Author Topic: Starter Solenoids - Interested?  (Read 1232 times)

Offline Kiwi_Roy

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Starter Solenoids - Interested?
« on: June 08, 2019, 12:02:43 AM »
A little more information on the solenoids that operate our starters.

A friend gave me a solenoid off a Bosch starter so I thought I would pull it apart to check the coils.
To my surprise both coils have the same number of turns.
The heavy coil I call the Grunt coil is wound on the bottom so it only uses a fraction of the wire that the outer coil does but its also a larger gauge.
The outer coil I call the holding coil is wound of a smaller gauge but the wire is also much longer because the circumference is greater therefore it will have more resistance and so draw less current.

The strength of a magnetic coil is dependent on the current x the number of turns (Ampere Turns)
Lets say the inner coil draws 40 Amps and the outer coil draws 10 Amps (pretty typical)
They both have the same number of turns therefore the relative strength is the ratio of the currents.
The inner coil is 4x as strong as the outer. (does 4 x the work)

Once the solenoid is pulled in the inner coil drops to zero current because its shorted out by the main contacts and just the holding coil holds everything in place.
Then interestingly when you take your finger off the button you probably assume the current is turned off, but no, now both coils are effectively in series. As they have the same number of turns the strengths will be the same.
BUT now one coil has the current reversed so the field is equal but opposite, in other words the fields cancel out so the solenoid lets everything go, that's pretty neat I reckon.

I didn't do a very good job of explaining that, I know
« Last Edit: June 08, 2019, 12:25:46 AM by Kiwi_Roy »
17 V7III Special
76 Convert

Moto Guzzi - making electricians out of riders since 1921

Offline Roy gardner

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Re: Starter Solenoids - Interested?
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2019, 04:04:53 AM »
Does it fit on your Guzzi starter, I believe there are not many variations? I watched my favorite auto sparky clean the big copper contact pads  on mine 20 years ago, & that solved the "activation by boot heel" problem I had.   :laugh:
MGNOC L112
1973  850 GT (sold 1979)
1974  160 Stornello (bought new 1978)
1972 V7 Sport, (bought 1979, still running strong)
1977 Convert (bought 2009)
1974  850T (ComposT, pawned to buy Vincent parts!
1985? LM 1000 (saved from a savage, has become hotrod Convert)

Offline Kiwi_Roy

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Re: Starter Solenoids - Interested?
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2019, 09:16:16 AM »
Does it fit on your Guzzi starter, I believe there are not many variations? I watched my favorite auto sparky clean the big copper contact pads  on mine 20 years ago, & that solved the "activation by boot heel" problem I had.   :laugh:
Not any more, I kept the magnet wire but threw away the rest.
Both the Valeo and the Bosch starter solenoids have the double coil
I suspect the Chinese starters fitted to the V7s will also be the same but I haven't confirmed it yet.

Here is the sketch I did of the Valeo starter, the Bosch solenoid is very similar.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2019, 09:28:38 AM by Kiwi_Roy »
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Moto Guzzi - making electricians out of riders since 1921

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