"I know, I know, you'll probably scream and cry...": Learning to tune the Bassa

[normzone]

Looking at the calendar, and next week I have committed to the next stage in putting my dentist's kids through college, so I don't think a trip to the tuner is in the cards any time soon.

I'm always slow to come up to speed, but I'm beginning to wrap my head around doing rudimentary tuning work on the Bassa.

Of course, some of you will say " But first...are you experienced? Or have you ever been experienced? Well, I am..."

At least, that's what I'm hoping some of you will say. Others of you may simply choose to mock me, and find cheap entertainment at my expense. I'll be kinda disappointed if you don't - I'm going to need something to read while waiting for the technical experts to put down their beers and share their wisdom.

But I synced the carbs on the Eldo without sucking the mercury into the engine, unlike the fellow I loaned the synch tool to later on. And I was looking under the tank and between the carbs injector thingies, and I can see that there's...stuff...in there. I figure once I clean it all up, scrape off all that yellow paint and make certain that those screws can still be turned I'll be well on my way to a better running bike.

In the last thousand miles, I've changed oil and air filter. New plugs and a valve adjustment happened yesterday. So I think I met [rodekyll]'s starting requirements. Oh, and it has gas in the tank - that can make a difference, I've learned.

[oldbike54]

 
 In a Cheech Marin accent
   

                                                             You can do it !

 Dusty

[guzzisteve]

That one has 2 magic screws that you have to turn.

[rodekyll]

You keep saying you'll be scraping the paint off the screws and checking to see that the screws move freely.  I'm hoping you jest, but in the event that you are serious, I'll just say that if you mess with those screws or their paint before having an extremely good idea of what you're doing when you mess with the paint and the screws, we'll have to part company.  I don't have free time to fix what happens when you do that.  Nobody does.

[Chuck in Indiana]

You keep saying you'll be scraping the paint off the screws and checking to see that the screws move freely.  I'm hoping you jest, but in the event that you are serious, I'll just say that if you mess with those screws or their paint before having an extremely good idea of what you're doing when you mess with the paint and the screws, we'll have to part company.  I don't have free time to fix what happens when you do that.  Nobody does.

Yeah, a little study and a rudimentary understanding of "how it works" will be good for a start before wiggling screws. It's *not* rocket science and you *can* do it.. but.. don't take too cavalier an approach. Beyond there be dragons.

[oldbike54]

  Relatively sure Norm is not serious about the yellow paint thing .

 Dusty

[normzone]

Wow, you mean those threads about the untouchable screws were about THOSE screws ?

 

If it reassures you guys any, my sense of humor exceeds my common sense sometimes, but a couple of years as an auto mechanic in my early twenties instilled a strong sense of "don't !@#$ with that unless you know what you're doing".

I did explode a carb into about a thousand pieces once, thinking I was doing the right thing. My boss put it back together, and I didn't make that mistake again.

[rodekyll]

Just wanted to get that cleared up.   

[fotoguzzi]

if the yellow paint is still all over the tps and air screws then you motor has probably never been tuned and that's why someone added the PC.. erongly thinking they could tune it that way.. you might be amazed at how well the motor works once it does get set properly.

here's a little look at how the TB's work.. I'm no mechanic and some will dispute the second stop screw as moot..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVTiUqw8hew

[radguzzi]

" But first...are you experienced? Or have you ever been experienced? Well, I am..."

How to go Jimi...!

If it reassures you guys any, my sense of humor exceeds my common sense sometimes... 

Sometimes...?  True story...! 

Hi Norm,
Don't make me come out there... lol

[normzone]

If I thought it was that easy to get you out here I'd just turn the screws and be damned. I'd probably have to facilitate another multi-million dollar contract to get you back here again. Any of those in the wind at this time? Or are you retired now?

As for that carb in my misspent youth, my boss said to take it off the car, take it apart, and put it in the bucket of carb cleaner in the back. I now understand that what he meant was " Take the sandwich off the engine, break it down into bread, meat, lettuce, and tomato.

Man, I was so proud of myself. I broke that thing down to the sub-atomic level, and I only quit disassembling things 'cause I got tired.

[normzone]

if the yellow paint is still all over the tps and air screws then you motor has probably never been tuned and that's why someone added the PC.. erongly thinking they could tune it that way.. you might be amazed at how well the motor works once it does get set properly.

here's a little look at how the TB's work.. I'm no mechanic and some will dispute the second stop screw as moot..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVTiUqw8hew

Well, that looks simple enough. Remove all the rest of the motorcycle, then tighten an allen wrench. I should be able to do that, but it's going to take a while to get the bike parts removed.

