid of leaving the couch.

Yes, I'm posting at work - a place populated by those same couch potatoes.

I told one techie at Bank of America, after another tirade about "I see, riding your murdercycle again because a car isn't good enough for you. I don't see why you have to come clomping in here in your boots every day..."

I ride so your kid has someone to look up to! Shut him right up....

Do what works for you and don't waste your breath trying to explain it. When it's time to stop, stop and don't apologize.