To MGNOC, or not to MGNOC, the threadfest

[fotoguzzi]

Grand Marias   ;-T

this was the view from my camp site:

Lake Superior is sublime@!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrAgGqJdYdM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMQ9LdqzUzI
one of our rallys had a couple Hard tails in the campground.. note plate.. these were hard core riders crossing the USA off their bucket list.





visit Wild Goose park no of Thunder Bay if you come round the lake.



off the beaten path along the north shore,

[Silver Goose]

Thanks to all that have reviewed or commented about this topic. It appears the forum is the best place for news and information.

 ;-T

[sknapp351]

As a (just barely) sub-40 year old member, I've been reading this, trying to decide how to contribute to this conversation. It seems that it started with how to get more young people interested in the MG brand of bikes, and has turned into a question of how to get more younger people interested in rallies.

As for interest in the brand, I purchased my Jackal rig from a family member, who originally purchased it on a whim because I had been droning on and on about wanting a sidecar. I did not know the brand, I didn't buy into the club so to speak. As soon as I started riding it, I fell in love. The feel of the bike, the personality won me over. I became an instant ambassador of the goose. However, as someone in an age group that sometimes has to pit even the cheaper motorcycle repair costs against basic bills like rent, utilities, and school loans, the lack of readily available used parts has made me dream of a Honda on occasion. The other issue for younger owners is the lack of available mechanics. I have been very impressed with the availability and willingness of people here to offer advice on repairs, but there is a point where I am stressed that something is wrong and I am sorting through threads and sometimes differing opinions on how this or that should be done. Sometimes, I would like that safety net of knowing that if I can't get it, there is that mechanic in town who has done this hundreds of times before. There is no mechanic (that I've found) in the county I live in who will look at my bike with a tool anywhere near them. As I learn more and more about my bike, this will be less and less of an issue, but if I was 20 with only the basic mechanical skills, this would be a major issue. As it is, my bike was making some odd noises when I last rode it...

As for rallies, I attended my first motorcycle rally in June in SW VA, and even though it was a fiasco for me (rear wheel basically fell apart an hour or so after arriving), I didn't know what I rode there expecting. I wanted to ride, sit and bullshit, drink some whiskey, and make new friends. I can't really say how it went for me, since I was so completely stressed over my situation, I didn't have a chance to really enjoy myself. Had my bike not broken, I think I would have greatly enjoyed it. Had I not been so distracted, I would have recorded the symphony of snoring that started just after 9pm and composed some beautiful, beautiful music from it.

I think I would enjoy something like Sturgis, but probably for only the first day. Maybe the first few hours even. The idea of the spectacle is appealing, but is undoubtedly shallow. The thought of getting laid at the rally never entered my mind as I had been to enough of the lunches to know I never wanted to see Lannis, Ron, or Allyn with their shirts off, none the less any other articles of clothing. And, certainly, nobody wants to see me with my shirt off. The rally I was looking forward to was about socializing, relaxing, and learning about the brand I've invested in.

I think that events might be a part of attracting a younger crowd, but rallies and camp outs might not be the right events. The idea of gatherings at garages or dealers, with bbq, music, merch vendors, and good people might appeal more to younger crowds. These could be a day long event, so they can go home to their kids. Instead of a single event, that people come from far and far away for, these can be smaller, local when possible. These hopefully wouldn't replace the rally, just augment. I've thought a few times about offering to host a bbq for my local group. But, I hesitate to interfere with the regular lunch.

With social media and hand held internet access, socializing has become a constant part of the day for the younger generation. I think a single event, once a year is a strange concept to some. The monthly lunches are really good, but what else could they become. I'm probably talking out my keister right now, but mostly thinking out loud. I'm a bit horrified at how long this reply was, thankfully there isn't a per word charge...

Sam


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Guzzistajohn]

Get real boys, this is what we need to "breathe new life" into this bunch!
http://www.daviddarling.info/images/automated_external_defibrillator.jpg

[Dilliw]

I'm late to the party but to the OP what "club" are you refering to? 

MGNOC is Frank's and unless he breathes new life into it then I'd say you are probably right it's lost.  If you read the "Club History" on the website it seems to stop somewhere in the late '90s.  MGNOC is definately not a "club" but a product owned by a person and he can (and seems to) do as he pleases.

Wildguzzi is a website and a place to share information and ejoy written conversation.  It's not a club either and anyone can join in, share information, or just read.  Luap and the mods do a great job of keeping things straight and I was very happy when added the donation button to support their efforts. 
It's where I get all of my rally information and through its messaging where most of my informal ride planning comes from.

