Author Topic: Dealership gone  (Read 2398 times)

Online Mayor_of_BBQ

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #30 on: February 26, 2018, 10:52:26 AM »
Not sure I'd use Walmart and Target as the paragons of business practices.

I don't agree with their business practices...  But the point of capitalism is to extract maximum labor from from your employees for the least amount of compensation possible, source supplies for the lowest cost possible, sell good/services at the highest price your customers will bear, and provide maximum ROI for your owners & shareholders.....  By that rubric, they are excelling
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Offline Tom

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2018, 04:19:44 PM »
On that observation.   :thumb:  The main reason to be in business is to make money.  Simple logic.  Make no money.....no business.
There are no stupid questions.  There are however stupid people asking questions.

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #32 on: February 27, 2018, 11:57:43 AM »
as of right now... I have a 6 hour drive to the nearest [Guzzi] dealer. That's not exactly gonna sell bikes.

And, how far is it to the nearest Ferrari or Maserati dealer?

Michael T.
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Offline Guzzi Gal

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #33 on: February 27, 2018, 12:37:55 PM »
And, how far is it to the nearest Ferrari or Maserati dealer?

We have 2 of each within about 20 miles of each other.  We also have Bentley, Rolls Royce, Lamborghini, Alfa Romeo, Aston Martin, Jaguar, Audi, Porsche, Mercedes, BMW, Land Rover, and the list goes on.     
:bow: Thanks for enabling my MG obsession! :bow:

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Offline Toecutter

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #34 on: February 27, 2018, 12:38:37 PM »
Are you honestly comparing Guzzi to Ferrari and Maserati?



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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #35 on: February 27, 2018, 12:41:28 PM »
Quote
The main reason to be in business is to make money.  Simple logic.  Make no money.....no business.

Sure, on paper. But money can be made ethically, too. Businesses can survive without being... *this.

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #36 on: February 27, 2018, 01:31:55 PM »
We have 2 of each within about 20 miles of each other.  We also have Bentley, Rolls Royce, Lamborghini, Alfa Romeo, Aston Martin, Jaguar, Audi, Porsche, Mercedes, BMW, Land Rover, and the list goes on.   
Are you toecutter?

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #37 on: February 27, 2018, 01:33:20 PM »
Are you honestly comparing Guzzi to Ferrari and Maserati?
Is Guzzi not an exotic, low production Italian motor company?

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Michael T.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #38 on: February 27, 2018, 02:00:01 PM »
I would argue that your stance makes zero sense, considering how hard Guzzi is marketing to the current crop of new riders... through social media. The want to sell to the Triumph crowd, they want to sell to the Ducati crowd, else, they wouldn't be on the same showroom floors.  They wouldn't be showing up at the same motorcycle shows. I don't see Ferrari or Maserati, which, by the way are inarguably, high-end, LUXURY brands, that sell simply through their own legacy (otherwise known as "word of mouth"), resorting to selling to Gen Y and Millennials through Instagram, or putting said generations in their advertising. I have yet to see an ad, featuring hip 20-somethings, gleefully piloting their new Maserati , to park in front of the local pub.

Face it, Piaggio is trying to crack into a market that far outstretches the niche market, small batch, exotic Italian brands. They're reaching the market for sure... but they're dropping the ball on supporting that market. Those Gen Y and Millennials that are about to drop the scratch on a new bike... they like that Guzzi. Hell, an average night's ride for me will prove that, they love the bikes. They would BUY the bikes... but dealer and service support just aren't there. So that $8000 -$10,000 they scrimped and saved for... is better spent on a Sportster, or a Bonnie, or any of a dozen similar bikes that just make more sense.

And finally, you go buy a Ferrari, or a Maserati... and tell me how the customer suppoort is, compared to Piaggio.

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #39 on: February 27, 2018, 02:53:18 PM »
Are you toecutter?
Nope, just observing that darkstar1269, myself and a few others on this forum live in an area where those brands thrive.  Sorry to have overstepped.  :lipsrsealed: 
:bow: Thanks for enabling my MG obsession! :bow:

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Offline rodekyll

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #40 on: February 27, 2018, 02:58:08 PM »
UPS is heavily into the "depot repair and supply" service.  When you send your computer or other electronic device, small appliance, power tool, etc in for "depot repair" it could well be headed to a UPS facility where UPS employees with some sort of "universal certification" (read that "minimally skilled") with a procedure sheet and minimum wage changes out the part.

