"Spendy" vintage Ducati...

[JJ]

Already at $10,000....6 days left...and this one has a *** RESERVE!! ***

[fotoguzzi]

That engine is beautiful!

[JJ]

That engine is beautiful!

Yes...and the entire BIKE is beautiful...and one will have to PAY to be a official member of the vintage Ducati Club!!

[jpv7]

My friend has the same bike.  Original paint (although faded), orange and black, on his.  Electronic ignition.  His older brother bought the bike new and sold it to him in the 1980s.  Boy does it get attention when we are out for a ride!

[JJ]

Now at $12,000...with 5 days still to GO!

Wonder if it will his its *** RESERVE?!? *** 

[jbell]

Now at $12,000...with 5 days still to GO!

Wonder if it will his its *** RESERVE?!? *** 

It should go for about double that, if not more.  Me? I waited a year and bought the more modern 860GT which is worth about 1/3 (or less) than the '73 & 74's.  I pick stocks with the same astuteness for any of you contrarians out there.

[Tusayan]

Bevel Ducatis haven’t been reaching reserve on BaT.

[JJ]

It should go for about double that, if not more.  Me? I waited a year and bought the more modern 860GT which is worth about 1/3 (or less) than the '73 & 74's.  I pick stocks with the same astuteness for any of you contrarians out there.

Now up to $15,000...with 5 days to GO!  (As my late mother used to always say......

"We'll see....") 

[jpv7]

My friend has the same bike.  Original paint (although faded), orange and black, on his.  Electronic ignition.  His older brother bought the bike new and sold it to him in the 1980s.  Boy does it get attention when we are out for a ride!

[huub]

Bevel Ducatis haven’t been reaching reserve on BaT.

possibly  a demographic thing,  vintage MV agusta's do the same.
may be the generation that originally loved these bikes is slowly shifting their interest to different things
( read , getting too old for bikes. )
classic MV fours dropped from 100.000 to 65.000 in a year time.

[jas67]

Beautiful bike!

It might be a '73 that got titled in '74.
Here is an ad from 1973 with the exact same paint, and the same fork.


'74 had a different fork. See below:

Earlier fork, '72, early '73:


Late '73, and '74 fork:

[cliffrod]

Beautiful bike!

It might be a '73 that got titled in '74.
Here is an ad from 1973 with the exact same paint, and the same fork.


'74 had a different fork. See below:

Earlier fork, '72, early '73:


Late '73, and '74 fork:

Same opinion here.  Based upon the leading axle lowers on forks, it looks earlier to me, not a 74.  Nearly 50 yrs offers lot of time to juggle parts.

One of the most consistent things about early Ducatis is the inconsistency of the titled year vs the actual year model.  Singles are even more prone to this issue than twins.   hard parts are difficult to refute but it's not worth debating. 

[JoeW]

I've turned down an offer of $20,000.00 for this one...







toss up dice game

[Tusayan]

The paint scheme is one applied to the earliest fiberglass tank bikes, bikes which also typically had Amal carbs as in the advert showing the same paint scheme. This bike has a steel tank and metal tank badges so the paint scheme is not original to that tank.  The forks and unpainted fenders are those of an early-ish bike, but it has Dellortos.  My guess given the forks would be it’s a ‘73 with a back dated paint job and fenders (like others have guessed) or possibly a ‘72 updated with a metal tank and Dellortos.  It’s a nice motorcycle anyway.

[lucky phil]

Same opinion here.  Based upon the leading axle lowers on forks, it looks earlier to me, not a 74.  Nearly 50 yrs offers lot of time to juggle parts.

One of the most consistent things about early Ducatis is the inconsistency of the titled year vs the actual year model.  Singles are even more prone to this issue than twins.   hard parts are difficult to refute but it's not worth debating.

I owned one of the earliest GT's made. Last three engine number digits were 838 so in the first 1000 made. The sale bike has the earlier forks and the later kick start lever. Earlier bikes like mine had a lever that was a more right angle shape so a short straight section from the shaft then a more acute bend to the nearly vertical. Later arms were more a true banana shape. You can see the difference in these two images.

Ciao

[Canuck750]

My 2 cents is that’s a $27000 bike.

[Jim Rich]

So if standing in the shower tearing up $100 bills gives the same sensation as yacht ownership, standing in the wind tearing up $100 bills is like having a vintage Ducati?

[lucky phil]

So if standing in the shower tearing up $100 bills gives the same sensation as yacht ownership, standing in the wind tearing up $100 bills is like having a vintage Ducati?

Pretty much. I've owned an old 750 GT and a 74 750 Sport, lovely old things of their time but I don't miss them. I see them on the road from time to time and look at the skinny tyres and laugh about how that was me about 35 years ago. When parts supply and expense get to what they are now for old bevel engines and every knuckle dragger around has had 40 years of butchering and bodging them you need to step back and take a reality check. Shiny paint and chrome is no guarantee of a sound bike of this age and neither is receipts from supposed "experts" that have rebuilt them.
I enjoy them for what they are and were but wouldn't pay to own one now.

