The rarest of bikes for sure

[Ncdan]

I’ve been a fan of the Honda motorcycle brand for decades but have never ran across one of these in person or picture until now. Someone posted this 1986 Honda 750 XLV R750 on the antique Honda forum I’m on.  It’s a V twin, twin spark 750cc Adventure Bike. It’s so rare because it never made it to the UK or the US. Even by today’s standards this looks to me like a great adventure duel sport motorcycle. I intend to do a little more research as I simply can’t see why this bike would not still be popular in today’s motorcycle world.

[JJ]

I am sure that would be a BLAST to own and ride!!!

[guzzisteve]

Looks similar to the RS750 they were making for Flat Track at the time and took the title away from HD.

[oldbike54]

 For several reasons , that market is controlled by European brands , Honda and Yamaha have built some fine twin  cylinder motorbikes in the larger dual sport class , and met with some success , but when most hard core RTW types spend their money it is on a BMW and more recently KTM . 

 Dusty

[oldbike54]

Looks similar to the RS750 they were making for Flat Track at the time and took the title away from HD.

 There is a story , probably made up , that Gene Romero saw that bike at American Honda in California and told Honda that the engine would make a good dirt track motor . Burrito did jokingly tell the tale to Dave Despain , problem is , the race motor was already being developed . There were a pair of the OHC heads at Bill Blake's shop here , HRC sent then so Blake could design port shapes on his flow bench as he had for so many race motors , and somehow he still had an unmolested pair of the 4 valve heads . Last I knew they were sitting in a small race shop West of here .

 Dusty

[Ncdan]

Just did a little more research.
Like many other great Honda models this one was short lived. It was introduced in 1983 and the last ones were made three short years later in 1986.
Here’s a little of its history. Tap on to enlarge the photo to read.

[Bulldog9]

I used to love the old Honda Enduro bikes. Would draw pics all the time.

[BrotherJim]

Back in the late 80's, I was in love with the XL600V Transalp.  A no money high school kid about to transition to a no money college kid, I couldn't afford one.  It certainly doesn't look as off-road capable as this XLV R750.  Pretty cool!



 

[hauto]

Guy had two for sale at the last VMD,so I guess they are around to be had

[Ncdan]

Guy had two for sale at the last VMD,so I guess they are around to be had

I found one in Hungry and one in Germany. A couple listed in the states listed from one to  two years ago. I could not find a recent listing.

[cliffrod]

Looks similar to the RS750 they were making for Flat Track at the time and took the title away from HD.

There is a story , probably made up , that Gene Romero saw that bike at American Honda in California and told Honda that the engine would make a good dirt track motor . Burrito did jokingly tell the tale to Dave Despain , problem is , the race motor was already being developed . There were a pair of the OHC heads at Bill Blake's shop here , HRC sent then so Blake could design port shapes on his flow bench as he had for so many race motors , and somehow he still had an unmolested pair of the 4 valve heads . Last I knew they were sitting in a small race shop West of here .

 Dusty

My often-mentioned best friend was involved with RS750 flat track program with HRC during his racing/tuning days.   so I just asked him.   His brief version-

Gene was manager. muzzy was over all of them.  Gene took his xr750 heads to Japan at one point and commented that if they figured out how to put flywheels in that engine, they would beat HD.  And when they did, that's what happened.  He also said Blake (if he's the one he's thinking about, but thought his shop was in San Mateo then) was really good but was really expensive. 

The RS750 engine was based upon regular Honda Shadow cases that were reinforced and modified.  He still has a set of them on the shelf at the shop.  The perennial ashtray at the shop for the past 30+ yrs is a souvenir original RS750 piston.  We recently cleaned up and threw out numerous minor odds and ends from his RS750 days, like HRC parts boxes and bags that had sat around for so many years that they crumbled when we picked them up.

