New Moto Guzzi Door Mats Available Now
I wonder are used Guzzi sales in Europe, and other countries outside of the USA experiencing the same thing? Rick.
Undervalued: assets, stocks, or items priced below their actual intrinsic worth, or people/efforts deemed less important than they truly are. Intrinsic value: the calculated, "true" worth of an asset based on fundamental analysis (cash flows, assets, earnings) rather than its current market price. It represents an inherent, objective value used to determine if an investment is undervalued or overvalued.I've always been told something is worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Not many people are willing to pay very much for used Moto Guzzis."Rare does not equal valuable" was never truer when considering what used Moto Guzzis sell for.
I have a short list of older bikes that for the right price, I'd like to try out (Nevada 750, Ducati Monster 620, Buell Lightning XB12Scg, Royal Enfield Classic 500, Honda NX250, Kawasaki Super Sherpa 250).
I'd like to try a Honda ST, a Yamaha GTS1000, and a BMW K1600 for a few days to see if I could live with them (perhaps a couple of other odd-balls).
How are the used prices for those bikes?It always surprises me how much Buell owners want for their Lightning XB’s. Rare to find one under $4k. Although I do regularly see Monster 620’s under $3k.
*WARNING* Monster 620 (or any used Ducati desmo with some miles).Unless you're happy replacing timing belts (and tightening them until they produce the right sound on a decimeter) and checking/swapping desmo valve shims, then a used Ducati might not be as cheap as it seems. *WARNING*My wife fell in love with the Monster 620 back in the day. We eventually ordered her a brand spanky new beautiful Monster 696 from FBF.She still has and loves it today (it will be 15 years in a few months).In those 15 years of gentle riding we've stretched the desmo/belt service A LOT, like 5-7 years between them meaning we've only had the FULL service done twice so far. And by full I mean that I hand the bike over and they go to town. Draining and resealing forks, new tires, belts, valve service, spark plugs, etc. By the next time we perform that service, we will have bought that bike TWICE.Meaning even if you buy a 620 for $3k you can easily double the price if you pay a dealer to perform that service, which is most likely why the bike is only $3k in the first place, the owner is selling it without doing that.
This is not intrinsic to Ducati and probably most bikes. Relying on a dealership to perform service is going to be expensive no matter the brand or age of the bike. It only gets worse as the value of the bike is decreased meaning it hard to justify spending a large percentage of the value of the bike on service that essentially does not increase the value of the bike only maintains what little is left.Older bike can be great values If you can do a lions share of the servicing and maintaining yourself.
Hey, Don’t call me cheap!I’m considering not buying anymore, but renting As I peruse the classified ads almost everyday I am drawn to the bikes i would like to “try” for a few days just to see what they’re likeI really would like to avoid the purchasing, insurance, storage, maintenance, repairs and reselling Guzzi I’ve wanted to ride? Stornello, Griso, V11Sport, Big Breva. I’ve suggested to several members here in Corn-eck-tee-cut we should just swap bikes with each other for a few weeks and stop all this purchasing Just give me the damn bike for a few days and let me scratch that itch, then I’ll be done
I'd probably make more money parting out my 07 Norge with 70,000+ miles than selling it as is, but I'm not ready to sell that bike as it's my only sit up bike with wind protection.
Of course it's not limited to only Ducati, but I do not concur with your use of the word intrinsic.It is most certainly 100% intrinsic to Ducati because of the off-putting nature of their maintenance choices. Specifically the desmo valves and the timing belts set like you're tuning a guitar make even fewer DIYers tackle it and the more frequent and higher costs keep more people away.This same sort of pressure is not on a bunch of other brands (especially most from JAPanInc) where owners treat them like cars.
*WARNING* Monster 620 (or any used Ducati Desmo with some miles).Unless you're happy replacing timing belts (and tightening them until they produce the right sound on a decimeter) and checking/swapping desmo valve shims, then a used Ducati might not be as cheap as it seems. *WARNING*Meaning even if you buy a 620 for $3k you can easily double the price if you pay a dealer to perform that service, which is most likely why the bike is only $3k in the first place, the owner is selling it without doing that.
Why is the same sort of pressure not on other brands? Every manufacturer states service intervals and specifies what is to be competed at these intervals. If an owner chooses to stretch, omit or neglect services that does not make them go away.
