NGC-new car stories good or bad

[Bulldog9]

I had a very educational talk with my brother in law who lives in NY state.

He recently bought a new car (a KIA) even though he loved his previous car which was only a few years old because the "check engine" light came on and in NY state you can not get an inspection sticker for a car if the check engine light is on.  Numerous trips to the OEM dealership proved they were unable to figure out the cause of the check engine light coming on.

The new KIA burns almost 1 quart of oil in 1,000 miles which is, strangely enough within OEM specifications.  IIRC, Yamaha and/or Suzuki relaxed the specifications on oil consumption after they botched the manufacturing process on a few bikes for a couple years.

He did not want third row seats, but removing the seats voids the warranty!  Same with adding tail light wiring to pull a trailer.

The conversation reminded of a previous conversation with a neighbor who wanted a new brand D truck, but ended up buying a new brand T truck since brand D would not allow him to check the engine oil level or change the oil.

The day may soon be here where most vehicles are leased and few are owned.

You guys dabble in the new vehicle world much more than I, what have you learned?

Where to start...

I guess first, Kia and Hyundai are generally garbage and disposable vehicles. Yeah yeah everyone has an opinion and that's mine. I have the same sentiment towards other manufacturers.

 I've always tried to buy new when I could afford it with the goal of keeping the car 10 years or more. Because my wife changes her car every 4 to 5 years, and insists on a luxury brand, we usually buy certified pre-owned. My experience with buying used has been hit or miss. With so many of the luxury brands and even Toyota, providing dealer service or at least oil changes for free for the first two or three years, I have more confidence buying certified pre-owned or off lease pre-owned in general. You can find pretty good deals in this category, but it's always a role of the dice.

For me, there's always a distinction between the fun hobby vehicle and the primary driver. Most of my comments relate to the primary driver or family vehicle.

My first new vehicle was a 1985 Volkswagen GTI. It was a total piece of junk and always in the shop as or the two Audis I bought after it all within 4 years.

My second new vehicle was a 1990 Pontiac Grand Prix. This was our family vehicle and we only got rid of it when baby number three came along. That was replaced 5 years later with a custom ordered short wheel base Ram Van....  The Pontiac never saw the dealer once over 80,000 miles. The Van??? It lived at the dealer. We replaced that with a series of heartbreaks until 2000 when we bought an Oldsmobile silhouette that was great over its 10 years.

For myself personally, I bought a Jeep Grand Cherokee in 1996 and drove it problem free until 2006 when I replaced it with a Commander. The commander stayed in the family until last year and made it 225,000 miles with virtually no major mechanical repairs. In 2017 I gave it to my daughter and bought a Toyota Tundra which I still have 110k trouble free miles.

I've been pretty fortunate with a few exceptions. Buying new,  a 1k oil change and early initial (1/2 mfg recommended) with other fluids (transmission/diffs/PS/brake fluid) has served me well.

I had a neighbor, let's call him Jim. Guy was a jerk and a tool. He leased Cadillacs exclusively. Would drive it and do NOTHING for service. One day he gave me a ride. His CEL was on, oil light on, alternator light on. Agast, I pointed this out. His response mostly cured me of buying used and off lease. He said 'ah who cares.... It's a lease and under warranty and was turning it in next week'

2 years and 20k miles never an oil change. Low oil pressure jerky shifting, etc. he turned it in, and the dealer likely changed the oil, cleared CEL and put spit and polish on it and sold some sucker a future time bomb....

If your gonna swap out in a year or two it doesn't matter usually, but if keeping over 5-7 years or more, buy new, even if it has fewer bells and whistles.

Ok will stop this book. I mean what else am I gonna do while sitting at my grand daughters TWO hour dance recital? She was in the first two acts, and I am sitting through the 18-20 that follows! Good news, just 3 to go till the finale... Oy veh...

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

My first new vehicle was a 1985 Volkswagen GTI. It was a total piece of junk and always in the shop as or the two Audis I bought after it all within 4 years.

My first new vehicle was an '82 VW ("Rabbit") Pickup. I was commuting 100 miles a day, so in the year I owned it, put on 30k miles. When I bought a new '83 GTi, I sold it to my sister who worked at the same place I did. It had 126k miles on it when she sold it to buy something with more seats for carpooling. The only problem she ever had was with the fuel injection after filling up at a station with water in the tanks. My GTi had 65k miles on it when I traded it for an '85 Bertone (Fiat) X1/9. Totally trouble free except for a cracked distributor cap. I was not easy on it either, but was meticulous with maintenance.

