1200 8V big bore kit at Guzzitech

[flip]

I just saw this at Guzzitech, a big bore kit for the 8V 1200 engines:

http://www.guzzitech.com/store/product/gt-1380-big-bore-pistons-cylinders/

Anyone know anything about it?

[pyoungbl]

Hummm, $1300 for the kit (less gaskets), maybe $100 for the gaskets, another $200-300 to re-balance the crank, then $300 to flash the ECU.   Add in $1,000 for labor and this becomes a really expensive proposition.  I don't see the point.

[JeffOlson]

Interesting. Would this turn my Norge into a "1400" cc Norge with essentially the same motor as the current California "1400"?

[canuguzzi]

Maybe, except the engine on the California is fugly, the one in the Norge, nice.

[Triple Jim]

"Available on backorder"

[pete roper]

Looked at this a while back. There are a variety of reasons why big boring a 1200 is not a straightforward job, it's not simply a matter of buying 1400 barrels and pistons, there are issues with gaskets and the lack of a second plug may cause serious difficulties.

If and when a wrecked 1400 turns up at a decent price Mark and I might look at it but I think the gains will be meagre. It'll be more about bragging rights than performance but that's what that source sells and thrives on.

Pete

[canuguzzi]

$4000-$5000 by the time its all done and if you're not doing it yourself.

[Cool Runnings]

If it was Harley, people would be all over it!

Screamin' Goose.   

[rboe]

Harley would call it something like a Screaming Eagle Stage III kit. Moto Guzzi (err. GuzziTech in this case) needs a cool name to sell this.

Perhaps the Bastard Griso Full Bore Kit. 

[Cam3512]

Not exactly "drop in" if you have to balance the crank?

[beetle]

Rebalance the crank and full remap (which no doubt entails a poorly modified stock map and unnecessary extra hardware) without any consideration of the requirements of the newly cavernous combustion chamber. The 1400 is dual-plugged for a reason.

[cruzziguzzi]

OK, I know I'm in "left field" of the "peanut gallery" and have "no dog in the race" but as a casual observer of these things, how is it that this is available but a aftermarket "roller kit" is not?

Are these different engines; the ones needing rollers and the big-bore kittable ones?

As far as practicality, I guess were a fella to "use up" a 1200 8v, this'd be kinda fun to throw at it in the course of a rebuild.

Wasn't that awful long ago that 1340cc or 80cubic inches was huuuge.


Todd.

[pete roper]

I have no dog in the fight either. The reason for that is because I know there is a lot more to producing a successful capacity increase and performance lift than simply bunging a big set of jugs on.

Mark and I were considering the possibility of doing something like this using Cali 14 parts but the more we looked into it the less appealing it became. If we do go ahead with it at some point it would purely be for the intellectual challenge and at least my guess is that it would be a disappointing waste of money. Even if you could get it to burn acceptably with a single plug if you're using the W5AM there is no real way to know how some of the unknown correction tables in the ECU are going to react when asked to cope with the big input changes needed with that sort of capacity hike. It might do it easily. It might also turn into a huge, colossal shitfight! Let's face it some pretty strange stuff happens even when you play with simple things like the CO trim!

Pete

[oldbike54]

 "Wasn't all that long ago" that formula 1 ran 1.5 liter normally aspirated engines that produced 160 HP, and the racing was good .

 Dusty

[AH Fan]

Ya ............. I'm with Pete on this EXPENSIVE science experiment.

 

[Rox]

So how much would this kit bump the numbers on an 8v motor?

[molly]

You don't see as many motorcylce big bore kits these days. It was a lot easier with carbs so maybe fuel injection is the stumbling block.

[beetle]

So how much would this kit bump the numbers on an 8v motor?

Look at the specs of the 1400.

[bpreynolds]

Seems like I would actually be more curious/interested in kits for the 1100???

[leafman60]

You don't see as many motorcylce big bore kits these days. It was a lot easier with carbs so maybe fuel injection is the stumbling block.

The H-D motors have a huge array of aftermarket and factory direct, bolt-on kits available. Many people make big bore kits for the Big Twin.

I am amazed at what the factory offers in their Screamin Eagle (SE) catalog now. You can buy a bolt-on big bore kit to take your 96-inch or 103 stock motor out to 110 CID without splitting the cases now for 1195.00.

A friend picked up his CVO Ultra last Friday. It was already a whopping 110 CID and he had H-D bolt on H-D parts to take it out to 117 inches.

He went whole hog(!) too. H-D offers several iterations of ported heads that are as cheap or cheaper than having a porter do the work. He went with the 117 (1927 cc) big bore kit, ported heads, roller rockers and a power cam, all bolt-on things from H-D.

Their first dyno run showed 120+ HP and 125 torque at the rear wheel at about 5000 RPM. He is breaking it in now before having the final mapping done to squeeze a bit more out of it.

He had already installed Screamin Eagle (SE) gas-charged cartridges in his forks and SE rear shocks.

I have to really work to stay up with him on my Stelvio!  In fact, in a direct top gear roll-on, the H-D will walk away from the Guzzi!

I'm considering making my Super Glide a 110.

[kevdog3019]

Before everyones knickers get too tightly wadded about this kit of Todd's, why doesn't someone ask him what's needed?  Todd doesn't usually throw out something he has no knowledge of.  I'm betting he's done the experiment.
K

[Xlratr]

Well, somebody has to say it....

"There ain't no substitute for cubes"   

[leafman60]

Well, somebody has to say it....

"There ain't no substitute for cubes"   

Or -  There's no replacement for displacement.

[leafman60]

Or -  There's no replacement for displacement.

Or -  Way too much is just about right.

[kingoffleece]

"To much is just enough!".

[Cool Runnings]

The H-D motors have a huge array of aftermarket and factory direct, bolt-on kits available. Many people make big bore kits for the Big Twin.

I am amazed at what the factory offers in their Screamin Eagle (SE) catalog now. You can buy a bolt-on big bore kit to take your 96-inch or 103 stock motor out to 110 CID without splitting the cases now for 1195.00.

A friend picked up his CVO Ultra last Friday. It was already a whopping 110 CID and he had H-D bolt on H-D parts to take it out to 117 inches.

He went whole hog(!) too. H-D offers several iterations of ported heads that are as cheap or cheaper than having a porter do the work. He went with the 117 (1927 cc) big bore kit, ported heads, roller rockers and a power cam, all bolt-on things from H-D.

Their first dyno run showed 120+ HP and 125 torque at the rear wheel at about 5000 RPM. He is breaking it in now before having the final mapping done to squeeze a bit more out of it.

He had already installed Screamin Eagle (SE) gas-charged cartridges in his forks and SE rear shocks.

I have to really work to stay up with him on my Stelvio!  In fact, in a direct top gear roll-on, the H-D will walk away from the Guzzi!

I'm considering making my Super Glide a 110.

He should now be a good race for the Norge GT 8V. 

[Cool Runnings]

Or -  There's no replacement for displacement.

Still miss my old 429SCJ.

[Rox]

Look at the specs of the 1400.

Would be a little inaccurate on displaying performance . The 8v is geared and fuelled much differently. If looking at the 1400 Cali is the example it would be a downgrade.

I'll email Todd at Guzzitech and ask.

[LowRyter]

I applaud anyone building a 125+ HP Guzzi not matter how.

[lucian]

My guess is you'd be giving up some top end rev's for some more torque down low , as is the case with the 1400. If I could change anything on my 8v griso it would be to a lighter flywheel, clutch, and  lower gearing . Would hate to give up any top end as that's where the 8v shines. My other guess is knowing Todd he has the answers we're looking for, can't wait to learn more.