Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: janguzzi on November 07, 2023, 01:09:45 PM
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A LOT of updates:
https://www.motoguzzi.com/en_EN/moto-guzzi-world/news-moto-guzzi/new-v85/
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For those that wanted cast wheels, no more excuses!
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I just got back from throwing rocks at my 2022 after reading this. :grin:
Some very nice updates!! MG has been busy, and here I was thinking the V85TT was on their back burner-wrong.
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Here's a write up from Motorcycle.com https://www.motorcycle.com/bikes/new-model-preview/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-range-first-look-44596351 (https://www.motorcycle.com/bikes/new-model-preview/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-range-first-look-44596351)
From the article: "Moto Guzzi has updated its V85 adventure range, adopting variable valve timing, a six-axis IMU, and adding a new road-oriented V85 Strada variant joining the V85 TT and the luggage-equipped V85 TT Travel."
There are some pretty bold claims on torque and HP improvements "Moto Guzzi claims the engine provides a peak output of 61.2 lb-ft. at 5,100 rpm, with 90% of that peak available at 3,500 rpm. Peak power output also sees a boost, with Moto Guzzi claiming an increase to 80 hp at 7,750 rpm from the previous 76 hp at 7,500 rpm. "
(https://i.ibb.co/tb6Sq8d/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-range-first-look.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tb6Sq8d)
(https://i.ibb.co/DCxLN2M/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-range-first-look.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DCxLN2M)
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I’m throwing the penalty flag! :violent1:
I definitely wanted cast wheels.
What’s the scoop on variable timing and does that change valve check adjustment intervals and/or the screw and lock type adjusters?
inditx
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Variable timing has been a thing on cars (I believe) for quite a while.
I suspect they are talking about ignition timing, not valve-train timing.
Although...even my tacoma has variable valve timing. I do not know the advantages/tradeoffs of variable valve timing. I do have a BMW R1250RS with a shift cam, but that is a bit different. The bimmer goes like stink, I can say that.
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Variable valve timing allows and engine to have great torque at lower and mid RPMs and great horsepower at the top end. So they made the engine both cleaner AND more powerful, which is very awesome. Very nice to see them continuing to upgrade the V85 platform. I wonder if they will give the same variable valve timing to the V7? It is basically the same engine and though I think the V7 is plenty powerful already, more power is certainly OK as well.
Scott
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I gotta say im a little scared about the roll out of variable valve timing. Yes it has been around for decades on other engines, but see how they did hydraulic lifters... Also Im kinda wondering why the Strada doesn't have a lower front fender? You would think a road going focused V85 would at least have a lower under fender.
Other then that I like the changes, and it nice to see that they are still investing in the old air cooled platform.
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https://www.rideapart.com/news/694988/2024-moto-guzzi-v85tt-range/
Steven Rossi
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I think the bigger TFT screen and normal switches are a big plus. It's nice they are evolving the TT not just adding bold new colors.
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It looks like there are some nice improvements this time, and I'd be curious to ride one to compare it to my 2020 MY V85. I might have to get a set of the cast wheels for mine eventually, once they are easy to find.
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Also Im kinda wondering why the Strada doesn't have a lower front fender? You would think a road going focused V85 would at least have a lower under fender.
It looks like it does . . . ok, it’s only a half fender but it’s there ==>
And I think those wheels look great!
(https://kickstart.bikeexif.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-strada-1.jpg)
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It looks like it does . . . ok, it’s only a half fender but it’s there ==>
And I think those wheels look great!
(https://kickstart.bikeexif.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-strada-1.jpg)
Ahhh OK, these old eyes missed that. I also think the wheels are pretty cool.
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IMU? Had to look it up after reading an ADV piece on the '24 V85. I don't yet own a bike with ABS, doubtful I'll ever graduate beyond a bike with EFI. LOL
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It is basically the same engine and though I think the V7 is plenty powerful already, more power is certainly OK as well.
Scott
Ehhhhhhhhh, but is it really?
I know it's popular to say that but they are as different as "the same engine" can be.
Different valve trains, different lubrication system, different EFI system.