[LesP]

[Murray]

For several reasons , that market is controlled by European brands , Honda and Yamaha have built some fine twin  cylinder motorbikes in the larger dual sport class , and met with some success , but when most hard core RTW types spend their money it is on a BMW and more recently KTM . 

 Dusty

The Honda was a heavy fairly poorly engineered POS up there with the original VF750 Roper had a few horror stories about them. It was basically the mistake that became the original Africa twin.

[SIR REAL ED]

Just did a little more research.
Like many other great Honda models this one was short lived. It was introduced in 1983 and the last ones were made three short years later in 1986.
Here’s a little of its history. Tap on to enlarge the photo to read.

I saw one of these at the Charlotte road race in 1992.  I really liked the concept.   I suspect the execution was nowhere near as promising.  A friend has one of the older Africa Twins.  Another friend had a Transalp.  the Transalp was very functional, but if ridden today would feel ancient.

[roadventure]

Looks similar to the RS750 they were making for Flat Track at the time and took the title away from HD.

I was going to say the same thing, but you beat me to it!

[oldbike54]

My often-mentioned best friend was involved with RS750 flat track program with HRC during his racing/tuning days.   so I just asked him.   His brief version-

Gene was manager. muzzy was over all of them.  Gene took his xr750 heads to Japan at one point and commented that if they figured out how to put flywheels in that engine, they would beat HD.  And when they did, that's what happened.  He also said Blake (if he's the one he's thinking about, but thought his shop was in San Mateo then) was really good but was really expensive. 

The RS750 engine was based upon regular Honda Shadow cases that were reinforced and modified.  He still has a set of them on the shelf at the shop.  The perennial ashtray at the shop for the past 30+ yrs is a souvenir original RS750 piston.  We recently cleaned up and threw out numerous minor odds and ends from his RS750 days, like HRC parts boxes and bags that had sat around for so many years that they crumbled when we picked them up.

 Interesting , thanks .

 Blake had a shop in Matteo to deal with the factories when he was doing heads for superbikes , mostly he lived and worked here in Muskogee . Kind of a different duck , a genius in most ways , but could be hard to know . He pioneered turbos for cars and bikes as a commercial venture , really didn't much care for the way turbos worked .

 Dusty

[cliffrod]

Interesting , thanks .

 Blake had a shop in Matteo to deal with the factories when he was doing heads for superbikes , mostly he lived and worked here in Muskogee . Kind of a different duck , a genius in most ways , but could be hard to know . He pioneered turbos for cars and bikes as a commercial venture , really didn't much care for the way turbos worked .

 Dusty

Sounds like describing my friend Dennis instead of Blake....   He's one of the few people I've known that I see as a legitimate genius.  Brilliant mechanical mind, like stunningly brilliant.  But in regular world stuff, he's a character that many people know but not really.  He's overly brash and audacious about some things, but very reserved about everything else.   Typical successful racer personality in many ways- make sure you win no matter what but not by enough that someone protests your bike or engine. 

The racing and tuning he did before he retired and opened the shop for normal stuff means all kinds of legends just stop, call, first name basis, want to know if he's doing anything besides drinking beer.  Most people have no idea what he did or who he did it with. His HRC time was just part of it.

Edit-

Those flat slides remind me of one of his related stories.  Shortly before his HRC time, Dennis had built an XR with flat slides.  He was young and still anonymous.  At one point, he was within earshot of Muzzy and heard him deriding that "dumbass" who put those "stupid looking carbs" on that bike.  Then that bike beat Muzzy's bikes.  Pretty sure that was the XR that was producing approx 15hp more than the factory bikes..  There's another good story about HD response to that.  Shortly after that, flat slides were std equipment on the bikes Muzzy oversaw.   

He still has that pair of carbs, just because....

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Timely thread on ADV Rider: https://advrider.com/f/threads/honda-xlv750-into-rs750-flat-tracker-build.1488706/

"I loved my XLV750, the motor was fantastic, the frame looked like it was made from some 50mm box section...and off road it was like riding with 2 bags of cement on your lap. But shit, I loved thrashing that thing." 

