Why I cant wait to retire......

[Bulldog9]

(Mine's bigger than yours)      I quit punching the clock at 47. Dorcia was a benefits rep at a GM plant, and retired every one. She saw *many* work until they almost dropped, retire, and die. She told me stories of why people thought they just "couldn't" retire.. mostly involving not having enough money. Pffft. You don't spend as much money once you are retired. Trust me on this.
That said.. she also told me that people that retire and *don't do anything* don't last long either. I've built airplanes, motorcycles, and traveled the country.
You absolutely *have* to have something to do that makes your life worthwhile to you. If your work is your life, you'd better not retire. She's seen that one, too. Many times. <shrug>

You are exactly right. Too many people have no life or plan beyond work, and when they retire they stop living. I've had good models to emulate in that regard. My grandparents planned and retired well, my dad has done the same.

Our plan has been to get the kids through college, pay off all mortgages and vehicles/debts, and retire before 60. While I do (despite my pitiful whining in the original post) LOVE my job and it is a blend of calling and vocation, I view the "job" aspect as a funding vehicle to get me to retirement.  I'm not a Dave Ramsey (Financial Peace) devotee, but our approach has always been to live debt free with the exception of mortgage and an occasional car payment.  I usually finance a car for 3 years and keep it for 15.  We started serious planning for retirement with a December 2022 target date as being debt and mortgage free, and have a full slate of life planned post retirement.

Set a budget, keep the budget, live well, and just below your means. Always bargain hunt, always look for a deal, its bizzare, but we shop at Aldi, Marshalls, etc, and have furnished our house for pennies on the dollar for years by yardsales, and craiglsist and such. We dont really need to, but we review the budget monthly, and stick to it. We dont go in debt. When we go on vacation, it is on a set budget, etc. Same for my MC hobby.

I went  years without saving a penny for retirement, was more important for my wife and kids to have what they needed. I knew the day would come when they were grown and out, my wife could work, and I could save. Like Kev, my wife is the real bread earner now, despite my successes. When I retire, she will probably keep working as long as she wants. I married a hottie too, but not a younger hottie ;-)

Most of our strategy has been real estate. I've moved every 2-3 years and have bought a house at nearly every move, keeping the mortgage below what it would cost to rent the house out, or selling and using profits to buy the next. Worked out well in all but 1 situation. Started selling all but 3 about 10 years ago. My wife will want to keep working (likely) and when we both retire will go to 2 homes, a condo in the City and the house in the country. We will likely live in the country home, and keep the condo which will generate enough rental income to cover the operating costs of the other houses. We refinanced one home 15 years ago and cased out enough to buy the condo free and clear. So far, the market is cooperating, so the strategy has worked. As a result, I havent done much with IRA or 401K, but with a solid pension, good medical coverage and zero debt, things should be fine. I also plan to start drawing SS at 62. 

BOTTOM LINE is to start with the END in sight, and backwards plan.....

I'm always toying with dozens of ideas post retirement, teach at a local elementary school and invest in the next generation, write, continuing to work with Habitat for Humanity and aid organizations, consult, and my latest crazy scheme is to partner with Revzilla to open MC parts and accessory shops in military PX's. I also toy with the idea of buying the local Guzzi dealer, setting it up as a partnership/co-op of owners vested in its success, or to have my own little 'handyman' home repair business. The ideas are always flowing.  BUT, the key issue is whatever I will do, it will be on MY terms, on MY timeline..... I may do NOTHING.......Just plant some trees, build a chicken coop, keep bees, ride my motorcycles, fish, hike and spoil my grandkids.... No matter what I do, I'll be doing the last things, just havent decided on the rest...

Most important is to live, love people, serve others and just enjoy life. Despite the hard points, spending no less than 7 of the last 17 years deployed to Iraq & Afghanistan, working 12-14 hour days, I've managed to do that. Something tells me that I will do the same in retirement. Faith, Family, Friends and Fun are the the things that make life worth living. $$ is just a tool, and all that needs is discipline and planning.

[Gliderjohn]

From Bulldog9:

Set a budget, keep the budget, live well, and just below your means. Always bargain hunt, always look for a deal, its bizzare, but we shop at Aldi, Marshalls, etc, and have furnished our house for pennies on the dollar for years by yardsales, and craiglsist and such.

