NEW Model Spy Pics: topic merged

[hauto]

"The new engine will no longer have the intake behind the cylinder and the exhaust in front, but the first in the center of the V and the exhaust manifolds that will come out on the outside of the cylinders,

That also give them more room for the radiator. Last thing you want is a over heating water cool bike.

[AJ Huff]

Awesomeness!

-AJ

[Roebling3]

If not for that cock eyed engine I'd mistake it for any one of my 15 or 20 year old SVS's. Fakir or not, a V twin 2 stroke under 350 lbs. Sold!
    R3~

[egschade]

Fascinating!  Thanks for posting the link!  I can't wait to see one of these machines in person.  Though.... "The new engine will no longer have the intake behind the cylinder and the exhaust in front, but the first in the center of the V and the exhaust manifolds that will come out on the outside of the cylinders," seems somewhat... different...

Maybe there's a V-4 in the works? Kidding aside this will be a very interesting bike and certainly an important one for MG. Would be nice if the production version had some faux fins on the cylinders but not a deal breaker.

[yogidozer]

Air cooling seems like it worked fine. Why change to something that can always cause trouble?

[Mayor_of_BBQ]

Air cooling seems like it worked fine. Why change to something that can always cause trouble?

Emissions requirements

[LowRyter]

Air cooling seems like it worked fine. Why change to something that can always cause trouble?

horsapower

[Chuck in Indiana]

LIke Chad said, emissions. And, sure.. you can make more horsepower. FWIW, I've had two liquid cooled bikes, and no issues.

[yogidozer]

Emissions? Horsepower?
Never heard air cooled bikes having a problem.
Air cooled bikes made plenty of horsepower.
Sales gimmick sounds more likely. JMO

[Xlratr]

I have a liquid cooled car!!
Of course I don't really trust it and I am sure it will let me down sometime. Hasn't done yet though! 

PS: Is that a serious comment about air cooled engines not having emissions problems? (gas and noise!)

[SteveRivet]

Emissions? Horsepower?
Never heard air cooled bikes having a problem.
Air cooled bikes made plenty of horsepower.
Sales gimmick sounds more likely. JMO

The emissions regs - especially in Europe - continue to get tougher, and air cooled bikes have a harder and harder time complying, especially on the bigger displacements.  I get what MG is trying to do here.

Steve

[Snowman]

Emissions? Horsepower?
Never heard air cooled bikes having a problem.
Air cooled bikes made plenty of horsepower.
Sales gimmick sounds more likely. JMO

Ahhhhhh, there is that Guzzi optimism. Ya know, I do miss that donkey and cart I used to have, no issues with water cooling. The combustion engine is just a gimmick.
 

[yogidozer]

I have a liquid cooled car!!
Of course I don't really trust it and I am sure it will let me down sometime. Hasn't done yet though! 

PS: Is that a serious comment about air cooled engines not having emissions problems? (gas and noise!)

So, your air cooled Stelvio NTX, 850 T3 didn't pass emissions?
Maybe if you set at idle for hours at a time.
Never heard of water cooled engines have problems? 

[yogidozer]

Ahhhhhh, there is that Guzzi optimism. Ya know, I do miss that donkey and cart I used to have, no issues with water cooling. The combustion engine is just a gimmick.
 

Relax, I didn't call you a donkey

[kingoffleece]

We've been reading for a while now from OEM's that air-cooled won't be able to pass newer regulations.  This is not new information.

[Xlratr]

So, your air cooled Stelvio NTX, 850 T3 didn't pass emissions?
Maybe if you set at idle for hours at a time.

It did. In 2016. Just!! Wouldn't now for new vehicles though. Not only pollution, but also noise!
As far as I know, nobody is developing large capacity air cooled engines anymore. Liquid cooling is the only way to go if you want to stay in the game. I applaud Moto Guzzi for doing just that.

Never heard of water cooled engines have problems? 

Can't say I'm aware of it being a thing.

[yogidozer]

When additional parts (hoses, thermostat, radiator) could all fail, break, or wear out, call the tow truck.
I'll wave as I ride by. 

[Xlratr]

When additional parts (hoses, thermostat, radiator) could all fail, break, or wear out, call the tow truck.
I'll wave as I ride by. 

We'll be talking about points vs. electronic ignition next. 

The point is, the only way for Moto Guzzi to continue as a motorcycle manufacturer is for them to develop modern, liquid cooled, clean and quiet engines. That's what they're doing. Enjoy it while you can! They'll be some of the last.

[yogidozer]

We'll be talking about points vs. electronic ignition next. 

The point is, the only way for Moto Guzzi to continue as a motorcycle manufacturer is for them to develop modern, liquid cooled, clean and quiet engines. That's what they're doing. Enjoy it while you can! They'll be some of the last.

Yeah, when your points or condenser go bad, $10 spares in your tool kit get you going....
When your computer goes bad...$$$ and a flatbed 

[Tusayan]

If not for that cock eyed engine I'd mistake it for any one of my 15 or 20 year old SVS's.

