BREVA 750 FLUID CHANGE

[timonbik]

Did an oil and filter change on the Breva today.  No problem there, but when I went to change the gearbox oil, I found that I could not remove the drain plug as it hit the exhaust crossover pipe with more than a few threads to go. Is there a trick to this or am I missing something?  Surely you don't have to remove the exhaust to perform this simple function.  Anybody tried a vacuum extractor to remove to old gear lube?
Thanks,  Tim

[Muzz]

I had to remove the exhaust the first time. When I put the crossover back on I was able to rotate it enough to just clear the plug. The spigots on it are not central in the body, so you can get a bit of extra clearance by rotating it.

[Arizona Wayne]

It's a tight fit but you can get it off/on with just your fingers to end/start. 

[pete roper]

It's a tight fit but you can get it off/on with just your fingers to end/start. 

Not always.  . Tolerances mean that sometimes you can't.

The simplest way is to remove the RH muffler, loosen the clamp on the centre/balance pipe and then the nuts on the exhaust flange at the head. You should then be able to swing the header out o the right and wriggle the balance pipe back a bit and the plug will come out. It may sound awful but it's only a few fasteners, no need to drop the header completely. After you've drained it re-install the plug and then fill the box on the sidestand using a FULL litre of 80/90 yak fat. Reassemble.

Pete

[Arizona Wayne]

Not always.  . Tolerances mean that sometimes you can't.

The simplest way is to remove the RH muffler, loosen the clamp on the centre/balance pipe and then the nuts on the exhaust flange at the head. You should then be able to swing the header out o the right and wriggle the balance pipe back a bit and the plug will come out. It may sound awful but it's only a few fasteners, no need to drop the header completely. After you've drained it re-install the plug and then fill the box on the sidestand using a FULL litre of 80/90 yak fat. Reassemble.



I replace 75W-90 oil so when it's 40F the tranny still shifts properly instead of hanging up until the oil warms up some.   

[timonbik]

This to me this is a prime example of poor design and pure laziness in behalf of Moto Guzzi.  I'm sure the crossover  could have been pushed back a few MM (all that is needed) or at very least it could have been designed with an indentation to clear the gearbox drain plug.  Frustrating to say the least making what should be a simple job so difficult.

[pete roper]

YAWN!

[timonbik]

I guess poor design is great for mechanics.  When small maintenance issues like routine fluid changes become NEEDLESSLY difficult, your average Joe is reluctant to undertake them, and defers the job to a shop. 

[Chuck in Indiana]

It may sound awful but it's only a few fasteners,

Agreed, but Guzzi is bad about service accessibility. I could name several examples of "afterthought engineering." 

[Dilliw]

Agreed, but Guzzi is bad about service accessibility. I could name several examples of "afterthought engineering." 

The 2007 Norge dipstick?  Oh and didn't they add another plug to the California series because the one in the rear wouldn't clear the crossover muffler?

This isn't an afterthought it's a family tradition!

[pikipiki]

Can you not loosen the crossover pipe and rotate it sightly to get the bolt out?
You may also find it awkward to get a ring spanner in and over the bolt
either find a slimmer spanner or do what I did, take a grinder to an ond spanner to make one a little slimmer for the job.

[Doppelgaenger]

The 750 isn't the only difficult customer. I find it very challenging to get the drain plug for the transmission started back into the drain hole on the Breva 1100. I have to do it by hand because I don't want to cross thread it and my fingers barely reach. But after some swearing it always goes back in.

[sign216]

I wrote a tutorial on changing the transmission oil.  It's better than nothing, double click on the photos for the text,

https://www.flickr.com/photos/sign216/albums/72157626993357143

[pete roper]

Agreed, but Guzzi is bad about service accessibility. I could name several examples of "afterthought engineering." 

Oh, certainly. Look at you'd son's Sport C and its clutch adjustment! And then there are other brilliant bits of engineering like puting the V11 gearbox breather directly in line with the wheel-spray from the rear tyre so when it's wet the gearbox fills with water to name just a couple! Thing is I really don't think that the drain plug accessibility on a baby Breva is worth wadding one's panties over. Getting the pipe moved is a five minute task. As a 'Proffesional Mechanic' it doesn't earn me any more money in real terms than simply dropping out the oil easily. There really isn't a conspiracy by tradesmen to rip people off and I find the insinuation tiresome.

Pete

[timonbik]

Not insinuating anyone is ripping anybody off, but quite often what appears to be on the face of it an easy task such as loosening a few fasteners, more often than not becomes a nightmare when an exhaust flange nut is seized or stripped or the bolt snaps off etc.  Maybe I am just unlucky??? The questions begs to be asked, why make it so difficult in the first place?   Common sense has to come into play at some point.
Cheers, Tim

[Doppelgaenger]

I don't know about you guys, but my bike likes to remind me on a regular basis that it's an italian vehicle. And a vehicle can't be truly italian unless it has some kind of flaw.

[Fuzzy]

I don't think they are flaws, it is simply the motorcycles and designers clearly demonstrating the difference between Italian culture and focus on beauty, and our own cultures expecting things to "make sense."
I don't think they care what we think, as long as the motorcycles are beautiful and work most of the time (with some tenderness) and all the complaining in the world isn't going to change the way they do business.We just got to accept them that way.

[Muzz]

Back to the clamps used on the exhaust, the clamps used by Guzzi were the supra heavy duty type, with the band extending all the way round. The ones they used were the full stainless type, with both  a stainless band with a stainless bolt. Unfortunately, at least on my bike Luigi did not put any nickel anti-seize on the thread, so although they felt tight they weren't; they had just galled on the thread. I dumped them and actually put the model with the band in stainless and the bolt in 8.8 grade steel, and liberally coated the thread with antiseize. They now do up tightly, but are easy to undo and the threads last a lot longer than full stainless.

The ones I used to sell had the trade name "Mikalor". Diameter of the clamps increase in 3-4 mm increments, so they have quite a narrow range of operation.

Also got rid of the slight air leak that it had from new at the crossover.

[sign216]

I added an extension to the oxygen sensor line, so that the crossover wouldn't have to be rotated all the time.  But I did that only because I had spare Super-seal connectors.   Otherwise making a spare line would be a pain.

[Perazzimx14]

Somehow I ended up with an extra Mistral crossover that is the fix for your situation just like thins one:

http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=26_95&products_id=2579

I'll sell it for $40 USD + shipping.