That's a big one that can really stretch a dollar plus being fun now that we have the time. We have a wonderful set of cookware that was top of the line in it's day that we probably have a total of $30 in. Recently picked up a set of 8x40 vintage Zeiss binoculars with original case for $8. Found a high quality brown dress style leather jacket for $6. Could go on. Kind of like a scavenger hunt.
GliderJohn

[pebra]

(Mine's bigger than yours)      I quit punching the clock at 47. Dorcia was a benefits rep at a GM plant, and retired every one. She saw *many* work until they almost dropped, retire, and die. She told me stories of why people thought they just "couldn't" retire.. mostly involving not having enough money. Pffft. You don't spend as much money once you are retired. Trust me on this.
That said.. she also told me that people that retire and *don't do anything* don't last long either. I've built airplanes, motorcycles, and traveled the country.
You absolutely *have* to have something to do that makes your life worthwhile to you. If your work is your life, you'd better not retire. She's seen that one, too. Many times. <shrug>

I too think that's an important observation ^. For a lot of people there’s a health aspect to working  -  get up in the morning, social interactivity, physical and mental activity, taking on responsibilities and so on. Getting out of the house and away from the spouse for a little while. Also, as life expectancy increases, so will the length of our working life  -  it’s not likely that the retirement period will increase as much as the life expectancy. People will have to work into their seventies to fund their extended life and stay healthy, but mostly not in the position they had at age 50.

People are different. Some enjoy working, some don’t and for various reasons. Many of us will find that we can’t have the same job all our working life. Most of us will not be able to keep a demanding job as we grow older, we shall have to find something less demanding. Some of us don't have the ability or self dicipline to build airplanes or improve the house.

After about age 65 I started feeling it was difficult to cope at work. Those periods of long working days became ever harder to endure, I became less motivated and adept at keeping updated, and so on. Fortunately my employer let me wind down a little by reducing my workload.

When I started drawing on full pensions at 67 I found I didn’t want to just suddenly stop working  - I wanted to be in touch with old colleagues and my field of work, also be of use outside of the house and family circle. Fortunately my employer wanted to retain my services. Preferably in a full- or part-time position with defined responsibilities, but in the end it was accepted that I didn’t want that. So now I «help out»  -  assisting my old colleagues, typically with low-responsibility tasks that I know from before, frequently being a discussion partner. A colleague recently had a traffic accident and is out for several months, so now I take responsibility (ugh!) for one of his clients (that I know intimately from before).

I’ll be 70 in March and right now I think I’ll still be working after that, a short day or two per week. Then there's the grandson, riding, walking the dog, reading, travelling. If I had the ability to service my Guzzis I'd do that. I could (and should!  ) do some redecoration but just can't be arsed - - - - Yeah, I'm lazy and have learned to live with it.
Or maybe I should quit my present «job» and do something completely different, perhaps charitable work. I'd get out and do something useful, and I don't need the income.

[Chuck in Indiana]

 Maybe this is why we retire ?  Peter

Yeah, pretty much. 

[John Ulrich]

Retirement is the goal. I am 59 and really only working for the health insurance(the paycheck is good, also). The insurance is paramount as Cookie is a cancer survivor.

I checked out at 59 to ride around AZ on my motorcycle in the winter.  My wife continued to work a few more years as she was able to work winters with her Phoenix based team and spend summers in MN at corporate while I mowed the lawn and painted the house.  Insurance IS paramount!!!!  We just "sunsetted" our Cobra coverage and now pay north of $30K a year for the same policy......which we use regularly     
We have a few more years until I turn 65 but insurance is the major factor to consider when pulling the plug!

[Wayne Orwig]

A weather station has been keeping me busy for a while now.
http://hogmountain.asuscomm.com/

Before that, I designed and programmed a solar charge controller.

Since my original retirement plans where dramatically, and traumatically changed, I needed to come up with new things to keep me busy. I guess I need to put the EV up in the air and pull the transmission in a few weeks. Yuck.

[Markcarovilli]

pebra

I'm with you and your outlook.  Turning 69 this week and still at it mostly full time and will keep at it, but take more time off as needed....

