Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Quielo on July 22, 2019, 09:47:44 AM
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I'm a "returning rider" or just an old guy with rusty skills depending on whether you work in marketing. My last bike was a BMW K100 and I put over 30K miles on it though I have crashed 3 bikes in the distant past when I had habits that facilitated crashing.
I'm now living in a small city outside of Portland, OR and would like to get a mid-sized bike for around town and back road day tripping. I'm thinking very seriously about the V7 series though I am somewhat confused about the different models and somewhat apprehensive about buying a bike without a tach.
Looking at the dealers within a days ride I see.
Dealer Year Model Color $
1 2017 GRISO Silver 8K
1 2017 V9 BOBBER Grigio 7K
1 2018 V7 III MILANO GRAY 7K
1 2018 V7 III CARBON DARK Dark 8K
2 2017 V9 Roamer White 7K
3 2017 V7 III Stone Blue 6K
3 2017 V7 III Stone Green 6K
3 2017 V7 III Stone Black 5.8K
The above are just asking prices and I understand further negotiation is possible.
I like the red accents of the 2018 carbon dark and perhaps a numbered edition is worth something but is it worth $1200 more than a 2017 stone in black? I like the stone in green as well.
The Griso is way more powerful but perhaps I am too stupid to have a bike with 100 hp and should relax on a 750. The V9s are more power but I like the look of the V7s better. Of the 750's above is there any real difference other than looks?
Jim
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The Griso is almost a completely different animal. I won't say you should or should not get it, but the difference is more than just power. As much as I like Grisos, they're not for me, which is why we have two smallblocks in the fleet.
Dark vs. Stone (ha ha, we happen to have both). Worth more? Not for the numbered BS, but worth more IF YOU WANT it more yeah, otherwise probably not.
No tach, no big deal. I like tachs on my bikes, but the Dark doesn't really suffer for the want of one.
Bobber, kinda cool, definitely makes more power than the V7, but I find the V7s make enough anyway. And the Bobber tank isn't as nice nor does it hold as much.
Go ride a couple, buy when tickles your fancy. I don't honestly think there's a bad choice there.
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Since you were riding a K bike, I'd think the performance of the Griso would be the preference. It's the only big block on the list.
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Price on that Griso gives it more bang for the buck..
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The v7's might be a better bike for coming back to riding.. Im really not a fan of the dull paint of the new crop of bikes.. but the Carbon DOES look nicer to my eye.... but frankly for the money I would be looking at either the blue or green stone...
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Any of the V7s would be a great choice. You will be looking at it for quite some time so if the looks of the Carbon Dark really does it for you it would be worth it. Otherwise you will never know the difference riding them Dark vs Stone.
And congratulations on your interest in Moto Guzzi!
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get the Milano, you wont regret it
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I'm thinking the V7. If your of average build, the V7 should have plenty of power for trips in town and to go for some rides on the paved back roads. If I didn't have my Ambo and Eldo, I would look at a V7 or V9. If your plans are for two up riding, I would lean toward a V9.
JMHO,
Tom
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A Griso at a little over 500lbs is about 100lbs heavier than a V7 with about double the horse power.
The Griso does not feel too heavy to me. It also has better suspension. But a hundred lbs certainly makes a difference.
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Thank you everybody. Note the HP and weight of the Griso. For me I would prefer to not be tempted to engage in behaviors that have put me on the ground previously. I'm older but not totally convinced I am wiser.
The Dark/Milano/Stone are just appearance packages? I believe the Milano is the only one with a tach which added to it being one model year newer may make it worth $1200 over the green 2017 stone. It looks like it comes with Pirelli Sport Demon tires. Never rode those but some of the reviews online have criticized these tires. Being in the PNW wet roads will be a real issue for me.
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All smallblocks had a Tach until the V7III came out in 2017, then a few of the models eliminated it for styling and model differentiation differences.
I find the SD's great, and quite sticky dry or wet, just they wear out a little too quickly.
Most V7s came with the SD's except maybe the Stornello or some other scrambler-esque variant.
