Normal throttle behavior?

[jkg70]

Hello! Relatively new rider with about 1600 miles on my 2013 V7. I recently noticed my throttle jumps from idle, about 1400-1450 rpms, to 2100-2200 rpms. I’ve reset the TPS and Autolearning. I’m running a beetle map but it behaved similarly with the latest stock map, just before I reinstalled the beetle. Is this normal or something I simply didn’t notice before? Thank you in advance for any insight!

[malik]

This is not normal. The target idle, set by the ECU, is 1370. Check the idle speed with Guzzidiag, the gauges are hardly accurate. The first thing I'd check are the throttle cables. Then the air filter (should be clean), and that there is no oil in the bottom of the airbox (from too much engine oil). Keep us informed.

[guzzisteve]

Does it only happen when cold or all the time?

[Huzo]

Does it run a stepper motor like the Norge etc..?

[jkg70]

Thank you for responses so far.

Huzo, I’m not sure if it has a stepper.

Guzzisteve, I believe it does it even when warm but because I rev it higher to take off, I don’t notice as easily. I’ll purposefully check report back. Might take a day or two.

Malik, you mean check the cables for binding? Would I do that at the handle bar? I ask because, more recently, I installed a catch can and, in that process, completely cleaned out the air box and the ‘sponges‘ used to condense the oil vapor. So the air box is completely dry now but the issue persists. Oil-in-the-airbox had been an issue since I’ve owned the bike, despite my efforts to lower the amount of oil in the sump. When I removed the throttle body, I cleaned it of all surface oil but it didn’t occur to me to spray anything through any of the ports. The cable connections at the TPS ‘wheel’ seemed clean/normal but I wouldn’t have known what to look for there. Thank you!

[jkg70]

I had another thought and maybe it’s related? I seem to remember the bike would idle a bit higher at cold startup but it doesn’t do that anymore. Is my memory failing me or could that be a clue?

[Kev m]

Hello! Relatively new rider with about 1600 miles on my 2013 V7. I recently noticed my throttle jumps from idle, about 1400-1450 rpms, to 2100-2200 rpms. I’ve reset the TPS and Autolearning. I’m running a beetle map but it behaved similarly with the latest stock map, just before I reinstalled the beetle. Is this normal or something I simply didn’t notice before? Thank you in advance for any insight!

Does it do this just during warmup or later during the ride after it if definitely warm already?

My 2013, I've had since new, will occasionally act funky on a cold start. Well actually it always sucks on a cold start, just sometimes more or less. Seems to depend on temperature and humidity. But at some times it's really bad hunting up and down the rpm range and stalling or bucking if I pull away before it warms up for a minute or two.

I've heard of others who develop problems from oil carryover into the throttle body from the breathers. It clogs the pressure sensor port and the stepper motor passages. So check the but clean only with compressed air or, a throttle body safe cleaner not the typical carb stuff.

Still others I've heard have either a corrupt ECM that needs to be replaced or at least have the map reloaded or reset.

Start with the simple first....

[jkg70]

Thanks, Kev, for sharing your experiences and for the additional insight as well. I definitely have a better idea of things to check next and will report back—I really appreciate everyone’s help!

[jkg70]

Following up on this. The rpm jump does happen when the bike is both cold and warm. As Malik suggested, I think it’s a cable issue; I remembered it started after replacing the swollen half-plastic fuel filter, so I must have damaged something when refitting the tank.

What was found: After opening the housing on the handlebar and rotating the throttle tube, it appeared one of the cables (the rearward one) was simply going slack in the housing and not moving with the cam. I adjusted and lubed both cable ends. That dropped the idle to normal but the rpm jump is still there. However it’s now possible to adjust the throttle and get it down to 1800 rpms. So, progress but still some work left. That rear cable’s adjuster is nearly out at its limit so I may need a new one.

Once I get this completely fixed I’ll report back but it may be a while. Just wanted to say ‘thanks’ to all for your suggestions. I’ve learned a LOT while lurking this site and am tickled that people, whose many posts I’ve read, responded to mine. :-)

[malik]

The cables, both pull & return, can be adjusted at both bottom and top. I think these cables roo, are stainless with a Teflon lining, and normally don't require lubrication. Sounds as if the return cable isn't returning properly (with a snap). Good luck. Hope you sort it.

[lucky phil]

Following up on this. The rpm jump does happen when the bike is both cold and warm. As Malik suggested, I think it’s a cable issue; I remembered it started after replacing the swollen half-plastic fuel filter, so I must have damaged something when refitting the tank.

What was found: After opening the housing on the handlebar and rotating the throttle tube, it appeared one of the cables (the rearward one) was simply going slack in the housing and not moving with the cam. I adjusted and lubed both cable ends. That dropped the idle to normal but the rpm jump is still there. However it’s now possible to adjust the throttle and get it down to 1800 rpms. So, progress but still some work left. That rear cable’s adjuster is nearly out at its limit so I may need a new one.

Once I get this completely fixed I’ll report back but it may be a while. Just wanted to say ‘thanks’ to all for your suggestions. I’ve learned a LOT while lurking this site and am tickled that people, whose many posts I’ve read, responded to mine. :-)

As someone that's spent a lifetime as a professional troubleshooter I'm always amazed at the fact that people ask for technical help and completely neglect highly critical information that should be relayed right at the beginning. Troubleshooting 101.....what was the last thing you did to the machine (if anything, including giving it a wash) immediately before the issue/s began?
I've seen 5 pages of forum troubleshooting assistance for a running issue and eventually the OP lets everybody know he's solved the problem by removing the power commander which in 5 pages no one knew he had because he never mentioned it.....Man oh man.

Ciao   

[jkg70]

Thanks for the additional info, Malik. I didn’t see a second set of adjusters but will look for them.

Lucky Phil, I get it. I simply didn’t remember what I had done nor think I would have realized cause/effect without others’ advice/input. Learning curve... Good to know you’re a professional troubleshooter, though. Engineering?

[lucky phil]

Thanks for the additional info, Malik. I didn’t see a second set of adjusters but will look for them.

Lucky Phil, I get it. I simply didn’t remember what I had done nor think I would have realized cause/effect without others’ advice/input. Learning curve... Good to know you’re a professional troubleshooter, though. Engineering?

Yep, engineering, commercial jets professionally and motorcycles and automotive as an interest.

Ciao

[Kev m]

I don't mean to throw a fly in the ointment but how exactly would replacing the fuel filter effect the throttle cables?!?

You shouldn't have to touch the one to do the other. 

[malik]

I don't mean to throw a fly in the ointment but how exactly would replacing the fuel filter effect the throttle cables?!?

You shouldn't have to touch the one to do the other. 

Normally I'd say it wouldn't. It depends what has been nudged on the way through - getting the tank off & back on can be a bit of a bear the first few times, but it could just be the usual - fix one thing & something else rears its head.

The adjusters at the top, along with their locknut (both 8mm) are behind the boot. Here's a photo of a new one.





Note that cables on the 1TB are still working well, without adjustment, at 120,000km, but those on the 2TB first needed adjustment at 68,000km and replacing at 134,000km after a broken strand affected operation. Unadjusted since then & now at 220,000km.