V7 850 Follow-up ... 2 Questions have come up

[SLDMRossi]

1. Why detuned? Because the engine's been taken out of the V85 and placed into the lesser V7 platform. So single front disc brake, etc.

2. What's the price? Not included in official announcement (see below)...

Full photo package, here:

https://we.tl/t-jayjk3U3nM


NEW MOTO GUZZI V7

AFTER YEARS OF SUCCESS, A NEW V7 IS BORN

THE NEW, HIGH-PERFORMANCE, 850CC, 65 HP ENGINE MAKES ITS DEBUT

2021 V7 IS FASTER, MORE COMFORTABLE, BETTER EQUIPPED AND REFINED, MAINTAINING ALL THE CHARACTER AND AUTHENTICITY THAT EVERY MOTO GUZZI BOASTS


More than fifty years after the launch of its first unit, Moto Guzzi is proud to present a new and important evolution in the history of the V7, a prominent symbol of Italian motorbikes around the world.

The revamping is so profound that the progressive numbering in Roman numerals, which had characterized the various evolutions of the model since its return to the market in 2007, is gone. But the character and authenticity remain intact, as these values are destined to last over time and embedded in the genetic code of every Moto Guzzi.

Two versions are available: the patriarch, V7 Stone, with its strong and minimalistic style, is joined by the V7 Special, with its classic and elegant lines.

A new Moto Guzzi engine makes its début on the new V7, a close derivative of the one that powers the V85 TT. This is the most recent and modern drive built in Mandello, which guarantees better performance and overall greater efficiency in order to provide maximum riding pleasure, fun and reliability.

It has 25% more maximum power, going from the previous 52 hp at 6,200 rpm to the current 65 hp at 6,800 rpm. Maximum torque has also increased significantly, going from 60 Nm at 4250 rpm to the outstanding value of 73 Nm at 5,000 rpm, with more than 80% of the torque already available at 3,000 rpm.

Compared to the previous version, the new addition from Mandello is generally more complete in terms of equipment and demonstrates superior maturity, also evident in the aesthetic impact of the larger engine, which stands out for its generously sized exhaust pipes in a different layout; the view from the rear highlights the larger cardan final drive and the wider rear wheel, as well as the more robust pair of Kayaba shock absorbers.

The stylish side panels are new, as is the shorter rear mudguard, elements which, along with the new exhaust system, give the new 'eight and a half' a revamped and more seductive look.

Many new features have been introduced to improve stability and comfort, leaving the proverbial handling of the Moto Guzzi best-seller unaltered.

The frame has been evolved with the addition of steel elements in the headstock area, whereas the new pair of shock absorbers with greater travel and the new, two-tier saddle ensure greater comfort. With this same goal in mind, brand new rider foot peg supports are used.
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone has the new, full LED light system with the headlight that includes a DRL in the shape of the Moto Guzzi Eagle, whereas the new instrument cluster is perfectly in line with the look of a minimalist motorcycle, entirely digital on a single, circular dial. The aluminum wheels, in the sporty style that equips the Stone, are also new; the rear rim is shod with a wider 150/70 tire.

V7 Special maintains the elegant, dual dial analogue instrument cluster (speedometer and rev counter) and the ultra-classic spoked wheels.

V7 Stone is available in three satin-finish color schemes: Nero Ruvido, Azzurro Ghiaccio and Arancione Rame. The color variants of the V7 Special, the version closes to the classic and elegant spirit of the original model, are Blu Formale and Grigio Casual.


Steven Rossi

 

[Kev m]

My GUESS is it was detuned not for emissions but for position in the market.

The V85 is currently (and I am betting will remain) more expensive than the V7 (since that's their "entry" level bike, especially in Stone trim. So it's just plain and simple marketing 101 to not give the V7 as much power if it costs less.

I don't think they are going to raise the price of the V7 significantly because it's priced to the market and has pressures to face in terms of what Triumph and other brands are selling for at that point.

But it's my guess and I could be wrong.

[Wildroamer]

I'll be very surprised if there is more than a slight bump in MSRP with RE having such a strong impact on this segment. At least here in the States.

[SLDMRossi]

One could assume it will slot in where the V9 was ... $9,990. But unlike the Roamer, I wouldn't expect to see any discounting. Particularly with that 100th Anniversary graphic on the front fender!

