Author Topic: Cranky Norge  (Read 2331 times)

Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2026, 08:51:38 AM »
Since this problem got worse over a couple of years, I wouldn't suspect the sacred screw.  That should not move over time.
Maybe dirty TBs?  Or all the fuel related ideas already mentioned.
One other related thought is to spray gas into the TB before first crank.
That is a pretty good diagnostic method.

Online BMCMOTO

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #31 on: March 03, 2026, 12:41:19 PM »
The most likely culprit in this scenario are the injectors. When injectors leak the fuel from their supply lines, your circumstances are assured. A leaking fuel pump check valve is also quite possible, but that would still leave unpressurized fuel in the line, so only pressure would need to be built in the line from the pump. Leaking injectors mean not only pressure has to be built but also fuel moved. Air takes longer to compress than it takes to move fuel. The air has to leave by way of the injector opening and closing. There are many way to check for injector leakage, but probably the easiest is to simply have them checked cleaned and flow checked at an injector shop. This has been mentioned before. Please try this. You may be pleasantly surprised!

Brian

 
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Offline Bulldog9

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #32 on: March 03, 2026, 02:14:07 PM »
The most likely culprit in this scenario are the injectors. When injectors leak the fuel from their supply lines, your circumstances are assured. A leaking fuel pump check valve is also quite possible, but that would still leave unpressurized fuel in the line, so only pressure would need to be built in the line from the pump. Leaking injectors mean not only pressure has to be built but also fuel moved. Air takes longer to compress than it takes to move fuel. The air has to leave by way of the injector opening and closing. There are many way to check for injector leakage, but probably the easiest is to simply have them checked cleaned and flow checked at an injector shop. This has been mentioned before. Please try this. You may be pleasantly surprised!

Brian

Generally, the check valve is between the pump and injectors or fuel rail to keep fuel pressure up, not between the tank and pump. That's just suction. I'm pretty sure Huzo has already said his injectors are not leaking down.
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Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #33 on: March 03, 2026, 02:51:39 PM »
Generally, the check valve is between the pump and injectors or fuel rail to keep fuel pressure up, not between the tank and pump. That's just suction. I'm pretty sure Huzo has already said his injectors are not leaking down.
I’m a bit hazy on this, it’s not something I have ever been involved with.
I haven’t claimed that my injector/s are not leaking down, I wouldn’t know.
When you say between tank and the pump, I don’t follow you, because the pump is submerged in the fuel.

Why don’t I just remove the injectors from their position and watch them as I crank the starter to see if they deliver fuel immediately as I press the starter ?
Wouldn’t that highlight the issue if there was one ?

Offline Bulldog9

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2026, 03:02:14 PM »
I’m a bit hazy on this, it’s not something I have ever been involved with.
I haven’t claimed that my injector/s are not leaking down, I wouldn’t know.
When you say between tank and the pump, I don’t follow you, because the pump is submerged in the fuel.

Why don’t I just remove the injectors from their position and watch them as I crank the starter to see if they deliver fuel immediately as I press the starter ?
Wouldn’t that highlight the issue if there was one ?

Ah, my bad, I thought you said you had pulled them and let them sit outside the head and nothing was leaking or ripping. Must've been another thread.

I know the pump is immersed in the tank, I was referring to the gas/liquid being pumped. The Fuel System goes as follows as I understand it.

(INSIDE TANK) - STRAINER>>> PUMP W/INTERNAL CHECK VALVE>>> FILTER>>> (OUTSIDE TANK) >>> CONNECTOR>>> FUEL LINES TO INJECTORS.

I would just pull them when the bike is off, leave them out and see if they drip down or are wet over a couple days.

You MAY see some spray immediately, but is it the correct pressure and amount?

Have you tried just cycling the key 2-3 times after sitting to see if it cures the issue?

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The Living: 1976 Convert, 2007 GRiSO, 2012 Norge GT, 2016 Stornello #742, 2023 V85 TT
The Departed: 2017 MGX, 2014 Norge GT, 2004 Breva 750, 2008 1200 Sport
In Stasis: 1978 XS750, XS1100SF

Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2026, 03:21:19 PM »
Ah, my bad, I thought you said you had pulled them and let them sit outside the head and nothing was leaking or ripping. Must've been another thread.

I know the pump is immersed in the tank, I was referring to the gas/liquid being pumped. The Fuel System goes as follows as I understand it.

(INSIDE TANK) - STRAINER>>> PUMP W/INTERNAL CHECK VALVE>>> FILTER>>> (OUTSIDE TANK) >>> CONNECTOR>>> FUEL LINES TO INJECTORS.

I would just pull them when the bike is off, leave them out and see if they drip down or are wet over a couple days.

You MAY see some spray immediately, but is it the correct pressure and amount?