Ciao     

[jas67]

JoeW -- I noticed that your bike:


and mine, have the fork tubes turned 180 degrees from each other.


My bike was an amateur restoration (I bought it this way).   Thankfully, the motor was done by Syd's Cycles.    Everything else was done by the (late) previous owner.

Digging around the interwebs, I'm seeing examples of both.   Which is correct?

[jas67]

Looking carefully at JoeW's bike (which is BEAUTIFUL!) and at mine, it is evident that the brakes and forks are different from each other, and, both different from the early leading-axle type, so, there are (at least) THREE different forks that appear on the 750GT.

[LesP]

The bike in question is a mid 1973 model based on the dash, Amal carburettor's and INOX mudguards.
They went to 30 mm Dellorto's in the mid after, later part of the year.

The 1973 was the best year for the GT as they got budget parts for 1974, tin pot rims, steel guards and 5 light dash etc etc.
That bike is shiny but who knows what is done on the inside, you would want an upgraded rod kit at the least if paying silly money.
They are not a bike to buy and find out it was simply shiny on the outside.

It reminds me again, glad I kept the 73 GT bought in the 1990's for what is now peanuts.
They are still a very usable bike and more so if you can do any engine work yourself.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-ducati-750-sport-2/

[cliffrod]

I owned one of the earliest GT's made. Last three engine number digits were 838 so in the first 1000 made. The sale bike has the earlier forks and the later kick start lever. Earlier bikes like mine had a lever that was a more right angle shape so a short straight section from the shaft then a more acute bend to the nearly vertical. Later arms were more a true banana shape. You can see the difference in these two images.

Ciao

I've had dozens of singles but never owned a bevel twin.  I almost bought several, including my best friend's early GT (that he bought new) in 2000 but sadly didn't. He raced bevel twins and among a few friends there's been many (like 2 dozen)  of them either owned or through the shop.  He has worked to school me on the finer details, including the Kickstarter lever.  the parts stash of 750 Roundcase parts that was upstairs for many years at the shop would now be worth high 5 to 6 figures$$.  The last 2-3 sets of bare cases with some additional parts went to Germany about 12 yrs ago for $500, which seemed like a good price at the time.  The last Roundcase frame and original seat left about a year ago in a pile of other random stuff. Now we need that frame back to fix Jay's GT, so have been making some phone calls...

Hard to imagine, but the local Ducati dealer Bill Epley was heavily cajoled before agreeing to participate in a minimum order for 5 or 6 green frame 750SS when new because he had little cofidence that they could be sold without losing money.  The bikes came via the distributor in Kingsport TN.  We honored Bill as Grand Marshall of our last bike rally  (2019, before -) and he told me the details for an article about his decades-long contribution to local motorcycle scene as a dealer,,shop and racing team owner/sponsor.  Iirc, he received 3 750SS bikes to sell. 

One of those SS bikes was purchase new by the same man who bought my V7 Sport new from Bill in 73 here in. Soartanburg.   It's still around and can be purchased, but needless to say I don't have the spare funds to buy it right now.....

[Tusayan]

LesP, thanks for correction on the Amal carbs on the BaT bike, I wasn’t able to see them on my phone. Also on early ‘73 bikes having stainless fenders as I thought they ended with the ‘72 model year.  Some things to remember.

Nowadays with improved Amals being available that don’t wear out in five minutes, they are a more attractive carb than they once were.

It appears to me to be a ‘73 with the paint scheme of an early fiberglass tank bike. 

I doubt I’ll sell my bevel SS ever, before I can’t ride any motorcycle.  I’m the second owner of mine, bought from family friends with all records from new, and that has the advantage that you don’t have to guess on any part of the bikes spec.

[lucky phil]

JoeW -- I noticed that your bike:


and mine, have the fork tubes turned 180 degrees from each other.


My bike was an amateur restoration (I bought it this way).   Thankfully, the motor was done by Syd's Cycles.    Everything else was done by the (late) previous owner.

Digging around the interwebs, I'm seeing examples of both.   Which is correct?

Ones got Scarab brakes and ones got Brembos. Brembos are later. Scarab brakes were shite and seals were hard to get even 30 years ago. My GT had Scabbies. Most upgraded to Lockheed. My early bike also had Amal carbs and a decent amount of Araldite in the cranckcases from the factory filling in the area of porosity. Typical of Ducati in the day. Seriously if I were buying a second hand bevel Ducati these days and I was wanting a first class engine and not some 3/4 worn out rebuilt unit I'd be budgeting on spending around $12-15,000 dollars in engine parts. I'd hate to front up the labour costs on top.

Ciao

[Tusayan]

Seriously if I were buying a second hand bevel Ducati these days and I was wanting a first class engine and not some 3/4 worn out rebuilt unit I'd be budgeting on spending around $12-15,000 dollars in engine parts. I'd hate to front up the labour costs on top.

