how did this accident happen?

[Lumpy Idle]

this youtube viddy showed up on my screen and i watched it. go to 1:20 to see it just before the crash. i don't understand what happened to the first rider that made him ride off the road. he wasn't going all that fast and he just seemed to lose the road. any insights on this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2Z6w_rBsf0

[fotoguzzi]

 lead bike looks like a Scurra or V11 Sport.. maybe he felt there was no more lean left and stood it up to brake? but looks to me like he could have easily made the curve with a little more courage.

[Lannis]

Everyone will have a different view.

Mine is:

1) As the narrator says, he didn't know the guy in front, and was no longer riding "his own ride"; he was riding to keep up with the front guy.

2) The front guy was riding way too fast for his ability, and low-sided on the left-hand turn; whether his bike scraped hardware and lifted the back, or whether he panicked and jerked off the throttle or hit the brake, I don't know.

3) The camera guy was riding far too fast for his own ability to stop.   The front guy crashed, and the guy in back was too close, too fast, and couldn't stop.

Just going too fast to keep control of their bikes, that's all ... This is a perfect example of why I discount "fast street riding" as a measure of riding ability or bike performance.   You're not showing "how fast you can ride"; you're showing how willing you are to crash if something on the road isn't ideal.   The track, now, that's a different story ....

Lannis

[oldbike54]

 The lead bike got too wide in the corner , panicked , and appeared to stand the bike up instead of trusting in the laws of physics . He may have ran into some detritus on the road , hard to tell . But yeah , maybe riding faster than he was comfortable .The crasher may have also target fixated on the Armco barrier . The camera guy could possibly have avoided crashing by going to his left instead of simply cranking up his brakes , but all in all it could have been worse . At least the camera guy possessed the "cool" to give a warning to the following riders .

 Dusty

[yogidozer]

set up. they just wanted to be a youtube sensation. 

[Lannis]

set up. they just wanted to be a youtube sensation. 

Sliding into a guardrail at speed may mean that you don't get to see your own video go viral ... so I still think the testosterone/speed/skill cocktail probably meets the Occam's Razor test  ... 

[yogidozer]

Sliding into a guardrail at speed may mean that you don't get to see your own video go viral ... so I still think the testosterone/speed/skill cocktail probably meets the Occam's Razor test  ... 

so, you're saying it was an accident? 

[Toecutter]

Pure speculation obviously... but what I see is the front rider scraped hard stuff, and shit himself. There's that tell tale deep lean, followed by a super quick "oh shit" standup. Add in a little "that guardrail looks awfully close" target fixation and that's all she wrote.

Notice he heads *directly* for the only yellow sign on the side of the road. I'm guessing that's all he was seeing for that last couple seconds.

[Lannis]

so, you're saying it was an accident? 

Actually, no, I don't use that word any more in regards to road crashes (unless I forget).   

Almost nothing bad that happens on the road is an "accident", except in the sense that after it happens, we wish it hadn't happened.   A tree falling on your car while you're stopped at a light, or an eagle flying into your driver window at 65 MPH might qualify, but all the rest (running off the road, hitting a car from behind, sliding on ice or water, etc) are due to going too fast, not knowing how to control your vehicle, driving impaired, or someone not paying attention to what they're doing.

In this case, it was three people riding too fast for their sight line and riding abilities.

I thought you were joking when you suggested that it might have been staged.   Don't think you'll get many votes for that ... !

Lannis

[John A]

looks like he got spooked, his head looks like he was looking down. his unsecured backpack flopping around was a contributing factor

[Kiwi_Roy]

I was surprised when he wiped out, looked like he was an experienced rider but he wasn't the first to crash just there, hopefully not too badly hurt. I'll bet he's on VII Lemans.

[Socalrob]

Great how the second rider (filmer) says "I'm not mad", like any other person was responsible for his crash other than himself for tailgating.  The front rider should be pissed off at the extra damage to his bike.

[Ncdan]

Too hot and n the curve for his ridding ability.

[Wayne Orwig]

Who starts a curve on the inside like that?

[Tusayan]

lead bike looks like a Scura or V11 Sport.. maybe he felt there was no more lean left and stood it up to brake? but looks to me like he could have easily made the curve with a little more courage.

What happened is that the lead rider dragged the V11 Sport side stand slightly, you can see the sparks, it bobbled slightly and instead of retaking control he gave up, straightened up and rode off the side of the road.  His lack of skill is what caused the accident, compounded by the second guy following too closely.  One of the following riders was then unable to brake and steer smoothly enough to remain upright even when there was no chance he was going to hit anything using smooth normal braking and staying on the road.  A sport touring street pace bobble leading to a substantial three bike accident, all caused by lack of experience, lack of skill, and probably being too excited. 

