gutsibits external oil filter kit ENA 14005

[borgmann]

Hi folks
I'm interested in fitting an external oilfilter sump kit
the good folk at gutsibits in the UK have them , has any one on this site fitted one?
Part no ENA 14005 ,looks like a well made piece of equipment,
any opinions?
With thanks Max B.

[Vasco DG]

Probably is. Probably also a stolen piece of someone else's intellectual property too. Poor bastards. It's hard being a thief and living in whatever Northern hell-hole they operate out of.

Pete

[Rough Edge racing]

  The adapter in question looks like this....

   

[Vasco DG]

Dunno. The Harper's might chime in. It looks a lot like one of theirs. Thing about plagiarisms is they aren't fussy about who they rip off as long as they're making a quid.

Pete

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

  The adapter in question looks like this....

   

Says right on it... SD TEC... Stein Dinse.

[Curtis Harper]

That one is not one of ours. I prefer to think the Outsider is a much superior part. Also supplied by much nicer people and we ship to Australia daily.

Depending on which bike you are fitting, below are the links. Outsider kits come complete with hardware, gaskets, filter and instructions.

http://www.harpermoto.com/harpers-outsider-for-1998-and-newer-machines.html

http://www.harpermoto.com/harpers-outsider-for-pre-1998-moto-guzzi.html

[mtiberio]

Pete, are these the guys that ripped off your sump plate?

[Vasco DG]

Yup.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Pete, are these the guys that ripped off your sump plate?

Which guys: Stein Dinse or Gutsibits?

[Vasco DG]

The latter.

[Stevex]

I live but 50 odd miles from this fabled Northern hell-hole, I've used Gutsibits on a few occasions recently.
This is mainly because they are now the UK's most prominent supplier of parts for old (and new) Guzzi's.
I've had to return some of their pattern parts because they didn't meet my standards of quality, and I'm comparing their pattern parts to the originals I remember fitted to my original 1980 Le Mans II, which I bought new in er...1980.
30 years on I would have expected at least equivalent quality.
Having said that, they've supplied a number of parts that are of the desired quality I require.
Since returning to Guzzi via another 1980 Le Mans II, based entirely on my memories and experiences of the original LM2, I've become aware of many, many things Guzzi that I had no idea of in the 80's; that's the interweb for you.
One of the many new facts I've learnt about is Mr Pete Roper and the Guzzi guru he is.
Also, that he is responsible for the 'Roper plate' which I believe has been incorporated into the manufacture of the sump which is the talking point of this thread.
Although I've questioned the quality of some of Gutsibits pattern parts, they've never come across as thieves, but then I don't know them personally.
Pete, may I ask how they ripped off your sump plate?

[Vasco DG]

I presume bought one and copied it.

Their offering is not just similar, it's IDENTICAL. In fact they replicated two of my products.

If they had simply had the courtesy to ask I would probably have said add an extra five bux to the price and give it to medicine sans frontiers for every sale and good luck. The fact they just pinched it shits me to tears.

Pete

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

The "Roper Sloppage Plate":



Gutsibits plate:

[Steph]

I'll chime in with my personal experience of Gutsibits.
I have bought several used parts from them and the service has been excellent.
They will speak to you and email you multiple photos of the item before you buy.
On one occasion the EV luggage rack did not fit my Cali Stone and THEY organized and paid for the return shipping. All I had to do is shove it back in the cardboard box and wait for the courier and I got a full refund.
I have never seen them, but on the phone they have always been more then helpful to me.
It sort of hurts me all this bad blood whenever their name is mentioned. -They have been more then alright with me.

Pete, reference your plate being copied by them. When you raised that thread way back then. I emailed them so they can provide an explanation The guy emailed me back that he doesn't get involved in forum debates and that the plates were from a supplier and they had nothing to do with the design.

[Vasco DG]

So they're happy to buy copies from thieves. Same thing in my book.Respect not regained.

Pete

[Offcamber1]

Hmmm.  Stein Dinse part number is Product no.: 200099020   Not ENA 14005

http://www.stein-dinse.biz/Moto-Guzzi/Motor/Oil-Circuit/Oelwannen-u-Zwischenringe/External-filter-ring-flange-filter-at-front::819.html?language=sc

Looks like a damned fine copy though.  You don't suppose Stein Dinse copied the gutsibits adapter? 

[borgmann]

  The adapter in question looks like this....

   

thanks for the comments guy's ,
the sump kit looks nothing like the one you're all talking about.
the filter is mounted in a recess under the sump similar to BMW s
and has the same depth [82mm ] as the stock sump.
be sure of the facts before you accuse people of intellectual theft.
[check out part number ENA 14005 on gutsybits website]

[Vasco DG]

I know nothing of the part in question, only of the questionable practices of the operators of the business.

