V7 III clutch ?

[RRider]

I've noticed that there's quite a lot of discussion around clutch with V7 models. Especially about proper clutch adjustment.

Being a Japanese bike owner at the moment, I'm not used to paying much attention to clutch - it just works and it's enough to check/adjust (rarely) the cable movement at maintenance intervals.

Is there a mechanical or design reason in V7 Guzzi that requires more attention to the clutch (free play or point of opening), or is this all clutch talk just a statistical bias in forums? I know V7 has a dry clutch, but in principle this should not cause any more frequent need for adjustment than a wet clutch.

[sign216]

RRider,

You're talking about clutch cable adjustment, or about the clutch plates themselves?

I'll assume it's the cable adjustment.  Some manuals recommend only 1mm of lever free play.  Be careful, and too much is better than too little.  Too much play can make the clutch drag and gear change notchy.  Some people set the clutch with too little play, because it makes the gear change easier.  Do not set the clutch play too tight as a “fix” for this.  Especially since the small block 1st gear can be picky, requiring one to press on the gear lever while the clutch is let out, to make sure it engages. 

Too little play can lead to clutch wear and slip.  It makes the throwout bearing spin all the time, wearing the pushrod and bearing, and the clutch may slip, letting it heat up and wear.   


Joe

[pyoungbl]

The V7 dry clutch is more like an automobile clutch than what you find in the typical Japanese bike.  My experience with multiple Guzzi models has been that the clutches are about as dependable and require about as much care as my car/truck.  Of course a random machine can come off the assembly line and end up with problems.  That is not common with the V7 but I'm sure you can find someone who has had a clutch problem. 

Being cable operated you really don't have many places to make an adjustment.  At the lever, make sure you have left a bit of slack in the initial take-up so the clutch is not engaged when you take your hand off the lever.  There is an adjustment down at the bell housing.  I cannot remember messing with that adjustment.

Smarter folks will offer a more technical discussion. 

Peter Y.

[Roebling3]

2017, V7 III Racer w/ABS.

I was hugely annoyed by a very spongy front brake, from new. Near crashing once when the lever pulled to the grip and the rear brake was hardly better I took it to the dealer. He went through 2 computer controlled flush/fill cycles b4 satisfaction.
I'm still not thrilled, but learned 'They're all like that', after pedaling around a new Anniversario and a Special. I had tried bleeding the brakes 3X. 2X with the lever bound to the grip over night. Which would give good braking for ~30 miles.

I've had 4 bikes w/ ABS. The earliest in '93. None of them were as sloppy? as this one. I cannot feel the ABS cycling in a planned panic stop, front or rear. Or don't they do that any longer. Is it telling me I'm way too old to ride quickly? R3~

[Roebling3]

V7 III as above. Sorry for the misstep.

The clutch play on my bike was virtually imperceptible. To bar the possibility of a dragging clutch I tried to adjust it. I could not get proper slack and thought the cable had stretched. I tried allowing more lead on the cable by loosening the near zero adjustment on the back of the gear box. It turned out the cable, as installed is short for the job. Plus it's threaded badly under the fuel tank forcing its way betwixt wire harness and frame elements. The consequence is too much induced drag and a hard pull caused by excess friction betwixt cable and housing. My son found slightly better routing resulting in better feel and pull.

After more than 60 years of riding, maybe 20+ mc's (one w/ hydraulics), I have never broken a cable. I'll replace the cable one day soon w/one an inch or 2 longer.  R3~

[usedtobefast]

To the OP ... on a V7 iii ... maybe adjust the clutch cable around the first service (~900 miles) ... then maybe once more before 5000 miles.  In other words, no big deal.

As some have pointed out, you can make it too tight (and cause some issues) ... and you can ignore it and let it get to lose (and cause some issues).

And if you are making an adjustment, turn the bars full right, full left, and notice the free play as it may vary (like full left might be a bit tighter than straight or full right).

[usedtobefast]

2017, V7 III Racer w/ABS.

I was hugely annoyed by a very spongy front brake, from new. Near crashing once when the lever pulled to the grip and the rear brake was hardly better I took it to the dealer. He went through 2 computer controlled flush/fill cycles b4 satisfaction.
I'm still not thrilled, but learned 'They're all like that', after pedaling around a new Anniversario and a Special. I had tried bleeding the brakes 3X. 2X with the lever bound to the grip over night. Which would give good braking for ~30 miles.

I've had 4 bikes w/ ABS. The earliest in '93. None of them were as sloppy? as this one. I cannot feel the ABS cycling in a planned panic stop, front or rear. Or don't they do that any longer. Is it telling me I'm way too old to ride quickly? R3~

I've only ridden 2 v7 iii bikes, and both had decent front brakes.  Not dual disc Brembo monobloc awesome front brakes, but decent lever feel, not spongy.  Maybe your dealer is not so sure what they are doing?? 

