Author Topic: Pop Quiz?  (Read 1583 times)

Offline wicks

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Pop Quiz?
« on: September 13, 2017, 01:06:43 PM »
Hi all - I've just acquired another Guzzi - which model is it?  :clock:

Here's the frame plate...


how do i upload a picture
*current toys list*
'78 LM1 / '93 1000s / '73 V7 Sport / '03 BMW GSA / '06 Ducati Paul Smart / '77 Yamaha DT400 / '73 Porsche 911s / '94 Porsche 911 Turbo / '01 Range Rover / '15 G550
*fun past toys*
Aprilia RS250 / Aprilia RSV1000R / Ducati 900ss / Ducati Paso / Citroen DS / Renault R5 Alpine

Online Tom

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2017, 01:28:31 PM »
T3FB
There are no stupid questions.  There are however stupid people asking questions.

Offline wicks

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2017, 01:32:23 PM »
And here is the case #...



*current toys list*
'78 LM1 / '93 1000s / '73 V7 Sport / '03 BMW GSA / '06 Ducati Paul Smart / '77 Yamaha DT400 / '73 Porsche 911s / '94 Porsche 911 Turbo / '01 Range Rover / '15 G550
*fun past toys*
Aprilia RS250 / Aprilia RSV1000R / Ducati 900ss / Ducati Paso / Citroen DS / Renault R5 Alpine

Offline lorazepam

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2017, 01:41:51 PM »
Lemans? The pic is described as a Lemans frame plate.  :cool:

Wildgoose Chase Moto Guzzi

Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2017, 01:41:51 PM »

Offline wicks

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2017, 01:46:41 PM »
Oh bugger, shoulda noticed that. ;) The bike is built as a le mans, but I am wondering, because the numbers both have an extra digit and even if shaving off the first digit which is a zero, the number 74521 doesn't fit into any VIN number list I can find. It also has a bit of a hodge podge of parts on it - the rear fender is the 76 style, the side covers had the II badge removed, the engine case is painted black, etc. It has PHFs on it and the small bolts holding the intakes to head...but which other bikes had this engine? The frame and engine numbers are the same...

Could the frame badge have been re-made or does that look original?

860 Lbs GVWR?
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 01:56:20 PM by wicks »
*current toys list*
'78 LM1 / '93 1000s / '73 V7 Sport / '03 BMW GSA / '06 Ducati Paul Smart / '77 Yamaha DT400 / '73 Porsche 911s / '94 Porsche 911 Turbo / '01 Range Rover / '15 G550
*fun past toys*
Aprilia RS250 / Aprilia RSV1000R / Ducati 900ss / Ducati Paso / Citroen DS / Renault R5 Alpine

Offline ITSec

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2017, 02:11:42 PM »

860 Lbs GVWR?


Well, just roughing things out, bike weighs 500+ lbs, rider and passenger nominally 160 each, fuel and fluids maybe 45-50 lbs, and it all adds up!
ITSecurity
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Offline Arizona Wayne

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2017, 03:02:02 PM »
My `81 CX100 (LM II) has a GVWR of 860 Lbs. or does your frame say GVWR 880#?  My wheel weight ratings are front-352#, rear-530#.  Your frame badge shows higher rear weight (540) rating.  My CX100 came with 100/90-18 front tire, 110/90-18 rear tire.

While not having seen your bike yet, it sounds to me it may have been a Tonti framed bike made to look like a Le Mans I.  What do you think you bought?
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 03:29:11 PM by Arizona Wayne »

Offline wicks

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2017, 04:01:08 PM »
I think I bought a Le Mans I, but then it's a 1978 tonti frame (which would be a Le Mans II right?), but maybe that frame badge isn't original - the frame was repainted...then it has the 1976 rear fender and later model LMII side covers, gold wheels, black engine case, etc...
*current toys list*
'78 LM1 / '93 1000s / '73 V7 Sport / '03 BMW GSA / '06 Ducati Paul Smart / '77 Yamaha DT400 / '73 Porsche 911s / '94 Porsche 911 Turbo / '01 Range Rover / '15 G550
*fun past toys*
Aprilia RS250 / Aprilia RSV1000R / Ducati 900ss / Ducati Paso / Citroen DS / Renault R5 Alpine

Online Chuck in Indiana

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2017, 04:04:54 PM »
That serial number is in the T range, isn't it? I'm with Tom, but really don't know.
Chuck in (Elwood) Indiana/sometimes SoCal

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Offline Arizona Wayne

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2017, 04:27:20 PM »
I think I bought a Le Mans I, but then it's a 1978 tonti frame (which would be a Le Mans II right?), but maybe that frame badge isn't original - the frame was repainted...then it has the 1976 rear fender and later model LMII side covers, gold wheels, black engine case, etc...