Assuming you mean Suzuki SVs, I’d agree as per my comment along those lines when the first Galluzzi desk top ‘leak’ photo was released.  It just looks derivative, Aprilia, Japanese, recycled 1995 Quota or whatever versus being designed as a whole in a way that attracts people to e.g. the V85TT.  I think this one is a miss unless it’s very different in person.  It could sell as an Italian commuter bike like the small Monsters but I’m guessing it may be too expensive for that market.

The ‘must be liquid cooled for emissions’ thing has been going around for 30 years.  I think the real reason for liquid cooling on this bike is power, and if it’s pleasant to ride that will to some degree make up for the uninspired overall design. 

[blackcat]

Yeah, when your points or condenser go bad, $10 spares in your tool kit get you going....
When your computer goes bad...$$$ and a flatbed 

Yeah, the Dyna on my CX was set sometime around 1995, rebuilt the engine around 2012 installed the distributor with the untouched Dyna and it's still rolling. Can't remember the last time I did anything on the 07 Norge except installing a new map about 5 years ago. Installed points on the rebuilt 76 LeMans but never could get them quite right and just installed a Dyna. 

Yeah, maybe I should consider getting a new Dyna box on the CX considering it's in it's 17th year of service.

[yogidozer]

Yeah, the Dyna on my CX was set sometime around 1995, rebuilt the engine around 2012 installed the distributor with the untouched Dyna and it's still rolling. Can't remember the last time I did anything on the 07 Norge except installing a new map about 5 years ago. Installed points on the rebuilt 76 LeMans but never could get them quite right and just installed a Dyna. 

Yeah, maybe I should consider getting a new Dyna box on the CX considering it's in it's 17th year of service.

Yeah, setting points is real complicated....


 

[blackcat]

Yeah, setting points is real complicated....

Yeah, Guzzi points are fine once you modify the points plate because it's such a pain in the ass to get it right with the non-modified points plate from the factory.

To each their own, but complaining because the rest of the world is moving on with modern equipment is rather silly. Yeah I know, "the T-3 is the best thing Guzzi ever made."   

[Mayor_of_BBQ]

ooof

that styling is a no for me, dawg

Hopefully they press release some good pics soon, that looks like a honda pacific coast...  fingers crossed it's prototype pics or a bad angle, but if not   

[moto]

What the heck is a "road crossover"? That's what they're calling this.

Crossing over from WHAT to WHAT?

Looks uncomfortable in the new photo.

Moto

[Dirk_S]

ooof

that styling is a no for me, dawg

Hopefully they press release some good pics soon, that looks like a honda pacific coast...  fingers crossed it's prototype pics or a bad angle, but if not   

Are you even attracted to sport bikes? I’m not, but I recognize MG’s need to get back to some of those roots. I actually dig its lines, because it’s not a Ninja or RNineT with a million different angles. It’s simple, sleek. And doesn’t have the big ol’ booty like the Centauri that BettyTheBear and I mutually dislike, ha.

[LowRyter]

That also give them more room for the radiator. Last thing you want is a over heating water cool bike.

And keeps the DOHC intake and exhaust valves on the same cam/geometry.  BMW  went to the same concept when the went with liquid cooling.

[Dirk_S]

What the heck is a "road crossover"? That's what they're calling this.

Crossing over from WHAT to WHAT?

Looks uncomfortable in the new photo.

Moto

Translations from a free translator will never be 100% efficient.

Fact: neither are paid translators.

Anecdote: I worked as a graphic designer for the world’s largest producer of non-powered lawn and garden tools (oh, the prestige!). When we created labels, packaging, instructions, etc., we sent the verbiage out to a translator who did both the French and Spanish translations. Yvan was a sweetheart. Soothing voice. One day, we got a new Marketing Director, who happened to be from France. During day 1, he looked at our hose packaging, and said ‘Whoah. Guys. We need to change the verbiage on these. You’re using boyeau when you should be using toyeau.”

(From Google Translate:)
tuyeau: pipe
boyeau: gut

Yvan was a sweetheart.

[LowRyter]

So, your air cooled Stelvio NTX, 850 T3 didn't pass emissions?
Maybe if you set at idle for hours at a time.
Never heard of water cooled engines have problems? 

No one says that an air-cooled engine won't meet emissions or make power.  But there are many advantages with emissions, performance and longevity with liquid cooling. 

I think this was proven about 35 years ago with sportsbikes, given the power increase compared to the earlier air-cooled turbo bikes.  Yes, a water pump makes more power than a turbo, and still meets emissions.  Tighter clearances, more compression, better combustion control, less friction, etc.

That doesn't mean there is anything wrong with an air-cooled engine.  It's traditional, simpler, better looking but there are performance trade-offs.  Even Porsche has given up with air-cooled engines.

[AJ Huff]

Are you even attracted to sport bikes? I’m not, but I recognize MG’s need to get back to some of those roots. I actually dig its lines, because it’s not a Ninja or RNineT with a million different angles. It’s simple, sleek. And doesn’t have the big ol’ booty like the Centauri that BettyTheBear and I mutually dislike, ha.

I agree. The only bikes I like look like a Triumph Bonneville, a Loop Frame, or a California. Or the Griso. But boy am I excited about something new, anything new.

-AJ