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The Dark/Milano/Stone are just appearance packages? I believe the Milano is the only one with a tach which added to it being one model year newer may make it worth $1200 over the green 2017 stone. It looks like it comes with Pirelli Sport Demon tires. Never rode those but some of the reviews online have criticized these tires. Being in the PNW wet roads will be a real issue for me.
Yes,just different trims other than the Milano having a tachometer.
Tires are similar to what oil you prefer. One will swoon in admiration of a particular tire while the next one will abhor. Personally I like the Sport Demon.
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get the Milano, you wont regret it
I saw one up close a couple weeks ago for the first time and am in agreement. It is my favorite of the current V7III s.
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I wouldn’t call the Griso mid sized. Great bike but not really what I think you’re looking for.
The v7 series , I’d go with one of the III, as they are over all better then the first couple series. The v9 might be up your alley too, go ride a couple, they are great!
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I wouldn’t call the Griso mid sized. Great bike but not really what I think you’re looking for.
The v7 series , I’d go with one of the III, as they are over all better then the first couple series. The v9 might be up your alley too, go ride a couple, they are great!
Good point... see if you can ride any of the V7's offerd,,, they are all going to ride the same... and try the V9. You might like the v9 better.
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Something that I don't think has been mentioned are the wheels. Some of the bikes have cast wheels with tubeless tires and some have spoked rims with tubes. Tubeless tires are definitely a nice thing to have, but you should at least be aware of that distinction. Also, as mentioned some of the bikes do have a tach while others do not.
Best thing would be to make a list of characteristics that are important to you and go look at the bikes and see which bikes come closest to meeting your requirements, then ride a few.
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I doubt you can go wrong with any of the bikes you listed, just check off what you want.
The Griso is a hoon machine rule that out (I have one)
Wire wheels come with tubes and their shortfalls
Tacho is nice.
The V7iii are all Hemi heads I believe, before that they were Herron head Kev will confirm that.
750s used to be considered a large bike, they have stacks of power.
A 5 gallon tank gives you a huge range, otherwise the V9s are very nice, I think they will be sort after in years to come.
Good Luck
Roy
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I'm thinking the V7. If your of average build, the V7 should have plenty of power for trips in town and to go for some rides on the paved back roads. If I didn't have my Ambo and Eldo, I would look at a V7 or V9. If your plans are for two up riding, I would lean toward a V9.
JMHO,
Tom
I bought a V9 Roamer last November and love the bike. No tach is no problemo, you can set the Rev warning light wherever you want.
Tank capacity is no problem either for me.
I would say that it's not ideal for carrying pillion passengers though. Pretty cramped on the back for average / small adults.
Kev
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Because you are returning and may (or may not), remain..
Would you consider a 750 Breva ?
Relatively small outlay and comfortable with no known terminal issues as far as I know. Relatively light and easily manageable while re learning your skills...(not saying you need to)
(https://i.ibb.co/xhsTMwY/B383-F79-C-E915-4-A33-A1-F4-0-BE4-DE565733.png) (https://ibb.co/xhsTMwY)
Just a thought..
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The test ride is the definer. It was for me, at least. Was looking at something else, took the V7 for a test, the rest is history. While armed with a full wallet, I'd also be tempted to test ride some other bikes as well, say, the RE Interceptor twin (an easier handler), the new SV650 (just for fun), the T100 Bonneville (heavier). Then a V7 again. That way you'll find out which one speaks your language, as it were.
If you are not wedded to the idea of new, that Breva idea of Huzo's is definitely worth a go. Think of the money you'd save (Guzzi-content).
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The 750 Breva is interesting but I have not seen any for sale either new or used anywhere near me. I'm pretty fixated on a Guzzi. I always wanted one and my current needs are so simple I'm not going to look at anything else. I had considered the Yamaha sr400 as I like kicking a bike over but it's just not for me.
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The 750 Breva is interesting but I have not seen any for sale either new or used anywhere near me. I'm pretty fixated on a Guzzi. I always wanted one and my current needs are so simple I'm not going to look at anything else. I had considered the Yamaha sr400 as I like kicking a bike over but it's just not for me.
Oh mate..
