Author Topic: My V50 Monza Rebuild  (Read 15652 times)

Offline Psychopasta

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My V50 Monza Rebuild
« on: May 29, 2017, 01:32:37 PM »
Hey guys,

I thought I should start giving back to the forum after asking so many questions here. Many years ago...2010 I think...I came across a very tatty and tired old V50 Monza that I decided to rebuild as a cafe racer. I started a blog that described the teardown and rebuild here: http://v50monzarebuild.blogspot.com/

However, work, family and other bikes got in the way and I have not done much work on it since around 2013. However, I'm now back on it, and have done a bunch of work that I did not document. So, these photos show the current state of build, and I'll update this topic as I get work done...honest!

- Pasta

V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

twowings

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2017, 01:35:06 PM »
That is a little jewel!! Nice job... :thumb:

canuck750

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2017, 10:39:48 PM »
Very nice!

Offline SED

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2017, 09:03:31 PM »
Let's see more!
1983 LeMans III
1981 Monza
1947 Ariel Red Hunter
1939 Ariel Red Hunter
1937 Guzzi GTV

Wildguzzi.com

Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2017, 09:03:31 PM »

Offline pjontian

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2017, 05:32:28 AM »
Everything looks great. I like the color combination.

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2017, 12:25:33 PM »
If I was doing it again, the thing I wouldn't do is paint the cylinder heads orange. But, that's easily taken care of in the wintertime if I want to. One of the things I've always loved about Guzzis is how easy it is to strip the engine with the rest of the bike fully assembled
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2017, 11:52:11 PM »
I've decided to unlink the front and rear brakes, as I'm really comfortable with unlinked brakes now and don't want to have one bike where my reflexes need to be different. I'm also using the Frentubo brake line set for the Monza. This means that I need a coupling piece to convert the LHS connector to a banjo bolt:







I also decided to fit a Nissin front master cylinder with 14mm bore to drive the two calipers. Coupling was pretty straightforward:







Anyone got any comments on this? Anything I should be aware of from previous unlinkings?

Also, the Stainless Steel line is great, but its quite resistant to the twisting action needed to make the banjo bolts fit the top master cylinder and have the bottom couplers fit into the calipers. Is there any way to relax the SS lines and get them less twisted? It's less than a half turn of course, but it affects how the brake lines lie at rest.

- Pasta


« Last Edit: June 04, 2017, 11:53:22 PM by Psychopasta »
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2017, 09:27:08 PM »
Well, I got onto the carbs. Cleaned up and rebuilt using the DellOrto gasket kit. Not much to report on that.

BUT, I just got some K&N filters for them, and I'm not totally impressed. Although they claim to be the right size for the V50, maybe the Monza has larger carbs, because fitting them was a pain:









You can see the bulge where they 'fit', and the hose clamp it comes with will not fit, so I had to use other ones. Worse, they only just fit on the bike:








I guess you could call it an interference fit. Has anyone done something more elegant on the Monza? And don't say fit the standard air box...elegant it ain't.  :boozing:

- Pasta
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2017, 09:38:25 PM »
I also got some stuff done on the front end, and it's getting closer to final state.










upload image on internet


I'm using a headlamp bracket from (I think) a V700, which has 35mm forks. I used a little shower sealing ribbon to make up a shim, so that the mounts bite cleanly. I found some fork gaiters on Amazon of all places, which are almost perfect. 33mm at the top, 50 and the bottom is finer, but 130 mm long is just a little short so it needs the host clamps to keep its pants up.

I'm using the instrument panel from MG Cycles, and some 32 mm fork clamps from Fast From the Past to mount it.










temporary picture sharing
 

So far, so good.

- Pasta
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline SED

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2017, 12:09:35 AM »
Cool updates.  Love the craftsmanship. May be irreverent, but the K&Ns have not worked for me - too small and the carbs sag on the rubber manifolds affecting float level.

Great work - keep the pictures coming!
1983 LeMans III
1981 Monza
1947 Ariel Red Hunter
1939 Ariel Red Hunter
1937 Guzzi GTV

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2017, 11:57:47 AM »
Yep, I was disappointed by the K&Ns. What do you use?
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline antmanbee

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2017, 06:17:02 PM »
I do this on all my Guzzis.  It worked well on my T3. It may work for the V50 also. You still utilize the velocity stacks that used to go into the airbox. Just cut out the end of an 8" UNI sock filter and put the internal filter spring over the ends of the stacks.









free image cdn

Offline SED

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2017, 12:00:36 PM »
Yep, I was disappointed by the K&Ns. What do you use?

