V7iii alternator output and heated grips, gear and lights

[Kiwi_Roy]

I'm not suggesting you will need a meter that will read up to 22 amps, just one that will measure the existing current which will be less than 10 amps.  Then do the subtraction to see how much is still available.  Personally, I wouldn't run anywhere near the stated capacity, but I'm saying there's plenty available for what Solcalrob wants to do.

Sorry, I thought you were, anyway someone might want to measure higher.

https://www.amazon.com/Extech-MA120-Clamp-Current-Detector/dp/B000BEZV5O/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1509306473&sr=8-3&keywords=clamp+on+dc+ammeter

The Hall Effect meters must be coming down in price, this one is ~$100, they used to be prohibitive
zzthis type of meter can be made more sensitive by putting more turns through the jaws

[Kev m]

This got me thinking that I should check the output on my V7-III Stone.  Happy to say that it was charging around 14.2 volts @ approx 3,000 rpm.  Griso 1200SE gave a similar result.

Just for giggles, I checked the cage, a Holden LS3 6.2 liter V8 (similar to a Chev SS sedan).  It read over 15 volts at idle, wasn't able to rev the engine while observing the voltmeter easily.  But it sounds a little high according to this conversation.  Should I get it checked properly?

It's funny. So like I said Guzzi seems to have specifically spec'd a VR that is considered in spec up to 15V.

And some research suggested that there are many batteries (most dry/gel cells) that tolerate that or even benefit from it, but only for a certain amount of time.

When this came to light and I tested and was surprised at the output I'd already had my bike for 3.5 years and maybe 10-12k miles and I seemed to have no other symptoms.

Todd at GT was stirring up the villagers with tales of fried ECU's or CPS's.

The only thing I suspect is that maybe it's shortened my battery life because now at 5 years old it takes significantly longer for the battery tender light to go to blinking green than it does my wife's 7 year old Duc!

So I dunno... What does Holden or their battery supplier say?

[Kiwi Dave]

I haven't asked.  Previous experience says I'll hit a brick wall.  And the model is now obsolete, last one rolled off the assembly line a few days ago.  No more RWD Commodores.  Did I say I detest front wheel drive vehicles?

But I'm feeling more comfortable about the 15v charging after a bit of research.

[Kev m]

But I'm feeling more comfortable about the 15v charging after a bit of research.

What, you mean the ECU isn't going to automatically fry?!? ( end sarcasm ).

Yeah I was surprised it wasn't completely black and white. But it didn't seem there was any negative to replacing our regulators with something that held it to low or mid 14's. And, well, it seems like a lot of our regulators were ABOVE 15 anyway... If only by a fraction.

[jas67]

I never had any worries about the electronics frying due to the 15V that the VR on the V7's were putting out.   I was only concerned about the battery life.

Electronics are usually concerned with a pretty good safety margin on input voltage.   15V is only 7% higher than 14V.   Now, if the voltage were 20 volts or higher, electronics would probably start to fry.   Certainly the light bulbs would be burning out, or at least very short lived.

[Kiwi_Roy]

It will make a difference because with the alternator connected it takes the load directly what's passing
through the fuse is charging/dis-charging current
http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2013_V7_Series.gif

If this drawing is correct just unplug the yellow wires between stator and regulator while you test it.

[Kiwi Dave]

It will make a difference because with the alternator connected it takes the load directly what's passing
through the fuse is charging/dis-charging current
http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2013_V7_Series.gif

If this drawing is correct just unplug the yellow wires between stator and regulator while you test it.

But only if the motor is running, right?

[TimmyTheHog]

It will make a difference because with the alternator connected it takes the load directly what's passing
through the fuse is charging/dis-charging current
http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2013_V7_Series.gif

If this drawing is correct just unplug the yellow wires between stator and regulator while you test it.

Correct me if I am wrong, the flywheel in the diagram is the alternator?

[Kiwi_Roy]

But only if the motor is running, right?

Yes, you are right, without the motor running there will only be a milliamp or 2 going into the regulator.
The headlight on my Griso only operates while the motor is running, it goes out if I press the kill switch (I'm new to the bike there may be a trick to turn it on) That's why I said unplug the alternator.
The V7 appears to have the same Light Logic Relay setup, I assumed it would be the same and you would need the light on while you do the test, it would be no use measuring fuse F as you wouldn't know how much the alternator was adding so just unplug it.
Note: I don't have a V7 to play with I'm just reading the schematic so take what I say with a grain of salt LOL

Correct me if I am wrong, the flywheel in the diagram is the alternator?

Yes item (31)


The charging circuit is rated at 268 Watts but that's at 3000 revs, if you are in stop and go traffic I doubt you will get much more than 100 average, but you soon learn and crank the heat down to match.

You are in Southern California aren't you?

