V85 TT Merged Threadfest

[bad Chad]

"On top of that, my dealer figures they can sell whatever is coming if not to the user, it will be ported to near by province with little cost..."

Good God, if they can sell them like hot cakes in Canada, the pot may be blowing it's lid!  I hope the factory can keep up!

[TimmyTheHog]

"On top of that, my dealer figures they can sell whatever is coming if not to the user, it will be ported to near by province with little cost..."

Good God, if they can sell them like hot cakes in Canada, the pot may be blowing it's lid!  I hope the factory can keep up!

LOL...well, I would hope its true tbh LOL...

but for now, I will take it with grain of salt...all I care about is I have a bike coming for me to try! LOL

[pete roper]

Well here's what I'll be getting instead. It'll be a couple of months before I commit but it costs half as much as a V85, weighs 30kg+ less, has proper suspension, Luggage etc, etc. AND a modernish DOHC motor rather than a re-hashed antique dressed up as the arse end of a pantomime horse!



 

Pete

[Huzo]

Well here's what I'll be getting instead. It'll be a couple of months before I commit but it costs half as much as a V85, weighs 30kg+ less, has proper suspension, Luggage etc, etc. AND a modernish DOHC motor rather than a re-hashed antique dressed up as the arse end of a pantomime horse!



 

Pete

I'm sure at least one of you will be very happy..!

[bad Chad]

Enjoy.   But I’ll bet a dime to a doughnut you’llbe Tired of it within 12 months.

[Scud]

Pete - before you commit to that SWM, you should get a ride on a Husqvarna 701 Enduro (or supermoto).

[pete roper]

Tried an AJP. More bike than I needed, I suspect the Husky would be more of the same but harder to work on and with a thousand fasteners to remove before you got to the engine. Probably an air filter that leaks as well! :D.

I've sold all my pre-2000 Guzzi stuff. Keeping the Cali for a chair, the Griso stays with me forever but after it's proven it's worth the Stelvio 1400 will also most likely be on the block. My Mana is also for sale but I'm not trying hard as it's probably not worth a lot, even with the super-dooper suspension and luggage.

I'd love to stick with another Guzzi but I think the V85 is a crying shame and betrayal of a once great firm. I know plenty won't agree but it's the way I feel and no amount of argument will convince me otherwise. I hope that those who buy them enjoy them immensely.

[Tusayan]

The most promising part about the Shineray/SMW is the involvement of the ex-Cagiva, ex-BMW plant manager and a bunch of the old staff.  I admire them for putting together a deal for Chinese buyers to acquire ex-BMW/Husqvarna assets and get production going again, and I also admire Shineray for craftily buying a different 70s Italian name, an existing modern plant and hiring some pretty good local staff.  However I think the reason it's inexpensive is that it has as many Chinese sourced parts as possible: I understand the engine is basically a 2011 Husqvarna TE and the bike is assembled in the same Italian plant,  but it's otherwise built predominantly from Shineray (Chinese) sourced components, plus an off brand Chinese Fastace fork and who knows what kind of miniscule front brake that may be.  Its a 'value driven', professionally brand managed, mostly-Chinese product using an unrelated old name to invoke nostalgia.  I guess the individual can decide whether brand marketing and third world labor sold as old world Italian dirt bike nostalgia is distasteful or disingenuous to them, or just modern and pragmatic.  They can also decide whether the involvement of some knowledgeable Italians will save it from being a poor quality Chinese product or result in something more durable, that's not clear to me.

The V85TT is a totally different kind of motorcycle. The only thing it shares with the SWM is the use of 1970s/80s Italian dirt bike nostalgia as a marketing tool.  In the case of the Guzzi, it's not nearly as contrived and based on the Motorrad riding impression the bike may actually perform pretty well too, and fill a gap in the market.  I'm much more optimistic that the V85TT will accelerate Guzzi sales and reputation than with anything built since Aprilia took over.  They've seemingly hit a good original Guzzi combination that works - and people respond to that.