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #41 on: February 27, 2018, 03:16:42 PM »
I would argue that your stance makes zero sense, considering how hard Guzzi is marketing to the current crop of new riders... through social media. The want to sell to the Triumph crowd, they want to sell to the Ducati crowd, else, they wouldn't be on the same showroom floors.  They wouldn't be showing up at the same motorcycle shows. I don't see Ferrari or Maserati, which, by the way are inarguably, high-end, LUXURY brands, that sell simply through their own legacy (otherwise known as "word of mouth"), resorting to selling to Gen Y and Millennials through Instagram, or putting said generations in their advertising. I have yet to see an ad, featuring hip 20-somethings, gleefully piloting their new Maserati , to park in front of the local pub.

Face it, Piaggio is trying to crack into a market that far outstretches the niche market, small batch, exotic Italian brands. They're reaching the market for sure... but they're dropping the ball on supporting that market. Those Gen Y and Millennials that are about to drop the scratch on a new bike... they like that Guzzi. Hell, an average night's ride for me will prove that, they love the bikes. They would BUY the bikes... but dealer and service support just aren't there. So that $8000 -$10,000 they scrimped and saved for... is better spent on a Sportster, or a Bonnie, or any of a dozen similar bikes that just make more sense.

And finally, you go buy a Ferrari, or a Maserati... and tell me how the customer suppoort is, compared to Piaggio.

We will just have to disagree, then, I suppose.

Maserati and Alfa Romeo are selling CUVs, fer Chrissakes.

Despite being at a decade-long high for production volume, Guzzi remains around 10,000 worldwide units.  Compared to Ducati and Triumph (which themselves are niche Euro brands), Guzzi is a rare and unusual exotic. 

Guzzi sends about 10% of production to North America, USA/Canada.  So, how many dealers should PGA have for Moto Guzzi, a brand which they're importing 1,000 units into a market of about 350 million people ??? 
Michael T.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #42 on: February 27, 2018, 03:20:11 PM »
Nope, just observing that darkstar1269, myself and a few others on this forum live in an area where those brands thrive.  Sorry to have overstepped.  :lipsrsealed:

So you live in a thriving metro.  Good for you.  So, put it into perspective for us.  You have dealers for everything just around the corner.  So, how far is your nearest Guzzi dealer ?
Michael T.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #43 on: February 27, 2018, 03:41:55 PM »
I'm not saying Piaggio should have more dealers... I'm saying that it's no surprise that dealers are cutting ties with them. I'm saying that the brand will continue to struggle, as long as the dealer/service network stays the way it is. I'm saying that the reality is at odds with their apparent marketing goals. I am giving reasons as to why they are and will continue to struggle... in a world of buyers with limited funds, it makes more sense to buy something with support. The world is changing. We are seeing the rise of a generation, raised on instant gratification, instant payback, instant results. What has worked for 90 years in an analog world, is going to struggle in a digital one.

And by almost all accounts... Piaggio is difficult to deal with. Is it worth it to a dealer to give up precious floor space for them?

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #44 on: February 27, 2018, 03:50:55 PM »

some fun numbers for US sales.  Maserati and ALFA have a higher % market share of the US car market than Guzzi does of the US motorcycle market:


Maserati All Models Market Share
2017       13.711      0,08%
2016       12.534      0,07%
2015       11.697      0,07%
2014       12.942      0,08%
2013       4.768      0,03%

Alfa Romeo  All Models  Market Share
2017             12.031   0,07%
2016              528   0,00%
2015              663   0,00%
2014               91   0
   
Ferrari All Models
2017      2.518
2016      2.326
2015      2.124
2014      2.110
2013      1.944
2012      1.764



http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/

   
 
 
Michael T.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #45 on: February 27, 2018, 07:44:27 PM »


It is sad. Most bikes these days will require some form of warranty work during the first couple years and if you need that done and do not have anywhere to go, then you are stuck footing the bill and doing it yourself.

Interesting.

Fwiw, I could have used a warranty on my Jackal, but buying it slightly used (under 1k miles) it didn't come with one and I didn't have the option.