Looking at EFI alone they are very different in terms of ECU and throttle body. And besides size and serviceability what's the biggest difference in those parts?!? COST.
So I'm just gonna go ahead and predict NO.
They are not going to add VVT to the V7 series (unless emissions forces them to, and I bet even that is unlikely).
Though I'll continue to shout to the stars how wonderful it would be for an actual Racer or Lemans model V7 made with the engine, USD forks, and triple discs brakes of a V85. At least then hopefully I could change it to a more standard riding position version and have both the performance and aesthetics. But I'm not holding my breath for that either.
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Hi folks, a friend forwarded this short article on ADV rider, telling me that Moto guzzi is finally coming out of the "stone age" .....Im not sure if the meant the "California Stone" or something else!
:laugh:
I must admitt, I miss the rear trellis frame on the older model. I think that made the bike look cool, and seems useful.
anyway, here is the article. enjoy.
https://www.advrider.com/moto-guzzi-v85-range-gets-variable-valve-timing-advanced-electronics/.
Rick.
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I’m curious as well about the VVT. Harley included VVT on their CVO motor, but that’s liquid-cooled. Is this V85 setup oil pressure-actuated? And does it still allow for easy clearance adjustments? My ignorant pea brain assumes so, as the cam should be in its proper place at stop, and you can’t really adjust valve clearance for the higher setting if it ain’t moving. But, now you also have more sliding parts. Again, pretty ignorant…but curious to learn more.
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I've merged three threads, so far, on the new for 2024 V85.
Please use this thread for news and info on the updated/upgraded V85 line, 2024-up.
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I was thinking the V85TT was on their back burner-wrong.
Me, too. Not sure there is much functional difference in a V85TT and a V100 Stelvio, but I guess Guzzi believes there is room for both. Sort of like all the sizes of CUV/SUV autos out there in the world, these days.
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The spoke wheel models appear to have the spokes attach to outside of the rim. I don’t see any mention of them being tubeless though. The Stelvio impresses with 115 HP but weight would rule that one out for me. V85 is looking better and better.
Pete
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I do not know the advantages/tradeoffs of variable valve timing.
Engines have different needs throughout the rev range. VVT allows the engine to adjust to those varying needs.
The tradeoff is more stuff to break or wear out.
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The spoke wheel models appear to have the spokes attach to outside of the rim. I don’t see any mention of them being tubeless though. The Stelvio impresses with 115 HP but weight would rule that one out for me. V85 is looking better and better.
Pete
Wheels are Tubeless.
V85 has a larger fuel tank, which matters for those who ride in The West.
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Engines have different needs throughout the rev range. VVT allows the engine to adjust to those varying needs.
The tradeoff is more stuff to break or wear out.
Hondas and Toyotas among others have been using VVT for years. My 2003 Camry has 207,000 miles with zero issues.
Pete
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Hondas and Toyotas among others have been using VVT for years. My 2003 Camry has 207,000 miles with zero issues.
Pete
Cars have also had hydraulic lifters since 1955. We saw the unfortunate issues at Aprilia/Guzzi 20-years ago with the PI Californias. Luckily, Piaggio is in command and I have more confidence they'll get it right. Still, it's more moving parts, so more chance of something coming up.
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(https://i.ibb.co/hMy5zx9/IMG-3215.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hMy5zx9)
Love the updates to this 85!! This is on my list of 5 bikes for next year!
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I’m throwing the penalty flag! :violent1:
I definitely wanted cast wheels.
What’s the scoop on variable timing and does that change valve check adjustment intervals and/or the screw and lock type adjusters?
inditx
VVT generally changes the timing of the Camshaft, just guessing, but I would be looking there and surprised if this effected the top end of the motor (meaning rockers and adjusters) but who knows these days.
VERY glad to hear they are keeping this platform going, now let's see a non ADV approach! Dump the Dual Headlights and front/rear Trellis frame components, streamline the body work, This should be the basis for the Racer or Corsa, let the V7 keep the vintage cruiser.
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VERY glad to hear they are keeping this platform going, now let's see a non ADV approach! Dump the Dual Headlights and front/rear Trellis frame components, streamline the body work, This should be the basis for the Racer or Corsa, let the V7 keep the vintage cruiser.
