The reason for the decline in motorcycle sales

[Lannis]

So did I.

Probably a LOT of people here did.   It's beyond me how anyone could say they know ANYTHING about Millenials if they haven't dealt with 1995 middle-school peer pressure, 2000 "which sports team?", 1997 "What IS 'Odyssey of the Mind' and should we do it?', 1999 8th grade "Your son wrote an article for an 'underground' school paper", 2003 "I was accepted to the Air Force Academy but I'd rather enlist in the Marine Corps (??!!!???)"  2001 "Everyone else has a cell phone" 2002 "You got WHAT kind of ticket?"  2004 "You're taking WHO to the Senior Prom?"  2005 "WHAT GPA did you say you got for your freshman year?   I couldn't have heard that right, what I heard started with a 1.!".

If you've been there, you know.   And because we paid attention to how we raised them, and didn't let MTV and "The Village" raise them, they humorously fit NONE of the millenial stereotypes, the stereotypes humorously parodied in the opening post of the thread ....

Lannis

[Mayor_of_BBQ]

I raised two of them.   What about you?   

Lannis

dang, so you are the dastardly knave handing out all those participation trophies!

[Shorty]

Poor kids. No matter what they do, they catch hell.  If they buy old bikes and try to modify them, (like we did) wear old jeans and flannel shirts (like we did/do), we call them hipsters. "Why don't they invent their own thing?"

If they want nothing to do with the smelly old deathtraps, and buy a newish sportbike, they are Squids.

And, if they cannot be bothered with bikes and hot rods, they are Millenial pansies.    I guess young and old laughing at each other is just part of the deal. Me, I'm just jealous of their shiney undamaged livers.....

[Lannis]

dang, so you are the dastardly knave handing out all those participation trophies!

We didn't much go for that, despite the popularity of them .... !  Our motto was "Second Place = First Loser!" 

[Lannis]

Poor kids. No matter what they do, they catch hell.  If they buy old bikes and try to modify them, (like we did) wear old jeans and flannel shirts (like we did/do), we call them hipsters. "Why don't they invent their own thing?"

If they want nothing to do with the smelly old deathtraps, and buy a newish sportbike, they are Squids.

And, if they cannot be bothered with bikes and hot rods, they are Millenial pansies.    I guess young and old laughing at each other is just part of the deal. Me, I'm just jealous of their shiney undamaged livers.....

You need to either get down to Raleigh EuroBike Day in April, or experience it vicariously through my pics in (for example) this

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=75811.0

post.

One of the real pleasures of this get-together is seeing the home-made, I-did-it-my-way, stick-to-it-boy creations of the young folks that are putting these things together with NO money.   I don't know how to spot a "hipster", but when I'm talking to some long-haired, wild-arsed 20-year-old who has built a "cafe" bike or a "tracker" bike out of some junked CX500 or C90 Honda or a KZ400 that someone put in the skip ... I have no fear for the future!   

Maybe it's the exceptions that prove the rule ....

Lannis

[Shorty]

You need to either get down to Raleigh EuroBike Day in April, or experience it vicariously through my pics in (for example) this

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=75811.0

post.

One of the real pleasures of this get-together is seeing the home-made, I-did-it-my-way, stick-to-it-boy creations of the young folks that are putting these things together with NO money.   I don't know how to spot a "hipster", but when I'm talking to some long-haired, wild-arsed 20-year-old who has built a "cafe" bike or a "tracker" bike out of some junked CX500 or C90 Honda or a KZ400 that someone put in the skip ... I have no fear for the future!   

Maybe it's the exceptions that prove the rule ....

Lannis

Your photos in that link have "shelf lifed", but I get your drift, and would probably love that event.

[Lannis]

Your photos in that link have "shelf lifed", but I get your drift, and would probably love that event.

Really?  I can see all of the photos ... or maybe that's because they were Photobucket at the time and I can see them but no one else can?   If so, I apologize for the inconvenience on behalf of the money-grubbing bait-and-switch team at PB ... 

Lannis

[mjptexas]

So do any of your kids fit the stereotypes?

So here's the youngest posing on her Honda Rebel:



She works hard, plays hard, owns her own house, and makes a whole lot more money than I did at her age.