Mark

[rocker59]

  We just "sunsetted" our Cobra coverage and now pay north of $30K a year for the same policy......which we use regularly   

Damn.  $30,000 per year for a health insurance policy?  Unfriggingbelievabl e!   

[Tusayan]

Damn.  $30,000 per year for a health insurance policy?  Unfriggingbelievabl e!   

Hence my post about younger wives and retiring, formerly health insurance providing husbands (or vice versa)  Medical care is not cheap and never will be, regardless of who pays or how the cost may be hidden. My company with many thousands of subscribers pays something like $15000 per year per family, of which the employee pays only a fraction.   Meanwhile my elderly mother recently had an Medicare/insurance paid operation with truly excellent care, a month in hospital and lots of professionals involved, and naturally the bill was many times that amount - which is what creates the costs for everybody.  Very likely all our times will come, and we will want somebody else to pay our own $150K bill.

The bottom line is if you retire from an employer with good health insurance benefits, even if you are 65 and Medicare eligible, don’t forget that one way or another you’ll still need to provide for younger member of the family.

I’m planning on retiring a bit early, in about 7 years, and building the funds to do it has been a focus of my life since my 30s.  At this point the die is cast for better or worse, its just a matter of paying down mortgage debts at $7K per month combined (mainly sourced from rent) and letting a 401K mature.   My biggest concern is maintaining health with good health care, so I can enjoy what decades of work will hopefully allow otherwise.  Ignore it and the unavoidable costs of quality health care at your peril.

[LowRyter]

Damn.  $30,000 per year for a health insurance policy?  Unfriggingbelievabl e!   

It's a real crisis. Particularly for the over 50 and not yet 65 crowd. 

I've heard this from too many people that had saved for early retirement and can't.  After you've had a loved one cry her eyes out regarding her job when she's 60 years and worked there for 30 years.  And suppose you're laid off? 

They follow the rules, get out of debt, save, put in the 401k/IRA and then this.

I mentioned this to my Congresswoman.  I hope they get a plan together.

[Tusayan]

Work hard in your 20s, start saving in your 30s as it starts to pay off, by your 50s make sure somebody else (for example tenants in their 20s) are funding much of your investments.  That way the train doesn’t come completely off the tracks if you have an upset in your 50s or later.

[Lannis]

Damn.  $30,000 per year for a health insurance policy?  Unfriggingbelievabl e!   

You don't have to pay that, unless you need a heart transplant or something, and then nothing's going to be normal in any environment.

Fay and I were both retired at 59 with no medical benefits.   We tried the "government health exchange" programs that were supposed to be so great, but the premiums rose to over $2000 a month and the deductibles and "out of pocket" in the $13,000 a year range (hence the $30,000 annually thing), so that became a non-starter after two years.

You have to ask yourself two questions, which I will not answer on-line for obvious reasons.   One is "Why was this not a problem for our grandparents?"  and "What can I do to fix it so that it is not a problem for me either?"

That's what Fay and I did, it worked great for the 4 years in between COBRA and Medicare, and we're living happily ever after.

Lannis

[Tusayan]

You have to ask yourself two questions, which I will not answer on-line for obvious reasons.   One is "Why was this not a problem for our grandparents?"  and "What can I do to fix it so that it is not a problem for me either?"

The answer is not at all political, it’s simply that the relatively poor health care of the past was less costly.  You can accept it today if you want and many times the risk will pay off (we don’t all have significant illness before 65!) but I want available to me what higher costs and technology can now provide, and also my choice of multiple health care chains, self employed doctors of my choice, specialists and so on...  waiting for my phone call with a near term appointment. YMMV.

That's what Fay and I did, it worked great for the 4 years in between COBRA and Medicare, and we're living happily ever after

I think that’s fine.  You knew your health status and you managed your risk to your best advantage. Probably (I suppose) a catastrophic health event could have made you flat broke but if that how somebody wants to play it, it’s their money.

[Lannis]

Work hard in your 20s, start saving in your 30s as it starts to pay off, by your 50s make sure somebody else (for example tenants in their 20s) are funding much of your investments.  That way the train doesn’t come completely off the tracks if you have an upset in your 50s or later.

