1971 Ambassador revival

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

OK well I had it running yesterday for a minute, then came back today at it wouldn't crank. Have noticed whiff of smoke from starter sometimes when it won't start. So was checking connectors and this one broke in my hand. I think it goes from starter solenoid to the kill switch. This connector looks specialized? Can I just cut it, strip the end and use an electrical connector that fits? Or do I need some specialized electrical connector? Thanks. Hoping this was my culprit in no crank.



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Did you mean to write "starter solenoid to starter button"? There isn't a kill switch, at least not originally.

The photo isn't clear enough to see what you're showing.

[Howard R]

What you have there is standard crimp-on ring lug terminal.  The ring part has broken off of the rest of the terminal, likely from being bent/flexed and fatiguing the cheap, thin copper.  Can easily be replaced if you have another terminal of the correct size for the wire gauge.  If that is a big, high current battery cable you will need a much heavier terminal.

[demet]

Sorry here is a better photo, and the wire in question is connected from the starter solenoid to the neutral switch stud.
It just looked weird but I realize now is just probably factory electrical connection. Will replace it and see if it solves problem.

Did you mean to write "starter solenoid to starter button"? There isn't a kill switch, at least not originally.

The photo isn't clear enough to see what you're showing.

[demet]

Thanks yes, with a little time I realized it wasn't that odd. I have rewired it but it doesn't solve my problem ;-(

What you have there is standard crimp-on ring lug terminal.  The ring part has broken off of the rest of the terminal, likely from being bent/flexed and fatiguing the cheap, thin copper.  Can easily be replaced if you have another terminal of the correct size for the wire gauge.  If that is a big, high current battery cable you will need a much heavier terminal.

[demet]

OK I rewired the funky starter solenoid to neutral switch wire, but still no joy. Wisp of smoke from the solenoid *I think* - made a video after first try, this time no smoke, but you can hear clicking and kind of 'burning' sound??
https://youtube.com/shorts/tP8NWwARzUc?feature=share

Did I fry the solenoid maybe? The bit of smoke came from that first connector you see in the video *I think*, red wire with yellow connector.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Sorry here is a better photo, and the wire in question is connected from the starter solenoid to the neutral switch stud.
It just looked weird but I realize now is just probably factory electrical connection. Will replace it and see if it solves problem.

Ground wire then. If wired that way, it will only start in neutral.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

OK I rewired the funky starter solenoid to neutral switch wire, but still no joy. Wisp of smoke from the solenoid *I think* - made a video after first try, this time no smoke, but you can hear clicking and kind of 'burning' sound??
https://youtube.com/shorts/tP8NWwARzUc?feature=share

Did I fry the solenoid maybe? The bit of smoke came from that first connector you see in the video *I think*, red wire with yellow connector.

The starter and solenoid need to be serviced. Here's a "how to" for the Bosch, the Marelli is similar.
https://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_loopframe_starter_and_solenoid_repair_-bosch-.html
If you don't feel comfortable doing it yourself, then find a local automotive electrical repair shop and have them do it. I have a good one near me, so if you can't find one near you, send the starter to me and I'll have them do it.

Alternatives:
1. Find a good used Bosch (Loop - late Ambo or Eldo) starter. The Bosch is a bit more efficient than the Marelli and parts are more available.
2. Adapt a Valeo or Valeo copy:
https://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_loopframe_starter_-_how_to_replace_the_magneti_marelli_starter_with_a_valeo.html
Copies are widely available on ebay, cheap. Work well. https://www.ebay.com/itm/275385225631

[demet]

Ok thanks! That gives me some much needed direction. I will take it off and see what I can do. If I need to just buy a replacement, what do you think of the unit for sale on MG Cycle?
https://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=4893

Seems like a reasonable price for starter+solenoid. Does this include the solenoid? It looks like it...

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Ok thanks! That gives me some much needed direction. I will take it off and see what I can do. If I need to just buy a replacement, what do you think of the unit for sale on MG Cycle?
https://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=4893

Seems like a reasonable price for starter+solenoid. Does this include the solenoid? It looks like it...

The MG Cycle unit is a Valeo copy, the same as the ebay one I linked to. They all seem to work well. All of them include the solenoid.

I do have a good stock of used Marelli starters and parts should you need anything for your starter.

[demet]

OK I decided to go with the Ebay unit you suggested, thanks! Making the modifications to get it to fit but my latest snag is I garbled the threads in the receiving end of the right side of neutral switch stud. I thought I was trying to get through the rubber so gave it some force and wasn't trying hard enough for straight alignment I guess. Quite mad about it lol.

So now, do I try to chase with M6 tap? I think I may have messed it up pretty bad, so not sure I can salvage the M6. I do have a 1/4-20 tap that is a bit bigger, try that? Or order an M8 tap? Thanks for any tips.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

OK I decided to go with the Ebay unit you suggested, thanks! Making the modifications to get it to fit but my latest snag is I garbled the threads in the receiving end of the right side of neutral switch stud. I thought I was trying to get through the rubber so gave it some force and wasn't trying hard enough for straight alignment I guess. Quite mad about it lol.