Is it going to be an issue that I don't have a working tach? Is there a piece of test equipment I should buy? I do have a multimeter... Is this where you guys tell me to search the forum?

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=26833.0

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=25447.0

I think at this point I'm going to shout out to the San Diego area riders to see if anybody has the tools...

[Tom H]

Read this:

http://archive.guzzitech.com/EVTuneup-Jeff_B.html

And this:

http://www.dpguzzi.com/efiman.pdf

Adjust the procedure to your bike as needed but the basics work.

And this for the cables from Amazon and WAY more info:

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=69168.0

For a balancer, I bought this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vacuum-Carburetor-Synchronizer-Carb-Sync-Gauge-Two-Cylinder-Bike-Honda-CB-CL-350-/390982697220?hash=item5b08628104&item=390982697220&vxp=mtr

Yes, you can make one at home, but even the suspender version I would have had to chase down and buy all the parts. Sometimes it's easier just to buy one.

Remember the paperclip to the test leads, works great.

Good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tom

[Zoom Zoom]

<snip> valve adjustment happened yesterday. <snip>

What setting did you use for the valve gap?


John Henry

[John A]

Read over it, think on it and dive in. If you screw it up, what it costs to get it fixed is the price of that particular lesson.

[normzone]

Thanks all - I set the valves for 5 & 7. Is it a good idea to use the more conservative 4 & 6 ?

My thinking was influenced by the error inherent in all measurement, and the thought that a little too loose was better than a little too tight. Common sense or heresy? Bear in mind I come from an Eldorado background, so that was my early influence.

[Wayne Orwig]

It's all good.
Get to wide, and you make more noise and hammer the tops of the valve stems harder. Get too small, and you run the risk of burning a valve. But you have a lot of tolerance there. So 4/6 or 5/7 is fine.

[oldbike54]

Thanks all - I set the valves for 5 & 7. Is it a good idea to use the more conservative 4 & 6 ?

My thinking was influenced by the error inherent in all measurement, and the thought that a little too loose was better than a little too tight. Common sense or heresy? Bear in mind I come from an Eldorado background, so that was my early influence.

 5 and 7 what ?

 Dusty

[normzone]

I know you jest - thousandths of an inch. No, wait...angstroms.

[oldbike54]

I know you jest - thousandths of an inch. No, wait...angstroms.

 I thought the specs called for 5 and 10 thou ??? Or the Euro specs do .

 Dusty

[Chuck in Indiana]

I thought the specs called for 5 and 10 thou ??? Or the Euro specs do .

 Dusty

Well, maybe on one of those stone age derelicts that you ride..  

[oldbike54]

Well, maybe on one of those stone age derelicts that you ride..  

 Hey , I've at least moved into the late 20th century (read as electric carburetors)  Besides , Norm's bike is a '99 model .

 Dusty

[oldbike54]

 Well dang , reading some old threads , and a couple of manuals , we get figures of .10 mm and .15 mm ,and.004 or .005 in and anywhere from .008 to .010 in . All very confusing . At least with airhead beemers there is a consensus of .004 in and .008 in . Tricky Italians  Always used the larger specs with no problems , dunno .

 Dusty

[chaoselephant23]

Well, that looks simple enough. Remove all the rest of the motorcycle, then tighten an allen wrench. I should be able to do that, but it's going to take a while to get the bike parts removed.

Is it going to be an issue that I don't have a working tach? Is there a piece of test equipment I should buy? I do have a multimeter... Is this where you guys tell me to search the forum?

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=26833.0

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=25447.0

I think at this point I'm going to shout out to the San Diego area riders to see if anybody has the tools...

fotoguzzi's video is dissembling. You can do the tune on the bike. Much easier to show which screws do what when the TBs are off the bike.

Having a tach won't matter, as long as GuzziDiag is in play. GuzziDiag can output the engine speed in RPM's.

You'll definitely need a throttle body synchronizer. I have been using a CarbMate TS-111 with great success. But mercury sticks or the home brew variety will do.

I put this guide together based off a Guzzi training video (referenced in the PDF), GuzziDiag post here on WildGuzzi.com and information gathered while trawling this forum and the internet at large. Video went very quickly. Too quick in fact. I prefer to have the information distilled so I can read it slowly and at my pace. Hopefully it helps you conquer your mission.

[Zoom Zoom]

Dusty, 4 and 6 thou on yours and Norms bikes. Us spec was tighter.

John Henry

[oldbike54]

Dusty, 4 and 6 thou on yours and Norms bikes. Us spec was tighter.

John Henry

 That was only to make them quieter , same engine as the Euros received .

 Dusty