A good riding buddy of mine and I share retirement strategies with each other (he's 10 years older than me).    I hired a financial consultant (with whom I've been for 30 years now), and he put together a portfolio (I hate to use that word because it sounds like Cornelius Vanderbilt stuff, but it's applicable even if you've only got a few hundred or few thousand dollars in each investment) that we adjusted over the years as my career changed.   For example, when I was younger, it was heavily weighted toward growth stocks.    When I was "between jobs" in 2006/07, we shifted money to the appropriate places.    When I retired, we shifted it around to generate the income I needed to live.

My buddy always "pooh-poohed" my approach, taking pride in managing his own money with no help from a consultant.   To him, consultants were always just leeches who siphoned away 2 or 3% of your money to take vacations in the Caribbean, and couldn't believe that I'd let them take me like that.  ESPECIALLY funding annuities and other instruments like that.

Until 2008.   In 2008 he was retired with most all his money still in stocks, his income coming from capital gains and dividends, and when the crash hit, his income fell by 60% and he was suddenly on ramen noodles and pre-owned tires for his truck.   That's not happening to me; only about 10% of my income is dependent on the stock market, and the companies that pay my annuity and pension haven't missed a payment since they were founded in the 1890s, through the panic of 1907, the Great Depression, etc etc.

The "tenants" thing is a good plan, but I would get SO frustrated with the crap you have to put up with from some of them that I wouldn't enjoy spending my money!    I have friends whose income is from rental property, and their stories really get my BP up ....

Lannis

[Testarossa]

The health care issue is serious. I had to wait until I was on Medicare before I could afford to drop employee insurance and retire. I'm essentially healthy but I do dangerous things including skiing and riding Italian motorcycles.

[Lannis]

The health care issue is serious. I had to wait until I was on Medicare before I could afford to drop employee insurance and retire. I'm essentially healthy but I do dangerous things including skiing and riding Italian motorcycles.

aHA!   So YOU'RE the reason the premiums are so high .... I knew it was someone ...

[moto-uno]

      Hurrah for Canada , sorry , I just had to throw that in ! Seriously , that is some scary insurance costs .  Peter

[roadventure]

Sick society when people are forced to work themselves all the way to the grave to ensure they have medical insurance; paying 20-70% of their income for healthcare so that some insurance executive can get a 7-figure paycheck for pushing numbers around a spreadsheet and optimizing a system in which paying customers are denied or extorted to pay extra for the very care that insurance is supposed to... uh, ensure.

Hopefully we will come to our senses sometime in the next 1.5-15 years and catch up with the rest of the civilized world. I certainly hope so.

Here, here.

[rocker59]

      Blame Canada  

Fixed that for you...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaXsWQAI2j4


 

[Gliderjohn]

From Testarossa:

I'm essentially healthy but I do dangerous things including skiing and riding Italian motorcycles.

Then add flying airplanes w/o engines and using a 61 year old tricycle front end tractor regularly.
GliderJohn

[Bulldog9]

The "tenants" thing is a good plan, but I would get SO frustrated with the crap you have to put up with from some of them that I wouldn't enjoy spending my money!    I have friends whose income is from rental property, and their stories really get my BP up ....

Lannis

We have had great luck because all the houses were close to Military bases, and you generally get a better tenant, and a bit more leverage due to their responsibilities as an ADSM.  One house didnt work out, due to real estate market issues. It was bought in 2003 when you were lucky to get a 7% interest rate. When the rates dropped, they built bigger homes for more $$ which was offset by the lower interest rates. So my nice 2200SF 4 bedroom 2 car garage dropped from $200K to $160K in one year, and plummeted over the 9-10 years I owned it from a nice middleclass neighborhood something less so I basically broke even on sale. I wanted to sell it at its peak of $200K in 2010, but was talked out of it. Ended up selling for $150K.