So now, do I try to chase with M6 tap? I think I may have messed it up pretty bad, so not sure I can salvage the M6. I do have a 1/4-20 tap that is a bit bigger, try that? Or order an M8 tap? Thanks for any tips.

It's easy to do - the plastic neutral switch tries to make the bolt go in at an angle for some reason. Chase it with an M6-1.0 tap.

[demet]

OK I got the new starter installed, seems to work well. Chasing those threads was a lot easier than I feared, thanks! ;-)

But now I'm getting fuel in the muffler again argh! Just on the left side, this picturewas after around 3 minutes of running it. I already got new float needles and polished the seats, and double checked the floats are not taking on fuel. I did check the float position by measuring and they both seemed OK. Anything else it could be?





I guess I'll need to change the oil yet again ;-/

Hmmm, thinking about it more: I just was trying to check the timing and around 1200 rpm the appropriate mark was aligning OK, but when I bumped up to 2200 rpm the marks did not move (advance?) very much, and I remembered the issue where the spring in my advance mechanism was maybe installed improperly. Could this be causing the advance mechanism to be working improperly and letting it run too rich and pushing fuel unburnt fuel through? I'm just guessing! lol

[demet]

I removed plugs and left side is definitely wet with fuel.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

OK I got the new starter installed, seems to work well. Chasing those threads was a lot easier than I feared, thanks! ;-)

But now I'm getting fuel in the muffler again argh! Just on the left side, this picturewas after around 3 minutes of running it. I already got new float needles and polished the seats, and double checked the floats are not taking on fuel. I did check the float position by measuring and they both seemed OK. Anything else it could be?





I guess I'll need to change the oil yet again ;-/

Hmmm, thinking about it more: I just was trying to check the timing and around 1200 rpm the appropriate mark was aligning OK, but when I bumped up to 2200 rpm the marks did not move (advance?) very much, and I remembered the issue where the spring in my advance mechanism was maybe installed improperly. Could this be causing the advance mechanism to be working improperly and letting it run too rich and pushing fuel unburnt fuel through? I'm just guessing! lol

Are you sure it's gas and not just gassy/rusty condensation? Idle and main jets in their correct holes? If the advance isn't working, then it might be time to strip it down, clean and lubricate, replace the springs.

[demet]

OK thank you, I will rebuild the distributor today, I have the new springs. Will then run it again and see if I get more fuel in muffler.

"Idle and main jets in their correct holes?" I believe so, but will check this next if I'm still getting fuel coming through.

Are you sure it's gas and not just gassy/rusty condensation? Idle and main jets in their correct holes? If the advance isn't working, then it might be time to strip it down, clean and lubricate, replace the springs.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

OK thank you, I will rebuild the distributor today, I have the new springs. Will then run it again and see if I get more fuel in muffler.

"Idle and main jets in their correct holes?" I believe so, but will check this next if I'm still getting fuel coming through.

https://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_loopframe_distributor_rebuild.html

[demet]

Ok distributor semi rebuilt. Stopped at that pin holding gear shaft ugh. The bike is not very worn in general so I hope this will be ok for now.

I have this gasket that came with bike, not sure how old but seems in ok condition. When I fit it on should I pre-lube it with oil or anything? Thanks!



Also, should I apply grease to the gear? I’m sorry if these are noob questions, I am one!

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Ok distributor semi rebuilt. Stopped at that pin holding gear shaft ugh. The bike is not very worn in general so I hope this will be ok for now.

I have this gasket that came with bike, not sure how old but seems in ok condition. When I fit it on should I pre-lube it with oil or anything? Thanks!



Also, should I apply grease to the gear? I’m sorry if these are noob questions, I am one!

It's actually a gasket for an Eldo, but that seems to be the only one retail supply now. The difference is the center hole is smaller and fits better on the V700/Ambo gasket. I use a light coating of Permatex 300 to make sure it seals. Engine oil on the gear is sufficient.

[demet]

Hi everyone, I'm back lol. Update: I finally found a local shop/guy with old MG experience and they helped me get the bike on the road, and indeed found I had missed a tooth on my distributor install and also swapped jets in one of my carbs. Maybe I should stick to woodworking!

But as the mechanic warned, it's an old bike and I should expect issues until everything is updated, so after enjoying it a few days, it started not running great and I found the plugs were fouled. But before I could sort that out the turn signals. headlight and horn all stopped working, not all at once but now none working at all. I took apart the switch and seems OK. Here's a picture of the fuse box, I found one fuse was broken, and I soldered it until I find the correct torpedo fuses. I'd like to replace all the fuses, and maybe do the whole fuse block replacement as seen on This Old Tractor. But looking at this picture at far right where the brown wires are, is there a fuses missing there? Top wire receptacle looks a bit fried, and wire won't come out, at least not easily. Advice? Should I skip the torpedo fuses altogether and just do the full block replacement? Thanks!

[John A]

They are Volkswagen fuses , if that helps

[demet]

Thank you, I think I'm just going to do the new fuse block from MG Cycle.

They are Volkswagen fuses , if that helps