Well well well…..
When I suggested this EXACT thing back when the small V7, V9 hit the streets, I proposed an 850 street based variant using that engine, with the same design brief of the 80’s Le Mans’.
My suggestion was that it could sit between the V7 and the V9 and as a tip of the hat to yesteryear, be dubbed the V8.
I was and possibly still will be roundly criticised, which I dine out on hungrily, but I’d be keen to see if your proposal gets up.
Maybe it will.
Back then most of the luminaries were scared of Pete Roper and Beetle… :wink:
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So here it is February, has anyone seen a 2024 V85TT yet? Or have an ETA?
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I waited until tubeless spoke wheels were standard. The improvements are nice but my 03 is fine as is.
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I waited until tubeless spoke wheels were standard. The improvements are nice but my 03 is fine as is.
’23…?
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Yikes. Yes, 23. :violent1:
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So here it is February, has anyone seen a 2024 V85TT yet? Or have an ETA?
Cadre told me it would likely be June.
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If it's that long there probably won't even be 2024's then.
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officially they are calling this E5+ version. Still looking like a summer sometime delivery.
The EU-market parts fiche got posted to dealers today. We'll upload one, once the NAFTA-market fiche goes live.
I really wanted to see the VVT setup.
Looks to just be a cam phaser on the end of the cam. A pretty common and simple way of doing it. Pic of it
(https://i.ibb.co/zNNmvgm/v85e5.jpg) (https://ibb.co/zNNmvgm)
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uses three Lambda sensors, one post-cat to monitor cat efficiency
#6 x 2, and #7
(https://i.ibb.co/7gXbW5T/v85lamb.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7gXbW5T)
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one knock sensor per cylinder, #14 sounds cooler in Italian Sensore di detonazione
(https://i.ibb.co/mG3j72L/v85knock.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mG3j72L)
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Thanks for providing these updates. Looking forward to seeing them in person!
one knock sensor per cylinder, #14 sounds cooler in Italian Sensore di detonazione
(https://i.ibb.co/mG3j72L/v85knock.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mG3j72L)
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Some early ride reports starting to emerge, all generally positive in terms of
of modest but noticeable engine improvements .
Most are stating April availability , but presumably that is Euro markets.
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The VVT system is shown here:
https://www.motorradonline.de/enduro/moto-guzzi-v85-tt-travel-strada-neu-2024-fahrtest/
(picture 12-14)
https://img1.motorradonline.de/Moto-Guzzi-V85-2024-Fahrbericht-169Gallery-6fe21d62-2087837.jpg (https://img1.motorradonline.de/Moto-Guzzi-V85-2024-Fahrbericht-169Gallery-6fe21d62-2087837.jpg)
https://img1.motorradonline.de/Moto-Guzzi-V85-2024-Fahrbericht-169Gallery-b27d9f52-2087838.jpg (https://img1.motorradonline.de/Moto-Guzzi-V85-2024-Fahrbericht-169Gallery-b27d9f52-2087838.jpg)
https://img1.motorradonline.de/Moto-Guzzi-V85-2024-Fahrbericht-169Gallery-cf9921c5-2087839.jpg (https://img1.motorradonline.de/Moto-Guzzi-V85-2024-Fahrbericht-169Gallery-cf9921c5-2087839.jpg)
@ Ed: Could you show an image of the airbox? Did they change/improve the design?
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There are other subtle changes too. A few reviews mention that the revised cylinder head / rocker cover / tank design, and a reshaped seat means they no longer hit a knee on the left cylinder. There's a little more leg room. Instrumentation location is also reportedly slightly closer to the rider, perhaps to compensate for the seat moving you slightly further back.
I've only seen one report so far that tries to quantify the torque improvements , which suggested 5-10 percent higher torque across the rev range. But they all seem to think that the engine definitely feels improved.
My personal view is that it's a shame they dropped the trellis frames for billeted aluminium , I prefer the previous look. But the revised bike looks like a decent, incremental upgrade. I do wonder if the third lambda sensor makes it even more difficult to customize the exhaust though.