We've only had one bad tenant, husband was an accountant, wife a nurse. They trashed the house, skipped out on rent, and when we tried to levy garnishments, they quit their jobs and went back to the trailerparks and welfare of West Virginia....... We have a no pet no smoking rule, and then agree to bi monthly visits from the property manager, disguzed as my 'free changing of AC furnace filters" ;-)  My brother in law rents one property, and he is so neat, he makes my wife and I look like slobs ;-)   I love it when he comes to dinner, he cleans our kitchen (and washes all the dishes) 

[Rough Edge racing]

The answer is not at all political, it’s simply that the relatively poor health care of the past was less costly.  You can accept it today if you want and many times the risk will pay off (we don’t all have significant illness before 65!) but I want available to me what higher costs and technology can now provide, and also my choice of multiple health care chains, self employed doctors of my choice, specialists and so on...  waiting for my phone call with a near term appointment. YMMV.

I think that’s fine.  You knew your health status and you managed your risk to your best advantage. Probably (I suppose) a catastrophic health event could have made you flat broke but if that how somebody wants to play it, it’s their money.

  I'm 72 and never have been fat, drink about 3 beers a month at most. I'm active and years ago started eating what's considered a healty diet and got rid of tobacco...Doctors always said I'm in great shape...Then several months ago I get a rare lethal cancer, I'm not a risk factor for it, just bad luck I guess..I have Medicare managed by a private insurance co..My out of pocket is about 1000 bucks on a bill pushing 50 grand and I'm only about 1/3 of way through treatments...These slap you in the face diseases can happen at 50 years old or 60 or whatever....For the record, the hospital info says if a patient has no heath insure, they will usually settle for 1/2 the billing amount with a monthy payment plan..As you say, it's your money and your risk..
 I have heard people on this site say there was far less cancer years ago, it's all new....Rubbish, many people 100 years ago died early from diseases easily treated today. Lethal diseases were often not treated because they wern't any treatments.Many people never saw doctors and no records were kept..A simple infection eaged on due to lack of antibiotics..How many here owe their lives to heart bypass surgury that didn't exist then...How many here would have been dead 100 years ago?
   It's all fun and games until the shit hits than fan...My advise is always been the same,always  live within your means, retire as early as possible, make sure you have the means to deal with your health,and have a good time while the times are good...

[larrys]

I'm 66 and still working. I genuinely like what I do. I started my latest job four years ago and just this summer finished building my department. Everyone who works for me, two admins and one inspector, I have hired. I have two new vehicles for the department and won't have to wrestle with the Board of Finance for any more capital improvements. Am on cruise control now. I plan on going to age 70 and will make the decision then about what to do next. My personal financial stuff is all in order. My quandary is what am I going to do to get me out of the house for the next thirty or so years. My mom made it to 102 and Dad made into his 90's. I am likely stuck here on this planet for quite some time. I have most all the toys and tools that I ever wanted. I have traveled pretty much everywhere I've ever wanted to go. What's next?
Larry

[Testarossa]

What's next?

Miles and miles.

[Joliet Jim]

As long as we're telling stories.
I was let go at 59 after 22 years with the Public Accounting firm I worked for. One of the happiest days of my life. Basically i was moved so younger females like my boss could take over the group. Not sour grapes just 90% of the group I worked with seemed to be female under 40. Had Cobra, a little severance (changed the rules the year before they cleaned house), and unemployment. Managed to pick up some consulting work with a competitor until Cobra ran out then joined them as PT with benefits. Been doing that for a year with a lot of RV travelling since I'm virtual. Health insurance is the big problem. It was going to run me about 18k for a year (single and Cheryl is now on Medicare).

Current plan is to really retire this summer when I turn 62 and SS kicks in, take Cobra until 63.5 and hope something is worked out by then to fix paying for our great healthcare system. Can't chance going without after an angioplasty in 2018, a false CT reading in 2019 that lead to another angiogram to show that the $6000 ct exam was garbage and totally wrong. "But isn't it good to know" All total about 60k for the first one that needed stents and about 35k for the totally unnecessary one. With employer insurance barely cost me anything. Without it could have been devastating financially. (I don't have agreed upon rates like BCBS so would have been much higher for me)

I'd like to move to a cheaper area, but grandsons keep me anchored until they're older. I'd miss them too much. All in all life is good, but I've also learned it can be short. Too many people I know held off on retiring and then unexpectedly lost the spouse they planned on spending retirement with (starting with my uncle 40 yrs ago, a good friend with a condo in Maui, my dad with a heart attack at 61 with almost a year accrued vacation). I used to joke that our retirement plan was life insurance proceeds to the survivor.