[fossil]

Well here's what I'll be getting instead. It'll be a couple of months before I commit but it costs half as much as a V85, weighs 30kg+ less, has proper suspension, Luggage etc, etc. AND a modernish DOHC motor rather than a re-hashed antique dressed up as the arse end of a pantomime horse!
 

Pete

Sounds like somebody who buys a Miata and complains about the fact that it is not a modern 4-seat front driven car like a Mini Cabriolet. 

[pete roper]

Both of the previous posts sound like the sort of grumpy old men who wish it was still 1957.

Fastace have a good name in the BMX world. Presumably moving on to a *Higher* market is only OK if you aren't brown and have slitty eyes?

Sorry, these arguments are bullshit. If it's a good product why not buy it? Don't tell me you believe Piaggio wouldn't sell their Guzzi workers down the river in an instant if they thought there was a quid in it!

Pete

[jacksonracingcomau]

presumably first 20 or so v85’s have been fettled and sent to journos by now

comparo with chinese singles unlikely, twin with Italian name more a risk Benelli DOH  500
could be competition, but I see sales coming.

[pete roper]

As I've said frequently Martin, I wish them every success. I just think it's a turd. Some people like turds. That's fine. Racist bullsit about where the money comes from won't sway my beliefs.

[fossil]

Oxford Advanced Learner`s Dictionary: turd (noun):

"a lump of solid waste from the bowels (e.g. dog turds)"

Well, I´m a technician. Thinking a new motorcycle is a turd without knowing it yet is not a valid argument for me. This argumentation simply says all people who like smallblocks in general and do look forward to the V85 are shit-loving idiots. Can we please stop this?

[pete roper]

Not what I was saying at all but carry on if it suits your narrative.

[Huzo]

As I've said frequently Martin, I wish them every success. I just think it's a turd. Some people like turds. That's fine. Racist bullsit about where the money comes from won't sway my beliefs.

High praise indeed Pete.
As I recall you referred to your Stelvio as a turd when you first got it.
If memory serves you said..
"It's a turd, but it's my turd.."
I don't have the report from ballistics as to whether it was your turd or not, but I guess it's safe enough to presume the rifling marks match your barrel if you say so.
I just hope you don't end up correct (again), regarding your initial appraisal of the V85...

[ratguzzi]

Well here's what I'll be getting instead. It'll be a couple of months before I commit but it costs half as much as a V85, weighs 30kg+ less, has proper suspension, Luggage etc, etc. AND a modernish DOHC motor rather than a re-hashed antique dressed up as the arse end of a pantomime horse!



 

Pete

I have put $8500 down on a Superdual X and as soon as it gets to Texas and set up, I will be doing a fly and ride to fetch it. I wanted a V85 but this is by far more offroad capable.
JB

[Tusayan]

I think the SWM will be fine for what it is, a budget bike designed to get Shineray going in more developed markets. My Cagiva Gran Canyon, built in the same plant and bought new and heavily discounted for $6K was a very good bike.  The Navigators were pretty good bikes too, the Suzuki engines are excellent, and a 2011 BMW-Husqvarna had a good engine too. However in time all those previous products left the market, ultimately unsuccessful.

Guzzi has a lot more potential but Piaggio has been clueless.  They were wrong with the range of BMW copies (it was a dead end) wrong with Aprilia in trying to compete directly with the Japanese (they’ve failed), and wrong with any number of other screw ups over the last 15 years.  The main thing they've got right with Guzzi during their period of ownership is the Griso, which because it was basically a redone Centauro and a unique concept that works, has street cred and built Guzzi’s reputation.  However against that backdrop of mostly bad ideas, downselecting to an improved small block indicates that they now recognize the Guzzi product is going to be more expensive than the Chinese and Indian competition over the next 15 years, and that they can’t price the bike like a BMW until they can offer the mass market status and backup of BMW.  It's very similar to what Ducati did successfully with the Monster in the 90s.  In parallel they've come with a concept that's attractive, not a direct copy of anybody else, nor of a previous Guzzi model. I think they’re finally ‘getting it’ - maybe the V85TT indicates they’ve finally learned that you have to have the confidence to be yourself if you want people to take you seriously.