The oldest one?  Maybe a few millennial tendencies, but not many.  When the Mrs and I talk about her we usually finish the discussion with "At least she hasn't done <fill in the blank>".  We'll leave it at that.

[Kev m]

The thing about trends is they may identify with some portion of a group, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's even the majority never mind all.

[Lannis]

The thing about trends is they may identify with some portion of a group, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's even the majority never mind all.

Yep.   Thing is, I don't think anyone is SAYING it's "all"; maybe not even that it's the majority.   

But enough to notice; and (as we who can remember the past), different from the past ....

Lannis

[Kev m]

Yep.   Thing is, I don't think anyone is SAYING it's "all"; maybe not even that it's the majority.   

But enough to notice; and (as we who can remember the past), different from the past ....

Lannis

Many of the comments on these threads seem to suggest the belief that it is the majority.

[Darren Williams]

The thing about stereotypes is there is a trace of truth to it and there are those tendencies in most subjects (of course some turn out perfect, like they were raised in the 1950's or something).  My two sons are very ordinary and typical, as are their friends. And while they all have smart phones and fact check everything you say and regularly check their social media, for the most part they are actually intelligent good kids that like to do cool things and have somewhat realistic views of the future. Just because some of those things aren't the way I imagine them to be, doesn't mean they are wrong.

I really think opportunity is a big factor in what they are able to accomplish. Several kids, who's Dads never turned a wrench or taught their sons to do it, took to wrenching on cars and bikes and had a lot of fun. They also thought tuning with diagnostic tools to be a piece of cake (very comfortable in the digital world). I think they will be OK and actually like them hanging out in my garage, as long as they stay out of my beer fridge.

[Sasquatch Jim]

  Going back to the original post, Rainwater is not hard water.  It is distilled water, therefore soft.
 

[PJPR01]

Perhaps each of us on WG should assign ourselves a sales quota this year:

Convince one person throughout the year to buy a New Guzzi, and simultaneously invite them to join WG here online.

Given the large of folks here and who also simultaneously participate in the MG Facebook page, there's a chance this could result in a moderate bump in new members and new owners over the course of time.

Cheers!

[oldbike54]

 Luap and I were discussing how to increase membership here , and help promote the brand . One of the ideas was to NOT insult young folks . There is a limited supply of us old guys , we really need young folks to join in , so let's not start dissing them . Agreed ?

 Dusty

[thepittsburghguzzi]

And not get all grumpy to hell and back when someone asks a question that was covered in a thread three years ago. Please.

Luap and I were discussing how to increase membership here , and help promote the brand . One of the ideas was to NOT insult young folks . There is a limited supply of us old guys , we really need young folks to join in , so let's not start dissing them . Agreed ?

 Dusty

[oldbike54]

And not get all grumpy to hell and back when someone asks a question that was covered in a thread three years ago. Please.

 Interestingly enough , we touched on that also . We were all neophytes at one time .

 Dusty

[Kev m]

Luap and I were discussing how to increase membership here , and help promote the brand . One of the ideas was to NOT insult young folks . There is a limited supply of us old guys , we really need young folks to join in , so let's not start dissing them . Agreed ?

 Dusty

+1 Brazilian

[Guzzistajohn]

Hey Dusty go ahead and delete the whole damn thread before we reach the dreaded �conjecture�

[Lannis]

Hey Dusty go ahead and delete the whole damn thread before we reach the dreaded �conjecture�

And we thought it was Humorous, shame on us you!   This is why we can't have nice things .... 

[oldbike54]

And we thought it was Humorous, shame on us you!   This is why we can't have nice things .... 

 It started that way , but then...

 Dusty

[Guzzistajohn]

And we thought it was Humorous, shame on us you!   This is why we can't have nice things .... 

Yes, I'm a mean no good SOB! An insensitive lout! I feel TERRIBLE! I hope the kids can forgive me and not make some hashtag thingy about me

[oldbike54]

 <sigh>

 Dusty

[PJPR01]

That’s why I suggested above we all put on our sales hats and go and recruit...diplomati cally of course.

[guzzi4me]

When I am out riding it seems like a "younger rider" always comes up and says the usual
things...