I am, however, a member of the Moto Guzzi Owners Club of Georgia even though I live in SC.  They have a website and have reqular monthly meetings, informal rides as well as a fall "campout."  The site does point you to the MGNOC and Wayne is the GA MGNOC rep but I'm not sure what other relationship there is between the two financial or otherwise.  Regardless Wayne and Vicky (and Screamday through Carolina Riders) were the first Guzzi folks we met and their friendship along with the others in the GA club are a big  reason we've stayed with the brand so long.  I would support it financially if I could but the guy running it can be difficult to deal with :) 

So If were to breathe some life it would be local.  Even though I'm in SC the GA group is what I consider to be the club.

[PJPR01]

Maybe consider that the Moto Guzzi Owners group will always be in this country a relatively small group of Guzzi fans - size is less important, and age is less important, what matters is whether you enjoy the interaction or activities put on by the club.  I really enjoyed last year's GRIT rally here in Texas, couldn't make it to the one this year, but I think we were up till past midnight around the campfire - great camaraderie and hospitality by all and a nice gathering.    I'm tempted to do the New Hampshire rally...although that's quite a trek on the bike...and Ouray...well that's heaven on earth...one of my favorite places in the whole US.

I've been a member of the Houston Land Rover club for 9 years...some years it had tons of activities, other years it has been quieter, we all still share the love of Land Rovers and it's cyclical as well at times.  I've also been an on/off member of the Porsche Lone Star Club - I've done a couple of events with them, they are well organized and lots of fun and activities.

I think with Guzzi - it's a smaller group of fans, and people come in one by one rather than by the dozens...either way, it's mystical, magical and exciting as well as entertaining...who cares what age someone is...if they are interesting, adventurous and have a sense of humour...what more is needed?

Cheers fellas...from "freezing" Houston... ha ha!

[Ronkom]

Another MGNOC State Rep here: Alice & I took on the job of being the Virginia Reps in 1992. Back then the order of business was trying to keep the Virginia Moto Guzzi Owners Club alive (sound familiar?). Yes, I have an actual Charter from the MGNOC, Issued April 11,1980, signed by Gale S. Simson over the title "National Director". The VMGOC formed in Tidewater (Norfolk/Virginia Beach/Chesapeake/Portsmouth) by a group of Guzzi enthusiasts, many in the Navy stationed there. There was a dealer in Va Beach, and the club held it's meetings in a room on the second floor over the dealership. An especially active member of the club was from the Western part of the state, familiar with Sherando Lake & motivated the group to move the Va rally there in 1982. (The first Sherando rally was actually the second Va rally).    
I bought my first Guzzi in 1981 & attended my first rally (Emmaus Pa.) in 1982. I was 36 years old, got Thoroughly "droned" howled at the moon, partied hearty, (fortunately) survived all that stupidity........an d LOVED it. I joined the Va club &got as active as I could....from 230 miles away. Through the later 80's the VMGOC suffered from the dealership closing, Navy people being transferred & retiring, divorces etc. etc. AND a schism developed between the MGNOC Rep (Located near Richmond) and the Tidewater group. The Rep wanted to move the rally closer to the center of the state & most other members were happy with Sherando. It resulted in TWO Va. rallies one year (a "MGNOC" & a "VMGOC"). After the Rep's rally was poorly attended he decided to resign. My thought was "This is ridiculous, a small group of people with a common passion can't get along???? I can get along with almost anybody".  So, I wrote a letter to Frank Wedge & got a box of MGNOC stationary with our names as new Va Reps....that & our MGNOC Memberships free pretty much all I've  ever received from Frank. I worked with the remaining core of the Tidewater group, trying to figure ways to recruit members (especially that elusive 10% who will actually DO something), but it was all just banging our heads against a tide of change. We ended up dropping all the formal trappings of a club, meetings,  dues, officers, etc. Those of us who put on the various Guzzi meets around the State are all "Directors" of the VMGOC. The Va rally is "the" Va yearly event. The last of the Tidewater group were retiring from the Navy etc. & handed the "rallymaster" job to Alice & I in 1998. We did the National in 2000 (with MUCH appreciated help from the North Carolina and Maryland/DC MGNOC Reps, along with more good folks than I can list here). We did the job until 2007. We were burned pretty crispy by then & were fortunate to have Roger & Marilyn Davis take over for a planned 5 years culminating in a National in 2012. R&M did one extra year in 2013. For 2014 Alice & I are again fortunate & grateful to have Kurt & Sue Nordstrom step up & accept the responsibility. They stepped into a mess. Weather & scheduling issues had resulted in low attendance at the '12 National & '13 Va state rallies. Festering problems with our old rally location dictated a relocation. A dwindling, aging group of volunteers demanded changes to lighten the workload. Kurt & Sue took over with fresh ideas & enthusiasm, streamlining the rally with: On line preregistration. On line advance ordering of tshirts.  No doorprizes. All meals catered. We were gratified by a good turn-out and a smoothly run event (especially with all the changes from  "the way we've always done it")    
As to the question that heads this thread, "breath new life" is what we're all trying to do. The future of the "rally" is a microcosm. It all comes down to good folks having time energy & enthusiasm they are willing to share.
Ronkom  
  