I've watched accidents like these for 35 years. I remember so distinctly following a guy, I forget his name, doing the same thing on a 900 Ninja circa 1986 and wondering why the heck he did that.  The first of many.   Similar accidents don't occur nearly as much to the new rider who spends a year or so following somebody around who knows what they're doing, and after being on the receiving end many years ago, I've been on the giving end quite a bit.  The issue with these kids is that they probably don't know what they don't know.  You can sometimes get their attention prior to an accident by showing them how its done on the road - in my case circa 1984 an 'old guy' passed me like I was standing still and I followed him and his bunch for the next 10+ years before I was in their position.  At (now) age 85 or so, he still kids me about saying "you go pretty fast for a bunch of old guys" after that first ride 

What you do in this particular circumstance is first take a better line and if you do drag, roll off about half way, keep counter steering because the bike will want to stand up when you gently roll off, and then once the road speed has decreased slightly and the stand is no longer dragging, you carry on.  If you're on a slight uphill grade as these guys appeared to be, the bike will slow markedly quicker than on a flat road.

The rubber side stand pad on a V11 Sport can be shortened from about 3/8 inch to 1/8 inch.  You can also reshape the foot of the stand so that it is narrower and less triangular in shape.  It drags quite easily in stock form and although the lead rider was unskilled in handling the resulting minor bobble, its always better to have the additional clearance if you can arrange it.

Its not a particularly good idea to wear a back pack when sport riding.

[Huzo]

Too hot and n the curve for his ridding ability.

His ridding ability seemed pretty smooth up to the crash.
He entered the corner too narrow requiring a tighter radius turn for the speed he was carrying.
His knee was pretty close to the ground on the earlier corners, actually reckon he's no slouch.

[yogidozer]

Actually, no, I don't use that word any more in regards to road crashes (unless I forget).   

Almost nothing bad that happens on the road is an "accident", except in the sense that after it happens, we wish it hadn't happened.   A tree falling on your car while you're stopped at a light, or an eagle flying into your driver window at 65 MPH might qualify, but all the rest (running off the road, hitting a car from behind, sliding on ice or water, etc) are due to going too fast, not knowing how to control your vehicle, driving impaired, or someone not paying attention to what they're doing.

In this case, it was three people riding too fast for their sight line and riding abilities.

I thought you were joking when you suggested that it might have been staged.   Don't think you'll get many votes for that ... !

Lannis

don't take these posts personally, BTW I not running for office, so vote for someone else

[Lannis]

don't take these posts personally, BTW I not running for office, so vote for someone else

I don't think you're in my district anyhow .... 

[yogidozer]

I don't think you're in my district anyhow .... 

Thank you Lord!

[Lannis]

Thank you Lord!

Hey, don't take it personally ... 

[pressureangle]

Everyone pretty much called it. The lead guy knew he was being filmed, the camera guy was well below ability but following too closely and got caught off guard.

Notice the geography, though. A pretty steep downhill, which acts like a decreasing radius and reduces traction on the front wheel. The two riders screwing the pooch behind them show just how easy it is to get in too deep in that particular corner.

None of them had to crash, it appeared to me that anyone comfortable in the performance envelope of those machines could have kept #1 on the road, missed #1 with #2, and missed/stopped without skidding and tipping over #3 & 4.

[lucian]

 Intellect meets Physics . 

[jetmechmarty]

Darn!  Nothing like that ever happened to me!   

[Tom]

lead bike looks like a Scurra or V11 Sport.. maybe he felt there was no more lean left and stood it up to brake? but looks to me like he could have easily made the curve with a little more courage.

Looks like an Ohlin front end.  Parts for sale???  The camera dude never practice a full lock up on the brakes.  The rider looks like he's over doing the body-english.  The camera dude after the accident is standing down stream of the accident and using some dubious hand signals.  Not a good idea with other bikes headed towards him. 

[Sasquatch Jim]

 Or he could have simply ridden a little slower.

[Ncdan]

His ridding ability seemed pretty smooth up to the crash.
He entered the corner too narrow requiring a tighter radius turn for the speed he was carrying.
His knee was pretty close to the ground on the earlier corners, actually reckon he's no slouch.

Lol, like I said, he hit the curve to hot for his ridding abilities.

[nbags]

look at 1.26 there is a dark mark on the road looks like rear tire was right on it rear tire broke loose got off throtle try to chase it up ran out of real estate

[Turin]

That's why I ride alone.

[Tusayan]

Darn!  Nothing like that ever happened to me! 

I wish I could say the same but Ive ridden over the top of a bike I was moments before following.  In this case it wasnt because I was following particularly close, it was because the leading bike was hit head on by another motorcycle coming the other way, out of control and crossing the double yellow line.  The whole mess stopped instantly in front of me, some of it came back to meet me, and right over the top I went like some kind of stunt rider.  Oddly and luckily enough l didnt even come off the bike, a very directionally stable Le Mans.

Agreed that the lead rider in this incident was over doing the alligator wrestling body English. If he had used the energy involved with jumping all over the bike to simply position the bike on a better line, he would have been better off. As with most things, its not making a big effort that gets the job done, its doing the right thing at the right time.

[JJ]

Too hot and n the curve for his ridding ability.

Watched the video twice...and that's my thoughts exactly!