2013 V7 Stone cranks but won't catch

[Chuck in Indiana]

clogged fuel filter?   or was this covered?

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Yeah, he put in a new metal filter right off the bat. This is a frustrating thread. Somehow we are all missing something obvious. About the only thing I can see right now is the fuel really isn't fuel, *or* maybe the pressure regulator is udders skyward, an unusual thing, to be sure. He says the injector is doing it's thing.. <scratching head>

[jkaelol]

Fuel filter was swapped out with a full metal one.

I just drained the tank and figured that I'd check on the pump and filter once more while I had it out. Filter was put on correctly. Using a totally scientific and safe bucket of gasoline I discovered that it does pump fuel with a pretty decent stream. There is, however, fuel weeping from the pressure regulator when there is no fuel out hose attached. If I cover the "fuel out" flange (to the injectors) with my finger, there is very little pressure on my finger and all of the fuel spews out of the regulator outlet.

Perhaps it's a failing regulator that can't keep the 30-50psi for fuel, but gives enough to push a little fuel out through the injectors??

[jkaelol]

\
Yeah, he put in a new metal filter right off the bat. This is a frustrating thread. Somehow we are all missing something obvious. About the only thing I can see right now is the fuel really isn't fuel, *or* maybe the pressure regulator is udders skyward, an unusual thing, to be sure. He says the injector is doing it's thing.. <scratching head>

Sorry, just read this after posting my above response. See above for comments on regulator. Anyone know exactly how "weepy" the regulator is supposed to be? Is there a way to adjust it, or is it a replacement?

[Chuck in Indiana]

You mean it spews out of the normally open to atmosphere fitting??

[jkaelol]

You mean it spews out of the normally open to atmosphere fitting??

I'm not positive. When I "prime" the pump in a bucket of gasoline with no fuel line attached to the red flange, it will weep a little bit from the holes at the top and the sides of the cylinder (see pic). Most of the gas will flow frok the red flange. When I cover the red flange partially with my finger, there is significant flow from the cylinder (about half from the cylinder and half from the flange). When I cover it completely with my finger, all of the flow comes from the cylinder and there is very little pressure on my finger.

[RinkRat II]

       When you close down on your red flange the only flow you should get is from the nipple protruding from the regulator and nowhere else, as this is the return port to the tank. Sounds like the regulator has some trash in it and is relieving too early. The old style external regulators can be taken apart and cleaned, not sure on the newer internal type like yours.

      Paul B

[GRGuzzi]

My  humble opinion is about the ecu censors I thing this model have a heel sensor
If I’m right just override it and try.

[SmithSwede]

To answer your questions.  The hose on right front side of the tank is an overflow or vent tube.  Yes, it should be connected to the metal nipple that is present on the right front side underneath tank.  Should be really obvious how it fits.

Those dangling rubber hoses are not the cross over pipe I’m referring to.  The cross over pipe is a chromed metal pipe located underneath the engine, near the kickstand, that connect each of the main exhaust pipes (the cross over is at right angles to the two main exhaust pipes). On each end of the cross over is a 10mm clamp.  Make sure they are good and snug.

It sounds like you haven’t actually cleaned the genuine throttle body.  There is just one, located beneath the air box in front of the ECU.   It is a pain to get to.   Definitely clean out that port at 6:00.

[jkaelol]

It was the fuel pump regular!

A local shop had one for a Ducati that fits this model. Popped it in and threw everything back together and she fired right up! Think that I fucked up the valve clearance though because there's a bit of ticking on both cylinders now. But she's running!!

Thanks everyone for the help and insight. I'll update my first post to include the solution.

[SmithSwede]

Outstanding!   Glad it is fixed.  And thanks for posting back what the solution was. 

I’m not sure you screwed up valve adjust.  A bit of ticking sound is good.  Better a bit loose than too tight. 

You probably just want to ride your new bike.   But . . . if you are so inclined, can you give us some more details so us peanut gallery diagnosticians can do better next time?

You mentioned a moaning sound.   Did the moaning go away with new regulator?   You had pressure in the tank before.  Did that go away?

If you want to pull the fuel injector again, kindly tell us what the good fuel spray pattern looks like compared to the old one that didn’t work.    I’d love to know some volume data. 

What is the Ducati pump part number?  Cross reference is good. 

Or just go ride.  They are great bikes. 

[Kev m]

Outstanding diagnosis.

[jkaelol]

Outstanding!   Glad it is fixed.  And thanks for posting back what the solution was. 

I’m not sure you screwed up valve adjust.  A bit of ticking sound is good.  Better a bit loose than too tight. 

You probably just want to ride your new bike.   But . . . if you are so inclined, can you give us some more details so us peanut gallery diagnosticians can do better next time?

You mentioned a moaning sound.   Did the moaning go away with new regulator?   You had pressure in the tank before.  Did that go away?

If you want to pull the fuel injector again, kindly tell us what the good fuel spray pattern looks like compared to the old one that didn’t work.    I’d love to know some volume data. 