I had a warranty on my Breva and would have liked to use it to get it to run without pinging, but alas no one could do that. That is until I spent $500 for a Guzzitech reflash. So the warranty was useless.

I had a warranty on my V7, but I never really needed it. Well I would have used it to cure the cold idle stumble, but it wasn't something that dealers could fix either. An by the time I realized my regulator was overcharging it was out of warranty.

So my warranty on my Guzzis has always been useless.

I know I used the warranty on my 93 and 96 Harleys a couple of times.

I don't recall ever using it on the 2004 or 2005 883s.

And on the 2007 I only used it right after break in when I pointed out they'd actually assembled a motorcycle without intake manifold bolts. I did later bring it in for a silly recall. But other than that, no warranty work.

And I've not used it in the first year in the FLHP.

So I dunno... Jury is out if "MOST" will need it.

But I understand wanting to have the option.
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Offline Guzzi Gal

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #46 on: February 27, 2018, 10:33:37 PM »
So you live in a thriving metro.  Good for you.  So, put it into perspective for us.  You have dealers for everything just around the corner.  So, how far is your nearest Guzzi dealer?

Twenty-minute drive before the aforementioned dealer ended its relationship with Piaggio, now 108-ish miles.  Again, sorry to have spoken out of turn.     
:bow: Thanks for enabling my MG obsession! :bow:

"Anni" Moto Guzzi V7 III Anniversario,
"Velvet" Honda CTX 700,
"Brigitte", AKA "Gigi"  Vespa GTS 300ie,
"Greywind" Vespa GTS 300 Super,  
The twin Honda Metropolitans
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Offline darkstar1269

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #47 on: February 28, 2018, 06:15:31 AM »

Interesting.

Fwiw, I could have used a warranty on my Jackal, but buying it slightly used (under 1k miles) it didn't come with one and I didn't have the option.

I had a warranty on my Breva and would have liked to use it to get it to run without pinging, but alas no one could do that. That is until I spent $500 for a Guzzitech reflash. So the warranty was useless.

I had a warranty on my V7, but I never really needed it. Well I would have used it to cure the cold idle stumble, but it wasn't something that dealers could fix either. An by the time I realized my regulator was overcharging it was out of warranty.

So my warranty on my Guzzis has always been useless.

I know I used the warranty on my 93 and 96 Harleys a couple of times.

I don't recall ever using it on the 2004 or 2005 883s.

And on the 2007 I only used it right after break in when I pointed out they'd actually assembled a motorcycle without intake manifold bolts. I did later bring it in for a silly recall. But other than that, no warranty work.

And I've not used it in the first year in the FLHP.

So I dunno... Jury is out if "MOST" will need it.

But I understand wanting to have the option.
I agree it is likely not most, but even in your case you are close to 50 percent. I have not used warranties even at that rate but like you said it is nice to have that piece of mind just in case.

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #48 on: February 28, 2018, 06:33:19 AM »
I agree it is likely not most, but even in your case you are close to 50 percent. I have not used warranties even at that rate but like you said it is nice to have that piece of mind just in case.

I hear ya. And I do like that I have a dealer or two to choose from in a 100 mile radius. We had 3 more in that radius, of course 2 were useless, but all 3 are gone now.

I sure wish it was like Harley where I have 2-3 dealers in a 30 mile radius instead.

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Offline Tom

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #49 on: February 28, 2018, 12:08:28 PM »
The dealer out here has been gone since they set up shop on the Piaggio line.  Their emphasis is on the scooters and for motorcycles it's the HD line, Triumph and Kawasaki.  They have to floor the Moto Guzzi bikes but don't service or carry parts.  The mechanics in the service department are mainly HD and could care less about the quality of their work on the other brands. 

They also own Lamborghini, Alfa Romeo & Ferrari rights.  All of course are by order only.  Their new boutique near downtown Honolulu is all about sales with no service.  Nearest dealer is somewhere on the West Coast.  I order parts from all over the U.S.  The dealer is Hawaii SUCKS.
There are no stupid questions.  There are however stupid people asking questions.

Offline blackcat

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #50 on: February 28, 2018, 12:40:20 PM »
The local dealer was selling about 15-20 Guzzi's a year with a sales and service staff that could care less about the bikes. In fact the sales staff would try to direct a customer who was interested in Guzzi's to the BMW line and in that process pissed off a few customer's into not buying anything. Only the manager was really interested in Moto Guzzi, so the sales staff would tell a potential customer that they had to talk to him because they didn't know that much about the bikes.