If you get any Guzzi, there’ll definitely be times when you’ll feel like kicking it over... :wink:
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Two items setting priorities:
!. "mid-sized bike for around town and back road day tripping"
2. "I like the red accents of the 2018 carbon dark and perhaps a numbered edition is worth something but is it worth $1200 more than a 2017 stone in black?"
Based on those priorities, I think the best affordable fit is a 2017 VIII Stone with the following luggage:
Side cases: https://www.motomachines.com/hepco-becker-c-bow-carrier-moto-guzzi-v7iii-in-black C-Bow mounts with https://www.motomachines.com/hepco-becker-oval-street-soft-bag-set 22L soft side bags or https://www.motomachines.com/hepco-becker-royster-street-soft-bag-black fancier 22L soft side bags. I am very much a fan of the C-Bow system and have it on both my Norge and Classic 500 which allows me to share bags between them.
Top case: H&B makes this rack https://www.motomachines.com/hepco-becker-rear-rack-moto-guzzi-v7iii-in-black but it forces the top case to sit too far rearward unless you are carrying a passenger which wasn't listed in your priorities. So perhaps another member can point you towards a rack that will allow you to mount the http://www.giviusa.com/givi-products/cases/monolock-cases/e300n2-30ltr-matte-black-case-detail Givi 30L Monolock case. It easily holds a full-face helmet with UClear wart; opens and closes easily; and is a snap to remove for a clean look and install for a snacks run. And for longer trips the http://www.giviusa.com/givi-products/cases/monolock-cases/e470na-47ltr-matte-black-detail 47L case will snap onto the same base mount. http://www.giviusa.com/givi-products/case-accessories/inner-bags-and-liners/t468b-inner-bag-detail liners are available. And Yes I have the base mount on the Norge and Classic 500.
I find a left-side Helmet Hook provides convenience and Grip Puppies provide comfort.
I had one of the first K100s and greatly enjoyed it. It mostly commuted 45 miles each way to work and ran flawlessly sun, rain, snow, etc. I dropped it many times (I lived on a rutted hilly dirt road); never dented the tank; and always picked it up by myself. Sometimes the snow melt was so bad I had to drive it into the rocky gutter and walk beside it to get up a hill. It was totally docile. I purchased it to slow down from it's Suzuki predecessors.
I have only sat on the V7 III but the weight and moment seemed close enough to the K100, maybe a bit in favor of the K100.
Let us know how it turns out and post pictures. :smiley:
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Check out the owner's club in OR. One way to make friends and talk about the bikes in person. I know of a low-mileage red Norge for sale and a nice Ambarado. (Ambassador/Eldorado hybrid) Both in Canby, OR.
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During my younger life I was a Honda fan. GL1000, CB550K, CB900C.
Was always interested in Guzzi's but didn't really consider them until my wife Laurie and I were in San Francisco for her birthday trip in 2001. She suggested we go by Munroe Motors just to see the Guzzi line up.
They had a 2001 Jackal V11, used, and I sat on it. Seemed to fit perfectly! It was Laurie's birthday trip but I got the gift of that Jackal!!
Fast forward to the present...due to some health concerns I realized that I would prefer something a bit smaller. Rode the V7II and the III. Preferred the look and riding ergos of the II so we bought it. This bike is FUN to ride!! No regrets at all going with the V7 series. The V7's have plenty of power.
I never considered another brand, for me it had to be a Guzzi. Like my tag line says it is a sickness!!
Ride the different models, go with what makes you feel good.
Most of all, ride safe and have fun!!
Jeff
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GRiSO..... all day every day.
More power, fully adjustable suspension front and rear, character flexibility to cruise, sport or tour and personality out the wazoo. IF IT FITS YOU. Some find the ergos on the Griso challenging.
I added 1" risers and 1" drop foot pegs and the bike is sublime.
I LOVE my V7, but everything about the Griso is better, and where the V7 is a joy to ride, the Griso is intoxicating... A totally different animal. V9 leaves me cold on all counts, wish the motor was in a V7 chassis.
But in the end you have to find and ride what moves you. All good choices here...
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Thank you everybody for your time. I did send an email to the local Guzzi club but have not gotten a response as of yet. They have a campout in Canby so I'll drop by if I don't hear anything.