SR

[Dogwalker]

They squeezed 77-78ps at the cranckshaft out of the 85tt, enough to write "80" in the datasheet, because otherwise they would not have sold te bike in that segment, but at at the expense of the low RPM torque.
In the V7 850 they'll aim more to a good delivery of power at any range (and that probably requires at least a different camshaft). It's an entry level after all. It has to be easy to drive.
It has to be said that the announced max power is even too detuned for that. 70ps would have probably been a better compromise.

[Kev m]

I don't know if they will continue to produce the V9 line.

[TimmyTheHog]

One could assume it will slot in where the V9 was ... $9,990. But unlike the Roamer, I wouldn't expect to see any discounting. Particularly with that 100th Anniversary graphic on the front fender!

SR

Found this in RiderMag

"The 2021 Moto Guzzi V7 Stone has an MSRP of $8,990 and is available in three colors: Nero Ruvido, Azzurro Ghiaccio and Arancione Rame. The classic feel of the 2021 Moto Guzzi V7 Special comes at a $500 premium, with an MSRP of $9,499 and features two colors: Blu Formale and Grigio Casual. Both models are expected to arrive in North American dealerships in March 2021."

https://ridermagazine.com/2020/12/14/2021-moto-guzzi-v7-special-and-stone-announced/

[SLDMRossi]

Isn't it funny that folks like RIDER aren't mentioning that these are 100th Anniversary editions? Despite that fact that there's a celebratory graphic on the front fender...

SR

[twowheeladdict]

Isn't it funny that folks like RIDER aren't mentioning that these are 100th Anniversary editions? Despite that fact that there's a celebratory graphic on the front fender...

SR

Mmm.  They just going to stick a sticker on every 2021 bike and call it an anniversary bike?  Sorry, but that is kinda lame.  Come on Moto Guzzi, give us a truly special anniversary bike. 

[Huzo]

Mmm.  They just going to stick a sticker on every 2021 bike and call it an anniversary bike?  Sorry, but that is kinda lame.  Come on Moto Guzzi, give us a truly special anniversary bike.

Yep.
Upside down forks and twin front discs option.
Gloss red.
Less black everywhere, it looks drab.
No digital clocks.

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

The V85 is currently (and I am betting will remain) more expensive than the V7 (since that's their "entry" level bike, especially in Stone trim. So it's just plain and simple marketing 101 to not give the V7 as much power if it costs less.

This! Similar to how for the longest time you couldn’t get a Camaro that was more powerful than a Vette. Trim levels being equal.

[egschade]

I don't know if they will continue to produce the V9 line.

Guzzi could keep it as their small cruiser line but given the sales numbers it's probably not going to last much longer. There are still 2017 leftovers for sale at several dealers. Too bad really as the Bobber - especially in Sport trim - is a decent bike.

[Vagrant]

More importantly what about the V twin thump!! The V7 has some but none in the V85 engine. I hope they didn't make a boring Honda out of the V7!

[LowRyter]

I doubt that the 850 V7 has any less power than the other versions.  I'd think they're the same mechanically.  Perhaps a different ECU tune.  None of the new 850 Guzzis are going to scotch the pavement.

[Wildroamer]

More importantly what about the V twin thump!! The V7 has some but none in the V85 engine. I hope they didn't make a boring Honda out of the V7!

Interesting! I didn't know that about the V85. That would be a shame, although for the new owner likely worth the trade-off in powah!

As for me and the new V7III I bought last year, zero regrets. I'll own a second bike some day to scratch the next itch. I wouldn't want any more out of the 750, and love the cheap insurance!

[Turin]

I can see them making a parts bin full power version for next year. 

[Dirk_S]

More importantly what about the V twin thump!! The V7 has some but none in the V85 engine. I hope they didn't make a boring Honda out of the V7!

That was the biggest criticism I gave to the salesman when I test rode the V85TT—“I mean, it SOUNDS like a Guzzi, but it doesn’t FEEL like one :( “

[bad Chad]

Haven't ridden a v85, but the v9 has the stuff!

[kingoffleece]

Feel is more important than bench race numbers 10 out of 10 times.
It's beyond amusing that the "best" bikes have so much power that they need all sorts of controlling electronic aids to ride them.

[reidy]

Here is my opinion on the question about why detuned.