What is the Ducati pump part number?  Cross reference is good. 

Or just go ride.  They are great bikes.

It's a little more ticking than I like to hear, so while the engine cools down a bit I'd be happy to entertain the peanut gallery.

There is still pressure from the tank when I take the cap off. I only put about a half gallon of fuel back in (going to fill it up with new fuel just to be safe), so it could be amplified by the mostly empty tank. I did not hear the moan when I fired her up, but will keep an ear out for it on my next ride. I tried it with an injector out before firing it up. The new spray pattern was significantly more of a mist. Before I cleaned it it was like the "jet" setting on a garden hose, then perhaps the "cone" after cleaning (4 or so small streams with intermittent misting in between). It is now a lot more mist than stream.

The part number is FPR35K, but a Google search makes it seem like it isn't OEM Ducati either. He just said that it came out of the Ducati parts catalogue.

[malik]

Winner.

Yes, please do send us the part no. for that regulator, &, if possible, a photo of the offending part.

Do note that the hose from the filter to the plate should be submersible fuel hose - I use Gates 5/16ths SAE 30R10. You can use oetiker clamps again if you also have the tool, otherwise there are a few stainless screw clamps with rounded edges for hose available, usually from the same people who sell the hose. I've found here that the hose is cheaper by the meter than by the foot. Cali's & V7C's, at least, need 7 inches.

Valve adjustment? The book specifies 0.15 & 0.20mm, but the older models had 0.10 & 0.15mm. As to whether it would make any difference long term, someone else may be able to shed an educated opinion on this - it seems for the big blocks, 10 & 15 are preferred, even when some of the books (not all) specify otherwise. Hey, it's Italian.

As for the parts availability, I've found that some components no longer available separately,used to be apreviously - for example, that red elbow in the fuel pump plate is not commonly listed any more, but it was once and it's (merely) a matter of finding the part no in older models' parts manuals & starting the search there. If it's an Italian foible, then Ducati is not immune either.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Fuel pressure regulator: https://ca-cycleworks.com/fpr35k.html

[Tom H]

Can't believe that a regulator crapped out overnight. But it appears that it did. WOW??

But then again, on my Eldo I installed a NEW universal VW style fuel filter (you know those plastic filter that every auto parts store had on their counter). Fired the bike up and all seemed well. Two days latter I go to start it. Acted like out of gas or maybe a plug bad, wouldn't run on one side. After a bit of mucking around, I found that the fuel was not going through the NEW filter. Tossed that one in the trash, installed a new one and all is well. Another can't believe it moment!

Congrats that you have hopefully solved your problem!!

Hopefully now you have a bike that will give you many miles and smiles

Tom

[Kev m]

If it sat then gunk likely formed in the tank.

Ethanol has this "wonderful" ability to turn hardened gunk in the fuel system into a partially soluble sludge.

It's conceivable that sludge that was sucked through the system during that post-purchase ride managed to gum up the works in the regulator helping it to stick open and cause the no start.

[Cam3512]

That "moaning" is from a one way valve in a vent line that stops gas fumes from venting.  Keeps a certain amount of pressure in the tank too.  I called it "mooing", and would happen after parking the bike ('14 Special) in the garage after a ride, and during extreme temperature changes.  You can slow it down by cracking the gas cap and relieving the pressure.  No big deal.

[jkaelol]

That "moaning" is from a one way valve in a vent line that stops gas fumes from venting.  Keeps a certain amount of pressure in the tank too.  I called it "mooing", and would happen after parking the bike ('14 Special) in the garage after a ride, and during extreme temperature changes.  You can slow it down by cracking the gas cap and relieving the pressure.  No big deal.

Good to know-- mooing is a better way to describe it!

[Kiwi_Roy]

We obviously need an easy method of checking the fuel pressure, reading that would have pointed to the regulator, a gauge short hose and a quick release fitting should do it.

The other Guzzis run at 40 psi but its not that critical
The injectors run in the region of choked flow, the inlet manifold pressure makes no difference and the fuel pressure / flow is a square root relationship

[Kev m]

We obviously need an easy method of checking the fuel pressure, reading that would have pointed to the regulator, a gauge short hose and a quick release fitting should do it.

The other Guzzis run at 40 psi but its not that critical
The injectors run in the region of choked flow, the inlet manifold pressure makes no difference and the fuel pressure / flow is a square root relationship

A gauge installed inline in a T fitting between the tank and fuel distribution line would solve that.

[Kiwi_Roy]

A gauge installed inline in a T fitting between the tank and fuel distribution line would solve that.

I went and looked on my V7iii it looks as though it would be easy to put a gauge in place of either injector using an "O" ring to seal it into the injector connector.
Someone with a lathe should be able to make an adapter
The Cycleworks regulator operates at 3.5 bar, I wonder what the guzzi one calls for

[Chuck in Indiana]

Outstanding diagnosis.