[TimmyTheHog]

Actually I am just north of Seattle

[Kiwi_Roy]

Actually I am just north of Seattle

Ok, I can forgive you asking about heated gear then LOL
It can get pretty miserable when the wind is blowing off the snow
I rode down there for a show one January, the wind blowing across the fields was numbing,  I had a heated vest by the time I rode back again

As I said earlier the bike will handle the gear just scale it back when running under 3000, if you have a Voltmeter that is useful also.

[TimmyTheHog]

Ok, I can forgive you asking about heated gear then LOL
It can get pretty miserable when the wind is blowing off the snow
I rode down there for a show one January, the wind blowing across the fields was numbing,  I had a heated vest by the time I rode back again

As I said earlier the bike will handle the gear just scale it back when running under 3000, if you have a Voltmeter that is useful also.

LOL...thanks...

ya...body I can bundle up, but man, fingers sometimes frozen and usually it when you need to clutch in and brake LOL...

Ya, I got a Voltmeter gauge that I am going to add onto the bike as well while I am doing other things to it...

[Kiwi_Roy]

Re V7iii Alternator Output Update
Since last posting I purchased a new V7, the alternator output is definitely on the low side, it will handle a pair of gloves or grips but if you want to run a vest be prepared to
turn it down or off a few minutes before you stop otherwise it will not crank.

[smdl]

Re V7iii Alternator Output Update
Since last posting I purchased a new V7, the alternator output is definitely on the low side, it will handle a pair of gloves or grips but if you want to run a vest be prepared to
turn it down or off a few minutes before you stop otherwise it will not crank.

Hi, folks.

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I'm currently looking at purchasing a V7 III for my wife (new rider), and it will be important for her to be able to run both heated grips and a heated jacket liner.  My initial plan will be to do as others have suggested, and substitute LED lighting in order to gain capacity, but I'm wondering if there is a better/additional way?  On my V85TT, there apparently is logic built into the integrated grip controller to turn the grips off (temporarily) when the bike is running at less than 2000rpm.  This got me thinking.  What I'm wondering is if one of our resident electrical experts could weigh-in on the practicality of creating a standalone circuit that could be used to supply electrical gear, and that could modulate power based upon engine RPM, alternator output, or, likely more easily, current battery voltage?  That way, whenever we find ourselves in that in-town, slow-speed mode, this circuit could just turn the heat down until full alternator output resumes.  Thoughts?

I'm aware of the Oxford Battery Saving Mode, which is a good (if sometimes confusing) feature that monitors battery voltage and turns off the grips if voltage drops below 11.5 volts (or if it senses that the engine is not running).  However, this seems more targeted at situations where a person forgets to turn the grips off when they stop riding, and I'm wondering if something a little more proactive (maybe at 12.0v) and dynamic (variable, not just a simple shut-off) would be practical?  My hope is that something could be devised using standard electrical components without needing to get into complex microprocessor-based controls, etc.

Anyway, just a thought I'd ask if anyone had any thoughts on the subject.

Cheers,
Shaun

[Kiwi_Roy]

I have my V7III setup to ride year around.
I have a Girbing Vest and gloves,
LED headlight (the OEM one draws too much) and two 10 Watt driving lights.
Most essential is a Voltmeter otherwise for sure I would be draining the battery requiring a push start.
The system will just maintain the load when its spinning over 2,000 revs.
With the Voltmeter if I see the Voltage dropping below 12 (typical at the lights) I shed some load.
And of course when the key is turned off its essential to shed the heating load.
I have my Voltmeter connected across the city light.
https://www.amazon.com/DAIERTEK-Voltmeter-Waterproof-Universal-Terminals/dp/B08D1QNH6G/ref=sr_1_12_sspa?_encoding=UTF8&c=ts&keywords=Automotive+Replacement+Voltmeter+Gauges&qid=1636319002&s=automotive&sr=1-12-spons&ts_id=15729811&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFBWDAwTk1QUFNGOFUmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA5NDIwNTcyQjNFMzM0R1Y5UERHJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA0NDc2MDMxTTFMNVRQNUVWQjZGJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfbXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
This type is not waterproof.
https://www.amazon.com/MICTUNING-Display-Voltmeter-Waterproof-Motorcycle/dp/B078LVLHNF/ref=pd_bxgy_img_1/135-3489330-4859034?pd_rd_w=66vwq&pf_rd_p=c64372fa-c41c-422e-990d-9e034f73989b&pf_rd_r=05FKGPNT0S0XXX0FPKP9&pd_rd_r=4c89314e-62b0-40a5-9c06-e86b61786a9d&pd_rd_wg=ReNi2&pd_rd_i=B078LVLHNF&psc=1
These small Battery Voltmeters come really cheap $3 - $10 so buy several, they only read from about 8 - 24 Volt because they use the two wires to also power them up, some aren't waterproof but you can pour some 2 part epoxy into them to make at least shower proof, I think green or blue is better than red as far as visibility.