What's that?
Didn't know they made them anymore.
What year is it?

A pleasant conversation always follows. I explain that you don't need 100+HP to have
fun and the way a bike handles has a LOT more input than mere numbers.

I tell them to check out this site and give them my Guzzi business card that I carry.
(My daughter made them for me and have been quite useful!!).

Does it help? Don't know.

But it is always nice to chat and promote the brand.

More often than not we leave together and they can see just how a Guzzi can handle...because this old guy is ahead of them!!!

We all share the same passion...
no matter what we ride.


Ride safe and often,

Jeff

[Huzo]

We didn't much go for that, despite the popularity of them .... !  Our motto was "Second Place = First Loser!" 

As a guy, there's nothing wrong with coming second..!

[blackcat]

Luap and I were discussing how to increase membership here , and help promote the brand . One of the ideas was to NOT insult young folks . There is a limited supply of us old guys , we really need young folks to join in , so let's not start dissing them . Agreed ?

 Dusty

Exactly.

When my Norton owning friends ask me why there are so many old guys who like Moto Guzzi, you know you have an image problem.

[Lannis]

Exactly.

When my Norton owning friends ask me why there are so many old guys who like Moto Guzzi, you know you have an image problem.

We want to be fair, though.

Every time we "dis" an old guy, we get to "dis" one young guy.   How else are they going to learn to take it?   They'll be on steel cut oats and viagra and knee replacements and cpaps and have gray beards and Dunlaps soon enough ... it's up to us to train them.

Lannis

[Kiwi_Roy]

From the perspective of what you folks lovingly refer to as a millennial, I can tell you the biggest reason is a lot simpler than that: we can’t afford new motorcycles. We ESPECIALLY can’t afford the big-displacement, overpriced (cough - Harley - cough) motorcycles that the generation before us popularized so well. Things are different now. We can’t afford to “work and pay our way through college” anymore. More and more of us are being forced to move back in with parents. As costs of living outpace wage increases and job prospects, luxuries like new motorcycles feel just as out of reach as home ownership (you know, another market that millenials are killing, in addition to jewelry stores and Applebee’s).
If you’d take the time to actually observe and chat with a few of us confoundin, dagnabbin millenials, you’ll see that we’re pretty huge fans of the vintage market, barn finds, and finding cheap bikes on Craigslist that we can afford to pick up. Scrape together a bit from our paychecks and make them our own. We love it. Here in Pittsburgh, I can name three cooperative shops in a 3 square mile area where a bunch of us rent a space, stock it with whatever tools we can afford, and wrench on our bikes. We buy old shop manuals off eBay, make tons of mistakes, create some really cool things, and absolutely love it. At 26, I’m fortunate enough to own three bikes so far. One of them I bought from my brother and pulled it out of a storage shed. The other two were bought used, one is a 2011 and the other a 2012. A truly new bike, the statistic with the storm cloud over it, is just out of reach for me (and almost every single one of my millenial riding buddies) for right now. We can’t afford new ones.

But trust me, we love motorcycles.

That’s not a whole lot different than when I grew up in the 60s, most of my fellow apprentices had beat up old Brit bikes from the 50s



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[Motormike]

I think the real problem are the bike manufacturers and their unrealistic production and sales expectations.  Did Harley Davidson really think they could continue to make and sell 350,000 bikes a year forever?  I knew when they decided to stretch the production run of the 100th anniversary models to 14 months they were headed for a glut.  I toured the Kansas City plant right after it opened, thinking, "my god, they've got more production space here than they could ever possibly use."  But we've been down this road before.  Anyone remember the Yamaha 550 Vision?  Only imported for a couple of years...1982 and 83 I think.  I wanted one of those so bad, especially the later faired version.  Couldn't afford it, but the warehoused were filled with unsold ones.  You could buy that bike (and other left-over models) several years later brand new.  The glut of unsold Japanese bikes led to the "Harley Davidson" tariff on bikes over 700cc.  The market will survive, but none of the manufacturers are going to sell as many $20,000 plus bikes as they thought they would.  Things are going to be slow until the market works through the over-supply of nice used bikes out there.  That will take several years.