Many that you’d find in the US are relatively low mileage bikes/engines that have never had their cases split, so while they might be worn to some degree, they likely haven’t been previously overhauled.  My SS would be one example.  I overhauled my higher mileage Darmah engine myself and it wasn’t particularly expensive, except perhaps for the con rod kit (about $1000 today or a little more from Carrillo)  I can’t remember what I did with the heads, maybe just new guides, and a valve job with existing valves. Pistons were not hugely expensive from what I recall and the cylinders were bored accurately by a local guy.

[JJ]

Subtle differences and $$ PRICE $$ aside...BOTH of these Ducati's are "stunners!"

[lucky phil]

Many that you’d find in the US are relatively low mileage bikes/engines that have never had their cases split, so while they might be worn to some degree, they likely haven’t been previously overhauled.  My SS would be one example.  I overhauled my higher mileage Darmah engine myself and it wasn’t particularly expensive, except perhaps for the con rod kit (about $1000 today or a little more from Carrillo)  I can’t remember what I did with the heads, maybe just new guides, and a valve job with existing valves. Pistons were not hugely expensive from what I recall and the cylinders were bored accurately by a local guy.

Ok, How long ago did you do your engine? I remember here 25 years ago a brand new big end set (rods, pin, bearings) was like $1600au and a new repro gearbox was $3500. Ducati pre 90's gearboxes are pretty much done in 50-60000klm from my experience. Sure people refit them even when you can see the pitting on the gear faces but I wouldn't be up for that. So gearbox and big end 25 years ago here was $5000 or so and we haven't even got to valves, guides, piston, rings, re bore,  rockers, cams, bevel gears, boring, and machine work. What's changed? are repro parts for them cheap now?
My Daytona engine rebuild owes me around $8500 in parts alone and I'd been collecting them for 10 years when they were still available and semi realistically priced. That's affectively a brand new engine rebuild with all labour done by me except the cylinder plating and sizing. If you add professional man hour charges to that and update to todays parts prices (if you can get them) its a rather costly exercise for the average person that cant do their own rebuild.
I'd be gobsmacked if my original estimate was way off for a Ducati bevel engine these days. The engine being unmolested by previous owners/mechanics would be an advantage though. I was asked by an acquaintance rebuilding a Green Frame engine for some advice on condition of parts and the first thing I told him was the gearbox was totally stuffed. Every gear had pitting and flaking on the drive faces, didn't even bother looking at the drive and backlash dogs. The shock to him was he had traded other stuff to get this "good" replacement gearbox in the first place. he wasn't happy but I bet that gearbox went in there anyway. 
Personally I think if you want a classic Ducati thats going to eventually appreciate and you have the sort of money they want for an old GT, Sport or SS go and by a modern classic like a 1098R. Sand cast cases, Ti rods,Ohlins suspension, carbon bits. A far superior piece of engineering and motorcycle, will appreciate into a future classic and if you have any cash left over from the purchase you can still buy parts at a reasonable cost so grab some spares.
Ten years ago I advised a friend that imported a 78 900SS from the states for silly money to instead go for a Guzzi Mk1 Le Mans as a way cheaper option for a future classic that was affordable now and still good parts availability. He went for the SS with the gearbox that jumped out of gears and the pleasure of an additional bill for thousands in parts. Missed the boat a bit on the Le Mans now though.     


Ciao   

[Tusayan]

A rod kit might be a little less expensive in the US but this is was an easy link to find.

https://www.ducati-kaemna.com/catalog/ducati-classics/crankshaft-connection-rod-ducati-classic/carrillo-pleuelsatz-20mm-900-koenigswelle.html

I’d budget about $2500 USD for parts for a routine bevel Ducati engine overhaul, with a few unexpected odds and ends needing replacement as well as the expected, but not a blowup or replacing every part in the engine and gearbox.  Most of the bikes here have 15-20K miles on them, give or take, they are not hammered to death.

I have both an early LM and the SS, they’re both good bikes but the weight of the LM is an issue.  It has however been an issue for 100,000 miles on the original engine and clutch etc.  It’s a durable device.

[lucky phil]

A rod kit might be a little less expensive in the US but this is was an easy link to find.

https://www.ducati-kaemna.com/catalog/ducati-classics/crankshaft-connection-rod-ducati-classic/carrillo-pleuelsatz-20mm-900-koenigswelle.html

I’d budget about $2500 USD for parts for a routine bevel Ducati engine overhaul, with a few unexpected odds and ends needing replacement as well as the expected, but not a blowup or replacing every part in the engine and gearbox.  Most of the bikes here have 15-20K miles on them, give or take, they are not hammered to death.

I have both an early LM and the SS, they’re both good bikes but the weight of the LM is an issue.  It has however been an issue for 100,000 miles on the original engine and clutch etc.  It’s a durable device.

From the link you posted a new set of Carrillo rods pin bearings press apart and fit and balance is 1385 euros (didn't see a price for the std config rods but you could probably deduct the 200 euros difference) plus a set of new pistons and rings comes to just short of 2100 euros, or 2400usd. That's just a big end set and pistons and rings. Personally I can't see how your parts budget works out.

Ciao

 

[Tusayan]

The Carrillo kit itself is €849.14 before tax.  Pistons are $639 USD for two.