[dilligaf]

Dililw said: :It's where I get all of my rally information and through its messaging where most of my informal ride planning comes from".
Without MGNOC there would be no state reps. Without state reps the number of MG get together would be reduced to little more than a few camp in's, if that.
Without MGNOC most get together would amount to little more that someone posting on WG suggesting we all get together at such and such.
In my travels when I speak to a MG rider some post on WG, many do not.
My impression is that not that many WG posters attend rallies and, for them, MGNOC would not be missed.
I will continue to support the MGNOC and, for those of you who are not members, I ask you to join.  :BEER:
Matt

[Arizona Wayne]

Dililw said: :It's where I get all of my rally information and through its messaging where most of my informal ride planning comes from".
Without MGNOC there would be no state reps. Without state reps the number of MG get together would be reduced to little more than a few camp in's, if that.
without MGNOC most get together would amount to little more that someone posting on WG suggesting we all get together at such and such.
In my travels when I speak to a MG rider some post on WG, many do not.
My impression is that not that many WG posters attend rallies and WG would not be missed.
I will continue to support the MGNOC and, for those of you who are not members, I ask you to join.  :BEER:
Matt

There are hundreds of MGNOC members who participate in rallies that know nothing about WG. Don't even use a computer.   WG serves 1 purpose and MGNOC another, real rallies, breakfasts, campouts.  You can go to the MGNOC website, see what, where their events are, maybe join 1 and see these committed riders for your selves.   Who knows, you might decide to join them.  MGNOC members represent more of the Guzzi faithful than WG does and has a much larger total count.

[oldbike54]

So MGNOC has 10,000 members ? That was the last figure I heard re WG membership . Funny , the next National is already being discussed on WG , and most of the state rallies are discussed and promoted here . Sure , lots of old farts don't have computers , but that is changing rapidly . As for the REAL rally question , none of our local stuff is sanctioned anymore , folks still show up , talk and ride Guzzi , have fun . Sorry , kind of find it silly to define them as not REAL .

  Dusty

[Arizona Wayne]

So MGNOC has 10,000 members ? That was the last figure I heard re WG membership . Funny , the next National is already being discussed on WG , and most of the state rallies are discussed and promoted here . Sure , lots of old farts don't have computers , but that is changing rapidly . As for the REAL rally question , none of our local stuff is sanctioned anymore , folks still show up , talk and ride Guzzi , have fun . Sorry , kind of find it silly to define them as not REAL .

  Dusty

What I mean by real is how many show up.   All the Guzzi rallies I've been to it's 80 to 500+ that show up.  I've been to 1 NAR so far and it was maybe 25.

[redrider90]

Actually Matt , the Admins and Mods here are doing this for free .

  Dusty

Yep Dusty you got it right. They do it out of love of the Guzzi community. I have no problem with Frank Wedge doing a members only for profit (that is if he does make a profit) newsletter but WG beats the heck of MGNOC. Realtime help for Guizzi's in trouble. Plus lots of non-Guzzi stuff. Heck someone started a freaking sewing machine thread this week. Talk about men being men.  MGNOC doesn't do that. There is more technical help here than I can find in Guzziology (apologizes to Dave Richardson).

[dilligaf]

What I mean by real is how many show up.   All the Guzzi events I've been to it's 80 to 500+ that show up.  I've been to 1 NAR so far and it was maybe 25.