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One of Quielo’s requirements was for a mid sized bike, so maybe a Griso is more than he wants size wise ?
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One of Quielo’s requirements was for a mid sized bike, so maybe a Griso is more than he wants size wise ?
The GRiSO is midsize isnt it? Between the V7 and 1400 series.
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I'd have to say no.
People know I'm a CARC bike tragic and Griso fanatic but I certainly wouldn't suggest that a cautious returning rider throw themselves into the Griso maelstrom.
For this gentleman I would think essentially a V7, any V7 from the 'Classic' right through to the current models, would be a good entry point.
Especially earlier models are now available at very affordable prices. Why not buy an early twin throttlbody model for peanuts, (Take a decent test ride to make sure it hasn't been arsed about with!) and use that to 'Test the water'? It may be that he finds the whole experience to be one of weird, unfathonable, bastardry! But he'll at least be only a few bucks out of pocket. If he buys even a 'Left Over' V7-III he'll pay lots more and if he does find he hates it he'll take a huge hit on, (Eventual!) resale.
Follow your heart, but really. I don't think the Griso is the bike for you at this time.
Just one opinion.
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I'm not sure your definition of a lot Pete but the leftover Stone prices are so cheap you'd have to be insane to get a used twin tb, plastic tank model unless $1-2k makes a big difference in your life.
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even if he purchased a Griso, it won't have the beans of a K-bike.
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even if he purchased a Griso, it won't have the beans of a K-bike.
He was asking for advice advice on an easy to manage, inoffensive bike within his set parameters.
Fast, (relatively) heavy and expensive was not a direction that he indicated he wanted to go.
Perhaps do multiple test rides of well used inexpensive V7’s and see if they pull you towards them.
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again, read the first post folks.... the MILANO is the clear & obvious choice. It's got the Tach, it looks tits, and it's a V7~~ the best bike guzzi makes to fit his needs
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An 8v Griso won’t have the beans of a k bike?
Weren’t the k bikes limited to a 100 hp?
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No argument the V7 is a fantastic platform and a great re-entry bike. My thoughts on the Griso is though it is heavier, and more capable in many ways, it is also an easy bike to ride slow. If the OP came off K bikes, he may find himself regretting passing on the Griso. Ultimately all good choices, and the Milano is a beautiful bike.
Will be interesting to see what his thoughts/feelings are when he sees/rides these gems.
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An 8v Griso won’t have the beans of a k bike?
Weren’t the k bikes limited to a 100 hp?
sounds right
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A Griso has more power, quicker gear box and similar weight, why would a k bike be faster?
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A Griso has more power, quicker gear box and similar weight, why would a k bike be faster?
I don't think the Griso has the power of a K-bike. I could be wrong.
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Thank you everybody for your time. I did send an email to the local Guzzi club but have not gotten a response as of yet. They have a campout in Canby so I'll drop by if I don't hear anything.
The camp out's at Gary Jenkins house. Very large backyard with fruit trees. The cherries/plums/apricots should be ripe for the picking. He'll have slices of log to make Moto Guzzi coasters with a branding iron. Cool stuff. I made a bunch in Texas. If you show, club members will more than likely let sit on their bikes and bench race on Moto Guzzis. Gary had/has a red Norge dressed out for touring for sale. You might find that some of the older Guzzis may work for you vs. a brand new one.
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Late model Griso are said to have 110hp in stock set up, I agree with you, you might be mistaken. :smiley:
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I'm a "returning rider" ... a mid-sized bike for around town and back road day tripping.
Jim, I was in the same place a few years back (2015). I'm about 5'11" and 170lb and the stone fit me well. I looked at the Griso, which was much more expensive then, and a 2013 V7 stone (white). After finding this forum, my worries about a brand I knew very little about were largely dispelled. I bought the V7 and thoroughly enjoyed it. I sold it a bit more than two years later (wasn't the bike's fault).