That's pretty much why I've stayed away from Ducati's. Three of my riding/touring buddies used to own ST3's. They loved everything about them except for the maintenance costs. Ed Milich of Guzzi Power/DucPower, always seems to have Monster 620's up for sale on CL and FB in the $3k range. Getting a Monster would really be just to "scratch that itch". I did that a couple years ago when I was Airhead curious. I found a 1983 BMW R65 in TN. The previous owner took it to Rick Jones of Motorrrad Elektrik in AL for me to make sure it was road worthy. As much as I enjoyed the 1200 mile ride back home, I knew the R65 was not for me. So five months later I sold it to a friend and got my V50 II as part of that deal.I'm fortunate that I get the opportunity to try out different bikes. I don't consider buying a motorcycle to be an investment or a life long commitment, just having fun exploring what various bikes are about.
*WARNING* Unless you're happy replacing timing belts (and tightening them until they produce the right sound on a decimeter)
Because:* Any monkey can change oil* Many monkeys can even inspect valves (and change shims) * Though it seems just monkeys just ignore shim and bucket valves on JAPanInc brand bikes and the major US brands mostly DO NOT HAVE ANY valve adjustments. * And just about no OTHER monkeys have desmo valves, never mind TIMING BELTS that are supposed to be changed as frequently as every other year * You can cross entire states in the US and not find an independent shop to do those things on a Ducati.So with the possible exception of BMW owners paying dealer ask on the most recent model maintenance, MOST MONKEYS aren't going to have to spend 1/3 of the cost of their bikes on routine maintenance. That's what makes a Desmo Ducati an outlier among outliers. Jeezz why was that concept so hard to understand?
Even though I've done the majority of my own spannering for 4+ decades (with some full teardowns), the rigmarole of demo valve adjustment is something I fortunately got away with not doing, before I sold my Monster. I've also shied away from changing shims, on my bikes, as having my bike in bits whilst sourcing the needed shims is just too much hassle. On at least two occasions I've borne the cost of taking a bike to a stealer dealer, to get valve clearances checked/corrected and felt the pain in my wallet. There's a lot to be said for modern bikes with extended valve clearance intervals, such as the Speed Twin. The above is a major deciding factor in deciding to go with Moto Guzzi 2-valvers, along with my much belated return to shaft drive.P.S. The paranoia over changing belts on Ducs is laughable; I'll bet if the bike hasn't been unused for extended periods, they'll last for multiple years and at least 20k miles. Are they not Gates Kevlar reinforced or equivalent? I changed the ones on my "barn find" Monster because it hadn't been done in decades and though not perished/worn in the slightest at ~7k miles, they had a definite formed shape from being stationary. The (shorter/thinner head) tension roller bolts are made of chocolate steel, even the replacements!
<contemplating what my garage would look like with 2 red Norges >
Timing belts on air cooled 2 valves take 20 minutes to change and the tension can be set with a 5 & 6mm hex key as go no go gauges. The valves are easy to check and if they need adjusted are no complicated to do, just follow the process. Throwing BMW into the mix, same goes. Valves are dead simple to check and the hardest part about changing is doing the measuring/math to make sure you get the right thickness shim. The same goes for any UJM shim and bucket set up. Sure the “premium” brands charge a premium but in a lot of instances it’s not drastically more than a UJM shop and typically the “premium” brand mechanics are factory trained and not a shop monkey fresh out of tech school that got trained on 8 brands. We all have choices and access to information that manufacturers make readily available like service intervals and tasks. Complaining about cost or intervals after buying should be done in the mirror as you made the decision to make the purchase. It’s like buying a Guzzi then complaining there is no dealer network.
The paranoia over changing belts on Ducs is laughable; I'll bet if the bike hasn't been unused for extended periods, they'll last for multiple years and at least 20k miles. Are they not Gates Kevlar reinforced or equivalent? I changed the ones on my "barn find" Monster because it hadn't been done in decades and though not perished/worn in the slightest at ~7k miles, they had a definite formed shape from being stationary. The (shorter/thinner head) tension roller bolts are made of chocolate steel, even the replacements!
Agree or not is your choice but paying a dealer to service and/or maintain ANY motorcycle is going to be expensive no matter the brand. Why is the same sort of pressure not on other brands? Every manufacturer states service intervals and specifies what is to be competed at these intervals. If an owner chooses to stretch, omit or neglect services that does not make them go away.
