Bad gasoline

[Lefty]

Went for a ride yesterday here in SW Ohio. The country roads west of Dayton, OH are absolutely beautiful. On my way home I topped off the tank at the local BP. After a short distance the engine started running rough. Made it home, checked various things, ended up draining the tank and got new gas from Shell this time. Bike ran fine once new gas was used. Anyone else have experience with bad gasoline? I’m 56 and it is actually my first time with this issue.

[Lumpy Idle]

many years ago i lived in soquel, california, a sleepy little town nudged cozily up against santa cruz. my nearest local gas station was an indy. my yamaha virago started to run really poorly - coughing...missing. ..slow startups. i pulled the plugs, check the high voltage wires , checked the timing - nothing. finally (i should have done this first) i checked the fuel float bowl and it was crapped up with a dull orange sludge i pulled the tank, drained the fuel, cleaned the system and put it all back together. in addition i added a pair of clear fuel filters in series so that i could see if the fuel was crapped up.

2 weeks later the station was shut down and two months after that they yanked the tanks. nowadays the tanks are all made of some sort of composite so this problem is minimized but back in the day.....

ry

[aproud1]

No issues recently. Several years ago I filled up my VN750 at a Marathon and headed home. Halfway through my ride and at just about the worst spot possible my bike stalled and shut down completely. I was able to get it home and like you checked everything. Replaced the gas and never had that problem. 

My VN750 was very picky about gas. My V7 much less so. VN750, I pretty much used Shell or BP and never filled up if I saw a gas truck topping of their reservoirs. I use most gas in my V7 but still always follow the rule about avoiding stations with a gas truck in the lot.

I think bad gas is rare but definitely possible.

[dguzzi]

  I had a potentially very costly problem with my truck. It seems to have fixed itself. Gas is the only thing I can think of.
Back in 1972 was the last time I had a problem, I borrowed mower gas from a guy and it was mixed with water. Parking lot draining and filling my Honda, I was a grasshopper.

[JJ]

You might consider carrying two of these LUCAS products with you on a trip, and add "just ADD a shot glass" into each tank fill up.   






i s images


They work well for my 2014 Victory Vision...

However, they "might" have contributed to a leaky fuel petcock on my 1998 Centauro GT....Since I stopped using these on the Guzzi, there have been no issues. 

Previously, I went through two (2) manual fuel petcocks from MG Cycle, which I suspect was from over use of these additives (?).  They said the same thing, by the way...

Just another data point...

[Perazzimx14]

Those elixirs will not make bad gas good and it’s suspect that they do anything others than lighten your wallet. Never could figure how such a small amount of chemical (typically 1 ounce) will effectively treat 128 ounces of gasoline. Especially when these magic elicits are typically a blend of naphtha and/or kerosene with a little coloring added in for good measure.

[Kiwi_Roy]

I helped install a couple of 20,000 gallon underground tanks in NY for Methanol, I was talking to the delivery driver and he told me when they used straight gas any water would lay in the bottom of the tanks but when they started adding Ethanol it would pick up any water that had been laying there safely for years and cause all sorts of havoc.

[n3303j]

Far as I was told ethanol will attract and mix with any water in the fuel system allowing it to pass through the system and be burnt with the fuel.

It sort of killed the market for Christie Dry Gas.

I think they used to use an alcohol / water mix injected into some radial aircraft engines when operated at Take Off Power to cool the combustion chambers and prevent pre-ignition.

[JJ]

Of course, over the years, history has shown that this also has been known to cause a lot of "BAD GAS"

[wrbix]

NGC.                                                                                     Topped up my Audi A4 at a busy BP station one Memorial Day a few years back....began running poorly shortly thereafter, missing etc. Called the station: “yeah, we know - delivery truck put Diesel in the Premium tank....call this number”. BP paid for roll back tow, fuel system flush, etc. Traded the A4 shortly thereafter on a TTRS, so don’t know if there were any long term sequelae.

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

I helped install a couple of 20,000 gallon underground tanks in NY for Methanol, I was talking to the delivery driver and he told me when they used straight gas any water would lay in the bottom of the tanks but when they started adding Ethanol it would pick up any water that had been laying there safely for years and cause all sorts of havoc.

When we deliver gas it unloads at minimum of 400 gallons per minute. (Some tankers are faster. Gravity drop) If there is any water in the tank it gets mixed with whatever gas is delivered and takes a while to separate again. Ethanol free, E-10, doesn’t matter. Before we deliver we stick the tank with a long measuring stick to verify the fuel level. We also check for water before we deliver. We put a reactive white paste on the measuring stick that will turn pink/bright red if it comes into contact with water. If there is an inch or more we note it on our delivery paperwork and notify the station management. It’s up to them to remove the water. Bad stations don’t do anything about it.

It’s less about brand than it is maintenance. Gas pumps have a canister filter installed that filters the gas before it goes into your car or bike. Gas is filtered down to 10 microns. Diesel is filtered down to 30 microns. Good stations keep their filters changed and remove water whenever it shows up. Bad stations just let the water mix and only change their filters when the pumps are effected.

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

NGC.                                                                                     Topped up my Audi A4 at a busy BP station one Memorial Day a few years back....began running poorly shortly thereafter, missing etc. Called the station: “yeah, we know - delivery truck put Diesel in the Premium tank....call this number”. BP paid for roll back tow, fuel system flush, etc. Traded the A4 shortly thereafter on a TTRS, so don’t know if there were any long term sequelae.