They now have two bikes on the floor, will not order anymore bikes and Guzzi is the problem.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #51 on: February 28, 2018, 03:22:30 PM »
   Sorry to have overstepped.  :lipsrsealed:

Hey, no problem.  I was just trying to understand the relevance of your reply, noting the abundance of dealerships in Phoenix, when I was addressing a Cannuckian in The Great White North.
Michael T.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #52 on: February 28, 2018, 05:24:41 PM »
You HOSER!!!


Offline Guzzi Gal

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #53 on: February 28, 2018, 06:23:54 PM »
Hey, no problem.  I was just trying to understand the relevance of your reply, noting the abundance of dealerships in Phoenix, when I was addressing a Cannuckian in The Great White North.

No worries. :thumb: 

My point was that if Piaggio can't maintain a dealer/service provider where one should flourish there's little hope for the more remote enthusiasts let alone potential new owners.  I'm a weirdo as I purchased a V7 III knowing that I was paddling against a swift current but the bike tugged at my heartstrings so thoroughly I couldn't resist.
:bike-037:   
:bow: Thanks for enabling my MG obsession! :bow:

"Anni" Moto Guzzi V7 III Anniversario,
"Velvet" Honda CTX 700,
"Brigitte", AKA "Gigi"  Vespa GTS 300ie,
"Greywind" Vespa GTS 300 Super,  
The twin Honda Metropolitans
"Miri" and Mori"

Offline sidecarnutz

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #54 on: February 28, 2018, 07:01:11 PM »
On the few new Guzzi's I did buy, letting the dealer do work under warranty always went sideways and became a nightmare for me. Seriously, back then they could have f***** up a wet dream. Their service was THAT bad on my bikes. The collateral damage their service department did was incredible. Came close to using the state lemon law on one bike. Funny thing was that after I just took responsibility for the bike and did the work myself, the bikes became very reliable and were no more trouble for me. A little warranty parts support was all I ever really needed. Back when my Ural was new, the factory warranty support for me was terrific. Since I run a licensed repair shop and knew the bikes inside out like I did Guzzi's, they would authorize me to do work under warranty and even overnight the parts to me. Only needed a few things in the three year warranty time frame. But they were Johnny on the spot for me each time.

But, can't afford new bikes anymore. I just play with cast off stuff no one else wants anymore. I seem to be the last dinosaur mechanic standing. Love the Tonti frame Guzzi's, Urals and Royal Enfields. Easy to work on as my lawn tractor!
yeah, I might be addicted to brake fluid. But I can stop any time I want.

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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #55 on: March 01, 2018, 08:04:10 AM »
My point was that if Piaggio can't maintain a dealer/service provider where one should flourish there's little hope for the more remote enthusiasts let alone potential new owners.  I'm a weirdo as I purchased a V7 III knowing that I was paddling against a swift current but the bike tugged at my heartstrings so thoroughly I couldn't resist.
:bike-037:   

That is true.  I live in one of our Country's motorcycle meccas.  We had a Triumph/Ducati/Moto Guzzi dealership here from 1995-2002.  Sixteen years, now, and no one has picked up any of those Euro brands, in a metro of 500,000+ with nearby roads that people come from all over the country to ride.

We do have a well established BMW shop.  And of course HondaYamaZuki dealers, along with the ubiquitous Harley-Davidson big box mega store.

I choose to ride Triumph/Ducati/Moto Guzzi, so Tulsa (120mi), Kansas City (230mi), and Dallas (340mi) are where I go for dealers, when I need one.


Michael T.
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Re: Dealership gone
« Reply #56 on: March 01, 2018, 08:21:31 AM »
My feeling is simple.  If you can't work on them yourself (do the basic stuff,)  then a Guzzi shouldn't be your ride of choice.  If it appears to be a crap shoot as to whether you'll have a dealer or not in a year or two, then maybe another brand is the right choice.  This is sad!

Bob
You are spot on Bob, thatís where Iím at now. My only dealer in NC is two hours away, a four hour 200 mile trip. Luckily Iíve got access to an old retired Honda mechanic whoís dealer had MG for 3 years.

 

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