Yep, and that would be the 25 folks who post on WG that go to--rallies.  And good on them.  ;-T  Marion and I sure enjoy their company.  ;D  I just wish those who are not MGNOC members would join.
We tend to resent Frank for trying to make a profit on the service he offers and while the admins and mods may not be getting a piece of the action(Thank You), someone is making money off of WG.  ::( :BEER:
Matt

[redrider90]

Yep, and that would be the 25 folks who post on WG that go to--rallies.  And good on them.  ;-T  Marion and I sure enjoy their company.  ;D  I just wish those who are not MGNOC members would join.
We tend to resent Frank for trying to make a profit on the service he offers and while the admins and mods may not be getting a piece of the action(Thank You), someone is making money off of WG.  ::( :BEER:
Matt

Who resents Frank for making a profit?  He puts a lot of work into MGNOC but no one has to join if they do not want to. When I joined WG no one asked me for a penny yet it costs to keep WG running. If LUAP et. al. make a few bucks then so be it. But I offered up a few bucks to keep this online. It is fun and a great resource for all things Guzzi and and many other things. The only time it gets loopy is with gun threads.....  ;D ;D ;D then all bets are off.  ;)

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Yep, and that would be the 25 folks who post on WG that go to--rallies.  And good on them.  ;-T  Marion and I sure enjoy their company.  ;D  I just wish those who are not MGNOC members would join.
We tend to resent Frank for trying to make a profit on the service he offers and while the admins and mods may not be getting a piece of the action(Thank You), someone is making money off of WG.  ::( :BEER:
Matt

When does the "statute of limitations" run out on Guzzi owners "owing" Frank for all of his past service? IMO, he's been well compensated by now and we don't owe him anything more. I gave him three chances to retain me as a member but his apathetic attitude towards resolving the issues I was having put me off permanently. I still help with the MD Rally and promote the brand every chance I get, but there's little chance I will ever rejoin the MGNOC.  

[Arizona Wayne]

Yep, and that would be the 25 folks who post on WG that go to--rallies.  And good on them.  ;-T  Marion and I sure enjoy their company.  ;D  I just wish those who are not MGNOC members would join.
We tend to resent Frank for trying to make a profit on the service he offers and while the admins and mods may not be getting a piece of the action(Thank You), someone is making money off of WG.  ::( :BEER:
Matt

Why shouldn't someone make any $ off their effort and idea?   Unless you think like a communist I don't see why a person would care if they do.  Does anyone here prefer to work for nothing??   ~;

[dilligaf]

ACC wrote: "When does the "statute of limitations" run out on Guzzi owners "owing" Frank for all of his past service? IMO, he's been well compensated by now and we don't owe him anything more".

And that Sir is your opinion.  ::(  I just don't happen to share it.  ;D  With out Frank and MGNOC I don't think you would have a MD Rally to help with. Frank must be doing something right. Sure has some folks resenting him.   :o  Best way not to upset folks is to sit on your thumbs and do nothing.  :BEER:
Matt

[freedom]

If you want to attract younger people to the owners group how about we ask the very people we want? It is a novel idea but it might just work!  ;D ;D ;D ;D
Seriously a bunch of old guys (I consider myself old too) talking about how to get younger people to come to join your club is like a bunch of nuns talking about what brand of condom is best for guys to use.

Most younger people are on facebook, or twitter, or instagram. The first thing you would want to do is have a presence on one of these sites and try to engage with them there. There is already a Moto Guzzi Owners group on facebook - https://www.facebook.com/groups/328264358708/?fref=nf if anyone on here is interested.

[dilligaf]

I'm not into face book but that appears to be the MGNOC.

The MGNOC (Moto Guzzi National Owners Club) is a friendly group to belong to. Here you'll find sociable Guzzi people, great times, and Moto Guzzi Information direct to you from Moto Guzzi enthusiasts World Wide. Please keep your posts on topic and remember we have members of all ages, races and religions, try not to offend anyone.  :BEER:
Matt

[rodekyll]

There are hundreds of MGNOC members who participate in rallies that know nothing about WG. Don't even use a computer.   WG serves 1 purpose and MGNOC another, real rallies, breakfasts, campouts.  You can go to the MGNOC website, see what, where their events are, maybe join 1 and see these committed riders for your selves.   Who knows, you might decide to join them.  MGNOC members represent more of the Guzzi faithful than WG does and has a much larger total count.

So . . .  if hundreds of mgnoc members don't have a computer and Frank has ceased to communicate in any other media but his website, how do all these phantom members stay in touch?

I've seen a few references to the huge membership of mgnoc compared to WG.  Frank doesn't publish his active membership stats.  How do you arrive at this conclusion?

To answer the OP directly -- The MGNOC is what FRANK wants it to be.  Our opinion doesn't count.  It's his business and his show.  If Frank thought the 'club' needed new life, he'd be doing something to make it so -- and he's not.  If he wanted his website to have a member forum it would be there.  It's not.  That's because these discussions would be happening there if a forum existed, and he doesn't want to hear about it.