The Bertone was driven hard, yet never had any failures in the 86k miles I drove it, other than a cracked distributor cap (too!). There was a series of busted grills and punctured CV joint and ball-joint boots due to hitting small critters at speed. More maintenance intensive than the VWs - timing belt every 25k, and I ran Mobil Delvac 5w40 synthetic.

I owned two Audis, both 5 cyl. and 5 speed. The first was an '85 5000S that had 116k miles on it. It was a salesman car, that went to my uncle's used car lot after the lease was up. It had 254k miles on it when I clobbered a deer and decided it just wasn't worth fixing. I'd rebuilt the steering rack once and the a/c compression locked up just before I hit the deer. The usual sets of tires, struts and brakes of course.

The second was an '88 80 Quattro with 110k miles, that I also bought from my uncle and was also just off lease. It was completely trouble-free except for minor things like window switches. Sold it with 309k miles on it. Still ran great, used very little oil.   

[Kev m]

Of course but the concept is valid. By the way Studebaker was a major horse drawn wagon manufacturer in it's beginning, in fact it was wheelbarrows in the goldfields in California during the gold rush.
kk

I'm saying the conclusion is invalid because they are too different to compare and assume that conclusion.

[Bulldog9]

My first new vehicle was an '82 VW ("Rabbit") Pickup. I was commuting 100 miles a day, so in the year I owned it, put on 30k miles. When I bought a new '83 GTi, I sold it to my sister who worked at the same place I did. It had 126k miles on it when she sold it to buy something with more seats for carpooling. The only problem she ever had was with the fuel injection after filling up at a station with water in the tanks. My GTi had 65k miles on it when I traded it for an '85 Bertone (Fiat) X1/9. Totally trouble free except for a cracked distributor cap. I was not easy on it either, but was meticulous with maintenance.

The Bertone was driven hard, yet never had any failures in the 86k miles I drove it, other than a cracked distributor cap (too!). There was a series of busted grills and punctured CV joint and ball-joint boots due to hitting small critters at speed. More maintenance intensive than the VWs - timing belt every 25k, and I ran Mobil Delvac 5w40 synthetic.

I owned two Audis, both 5 cyl. and 5 speed. The first was an '85 5000S that had 116k miles on it. It was a salesman car, that went to my uncle's used car lot after the lease was up. It had 254k miles on it when I clobbered a deer and decided it just wasn't worth fixing. I'd rebuilt the steering rack once and the a/c compression locked up just before I hit the deer. The usual sets of tires, struts and brakes of course.

The second was an '88 80 Quattro with 110k miles, that I also bought from my uncle and was also just off lease. It was completely trouble-free except for minor things like window switches. Sold it with 309k miles on it. Still ran great, used very little oil.

Good for you Charlie! I had terrible luck with my VW/Audi's

Water Pumps, timing belts, frozen throwout bearings, front hubs, cracked exhaust manifold studs, CIS injection issues, cracked radiators, power window motors, stuck open sunroof. Thankfully all under warranty.

Though I have to say one of my favorite driving cars of all time was the 1985 Turbo Quattro 5000.

[Alfetta]

Or olive oil for Italian machinery of course.

Some day I need to do an experiment......

must be pure virgin Olive oil in my Fiat, Alfa, and the Goose....   the Jeep gets whatever is on the discount rack

[Kev m]

must be pure virgin Olive oil in my Fiat, Alfa, and the Goose....   the Jeep gets whatever is on the discount rack

Hell, the newer of my Jeeps has an Alfa engine...

[SIR REAL ED]

I appreciate all these opinions!!  This thread is turning into a wealth of knowledge!!  I appreciate hearing all these stories of vehicles I have never even consider buying!!

To me, primarily due to economics, 4 wheel vehicles have always been a utilitarian purchase.

I suspect the old days of buying a 8-10 year old vehicle for $500 and putting $1500 into it to get a vehicle that will be reliable for ten years is long gone....

I see a Honda VTX1800 has come up for sale not too far from here....

Shirley it would not be that difficult to buy a small used vehicle and replace the car engine and transmission with the engine and driveshaft from the VTX1800....

[SIR REAL ED]

Hell, the newer of my Jeeps has an Alfa engine...

Don't risk it!

Buy Olive oil made in America!

[Kev m]

Don't risk it!

Buy Olive oil made in America!

As long as it's alotta virgin!

[fotoguzzi]

Now for a good news car story.. if I’m allowed to go there.
My car never needs an oil change, my drive train has about 20 moving parts as opposed to over 2,000.
In my Subi I was spending over $300/mo on fuel same miles traveled in the new car cost me about $80. And the tank is full every morning. I do use premium washer fluid tho. It can pretty much drive itself and sticker price is close to the average car sold in the US.
In the past the mods here have taken down my posts so I won’t name the car but I’ve done 10.95 seconds in a quarter mile drag.
Whats wrong in this pic?