[kingoffleece]

Silly me.  I thought it was just about motorcycles.
Very entertaining, gents.

[jas67]

High praise indeed Pete.
As I recall you referred to your Stelvio as a turd when you first got it.
If memory serves you said..
"It's a turd, but it's my turd.."

Kinda reminds me of George Carlin.

"Ever notice that your shit is stuff, and other people's stuff is shit?     Move your shit out of the way so I have room for my stuff!"

[pete roper]

What makes my Stelvio a turd is the abuse it's copped in its life, not its intrinsic design. Sure it's ugly but at least it's only ugly on the outside!

[rocker59]

...Piaggio has been clueless.  They were wrong with the range of BMW copies (it was a dead end) 

In regards to the CARC bikes, I always thought it was tragic that Piaggio/Guzzi developed R1150 clones just as BMW was getting ready to release the R1200 bikes!

The Guzzi CARC bikes were well behind the curve in the intended market niche.

[Devildog]

My dealer is confused by the Piaggio strategy. He thought since Aprilia already had the Dorsoduro, they could have easily modified that bike into an Enduro Adventure years ago.

[Smithy]

The V85TT will be Guzzis biggest hit and kick off an entire new generation of bikes. The mid size Adventure bikes are the next big thing, I have had the big Adv bikes in the past and my 2005 GS was excellent but they are getting too big with too much crap on them and single cylinder bikes for touring just dont cut it..my mate had a DR 650 for a while and lots of people rave about them..it was shit..

[inditx]

Well here's what I'll be getting instead. It'll be a couple of months before I commit but it costs half as much as a V85, weighs 30kg+ less, has proper suspension, Luggage etc, etc. AND a modernish DOHC motor rather than a re-hashed antique dressed up as the arse end of a pantomime horse!



 

Pete

That’s quite a nice looking bike, hadn’t seen that one before.
inditx

[blu guzz]

Is that SWM coming to the US?  I had never seen or heard of it.  When you posted it, I thought it was a photoshop of several different bikes (seriously).  I mean no insult to anyone who might like it, just was unaware.

[inditx]

A quick search indicated they are going to be available in the USA.

[pete roper]

AF1 have a couple of models in already but the Superduals aren't arriving for a couple of months I believe.

[Tusayan]

The V85TT will be Guzzis biggest hit and kick off an entire new generation of bikes. The mid size Adventure bikes are the next big thing, I have had the big Adv bikes in the past and my 2005 GS was excellent but they are getting too big with too much crap on them and single cylinder bikes for touring just dont cut it.

I agree.  The R80 and R100GS is where the whole thing started and much of the progression since then has been trying to do something newer, bigger and with more widgets just to keep people buying. At some point the soul of the idea gets lost... and I think they’re at that point.  The TT may therefore be the right bike at the right time.  I think the question mark has been the engines power output but the Motorrad impression seems to say it’s lived up to what was promised...  and that magazine is not particularly known for being charitable to Italian bikes.

[Huzo]

Paid my deposit this morning for the full house Ronald McDonald version.
Won't turn a wheel in that livery though, will be as per the Beetle photo shop version and either polished or silver anodised rims.
New Behr or Excell at a pinch...

[Trialsman]

I have had no luck with deposits.  First the $500 last March to All Season in OH - they retired.  Then $500 to Matthews in NC - then the Factory web thing caught them by surprise.  So I was at Matthews Wednesday and they talked to the rep at Piaggio.  I was supposed to put it in on the website, which Tee and I tried to do multiple times.  Error message each time, more calls to the rep, marketing, IT and still NO BUENO.  I had to leave but hope they were able to work it out and my Ronald MacDonald is on order.