But in my opinion, this is the wrong battle for the mgnoc faithful to be fighting.  If mgnoc members are concerned about the life of the group now, just wait until Frank is no longer in the mix.  With no club structure, no officers, no club treasury, no meetings, 'member' input not welcomed, and no plan for a successor, what happens to the 'club' then?  I think it bites the dust in a heartbeat.  So I think the battle should be to figure out what happens to the mgnoc post-Frank.  No plan, no future for the club.  It's that simple.

Once again, $0.02

[redrider]

Well Folks, I joined up today. I also have some spare time to assist with a SC Rally.

[bad Chad]

I recall a decade back Frank said in the news letter MGNOC had something around 1600 members.   That number is surely less today.  Draw your own conclusions.

[rodekyll]

I recall a decade back Frank said in the news letter MGNOC had something around 1600 members.   That number is surely less today.  Draw your own conclusions.

Folks in this topic have placed the number of members at 10,000, and the dues at $30/yr.  You're saying it's closer to 1600.  So the (essentially one-way) revenue stream is somewhere between $48,000 and a $quarter million/yr.  It's a good gig if you can get enough volunteers out to do your recruitment for you, especially if you don't use any of those 'dues' to promote the 'club'.  Me, I don't care for the Kool-Aid.

[oldbike54]

Folks in this topic have placed the number of members at 10,000, and the dues at $30/yr.  You're saying it's closer to 1600.  So the (essentially one-way) revenue stream is somewhere between $48,000 and a $quarter million/yr.  It's a good gig if you can get enough volunteers out to do your recruitment for you, especially if you don't use any of those 'dues' to promote the 'club'.  Me, I don't care for the Kool-Aid.

That "10,000 figure was from me in reference to the number of WG members after someone suggested that MGNOC had a higher membership than WG . Actually probably closer to 6,000 , which still dwarfs the MGNOC if the 1600 number is valid .

  Dusty

[rocker59]

Wild Guzzi number is currently around 10,000.  Growing every day.

If MGNOC is 2,000 I'd be surprised.  I expect it's less.

[dilligaf]

Wild Guzzi number is currently around 10,000.  Growing every day.

If MGNOC is 2,000 I'd be surprised.  I expect it's less.

 ::) Looks to me like it has between 20 or 30.  :BEER:
Matt

[Silver Goose]

I met Frank in person one time. He saw my new Stelvio and ask if I was a MGNOC member. My answer was quick and to the point. I explained that I had been a member, but saw no benefit and felt that the forum was the future.

I have used the forum many times for rally dates and tech information. All of the information is current and offers many different views to solve a problem(s). I resect the knowledge level and the interest shown by the members of the forum.

While I do not expect anyone to work for no money, I respect the effort that is freely given here.

As far as Mr. Wedge, I respectfully ask him for any input to this post and to have a good life. This post is not a bashing of the MGNOC, but to gain insight as to how the make the Guzzi experience as good as possible.

[oldbike54]

Wild Guzzi number is currently around 10,000.  Growing every day.

If MGNOC is 2,000 I'd be surprised.  I expect it's less.

Luap did tell me 10,000 after you told me 6,000 , Chet just gave me a blank look when the subject came up at 3AM  during the monsoon in OK this year ;D Either way , that is damned amazing and shows that WG is healthy and yes growing everyday  ;-T Might have something to do with the dues being voluntary and the variety of subjects that get discussed here on a daily basis . The instantaneous nature is also nice .


  Dusty

[Lannis]

Wild Guzzi number is currently around 10,000.  Growing every day.

If MGNOC is 2,000 I'd be surprised.  I expect it's less.

Yeah, but what does that "10,000" really mean?   It's an interactive discussion forum.  THOUSANDS of those "members" have never posted, or posted once since they signed up.   And how many of them are just freeloaders?   That hardly counts, on the principle of "If you're not paying for it, you're not the customer.  You're the product being sold."

It apparently bothers the crap out of some people that Frank Wedge and the MGNOC actually exist.   How is it skin off of anyone's nose if they do?  What, does your state withhold taxes from your paycheck to support MGNOC?   I'm amazed that people think it has to be some sort of pissing or d!ck-measuring contest to see who the REAL Rulers Of The Guzzi World are. 

I belong to both, support both, and are glad for what each one of them does.   

Lannis

[oldbike54]

I think the controversy starts when it is suggested that WG and the MGNOC should be merged and only MGNOC members should have access t0 WG , how does that grow the clan  ??? Personally MGNOC is kind of a neutral thing , although 3 of the last 4 OK reps have been friends . The hard feelings seem to start when the inference is made that if one chooses to not "belong" they aren't "real" . As for the numbers , well, maybe there are only 50 or so loudmouths here (pointing the finger at myself) , but a much larger number read the forum everyday .

  Dusty