If I don't fully retire this year, it will be due to health insurance. Just need to figure out how to get the whole month of July off for an RV trip up north to British Columbia.

[John Ulrich]

Joliet Jim...Glad you're still with us!!!

Yup, Live life the best you can.  I'm driving to Michigan for a funeral... One of my best long time friends arrived in Florida, to a recently purchased winter home and his wife passed a couple days later...only 63. 

That $30K+ insurance.  My wife (retired heath insurance employee) ran the numbers from a number of different options including the gov plan.  Factoring in the total costs of our usual yearly drug costs (both have asthma)  surgeries we had in the past and how they would have been handled thru other policies etc, etc.... she can make spread sheets with the best of them.     The cheapest plans on the front end would not have been the best plan all said and done!  We live in two states... we need a network that covers that and the whole country in between for that matter.   

Canada was mentioned.  Talk to people you actually know there.  One friend has to drive 1 hr out of her town because the local doctors choose not to care for her sons condition.   Yes, medical is free, but a Doctor is not required to see you.  If you are in a small town your options are limited.

 

[moto-uno]

  So are you suggesting Docs in the US are in every small town ? Just curious ? Promise I'll drop it after this  , Peter

[Joliet Jim]

  So are you suggesting Docs in the US are in every small town ? Just curious ? Promise I'll drop it after this  , Peter

Saw that coming :)

[Wayne Orwig]

I had to drive 45 minutes, and I am in a populated area. Then, that doc (actually, the entire North Georgia system) decided they no longer would take my insurance company. Thousands now have to drive hours away for coverage.

[Bulldog9]

Healthcare policy is something I have a fair bit of knowledge and experience. I worked as a Bioethicist for the DOD from 2012-2015, and was in Grad School 2011-2012. During this time, during my course of study at Penn, the Medical and Healthcare ecthics chair/provost changed out to Zeke Emmanuel. He had just left the administration, and decided to teach an entire semester 's class (graduate level) on the ACA.

I didnt need the class, but audited it, and sat in on the weekly 3 hour lecture and discussion, as well as several seminars, participated in papers, etc etc.

I only bring this up because part of his challenge to the class was to 'come up with a better plan' (other than a Single Payer i.e. Canadian/European model.  One of the groups (mine actually) suggested a means tested Medicare buy in (slimilar to the child health plus medicare program) where ANYONE could buy into the existing Federal Medicare system on a means tested basis, paying a sliding scale premium based on income from $0 to the prevailing rate for competitive coverage in the private market. We felt this met the goal of making healthcare available to EVERYONE, while preserving the private market, and allowing a Federal competitor to the marketplace would increase competition, lower prices and keep the system funded ultimately meeting all the objectives.

Here is a direct quote. "It wouldn't meet the objectives, because the chief objective of the ACA is to bankrupt the private healthcare system and drive up costs leaving only one option... A single payer Government controlled healthcare system in the next 20 years."

The ACA brought several necessary improvements, but ultimately it was designed to fail, and fail it is. The underlying issue in healthcare is that it is a 'for profit' enterprise. This drives research, advances, and innovation that improves the health of all. Take for example Proton Radiation therapy.  Revolutionary...... . But it will take the average Proton treatment center almost 100 years to pay for the facility..... Not realistic, so the overall cost of all associated healthcare provided by that system is higher.

Another challenge is the issue of Tort law suits.... When doctors have to stop paying $400K a year, and Hospitas 10's of millions in liability insurance, healthcare costs may go down.

The third challenge is somewhat related to the first two and that is pharmaceutical costs.

Without a doubt, healthcare is a huge issue, particularly in people over 70. Most people will consume in $$ more healthcare cost in the last 2-3 years of their life than in the prior 70-75. This creates huge issues.

Prior to my time in the Army, I used a healthcare sharing network called Christian Medishare, basically a coop and sharing program. Costs were contained because as a Coop there were strict lifestyle requirements you had to follow. HC is a huge emerging issue, and unfortunately, the way we have gone about fixing it has only made the problem worse, and the solutions have huge second and third order effects.