[huub]

The XLV was a top heavy pig to ride off road , think of a quota , but without the torquey motor , wind protection and with crappy suspension.
it originally came in red white blue , but as they could not sell them they changed the color scheme,
a friend had one in the days, he bought it bought cheap , because the importer was stuck with them and sold them way below list price.
He rode it for a year, traded it for a cagiva elefant.

[Ncdan]

The XLV was a top heavy pig to ride off road , think of a quota , but without the torquey motor , wind protection and with crappy suspension.
it originally came in red white blue , but as they could not sell them they changed the color scheme,
a friend had one in the days, he bought it bought cheap , because the importer was stuck with them and sold them way below list price.
He rode it for a year, traded it for a cagiva elefant.

Just curious, did you own and ride the XLV as your description seems a little harsher than the many reviews that I found when researching this ole antique Honda???

[BrotherJim]

If we're tossing some Honda v-twin flat trackers in the mix, here's this crazy thing.  Basically a CX500 with the engine and heads flipped around = NS750.









Kinda hard to believe that Honda tried this, but that is what they had, I guess.  This used to be on display at the AMA HOF Museum in Pickerington, OH.

https://americanmotorcyclist.com/classic-bikes/1982-honda-ns750/

[LowRyter]

I wonder if any company in history has built more types and variations of engines than Honda? 

They seem to come up with engines just because they can and sell them for a year and whosssh, they're gone like Kaiser Soze.   Or build the same engine for 60 years.

[oldbike54]

I wonder if any company in history has built more types and variations of engines than Honda? 

They seem to come up with engines just because they can and sell them for a year and whosssh, they're gone like Kaiser Soze.   Or build the same engine for 60 years.

 BSA built 2 stroke singles , 4 stroke singles , the real Gold Star  , a V-Twin , 2 different vertical twins in 500 and 650 CC displacements , a triple , had a 4 cylinder in the prototype stage , the 350 Bandit prototype , flat head singles , flat head twins , and that weird little 75 CC 4 stroke single used in the Beagle .

 Dusty

[BrotherJim]

I wonder if any company in history has built more types and variations of engines than Honda? 

They seem to come up with engines just because they can and sell them for a year and whosssh, they're gone like Kaiser Soze.   Or build the same engine for 60 years.

Honda has got to be up there with just motorcycle engines.  On top of multiple examples of all the conventional stuff we tend to know about, they built V3's & V5's for homologation and racing, which boggles a simpleton like myself.  V12's, V10's, and V8's for their auto racing endeavors, on down to V6's, I5's, I4's, I3's and parallel twins in their production autos.  Heck, they are even building business jets, but I'll let that slide because they are in cahoots with GE on that one.  There's undoubtedly stuff floating around out there that I don't know about! 

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

For a company as well funded as Honda, it's really no big deal to experiment with different engine configurations. For a small company like Guzzi, it's a different matter. Guzzi has done singles (two and four stroke, horizontal, vertical-ish), twins of different sorts, triples, fours and a V8. I find that a lot more impressive than anything Honda has achieved.

[Ncdan]

Honda has got to be up there with just motorcycle engines.  On top of multiple examples of all the conventional stuff we tend to know about, they built V3's & V5's for homologation and racing, which boggles a simpleton like myself.  V12's, V10's, and V8's for their auto racing endeavors, on down to V6's, I5's, I4's, I3's and parallel twins in their production autos.  Heck, they are even building business jets, but I'll let that slide because they are in cahoots with GE on that one.  There's undoubtedly stuff floating around out there that I don't know about!

That’s a fact BJ, I had forgotten about the two cylinders on one side a one on the other. In my mind and with what little I know about the Physics of the ICE how in the heck is that thing balanced?

[BrotherJim]

Definitely some kind of magic.

[acguzzi]

I suppose if you can "balance" a single you can balance anything