[SIR REAL ED]

Now for a good news car story.. if I’m allowed to go there.
My car never needs an oil change, my drive train has about 20 moving parts as opposed to over 2,000.
In my Subi I was spending over $300/mo on fuel same miles traveled in the new car cost me about $80. And the tank is full every morning. I do use premium washer fluid tho. It can pretty much drive itself and sticker price is close to the average car sold in the US.
In the past the mods here have taken down my posts so I won’t name the car but I’ve done 10.95 seconds in a quarter mile drag.
Whats wrong in this pic?

Noting wrong that I can see!

How about some specifics?

Year, model, cost, expected battery life, etc?

Any insurance differences?

[fotoguzzi]

First, it’s not a Volvo.. 2024 Tesla Model 3 Performance top speed 163mph
About $50,000
Battery? Warranted for 8 years.. Range 304 miles
I insure it and a 2022 M3RWD and a Subi Forester all for about $300/mo full coverage.
The Performance is exceptional - hardly anything at the drag strip can touch it.10” wide wheels. It’s off the line like a jet.
I expect even better quarter mile times this summer as I have lighter 18” wheels now not the 20” stock rims.
I believe it’s faster than any motorcycle I ever owned with the possible exception of my Ducati HyperStrada, gone now but not missed, this car is super fun to drive.

[SIR REAL ED]

First, it’s not a Volvo.. 2024 Tesla Model 3 Performance top speed 163mph
About $50,000
Battery? Warranted for 8 years.. Range 304 miles
I insure it and a 2022 M3RWD and a Subi Forester all for about $300/mo full coverage.
The Performance is exceptional - hardly anything at the drag strip can touch it.10” wide wheels. It’s off the line like a jet.
I expect even better quarter mile times this summer as I have lighter 18” wheels now not the 20” stock rims.
I believe it’s faster than any motorcycle I ever owned with the possible exception of my Ducati HyperStrada, gone now but not missed, this car is super fun to drive.

So why is the name "Volvo" displayed on the car shown in the picture?  Preemptive protection from the crazy people?

I've seen the memes of disguise kits for Teslas.   Subaru emblems, "Save the Whales" bumper stickers etc..

The several people I know who own Teslas all love them.

Damn shame people can't realize that technology is completely indifferent to human feelings.

[bronzestar1]

I'll never own an EV or hybrid, all my conveyances are ICE 100 percent.  Don't care if they're faster, or allegedly better for the environment, just fundamentally opposed to the concept.  I'm an analog guy in a digital world, so don't need or want all the high-tech bells and whistles that a lot of EVs and hybrids have.  Makes buying a new car much easier...   

[fotoguzzi]

I'll never own an EV or hybrid, all my conveyances are ICE 100 percent.  Don't care if they're faster, or allegedly better for the environment, just fundamentally opposed to the concept.  I'm an analog guy in a digital world, so don't need or want all the high-tech bells and whistles that a lot of EVs and hybrids have.  Makes buying a new car much easier...   

nothing could be easier than buying a Tesla.. spend a half hour on the internet and when I picked up the car I was in the showroom for less than 5 minutes. No pressure to “buy the undercoating” (Fargo reference) or any other salesman BS.

[fotoguzzi]

So why is the name "Volvo" displayed on the car shown in the picture?  Preemptive protection from the crazy people?

exactly.. the kind of person who vandalizes a Tesla is ignorant of the car’s shape. They use the name emblem to identify it.. if they can read that is.

[Ncdan]

Now for a good news car story.. if I’m allowed to go there.
My car never needs an oil change, my drive train has about 20 moving parts as opposed to over 2,000.
In my Subi I was spending over $300/mo on fuel same miles traveled in the new car cost me about $80. And the tank is full every morning. I do use premium washer fluid tho. It can pretty much drive itself and sticker price is close to the average car sold in the US.
In the past the mods here have taken down my posts so I won’t name the car but I’ve done 10.95 seconds in a quarter mile drag.
Whats wrong in this pic?

“In the past the mods here have taken down my posts so I won’t name the car“
Clarification needed.
No moderator here has ever taken down your post because you named a particular type of vehicle.
In the, not recent past, there has been entire threads been removed because these types of subject matter most always either go political or totally rogue and that’s why they are discouraged. And they usually become a moderator nightmare. These past practices have been few and far between and will continue to be that way.
As in the past when the thread went rogue it went away, as this one will, if it crosses the line.
No response to this necessary, please.