The V7 was perfect for getting back into riding. I loved the exciting look of the Griso but it felt much too top heavy (still does) and was too expensive. I rode the V7 primarily on two lane back roads and commuted a bit. I hated longer trips on the highway. To me, it wasn't big enough or stable enough to comfortably travel at high speeds (80 +) for long periods of time. Not that it can't, but it just wasn't comfortable enough for that (to me). It was perfect at 70 give or take and can do that all day. The seat is OK for an hour or so but gets uncomfortable after that. I found that the beaded seat covers do a great job increasing the comfort and cooling over distances. Commuting isn't fun anyway, so I typically drive or take public transit. The times I did ride into work were fine and sorting through stop and go traffic on the highway is a real plus.
After getting to know the V7, I really appreciated the way it revs (I learned from this forum that you don't want to 'lug' the V7... it really likes to rev). The sound of the stock pipes got better after a few thousand miles and I found no need to change them. I added a Marlin wind screen which really increased comfort at speed without taking away from the aesthetics. Also, I changed the mirrors to Aprilia Tuono mirrors (I think several Aprilia models use them) which greatly increased visibility. That's it. The only thing I might have done if I kept the V7 might be to add a beetle map.
Hope that is helpful, take you time and enjoy the bike you choose. For me, the V7 was a perfect choice.
Vince
(https://i.ibb.co/X4867Fv/IMG-0687.jpg) (https://ibb.co/X4867Fv)
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You said you want mid size bike but didn't mention your size. Im 6'2" 225lbs and my Griso feels like a small bike compared to my Stelvio, I've sat on V7"s and they feel like a toy in comparison. At least at my local dealer(GP San Diego) they will let you take any bike for a test ride, so I'd hit your local dealer and see for yourself what works for you.
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You said you want mid size bike but didn't mention your size. Im 6'2" 225lbs and my Griso feels like a small bike compared to my Stelvio, I've sat on V7"s and they feel like a toy in comparison. At least at my local dealer(GP San Diego) they will let you take any bike for a test ride, so I'd hit your local dealer and see for yourself what works for you.
Did you ride the 7? Im 6'3" tall. and 250ish lbs. It did feel real small when I first sat on it.. But once I started riding it really felt good. Not sure I would want to two up tour on it for a few hundred miles... But I gotta say it felt good under me riding it.
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Late model Griso are said to have 110hp in stock set up, I agree with you, you might be mistaken. :smiley:
110HP? :kiss:
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Maybe it would help if people talked apples and apples (crank hp to crank hp claims or rwhp to rwhp).
BMW K100
Claimed 536-548# wet
Claimed Crank power - 88 hp (90 PS/metric hp)
RWHP: ~ 68 hp @ 7500 rpm & 53.6 torques @ 6200 rpm (with a considerable dip in the middle)
1/4 mile - 12.5 seconds
see https://ibmwr.org/index.php/1999/03/01/dyno-testing-of-k100-performance-modifications/ (https://ibmwr.org/index.php/1999/03/01/dyno-testing-of-k100-performance-modifications/) for Dyno chart.
see https://motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/bmw/bmw_k100rs%2083.htm (https://motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/bmw/bmw_k100rs%2083.htm) for other claimed specs. Not the best source, but hard to find 1/4 mile and wet weight data on a model that old.
Guzzi Griso 1200 8V (2015 # from MCN)
553# wet (MCN)
Claimed Crank Power (OEM) - 110 hp @ 7500 rpm
RWHP (MCN): 98 hp & 72 torques
11.42 1/4 mile (MCN)
Certainly seems like the Griso would be even fastener and potentially more of a handful/temptation.
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I guess my thinking was that Europe (France) had a 100 HP limit at the time. Many liter class bikes were tuned for torque and rpm limited so they would pull 99 RWHP. Now I know that several variants were made from the Kbike with more power than other variants. I've ridden with a K biker (I suppose it was an "S" model) and they seemed have about the same getup as my 1200 Bandit which also made for Europe rules and made 99 RWHP (add slip on + jet = 115 rwhp).
I think that 4v Guzzis are nice rides. I am guessing they have about 80-85 RWHP. My V11 Sport has about 75 but it's got strong mid range whereas the 4v has better top end rush.
I suppose my memory and guessing are pretty foggy. :angel: