A Ride and a Repair

[canuck750]

I took my Eldorado for a back country trip and ended up at Elk Island National Park, a gem in the middle of the prairies with large herds of both Plains and Woods buffalo, lots of old farms like this along the way, I put a solo seat on this weekend, getting used to the different feel



Pulled into the west back gate of the park, all gravel and very pretty, just made it to the administration area, went to shift down and PING the clutch cable snapped off at the handle, cable was well lubed and less than 4 years old with about 4000 miles on it



I packed a spare cable when I went to the John Day rally and thankfully it was still in the side bags.



Turns out the cable was for a V7 Sport, a little too short but I got it to fit by routing it non stock



10 minutes latter and I was back on my way, circled the park but could not find any buffalo, usually they are easy to find.

A couple hours later and many more back roads enjoying the beautiful fields in full growth and me and the bike are back home.

[Cam3512]

Every Loop should have a spare clutch cable in the bag.  Not sure why, but they're notorious for snapping.

[oldbike54]

 I was hoping for a complete top end engine rebuild in a coffee shop parking lot 

 Lovely bike , the barn shot is lovely Jim , thanks .

 Dusty

[Markcarovilli]

And the solo seat.....

I'm looking myself but have not done anything yet.

Beautiful bike.

Mark

[canuck750]

I was hoping for a complete top end engine rebuild in a coffee shop parking lot 

 Lovely bike , the barn shot is lovely Jim , thanks .

 Dusty

Ah that made me laugh Dusty, maybe next time

Cheers!

Jim

[twowings]

Great pic! 

[Farmer Dan]

That reminds me, I need to lube my cables before I head out next weekend.  Nice pics.

[swooshdave]

Every Loop should have a spare clutch cable in the bag.  Not sure why, but they're notorious for snapping.

Don't you mean every big block?

[ITSec]

Don't you mean every big block?

Well, some big blocks can only use a clutch cable to help out their friends... 

[tazio]

On these old loops, I think the front brake cable may be used in a pinch, no?

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I had my own "ride and repair" today on the '69 Ambo. Rode up through Michaux St. Forest to Shippensburg, PA for lunch and was headed back towards the forest (where it was cooler) when the engine just shut off. "No problem" I thought, "it's all just simple stuff." That was until I checked my tool boxes for the extra tools and spare parts I normally carry. Moved those to the '71 a few weeks ago and forgot to move them back. Had a no spark situation and did what I could with the tools in my tankbag. Could get it to spark a couple of times, then suddenly it wouldn't.

Fortunately for me, my friend Blaine Paulus was on his way in to Shippensburg to pick up a few things and happened upon me along side the road. What are the chances of that happening?Great guy that he is, he rode his F650 back to his house and returned with his Murano and trailer. He had also made arrangements with our friend Lance (Perazzimx14 here), who lives not far away, to drop me off there.

Once at Lance's I finally found the problem (badly burned points - only 50k miles on them! ), replaced the points and condenser with some Lance had on hand and the old beasty once again ran. After a delicious dinner with Lance, his wife and daughter I headed home in the dark, just after a storm blessed the area with some much needed rain.

Not the day I had planned, but turned out to be quite nice after all, thanks to Blaine and Lance.  I'm going to make up a second "travel kit" and carry one in each Ambo, that way I'll be sure to have what I need if there is ever a next time.

[pehayes]

went to shift down and PING the clutch cable snapped off at the handle, cable was well lubed and less than 4 years old with about 4000 miles on it

The cable was well lubed, but how about the barrel at the end?
Breakages like this occur because the barrel at the end is  not lubricated where it sits in the hand lever.  As you pull the lever, that barrel is supposed to slide and move in the hand lever so that the angle of pull on the cable is always direct and straight.  If you lube the cable but not the barrel, then the barrel stays fixed in a relative position within the hand lever and the cable filaments are required to flex through a very tight arc as the angle of pull changes.  Metal filaments 'work harden' and soon snap.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[Tom H]

The cable was well lubed, but how about the barrel at the end?
Breakages like this occur because the barrel at the end is  not lubricated where it sits in the hand lever.  As you pull the lever, that barrel is supposed to slide and move in the hand lever so that the angle of pull on the cable is always direct and straight.  If you lube the cable but not the barrel, then the barrel stays fixed in a relative position within the hand lever and the cable filaments are required to flex through a very tight arc as the angle of pull changes.  Metal filaments 'work harden' and soon snap.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

 :1: :1:

[swooshdave]

I had my own "ride and repair" today on the '69 Ambo. Rode up through Michaux St. Forest to Shippensburg, PA for lunch and was headed back towards the forest (where it was cooler) when the engine just shut off. "No problem" I thought, "it's all just simple stuff." That was until I checked my tool boxes for the extra tools and spare parts I normally carry. Moved those to the '71 a few weeks ago and forgot to move them back. Had a no spark situation and did what I could with the tools in my tankbag. Could get it to spark a couple of times, then suddenly it wouldn't.

Fortunately for me, my friend Blaine Paulus was on his way in to Shippensburg to pick up a few things and happened upon me along side the road. What are the chances of that happening?Great guy that he is, he rode his F650 back to his house and returned with his Murano and trailer. He had also made arrangements with our friend Lance (Perazzimx14 here), who lives not far away, to drop me off there.

Once at Lance's I finally found the problem (badly burned points - only 50k miles on them! ), replaced the points and condenser with some Lance had on hand and the old beasty once again ran. After a delicious dinner with Lance, his wife and daughter I headed home in the dark, just after a storm blessed the area with some much needed rain.

Not the day I had planned, but turned out to be quite nice after all, thanks to Blaine and Lance.  I'm going to make up a second "travel kit" and carry one in each Ambo, that way I'll be sure to have what I need if there is ever a next time.