All the Le Mans (I-V) models had Tonti frames.  But from LM III on they were modified some.  I read the Le Mans frames were made of thinner tubing than for the other Tonti models to lighten them up some.  I'm not sure exactly what year the LM II/CX100 models came out, maybe `79.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 04:30:48 PM by Arizona Wayne »

Online Tom

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2017, 04:37:18 PM »
Wicks.  Could be a CX100 with LeMans parts on it.  Can you post a pix of the bike and a better pix of the rivets?  No LeMans II were imported by dealers into the U.S.  If LeMans II would have to be a grey market import.  Highly unlikely.  You would have purchased knowing that and the seller would have told you that to jack up the price. 
There are no stupid questions.  There are however stupid people asking questions.

Offline Gliderjohn

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2017, 04:40:32 PM »
My March 1975 T-3 # is 101772, so I would say not a T-3.
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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2017, 05:00:31 PM »
Whatever it is, the numbers are nicely stamped and deeper than anything I've seen on a vin plate from that era. Not sure if that means anything, and I also haven't seen that many so take my comment with a grain of salt.. unless you have high blood pressure, then take it with just a grain and hold the salt  :grin:
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 05:02:35 PM by Groover »
1981 Moto Guzzi V1000G5
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, a
1987 Moto Guzzi LM1000SE, b
1980 Piaggio Vespa P200E
1980 Piaggio Vespa P125X
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Offline LeRoy

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2017, 05:23:19 PM »
Sounds like you bought the bike discussed in this thread:

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=92207.0

There were lots of comments in the thread on the bike, its parts, possible variations from the equipment expected on a Le Mans 850 of this vintage, and it's originality (or not).

The seller of the eBay bike mentioned above clearly represented it as a 1978 Le Mans 850. You should assure yourself that your bike is definitely what you expected. If it is in any way not a true 1978 Le Mans 850, you'll have to decide whether that is an issue to be discussed or pursued with the seller.
LeRoy (Bob Sharp)
Rochester, MI  U.S.A.
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Online fotoguzzi

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2017, 06:49:52 PM »
Wicks.  Could be a CX100 with LeMans parts on it.  Can you post a pix of the bike and a better pix of the rivets?  No LeMans II were imported by dealers into the U.S.  If LeMans II would have to be a grey market import.  Highly unlikely.  You would have purchased knowing that and the seller would have told you that to jack up the price.
a lemans 2 is a CX100 in the US.. my 81 Vin VU111572

the VE on your engine block is the designation for a Lemans 1,2 and 3 according Mick Walkers list in MG Twin Restoration book.. no CX or VU vin listed but I'll guess that U stands for US and is on the CX100's in place of the E.

Lemans 2 came out in the fall of 78 and your build date is Oct 77 so must be a LM1.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 06:52:13 PM by fotoguzzi »
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Online Tom

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2017, 08:01:27 PM »
He bought the 850 LeMans in Leroy's post but that looks like a number of parts that were utilized from other bikes.
There are no stupid questions.  There are however stupid people asking questions.

Offline jazzamoto

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Re: Pop Quiz?
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2017, 08:38:40 PM »
Oh bugger, shoulda noticed that. ;) The bike is built as a le mans, but I am wondering, because the numbers both have an extra digit and even if shaving off the first digit which is a zero, the number 74521 doesn't fit into any VIN number list I can find. It also has a bit of a hodge podge of parts on it - the rear fender is the 76 style, the side covers had the II badge removed, the engine case is painted black, etc. It has PHFs on it and the small bolts holding the intakes to head...but which other bikes had this engine? The frame and engine numbers are the same...

Could the frame badge have been re-made or does that look original?

860 Lbs GVWR?

Wicks,
Most of the '76 -'78 Le Mans imported to North America had 074-075 VIN numbers despite what you read in many publications of MG history. Plus you've got the VE prefix. You've got yourself a Le Mans!

Enjoy!

Jazz
Richmond, CA
'78 Le Mans I
2004 V11 Le Mans Cafe Sport
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