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airbox pic, just the #12 changed part #s, the TB side of airbox #4 is the same as all other v85. Same filter, same velocity stack
(https://i.ibb.co/x84rzKP/v85air.jpg) (https://ibb.co/x84rzKP)
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Thanks for posting these updates! Looking forward to seeing the new V85 fleet in person…
airbox pic, just the #12 changed part #s, the TB side of airbox #4 is the same as all other v85. Same filter, same velocity stack
(https://i.ibb.co/x84rzKP/v85air.jpg) (https://ibb.co/x84rzKP)
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uses three Lambda sensors, one post-cat to monitor cat efficiency
Which is more car emissions technology, meaning that if the catalyst is removed or degrades over time, the check engine light will come on and stay on. I just paid $2K to have that problem resolved on a late model car after 30 miles of unavoidable driving with an EFI problem.
The variable cam timing hardware is none-the-less interesting to me, particularly if it could be installed on a 2020 bike on which you can remove the catalyst and evaporative emissions control canister without inducing a check engine light problem. 5-10% extra torque although not as much as had been reported might be worth having, in addition to that you can get with a revised fuel map, plus air box and exhaust changes.
The tubular weldments on the 2020 V85TT were a great part of the original bike, and I’d prefer to have them. The replacements aren’t billet aluminum, they are cheap to produce die castings that detract from the original concept. The advantages of the later models to me are tubeless wheels (I’ve got them on my 2020), more ability to tune out the glitchy ‘Road’ mode throttle response with an owner selected ride mode, and the gear selection indicator working at all times, even when the bike is stopped… if that matters to you.
What would really be great is if the dealer-only service light reset was corrected. I wouldn’t bet on that one happening.
OTOH, somebody else might say to buy one now before dealers in your area can pay Piaggio to send you texts telling you to take your bike to their dealer for an oil change, based on mileage data uploaded to Piaggio in Italy by the bike without your knowledge. More depressing technology which I’d guess is likely on its way for European motorcycles, as it already is with cars.
I’m basically out of the new bike market because they’re mostly loaded to the gills with anti-owner nonsense, right at the time in life when I could buy whatever I’d like to buy with spare cash.
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airbox pic, just the #12 changed part #s, the TB side of airbox #4 is the same as all other v85. Same filter, same velocity stack
(https://i.ibb.co/x84rzKP/v85air.jpg) (https://ibb.co/x84rzKP)
Thanks a LOT Ed, so with a little bit of luck the problem I have described here was eliminated!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyde53V2YBw
:thumb:
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I dunno, for me it’s not worth the extra $ to go with the ’24 when I’ve just completed accessorizing my ’23.
I would still test ride one though and a new Stelvio. :thumb:
inditx
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It’s a bit strange but although I guess the later ones are better, I just don’t seem to want one.
If I destroyed either bike I own, I’d go for a red Stelvio.
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I dunno, for me it’s not worth the extra $ to go with the ’24 when I’ve just completed accessorizing my ’23.
I would still test ride one though and a new Stelvio. :thumb:
inditx
My '21 is accessorized AND paid for. I think I'll just admire the '24 V85, V100, and Stelvio on the shop floor...
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I’m with you.
inditx
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I know what I’d say the first time I got coolant in the oil.
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Love the look of the 24 TT
It will be either a V100 Aviazone or the S model or a 24 85tt for me around June time. Can't wait
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I’m with you.
inditx
Who ?
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Who ?
Hah sorry, BrotherDave and you of course Huzo :thumb:
inditx
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It looks like it does . . . ok, it’s only a half fender but it’s there ==>
And I think those wheels look great!
(https://kickstart.bikeexif.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/2024-moto-guzzi-v85-strada-1.jpg)
I wish they had also lost the high front fender dual headlight and windshield mount, and fit a full standard front fender, classic single headlight and low dual exhaust............ .
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I don't. I like the dual headlights , I think it's a key part of the styling of the bike. But we're all very individual.
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I wish they had also lost the high front fender dual headlight and windshield mount, and fit a full standard front fender, sassic single headlight and low dual exhaust............ .
Love the wheels. I too think that they should offer a low front fender and low exhaust as well, at least as options.
inditx
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Love the wheels. I too think that they should offer a low front fender and low exhaust as well, at least as options.
inditx
Not everyone agrees, but I like the low fender look a bit more.