So electronic ignition and hydraulic clutch next for this bike? 

[wirespokes]

Plus one on ensuring the barrel is lubed and free to swivel.

But there's something else to consider, and possibly the reason these older bikes break more cables.

Make sure the lever doesn't flop around in the perch. There's a bushing in the perch that gets worn - replace if it is. If the pivot retaining bolt is worn, replace it too.

[swooshdave]

The cables break because there's too much pressure on them. Clutches shouldn't be that stiff.

[nick949]

Hey Jim .............SNAP!  although my cable was for the Nuovo Falcone



I like the pic of the Eldo in front of the barn - nice.

Nick

[Cam3512]

The cable was well lubed, but how about the barrel at the end?
Breakages like this occur because the barrel at the end is  not lubricated where it sits in the hand lever.  As you pull the lever, that barrel is supposed to slide and move in the hand lever so that the angle of pull on the cable is always direct and straight.  If you lube the cable but not the barrel, then the barrel stays fixed in a relative position within the hand lever and the cable filaments are required to flex through a very tight arc as the angle of pull changes.  Metal filaments 'work harden' and soon snap.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

I lightly grease the barrels.  Keeps 'em slippery.

[Aaron D.]

Lubing the ends-both-is all that matters. I stopped breaking clutch cables in the '70s when I figured that out. So my cables get blobs of grease on each end.

[Lannis]

Lubing the ends-both-is all that matters. I stopped breaking clutch cables in the '70s when I figured that out. So my cables get blobs of grease on each end.

An old BSA rider who has 70,000 miles on his current 650 twin gave me some good advice that has saved many a clutch cable for me ...

Every time he checks the oil, he touches the end of the dipstick with the drop of oil on it to the clutch cable barrel at the lever.   That way, it stays oily there all the time.   Haven't had a clutch cable break in all these years doing that ....

Lannis

[canuck750]

An old BSA rider who has 70,000 miles on his current 650 twin gave me some good advice that has saved many a clutch cable for me ...

Every time he checks the oil, he touches the end of the dipstick with the drop of oil on it to the clutch cable barrel at the lever.   That way, it stays oily there all the time.   Haven't had a clutch cable break in all these years doing that ....

Lannis

That is a great tip!! 

Thanks.

The beauty of these old beasts is that when they do break they usually can be fixed on the side of the road, now had my RT stopped working it probably would have been a call for a tow truck but again to be fair the beemer is over 10 years old and only left me stranded once, burst fuel line disconnect.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

So electronic ignition and hydraulic clutch next for this bike? 

Not only "no", but "hell no". In the last 70k miles/19 years, I've replaced the points twice (counting yesterday) and the clutch cable once.

[Aaron D.]

An old BSA rider who has 70,000 miles on his current 650 twin gave me some good advice that has saved many a clutch cable for me ...

Every time he checks the oil, he touches the end of the dipstick with the drop of oil on it to the clutch cable barrel at the lever.   That way, it stays oily there all the time.   Haven't had a clutch cable break in all these years doing that ....

Lannis

The dipstick on the Scout is right over the clutch cable end, I do the same thing!

[Tom]

Y'ep, barrel ends need lube but it did inspire me to buy a Convert for commuting.   I did end up lubing the cable ends as part of the maintenance schedule.

[blackcat]

Not only "no", but "hell no". In the last 70k miles/19 years, I've replaced the points twice (counting yesterday) and the clutch cable once.

I think that everyone has their position on electronic vs. points and I understand why people like points. But in defence of electronic, I installed a Dyna on the CX about 12+ years ago, rebuilt the engine 4 years ago, re-installed the Dyna without touching anything except for timing and have never done anything in the 12 years of ownership. Could it go tomorrow and I would need a tow home? Sure, but I don't even think about it.

[Lannis]

Not only "no", but "hell no". In the last 70k miles/19 years, I've replaced the points twice (counting yesterday) and the clutch cable once.

I find that I've got sort of a "rule" that all my bikes have had done to them ....

1) If it's got ONE set of points (single cylinder, twin with a mag, or a twin with a distributor), I leave the points in place.   Except for the fact that condensers can be bad "out of the box", single points are low maintenance and don't need much help - a bit of lube on the cam, a piece of #800 sandpaper between the points sometimes, and that's it.

2) If it's got TWO sets of points, that's always trouble, because they're always going out of sync, leading to vibration issues.   Everything I've got with two sets of points now has an EI on it....

It works good for me.

Lannis

[atavar]

Back to the original question, I was told that the Loops and Tonti's both were prone to clutch cable failures because of ground cable issues. 
Apparently if the ground cable connections become loose or corroded the natural alternate ground path that exists is back through the clutch cable.  Through electrolysis the business end of the clutch cable becomes weakened and prone to failure.
How much truth there is to this I am not sure but it is an interesting bit of lore anyway.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I'll likely install an e.i. on the Le Mans 1000 project when I get that far. It will not be a Dyna.

[swooshdave]

Back to the original question, I was told that the Loops and Tonti's both were prone to clutch cable failures because of ground cable issues. 
Apparently if the ground cable connections become loose or corroded the natural alternate ground path that exists is back through the clutch cable.  Through electrolysis the business end of the clutch cable becomes weakened and prone to failure.
How much truth there is to this I am not sure but it is an interesting bit of lore anyway.

While that is probable I don't think the clutch cable is the most direct route as it would have to go up through the handle bars, steering head bearings and back the battery. I don't think the steering head bearings make the ideal ground path.

[atavar]

While that is probable I don't think the clutch cable is the most direct route as it would have to go up through the handle bars, steering head bearings and back the battery. I don't think the steering head bearings make the ideal ground path.

Oh, it would absolutely not be the ideal ground path, just the path of least resistance if the proper path fails.