[smdl]

I have my V7III setup to ride year around.
I have a Girbing Vest and gloves,
LED headlight (the OEM one draws too much) and two 10 Watt driving lights.
Most essential is a Voltmeter otherwise for sure I would be draining the battery requiring a push start.
The system will just maintain the load when its spinning over 2,000 revs.
With the Voltmeter if I see the Voltage dropping below 12 (typical at the lights) I shed some load.
And of course when the key is turned off its essential to shed the heating load.
I have my Voltmeter connected across the city light.
https://www.amazon.com/DAIERTEK-Voltmeter-Waterproof-Universal-Terminals/dp/B08D1QNH6G/ref=sr_1_12_sspa?_encoding=UTF8&c=ts&keywords=Automotive+Replacement+Voltmeter+Gauges&qid=1636319002&s=automotive&sr=1-12-spons&ts_id=15729811&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFBWDAwTk1QUFNGOFUmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA5NDIwNTcyQjNFMzM0R1Y5UERHJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA0NDc2MDMxTTFMNVRQNUVWQjZGJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfbXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
This type is not waterproof.
https://www.amazon.com/MICTUNING-Display-Voltmeter-Waterproof-Motorcycle/dp/B078LVLHNF/ref=pd_bxgy_img_1/135-3489330-4859034?pd_rd_w=66vwq&pf_rd_p=c64372fa-c41c-422e-990d-9e034f73989b&pf_rd_r=05FKGPNT0S0XXX0FPKP9&pd_rd_r=4c89314e-62b0-40a5-9c06-e86b61786a9d&pd_rd_wg=ReNi2&pd_rd_i=B078LVLHNF&psc=1
These small Battery Voltmeters come really cheap $3 - $10 so buy several, they only read from about 8 - 24 Volt because they use the two wires to also power them up, some aren't waterproof but you can pour some 2 part epoxy into them to make at least shower proof, I think green or blue is better than red as far as visibility.

Thanks, Roy.   I added a Gammatronix voltage monitor to Stelvio, and found that it worked very well.

https://gammatronixltd.com/epages/bae94c71-c5b6-4572-89a1-e89006e78fbe.mobile/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/bae94c71-c5b6-4572-89a1-e89006e78fbe/Categories/Category1

I'm planning to add one to the V85, and will likely do the same with the V7 when we get that.  They're waterproof and intuitive, and I especially likely the periodic flash to indicate status when the key is off.  I always leave the bike on a tender, so it works well for me.  I also think their prices are very reasonable for what you get, although not as inexpensive a those you listed.

Cheers,
Shaun

[Kiwi_Roy]

Hi, folks.

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I'm currently looking at purchasing a V7 III for my wife (new rider), and it will be important for her to be able to run both heated grips and a heated jacket liner.  My initial plan will be to do as others have suggested, and substitute LED lighting in order to gain capacity, but I'm wondering if there is a better/additional way?  On my V85TT, there apparently is logic built into the integrated grip controller to turn the grips off (temporarily) when the bike is running at less than 2000rpm.  This got me thinking.  What I'm wondering is if one of our resident electrical experts could weigh-in on the practicality of creating a standalone circuit that could be used to supply electrical gear, and that could modulate power based upon engine RPM, alternator output, or, likely more easily, current battery voltage?  That way, whenever we find ourselves in that in-town, slow-speed mode, this circuit could just turn the heat down until full alternator output resumes.  Thoughts?

I'm aware of the Oxford Battery Saving Mode, which is a good (if sometimes confusing) feature that monitors battery voltage and turns off the grips if voltage drops below 11.5 volts (or if it senses that the engine is not running).  However, this seems more targeted at situations where a person forgets to turn the grips off when they stop riding, and I'm wondering if something a little more proactive (maybe at 12.0v) and dynamic (variable, not just a simple shut-off) would be practical?  My hope is that something could be devised using standard electrical components without needing to get into complex microprocessor-based controls, etc.

Anyway, just a thought I'd ask if anyone had any thoughts on the subject.

Cheers,
Shaun

I think as long as you turn it off when the engine is stopped you will be ok, even at idle the alternator almost manages to hold its own, its when you turn the motor off and the heat is left on that it really takes a dive in a matter of a few minutes, with a Voltage readout its easy to see if you are getting into trouble. Pick up a signal after the kill switch so if that or the key is off the heats off. You want to keep it simple.
Check out the bluetooth 2 channel controllers that Girbing sell, you can put that under the seat or plastic side cover and mount the controls on the bars, makes for a neat and tidy installation.
I don't have heated grips but use heated gloves on the second channel.
I glued the controller to the side of the air-box under the LH side cover. 
The first one overheated and burnt out, I now have a tiny fan keeping it cool and seems ok.
     
The bluetooth unit has an internal battery, it didn't work very well here, too much metal.
I now have it out by the LH mirror where it works much better, you can also see my Voltmeter.