(https://i.ibb.co/jhjzVn0/IMG-4665.png) (https://ibb.co/jhjzVn0)
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My 2022? I like it, I ride it.
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Not everyone agrees, but I like the low fender look a bit more.
(https://i.ibb.co/jhjzVn0/IMG-4665.png) (https://ibb.co/jhjzVn0)
I like the low fender look myself. I'm working on that and removing the "high" fender. Plus lowering and leveling the exhaust below the bottom of the saddle box. Those utilitarian, function over form, uglier than a mud fence aluminum boxes still haven't started growing on me yet. I thought maybe they would grow to be so ugly they're cute, but not yet. But it's only been 9 months. :grin: I haven't loaded them up yet but they look huge! Like they'll hold everything and the kitchen sink. The only dirt my bike will ever see is a dirt parking lot or maybe a well maintained dirt road.
I'd love to put some Givi luggage on top and sides. They're even Italian!
Might even swap out the horn for one that'll be able to warn someone.
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Like this?
(https://i.ibb.co/7twk21Q/horn.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7twk21Q)
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Those utilitarian, function over form, uglier than a mud fence aluminum boxes still haven't started growing on me yet. I thought maybe they would grow to be so ugly they're cute, but not yet. But it's only been 9 months. :grin: I haven't loaded them up yet but they look huge! Like they'll hold everything and the kitchen sink. The only dirt my bike will ever see is a dirt parking lot or maybe a well maintained dirt road.
I'd love to put some Givi luggage on top and sides.
(https://i.ibb.co/rvtsDx8/IMG-2912.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rvtsDx8)
(https://i.ibb.co/30w7pfL/IMG-1519.jpg) (https://ibb.co/30w7pfL)
upload photo (https://imgbb.com/)
They kind of grow on you a bit…
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The new airbox cover has indeed been improved, but unfortunately it does not fit into the previous E4 and E5 models.
The shape of the back is more protruding - the bevel is not there.
(https://i.postimg.cc/jD1Gqxsn/20240321-174823-resized.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/jD1Gqxsn)
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The new airbox cover has indeed been improved, but unfortunately it does not fit into the previous E4 and E5 models.
The shape of the back is more protruding - the bevel is not there.
Thanks Jan!
Good info :thumb:
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The new airbox cover has indeed been improved, but unfortunately it does not fit into the previous E4 and E5 models.
The shape of the back is more protruding - the bevel is not there.
(https://i.postimg.cc/jD1Gqxsn/20240321-174823-resized.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/jD1Gqxsn)
Darn I was hoping it would.
Thanks just the same.
inditx
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the EU Strada version catalog posted, so we got to see the cast wheel part #s.
should be a direct swap, after checking one thing. The front axle changed part #s from previous V85, all E5+ ones (cast and spoked) take this new part #. New part # is same as V100, and new Stelvio. Supplier change? spec change?
Forks also changed part #s from previous V85. Spec change on the E5+? Be very shocked if the cast wheels cannot change over to other V85 and you just keep using your current axle. I bet its more of fork to axle change they did on the E5+.
didnt see any part # changes in the rear, wheel plus wheel cover/3 screws should be it
2B009303 Front wheel spindle
MOTO GUZZI - STELVIO
Stelvio E5+ ABS 2024 (EMEA)
Stelvio E5+ ARAS 2024 (EMEA)
Stelvio E5 ABS 2024 (NAFTA)
Stelvio E5 ARAS 2024 (NAFTA)
MOTO GUZZI - V 100
V100 Mandello Aviazione Navale E5 ABS 2023 (APAC)
V100 Mandello Aviazione Navale E5 ABS 2023 (EMEA)
V100 Mandello Aviazione Navale E5 ABS 2023-2024 (NAFTA)
V100 Mandello E5 ABS 2022-2023 (APAC)
V100 Mandello E5 ABS 2022-2024 (EMEA)
V100 Mandello E5 ABS 2023 (NAFTA)
V100 Mandello S E5 ABS 2022-2023 (APAC)
V100 Mandello S E5 ABS 2022-2023 (EMEA)
V100 Mandello S E5 ABS 2023 (NAFTA)
MOTO GUZZI - V 85 E5+
V85 TT E5+ 2024 (EMEA)
V85 TT Strada E5+ 2024 (EMEA)
V85 TT Travel E5+ 2024 (EMEA)
(https://i.ibb.co/6BGW0mS/strada.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6BGW0mS)
(https://i.ibb.co/2FrrZZt/strada2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2FrrZZt)
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the EU Strada version catalog posted, so we got to see the cast wheel part #s.