Dan

[SIR REAL ED]

exactly.. the kind of person who vandalizes a Tesla is ignorant of the car’s shape. They use the name emblem to identify it.. if they can read that is.

Brilliant!

[SIR REAL ED]

Uhh, yeah. 60000 miles on our dual motor model Y. I've filled the washer bottle twice. Charge mostly at home off peak for 9 cents per KWH. Costs roughly $40 per month. Handles well, fast, and quiet. Best car I've ever had by far. I need a bumper sticker that says I bought it before I knew Elon was such a dick, though..

If I were you, I would not count on potential vandals being literate.....

[LowRyter]

I had a very educational talk with my brother in law who lives in NY state.

He recently bought a new car (a KIA) even though he loved his previous car which was only a few years old because the "check engine" light came on and in NY state you can not get an inspection sticker for a car if the check engine light is on.  Numerous trips to the OEM dealership proved they were unable to figure out the cause of the check engine light coming on.

The new KIA burns almost 1 quart of oil in 1,000 miles which is, strangely enough within OEM specifications.  IIRC, Yamaha and/or Suzuki relaxed the specifications on oil consumption after they botched the manufacturing process on a few bikes for a couple years.

He did not want third row seats, but removing the seats voids the warranty!  Same with adding tail light wiring to pull a trailer.

The conversation reminded of a previous conversation with a neighbor who wanted a new brand D truck, but ended up buying a new brand T truck since brand D would not allow him to check the engine oil level or change the oil.

The day may soon be here where most vehicles are leased and few are owned.

You guys dabble in the new vehicle world much more than I, what have you learned?

New car?  does NY have a lemon law?  If the CEL doesn't clear, they need to own it.  No one wants a car that drinks oil.  This the car that you wanna park in their lot, hand them the keys and walk away.

[LowRyter]

I feel for the peeps of New York...
It is unfortunate that they are forced to comply with a light bulb and the stupidity of manufactures "good Ideas"

I know I'm old, but the norm used to be, an oil, generator, temperature and brake failure lights, that's it.... This covered the critical safety functions along with informing the owner of the source of the issue without having to connect a diagnostic tool, update firmware, and look up codes..   

wow, what a concept...

Today the "check engine" light is an indicator that only states that the CPU isn't liking something, and it may or may not be critical, and it may or may not actually be and engine issue..   therefore it's kinda crap IMHO..

then we have the rub, when you get codes with your reader, they may be a result of an issue, but not the real issue, so unless you have the outrageously expensive manufactures PC diagnostic system, you are left with replacing expensive parts one at a time, until you find the culprit, and most are electric that the part sellers do not take back...

Or you can pay the local mechanic, and that's fine, but it's an expense that goes directly to the operational cost. they typically have a two hour minimum, and that's a hard pill to swallow when you are told the light was on due to a two minute sensor replacement.

oh well...   there's my rant....  Sorry

Reminds me of my '08 Corvette.  I had a CEL due to EVAP.  Changed the gas cap and purge valve.  CEL just kept coming back on.  Took it to Chevy and they were clueless.  Just lived with it.  Finally took it a local guy, he's good, always reasonable and always backed up.  Actually took it there for a rear A arm.  He fixed the CEL in short order, the leak was under the hood on fuel delivery side.  The new A arm was $100 or so (cheaper than changing out the bushings).

[blackcat]

Now is the time to buy a Tesla, 0% financing and the $7,500 tax credit is about to exit. Yes it has an 8 year warranty but if you want to keep it longer than that the cost to replace that battery is currently $10K plus. After market batteries are a gamble so it would be wise to go with a Tesla battery.

Personally, I think they are particularly ugly cars and the SUV is hideous.

[kballowe]

I would really like to be able to buy a plain Jane automobile.
Stick shift, crank windows.  No electronics.

Air conditioning, of course.

[SIR REAL ED]

I would really like to be able to buy a plain Jane automobile.
Stick shift, crank windows.  No electronics.

Air conditioning, of course.

I think the same.  Due to emissions/safety regulations, & too may lawyers, etc. computers monitor everything from transmissions to door locks to seat belts.  I suspect the days of no electronics are forever gone.

I've been thinking hard about buying a 30 year old plus vehicle and sinking money into it to make it reliable.

One of the many downsides of that approach is that with the slight dent, an insurance company would total the vehicle.

Other options include kit cars or putting an older automotive drive train into a newer vehicle.

Or an older motorcycle engine/transmission.  Gold Wing, Yamaha Virago, Honda VTX, and of course, Moto Guzzi.

I recall seeing kits for SmartCars that allow the installation of a GSXR1000 or Hayabusa engine/transmission.

That would be a sleeper that would be fun to drive.

Every stop light becomes a Christmas tree.....