Author Topic: Really well done cafe  (Read 7001 times)

Offline Kev m

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Re: Really well done cafe
« Reply #30 on: November 22, 2016, 10:55:33 AM »
yes, the Tonti frame.   I don't see a lot of room for improvement for a standard-sport or cruiser-tourer design. 

it's not meant to be an FJR, GS, GSX-R.  But can do everything a Sportster can do.

I hear you but here are the concerns I think would need to be addressed:

* Wheelbase - couldn't use the California swingarm, need to shorten it up a tad. The Cal's were coming in at 61.4" even the Sporty is 60", and the new Triumphs are 55.7-56.9"

* Charging system - I think that crankshaft arrangement would have to go for an alternator, which means the Tonti frame itself would need some changes or the block needs to change. But I believe the competition all has much higher output systems. This isn't just needed for heated gear and driving lights but for ABS and TC systems too.

* Quirks - vent systems that run to the frame, dual-throttle bodies that require synchronization (and cause troubles at the incompetent dealer and DIYer level), and frankly startus-interruptus. They'd have to change things like this to be competitive. Sorting just needs to be a thing of the past.

* Motor - and here's the big one - like I said, even Harley Sportster is now putting out more hp while still putting out much more torque, so we can't even discuss the T120/Thruxton in this comparison. So even the 2V Tonti with Breva1100 engine internals doesn't cut it anymore. And I don't know if the 4V would be the solution, they aren't EU IV compliant either. So what are they going to do, increase capacity and/or go water-cooling?

I think that last one is the key - they have to do something. Maybe this is all moot and they already are in terms of development of a new water-cooled 1200 or the like, but we've not heard any real rumors (other than a new Stelvio in the works).

Maybe the 850 platform can or will be further upsized to meet that demand. I assume that would mean a new block and essentially new motor so that might not make as much sense as pursuing a water-cooler.

But I like the IDEA of a mid-range, standard, maybe classically styled bike - As well as the CARCs performed they never appealed to me visually (shy of maybe the Griso, but even there I had reservations). Something like a retro-Café would have way more appeal to me, like the current V7 line.

I'm just saying that love my old Jackal like I did, I DO think the motor and chassis are long in the tooth and cannot compete in today's market.
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Offline LowRyter

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Re: Really well done cafe
« Reply #31 on: November 22, 2016, 03:48:34 PM »
I'd rather have a Tonti California than any new Sportster.
John L 
When life gets you down remember it's one down and the rest are up.  (1-N-23456)

Offline Kev m

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Re: Really well done cafe
« Reply #32 on: November 22, 2016, 06:32:14 PM »
I'd rather have a Tonti California than any new Sportster.
That's fine, doesn't change my points, but neither does it address those problem areas.

Personally I guess I'm left with a preference for a rubbermount Sporty.

My Jackal was fun, but too much trouble and I never warmed to the shape of the tank and side covers.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2016, 07:02:21 PM by Kev m »
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