should be a direct swap, after checking one thing. The front axle changed part #s from previous V85, all E5+ ones (cast and spoked) take this new part #. New part # is same as V100, and new Stelvio. Supplier change? spec change?
Forks also changed part #s from previous V85. Spec change on the E5+? Be very shocked if the cast wheels cannot change over to other V85 and you just keep using your current axle. I bet its more of fork to axle change they did on the E5+.
didnt see any part # changes in the rear, wheel plus wheel cover/3 screws should be it
2B009303 Front wheel spindle
MOTO GUZZI - STELVIO
Stelvio E5+ ABS 2024 (EMEA)
Stelvio E5+ ARAS 2024 (EMEA)
Stelvio E5 ABS 2024 (NAFTA)
Stelvio E5 ARAS 2024 (NAFTA)
MOTO GUZZI - V 100
V100 Mandello Aviazione Navale E5 ABS 2023 (APAC)
V100 Mandello Aviazione Navale E5 ABS 2023 (EMEA)
V100 Mandello Aviazione Navale E5 ABS 2023-2024 (NAFTA)
V100 Mandello E5 ABS 2022-2023 (APAC)
V100 Mandello E5 ABS 2022-2024 (EMEA)
V100 Mandello E5 ABS 2023 (NAFTA)
V100 Mandello S E5 ABS 2022-2023 (APAC)
V100 Mandello S E5 ABS 2022-2023 (EMEA)
V100 Mandello S E5 ABS 2023 (NAFTA)
MOTO GUZZI - V 85 E5+
V85 TT E5+ 2024 (EMEA)
V85 TT Strada E5+ 2024 (EMEA)
V85 TT Travel E5+ 2024 (EMEA)
(https://i.ibb.co/6BGW0mS/strada.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6BGW0mS)
(https://i.ibb.co/2FrrZZt/strada2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2FrrZZt)
Thanks Ed!
Now to save our pennies up.
inditx
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Hallo Ed,
will the new, small Strada front fender fit on E4/E5 models?
(https://i.ibb.co/bHkrJjM/fender.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bHkrJjM)
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Hallo Ed,
will the new, small Strada front fender fit on E4/E5 models?
(https://i.ibb.co/bHkrJjM/fender.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bHkrJjM)
be very shocked if it didnt fit, all looks like the same mounting
(https://i.ibb.co/0ng6sLk/strada3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0ng6sLk)
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:thumb: Thanks Ed!
Do you also have a code number for this?
Unfortunately the new and improved airbox cover does not fit (see above).
Now I am thinking about if it would if replacing 2B005442 too:
(https://i.ibb.co/pdDGtSs/2B005442.png) (https://ibb.co/pdDGtSs)
... :cool:
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the NAFTA (USA/Canada) catalogs got posted.
we just uploaded them, if anyone wants to browse around at the new parts on the E5+ version coming soon.
https://www.af1racing.com/v85-e5-oem-parts-catalogs
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Thanks a lot Ed!
These are probably the differences that affect the new airbox lid (12) => part 4 is new and different and part 10 (w. three screws 11) is new. If this would solve the problem with the bad lid, the costs would probably be manageable:
You would need:
1. battery box: 2B011780
2. battery holder: 2B011781 + 3x AP8150509 self-tap screw 5x14
3. filter holder (aka airbox lid): 2B011834
(https://i.ibb.co/jgWJh0s/airbox.png) (https://ibb.co/jgWJh0s)
(https://i.ibb.co/mRxw2hd/2024.png) (https://ibb.co/mRxw2hd)
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Any word on availability date in the US yet?