As for ABS, I haven't noticed it activating on the front (and have not purposely tested it) ... it has activated in the rear, was kind of an odd feeling, like some pedal pulsing, but I was quickly past the gravel that caused that and braking was normal again. 

Does the service manual cover the bleeding procedure??

[Kev m]

To the OP ... on a V7 iii ... maybe adjust the clutch cable around the first service (~900 miles) ... then maybe once more before 5000 miles.  In other words, no big deal.

As some have pointed out, you can make it too tight (and cause some issues) ... and you can ignore it and let it get to lose (and cause some issues).

And if you are making an adjustment, turn the bars full right, full left, and notice the free play as it may vary (like full left might be a bit tighter than straight or full right).

This sounds right, well at least on my earlier Mk I model.

[egschade]

2017, V7 III Racer w/ABS.
 I cannot feel the ABS cycling in a planned panic stop, front or rear. Or don't they do that any longer. Is it telling me I'm way too old to ride quickly? R3~

On my V7 III Stone I can feel the brakes 'release' when the ABS kicks in but there's no noticeable cycling or pumping as with earlier systems I've had on bikes. Feels like a click in the foot or hand lever. I wouldn't say my brakes are mushy but they're not as rock solid as the Griso with dual fronts and stainless lines.

[JACoH]

I have lubed my V7 III Special's clutch cable and adjusted free play at the lever to 2mm. It hasn't varied in 7800 miles, and works fine.

[RRider]

Thanks all....I can also see that a guy like me, coming from Japanese bikes makes easily mistakes here: in my current bike the recommended free play at the lever is 10-15mm.

[pyoungbl]

RRider, take a look at the V7 III parts list as shown by AF1 Racing  http://www.af1racing.com/store/Scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=3049&description=V7+Special+III+OEM+Parts+Catalog  and you will see that the V7 has a single clutch plate, not the stack of plates you find in your Japanese bike (most of them).  That might explain why your free play is 10-15mm while the V7 is only 2mm...fewer plates to get apart.

Peter Y.

[TimmyTheHog]

RRider,

Same as you, I came off a Honda Shadow Cruiser which has a shit lot more slack required than my V7 as well, and same as you, I was concerned over it for sometimes until I just learn to ride with it after I set it to 2mm or so.

I used to check my slack like EVERY ride...but honestly I think I truly required to adjust maybe 3 times of what I can remember.

First when I got the bike and learning its friction zone
2nd when I was doing my 1st service @ 600 miles
Third time was @ 6100 miles before she went to sleep for the year, even tho it was like ~1/8 turn at most to bring it back to 2mm instead of maybe 2.5mm???

I could probably have left it alone...but I am anal :P

anyway, tune it up, get it within spec but not too tight, and get riding 

To the OP ... on a V7 iii ... maybe adjust the clutch cable around the first service (~900 miles) ... then maybe once more before 5000 miles.  In other words, no big deal.

As some have pointed out, you can make it too tight (and cause some issues) ... and you can ignore it and let it get to lose (and cause some issues).

And if you are making an adjustment, turn the bars full right, full left, and notice the free play as it may vary (like full left might be a bit tighter than straight or full right).

ya my full left is always tighter compare to full right...changed by maybe 0.5~ish mm?...when turn handle bar straight, it will have about another 0.5mm more than my full right...

So I set my based on the full LEFT @ 2mm lol...

so far seems to be working :P

[Socalrob]

2017, V7 III Racer w/ABS.

I was hugely annoyed by a very spongy front brake, from new. Near crashing once when the lever pulled to the grip and the rear brake was hardly better I took it to the dealer. He went through 2 computer controlled flush/fill cycles b4 satisfaction.
I'm still not thrilled, but learned 'They're all like that', after pedaling around a new Anniversario and a Special. I had tried bleeding the brakes 3X. 2X with the lever bound to the grip over night. Which would give good braking for ~30 miles.

I've had 4 bikes w/ ABS. The earliest in '93. None of them were as sloppy? as this one. I cannot feel the ABS cycling in a planned panic stop, front or rear. Or don't they do that any longer. Is it telling me I'm way too old to ride quickly? R3~

The ABS brakes on my V7iii have bedded in nicely.  When I first got the bike I was hot to do a brake upgrade via Todd at GuzziTech, and still may, but lately I have been finding the brakes at minimum ok and maybe actually good.  I do practice panick stops and can trigger the ABS cycling on both front and rear at speed (60-80mph).

I would say the brakes fall between those on my KTM690, which is just acceptable, and those on my BMW1200GSA, which are very good.  I test rode a new BMW RT the other day and the brakes were extremely good, producing a good howl before the ABS kicked in.

Not sure what could be wrong with your bike.  Perhaps the ABS module is not functioning correct, or perhaps you do need to really hammer harder on the brakes.  It should not be that hard to feel the either the ABS cycling on the rear only or to lock the rear wheel if the ABS is not working.  Locking the rear is pretty safe if you know what to do.