Ouch! That happens all too often. It’s expensive and dangerous. Expensive because in addition to being liable for damages caused, the delivery company has to pump out all the entire tank, and replace the fuel on their dime. Tank pump outs are very dangerous. One person has to operate the pump and lines, and another has to stand on top of the tank with the hatch open and measure the fuel as it rises. Vapors pour out of the open hatch. No cell phones, electronics allowed. And both people have to wear a fire suit, not that it’ll help all that much if anything goes pear shaped! That’s why we have high turnover in the industry. It requires attention to detail, and the ability to follow procedures by the book to prevent mixes. Too many drivers don’t do either.
Glad your car got fixed up.

[John A]

Here is Lightning talking about bad gasoline
https://youtu.be/o3SXKLas-ko

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

Here is Lightning talking about bad gasoline
https://youtu.be/o3SXKLas-ko

That was excellent 

[Lumpy Idle]

When we deliver gas ....If there is any water in the tank it gets mixed with whatever gas is delivered and takes a while to separate again. ... We also check for water before we deliver. We put a reactive white paste on the measuring stick that will turn pink/bright red if it comes into contact with water. If there is an inch or more we note it on our delivery paperwork and notify the station management......

It’s less about brand than it is maintenance....

FASCINATING! so that's how it works! thanks georgia. yuh see that's why i love this list. there is such a diversity of experience that if you throw something out there someone here is going to know something interesting about it...well, ok...most of the time.

[Lumpy Idle]

That was excellent 

yeah! made my day!

[Texas Turnip]

I delivered gasoline for a major oil company for 23 years so I will report how we did it. We stuck all three tanks and checked for water even if we were only delivering one flavor. We reported even a trace! If there was more than 1/2" of water we tagged the pumps and the dealer was not supposed to sell for 1/2 an hour as water settles to the bottom. When the oil companies had their own drivers the quality of the driver was unsurpassed. It is cheaper to use any bootleg outfit to haul your gas and most drivers probably don't know what water gauging paste is.

Many years ago it was discovered a driver put a tank of gas in the airplane fuel storage and the plane was in the AIR. Quickly or asap the plane was returned to the airport without a problem, but could have been.

I don't know about now, but back when I was driving I could make more money hauling chickens from Mississippi to Idaho than I could hauling gas.

I'd work like crazy then take some time off to ride my Guzzi. Of course, now I have some friends that brag about t
their 401K, stocks and bonds, real estate holdings blah, blah and I talk about my trips on my Guzzi.

You should die broke and I might only have a few weeks left.
Tex

[Lumpy Idle]

hey georgia and turnip -

maybe you can clear something up for me.

i was told on a few occasions that it doesn't do any good to have an allegiance to one companies' gas or another because the oil companies make deals with each other to fill the tanks of their opponents in areas where it is more convenient for the gas station to get their gas from one supplier rather than another. then they reciprocate in the opposing oil companies' area.
is this true cuz it just doesn't sound right to me?

[Texas Turnip]

Lumpy,,     Yes, I've loaded at Texaco and went directly to Shell and Exxon to Shell and Fina to Shell etc. But you will get those that say they will only use brand so and so. I'm not the person that likes to argue so I let it go.

Tex

[oldbike54]

 Gasoline , oil , tires , and countersteering 

 Dusty

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

Lumpy,,     Yes, I've loaded at Texaco and went directly to Shell and Exxon to Shell and Fina to Shell etc. But you will get those that say they will only use brand so and so. I'm not the person that likes to argue so I let it go.

Tex

Yes. Mostly true in my experience. There are not too many “branded” suppliers anymore. Texaco/Chevron and Citgo are the only ones in the Metro Atlanta area. I’m not carded there yet. Motiva and Magellan supply Shell in this area. Kinder Morgan supply’s BP and Exxon Mobile. The main difference is additives. Motiva and Magellan both add Shell additives to the “base” gas. Ditto Kinder Morgan. They add BP Invigorate to their base gas. Sometimes the line for adding a specific additive goes down and we cannot load gas for “branded” stations from that loading lane. We do not load generic unbranded gas for branded stations. We’ll just go to another supplier that has the additive. Stations like QT, Racetrac, Speedway, Kroger, Murphy, Costco, etc all do exactly like you describe. They negotiate with suppliers for their fuel. Most use non branded additives. Some stations get name brand gas with branded additives. I can’t say which because of NDAs and they are serious about it. It’s kinda the difference between generic and name brand drugs.

As far as brands go, it’s like Tex said. What matters most is stations maintenance and sales. And when I say maintenance I’m not talking about looking pretty and shiny. I mean when I open the lid to their fuel drop do they keep it clean or is it full of water and nastiness? Do I smell stale gas when I open the vapor recovery and fuel drop? Do I routinely find a little or a lot of water with the water paste? Those stations I don’t buy from no matter the price or brand. But stations that keep stuff clean and stay on top of issues and maintenance, their gas is good no matter the brand.

And busy stations rarely have problems with water. Selling 600-1000 gallons an hour (sometimes more!) means they are keeping their gas fresh. Most stations have a single 20k regular tank, (Big QTs have two 20k, they do that much volume!) so they get deliveries at least once a day. Some need two deliveries a day. So when I’m traveling I try to fill up at big busy stations. Just playing the odds. Around here locally I know which stations have good gas and that’s where I fill. Kinda like when I worked for Pepsi I learned real fast where to eat and where to avoid! Some kitchens are just nasty!!! At high class places too. Real eye opener.

Hope that answer is not too confusing.

[aproud1]

Many years ago it was discovered a driver put a tank of gas in the airplane fuel storage and the plane was in the AIR. Quickly or asap the plane was returned to the airport without a problem, but could have been.



You should die broke and I might only have a few weeks left.
Tex

When I was in the air force a new crew chief serviced several F-15's with motor oil for our trucks. We found out when they were in the air. All came back fine but scary and a very bad day for someone. Pretty tight tolerances in those birds.


I don't any way I could die anything but broke! I don't play the lotto and I'm told you have to play to win.