Pete

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

thanks for the comments guy's ,
the sump kit looks nothing like the one you're all talking about.
the filter is mounted in a recess under the sump similar to BMW s
and has the same depth [82mm ] as the stock sump.
be sure of the facts before you accuse people of intellectual theft.
[check out part number ENA 14005 on gutsybits website]

Gutsibits ENA 14005 is most likely made by G&G and is the same piece sold by MG Cycle as MG368. Looks identical in the photos:






Sold by Stein-Dinse as well:
http://www.stein-dinse.biz/Complete-partlist/Nicht-mehr-lieferbar/oilpan-G-G-Oelfilter-exterior::129874.html

[borgmann]

[/quote] that's the item Antietam.
I'm still wondering whether anyone has fitted one of these oil pans.
as for the negative comments levelled at gutsibits, every person sees things according to their experience I guess international patents will protect your  invention.
the reason I wish to use the ENA14005 kit is because it retains stock ground clearance height.
as well as it looks a more robust option than a filter mounted to a 15mm spacer ring with bracing plates bolted to the oil pan.
if I was to cut an anti cavitation plate for a guzzi motor it would look fairly similar to the roper plate .
After all the engineering of the surrounding parts dictates its shape.
Hope you all enjoy your weekend ,riding these great  bikes.
With thanks Max B.
 

[Vasco DG]

  Have you any idea how much a patent costs? For a product selling a few dozen a year it simply isn't viable.

You rely on basic human decency. It's in short supply it seems.

You have a good weekend too.

Pete

[O]

I'm surprised at the amount of rationalization from certain members here.  Pete is one of the most helpful, generous, and entertaining folks on this board, yet many seem ready to support a company that outright stole from him. WTF?! 

[oranges3]

Got one of thoseonmy 2003 ev11.
Pricey but very nice and makes oil changes a snap.
Well worth it for quick and painless oil changes.

[56Pan]

I'm surprised at the amount of rationalization from certain members here.  Pete is one of the most helpful, generous, and entertaining folks on this board, yet many seem ready to support a company that outright stole from him. WTF?!

 :1: Couldn't agree more.  It was theft, pure and simple. 

[Triple Jim]

Have you any idea how much a patent costs? For a product selling a few dozen a year it simply isn't viable.

It's worse than that.  25 years ago or so, I got a couple patents issued and kept the cost minimal by doing the work myself, making the drawings and writing the claims, with guidance from a retired patent examiner.  Then another company began selling a product that infringed on my patents.  I went to a patent attorney, who told me that it did appear that the other company was infringing, but there was a rule of thumb:  If the product isn't grossing at least a million dollars per year, it's not worth defending the patent.  In other words, trying to defend it would be more expensive than the loss caused by the infringement.

Then there's the additional complication of trying to get and defend an international patent.

[dawdish]

I installed this one from MG. dont have cut any fins, and the filter is to the rear.

http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=68_162&products_id=2216

[Turin]

Besides being thieves (or enabling thieves at best) they must not be very bright. The Guzzi community is very small. Didn't they guess that this would come out? They claimed they bought the plates from a supplier. Okay. They have been informed that the product they are selling is a knock off. Fine. Then the right thing to do would be to pull it from the website and don't order anymore. Better yet order a batch from Pete to promote some good will.

Either way you slice it, Gutsibits has gone out of their way to earn the ire of a lot of potential customers. I'll never order anything from them.

[Rough Edge racing]

  Business is ruthless , and any one in business including me knows you get stabbed in the back all the time. And it isn't the loss of blood but the sheer weight of the knives that brings you down...
  If DG Vasco  made the part and another guy took the design and calls it his own, then the only thing you can do is complain to the thief. And not buy the product...And patented items are still copied despite the laws.
 Triumph recently went on a campaign recently to enforce the copyright on the 30's-70's logo...Some were pissed because they couldn't use it to advertise......Same thing for Chevy logo 15 years ago...
 

[Mike Harper]

I installed this one from MG. dont have cut any fins, and the filter is to the rear.

http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=68_162&products_id=2216

This one is a Harper's Outsider knockoff so Pete is not in this alone.

I have been through this argument numerous times since the first design Outsider back in 1977.

Nothing you can really do about it but the fact is they have stolen the design.  All of the copies that have come from Europe are from my original although they have been slightly modified.

The G&G pan is the only one that has designed his own. The original G&G is a nice unit, Can't speak about the one pictured in an earlier post.

[dawdish]

This one is a Harper's Outsider knockoff so Pete is not in this alone.

I have been through this argument numerous times since the first design Outsider back in 1977.

Nothing you can really do about it but the fact is they have stolen the design.  All of the copies that have come from Europe are from my original although they have been slightly modified.

The G&G pan is the only one that has designed his own. The original G&G is a nice unit, Can't speak about the one pictured in an earlier post.

No argument, yet yours is a two or three piece with the filter to the front, theirs is a one piece with the filter to the rear, and its a knock off? That logic would imply that a Guzzi engine is a knock off of a Harley because they're both Vs and use pistons and rods.?????