A few years ago Triumph bought out a new engine for the Bonneville. Each year the bike has been getting changed a little bit here and there. I saw an add the other day that the 2021 model will have the engine retuned for more power. I don't think the engineers have just worked out how to get the extra few kilowatts that have been in hiding.

So the cynic in me feels that they will advertise the engine has been detuned for some marketing reason. In a couple of years they will bring out a new model with the full power. Maybe a few years latter they will find a few extra kilowatts that they forgot to mention.

In short it is all about marketing, next years model has to be better, some will buy this because of the 100 years or the first of this type. Some will by the improved 2022 with duel helmet locks and auto heated grips, than in 2023 we get the full power.

Steve

[kingoffleece]

+1

[s1120]

Here is my opinion on the question about why detuned.

A few years ago Triumph bought out a new engine for the Bonneville. Each year the bike has been getting changed a little bit here and there. I saw an add the other day that the 2021 model will have the engine retuned for more power. I don't think the engineers have just worked out how to get the extra few kilowatts that have been in hiding.

So the cynic in me feels that they will advertise the engine has been detuned for some marketing reason. In a couple of years they will bring out a new model with the full power. Maybe a few years latter they will find a few extra kilowatts that they forgot to mention.

In short it is all about marketing, next years model has to be better, some will buy this because of the 100 years or the first of this type. Some will by the improved 2022 with duel helmet locks and auto heated grips, than in 2023 we get the full power.

Steve

I semi agree..  I dont think its just under rated.. But I do feel they didnt feel too bad about retuning it, and getting less then the v85..  I mean, when and if they bring out a more sporting one, the extra power has to come from somewhere... 

[Roebling3]

Guzzi always goes their own way, - often stepping on their on toes or missing an opportunity. The general motorcycling public is left to puzzle, if they care at all. Owners and fanatics turn our same old frustrations into another oil thread.   R3~

[Guzikid]

  Where's "Dave Richardson" when you need him.....???  The Kid

[ohiorider]

That was the biggest criticism I gave to the salesman when I test rode the V85TT—“I mean, it SOUNDS like a Guzzi, but it doesn’t FEEL like one :( “

Kind of how I've felt the 3-4 times I've ridden small block Guzzis.  Just doesn't make me want to break out the checkbook.

Bob

[Vagrant]

Adding 5 pounds to the flywheel might be the way to detune it and give it some thump.

[twowheeladdict]

I doubt that the 850 V7 has any less power than the other versions.  I'd think they're the same mechanically.  Perhaps a different ECU tune.  None of the new 850 Guzzis are going to scotch the pavement.

I am reading hope in this post.    If that is true, then Beetle will be able to unleash the power.   

Based on my enthusiasm for all motorcycles and following all brands as they come up with new models, I believe they went with a different Cam to provide the power where more V7 riders would use it which is on surface roads instead of off road, or interstates.  Because the changed the cam the torque tapers off sooner and since HP = torque x RPMs the peak HP is lower. 

For riders using this bike the way it was designed it will probably feel more seat of the pants pull than the V85TT configuration.   

[Cam3512]

Kind of how I've felt the 3-4 times I've ridden small block Guzzis.  Just doesn't make me want to break out the checkbook.

Bob

His comment was specific to the higher revving new engine in the V85TT, not all V7’s.

[Kev m]

I am reading hope in this post.    If that is true, then Beetle will be able to unleash the power.   

Based on my enthusiasm for all motorcycles and following all brands as they come up with new models, I believe they went with a different Cam to provide the power where more V7 riders would use it which is on surface roads instead of off road, or interstates.  Because the changed the cam the torque tapers off sooner and since HP = torque x RPMs the peak HP is lower. 

For riders using this bike the way it was designed it will probably feel more seat of the pants pull than the V85TT configuration.

Pete was speculating that the difference MIGHT just be ECU/Throttle Body - because the V85 uses the 7SM and a LARGER BORE THROTTLE BODY, while the V7 line uses the MUIG with a smaller bore throttle body.

Sadly that throttle bore might be the limiting factor then.

And the photos seem to show throttle cables which suggests they are not using the 7SM ECU and separate RBW throttle body.

[LowRyter]

Do you really think the V7 850 has less power than the TT? 

Or are both models detuned to meet Euro 5?