Have you tried just cycling the key 2-3 times after sitting to see if it cures the issue?
No worries Bulldog.
When I turn the key, I can hear the pump spin up, so I don’t suspect that issue and I have done the key cycle thing as well and it seems to make no difference.
As mentioned and as is evident in video, I can start and run it for two seconds after a week storage where it cranks for 8 or so seconds where it the hesitatingly fires, turn it off, hit the starter and it fires immediately.

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #36 on: Today at 03:05:31 AM »
Today I installed the fuel pump back in with the new filter. I took the injectors out still connected and hit the starter, no fuel came  from the right one.
I subsequently found that the electrical connector was loose to the point of coming away.
This is the offending item.




I will source two new ones as a precaution.
Does anyone know what the way forward to getting new ones ?
e bay, generic automotive replacements ?
I don’t think the decrepid state of the electrical connector is the culprit, because the bike would always run well and start readily once the first start was out of the way, but the new injectors will not go astray.
I notice the prices on e bay vary wildly.






There is a number on my injectors 0267
Is that significant ?
« Last Edit: Today at 04:16:03 AM by Huzo »

Offline Pescatore

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #37 on: Today at 07:55:08 AM »
Good for you to find the problem.
Does the injector fire on second attempt?
If not a connector problem, do you suspect a clogged nozzle?
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Offline Pescatore

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #38 on: Today at 08:00:19 AM »
In US generic/compatible ones also around $30.
Originals $300.

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Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #39 on: Today at 10:07:22 AM »
Good for you to find the problem.
Does the injector fire on second attempt?
If not a connector problem, do you suspect a clogged nozzle?
Don’t know Pescatore, but I do know that there is plenty of fuel supply to the injector from the get go, because it spat one out once when the pump was priming and fuel gushed from the supply line.
I may have caused the damage when removing the injector and maybe not, but it’s getting new ones regardless.
When I get the new ones I’ll check the spray while cranking.
Still learning.

Offline PJPR01

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #40 on: Today at 02:52:58 PM »
Peter...there are 2 types of fuel injectors, so you'll need to the ones that are compatible.  Some have 6 holes, some have 12.  When you look on Ebay, make sure it says it's compatible with your model, as the fuel injectors used for 2V are different than 4V.

I have a brand new set of the 6 hole ones (non OEM) that I can send you if you like for postage plus $30 bucks in case you cannot find them on Ebay (which is where I sourced a pair of non OEM ones, and they work perfectly also).  You can get 10 non OEM pairs for the price of 1 OEM...

Glad you found the problem!

Paul R
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Online nc43bsa

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #41 on: Today at 03:15:11 PM »
In case your harness needs repair:

https://injectorrepair.com/connector-types/

And, I think the state of the electrical connector had everything to do with your problem.  I've seen that and worse on automotive FI systems, although usually it was rodent damage.
« Last Edit: Today at 03:18:17 PM by nc43bsa »
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Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #42 on: Today at 04:21:23 PM »
Peter...there are 2 types of fuel injectors, so you'll need to the ones that are compatible.  Some have 6 holes, some have 12.  When you look on Ebay, make sure it says it's compatible with your model, as the fuel injectors used for 2V are different than 4V.

I have a brand new set of the 6 hole ones (non OEM) that I can send you if you like for postage plus $30 bucks in case you cannot find them on Ebay (which is where I sourced a pair of non OEM ones, and they work perfectly also).  You can get 10 non OEM pairs for the price of 1 OEM...

Glad you found the problem!
Thank you Paul, I will check out some good petrol injection places around here to see what’s up and if I hit a dead end, I’ll take you up on the offer.
Very much appreciated.
Thank you.

Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #43 on: Today at 04:22:59 PM »
In case your harness needs repair:

https://injectorrepair.com/connector-types/

And, I think the state of the electrical connector had everything to do with your problem.  I've seen that and worse on automotive FI systems, although usually it was rodent damage.
Possibly yes nc43bsa.
Also much appreciate your interest.

Online Huzo

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Re: Cranky Norge
« Reply #44 on: Today at 04:32:35 PM »
Peter...there are 2 types of fuel injectors, so you'll need to the ones that are compatible.  Some have 6 holes, some have 12.  When you look on Ebay, make sure it says it's compatible with your model, as the fuel injectors used for 2V are different than 4V.

I have a brand new set of the 6 hole ones (non OEM) that I can send you if you like for postage plus $30 bucks in case you cannot find them on Ebay (which is where I sourced a pair of non OEM ones, and they work perfectly also).  You can get 10 non OEM pairs for the price of 1 OEM...

Glad you found the problem!
If you care to share your cell # Paul, I’ll ring and make some arrangements.
Mine is +61437070946
Thanks again.
Peter.

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