I've always used the stock airbox on the smallblock with both the V50 and V65 engines.  The problems I've had were with the bigblock 850 and now it has a stock airbox too. The V65 airbox seems to be a tighter fit and distorts with age, but seems to accumulate less oil vapor than the Monza airbox.  Monza airfilter is perhaps, slightly easier to change than V65 version.
1983 LeMans III
1981 Monza
1947 Ariel Red Hunter
1939 Ariel Red Hunter
1937 Guzzi GTV

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2017, 09:07:44 PM »
I'm going to rewire the bike using MotoGadget's M-Unit Blue. It turned up today (I'm not quite ready for it) and here it is next to a Dyna ignition coil for size reference:




full size image hosting


it is quite the marvel of modern engineering. It takes in all the control signals from the handlebar controls and brake switches on the lower connectors, and outputs all the control signals on the top connectors. It has built-in short protection, can drive starters directly (though the Bosch design used by Guzzi has its own solenoid), it can power a big horn like the Stebel Nautilus, etc etc. It also does brake light modulation and lots of tricks like that. It ALSO has an alarm, and if you use the Bluetooth capability to pair it to your phone it can let you know if it goes off (though if you use a Stebel Nautilus you'll probably find out the traditional way). It is totally cool!

Can't wait to rewire the Guzzi with it. I've always felt that Guzzi used great electric components, but then messed up with the nastiest wiring and switchgear imaginable. I'm hoping this will be Better Than New  :boozing:

- Pasta

« Last Edit: June 22, 2017, 02:01:38 PM by Psychopasta »
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Chuck in Indiana

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2017, 02:21:23 PM »
Nice work.. :thumb: thanks.
Chuck in (Elwood) Indiana/sometimes SoCal
 
87 AeroLario
95 Skorpion tour
22 Royal Enfield Classic 3 fiddy
 "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."
Albert Einstein

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2017, 12:29:59 AM »
Sooo...in one of Chuck's threads he talks about trying to do something every day. As the wife was out down the pub with her boozy mates tonight, and I received the Tomasselli Daytona throttle, I snuck down to the garage to give it a go.

I don't want to use black grips, so the first thing to do was to remove the old grip. I tried as hard as I could, but could not get it off without doing it some damage. So I sliced along the length in an unobtrusive place and peeled it off. I doubt I'll ever use it, but it could be pressed back into service if needed.

Anyway, fitting the grip I wanted was a tougher job than I thought. I started off using a little 'personal lubricant' (you know it, the stuff that's so good they named the whole damn state of Kentucky after it) but that only got it so far:



 

We've all had this problem at some time, I'm sure. Boil up some water and pour into a mug, and let the grip stand for a while:





Then hold the grip in a towel (it's damn hot) and thump it down on a table with a soft rag on it. Do it really hard, but you don't want to break the plastic molding that takes the throttle cables. It reminded me of the days of my youth, with the original Thor comics, with Dr. Don Bannon thumping his stick on the ground to transform into the Mighty Thor. Anyway, it worked:





Success my lord!

Then, and for no particular reason, I realized why the left handlebar didn't look right:







Sometimes I am such a doofus I amaze myself. I had placed the handlebar switch on the wrong side of the clutch lever! I've had it like that for something like six months. I always thought there was something not quite right about it...

Anyway, by doing it right I realized that I now had enough space to use the switch I originally wanted to use (I'd had to buy a really slim one to fit the available space), so now I got the Left hand side set up correctly:




upload images


The clutch lever fouls the Tarozzi clip on so that it can't be rotated through an arbitrary angle but only through a limited range. I can live with that for now. I then got both bars set up:





Then a bit of an adjust, but it will still be a while before she's out and riding, so there wasn't much point. But it made me happy:





Taking a final tip from Chuck I then declared it beer o'clock  :boozing:

- Pasta
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

canuck750

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2017, 01:53:39 PM »
Nice work! Thanks for sharing your progress.

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2017, 09:10:18 PM »
First oil leak!

Not the engine mind, nor transmission neither. Neither has yet been filled with oil. Nope, it's the K&N filters! Hard to imagine, but I found two little pools of pink oil on the engine:







Quite impressive really. The filters are provided with a little sachet of filter oil, and instructions to lay a bead of oil along each filter fold, wait 20 minutes and then fill in any white space. I did this, and had some oil left over from each sachet, so I thought I'd done it right. But apparently I used too much  :drool:

Ho hum.

Pasta

 
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2017, 09:46:58 PM »
OK, now onto the real work.

I bought a metal splashguard that replaces the plastic toolholder from http://radicalguzzi.com/an_einbauteile. As they are German, this is (a) very well made and (b) really cheap in USD because of the exchage rate. My goal is to use this as a mounting plate for all the electrics. Here is a rough layout:




anonymous picture share sites


Clockwise from top left we have the horn (a Fiamm unit), the fuseholder, the m-Unit Blue and the rectifier/regulator from EuroMotoElectrics. This little plate replaces the plethora or regulators, rectifiers, flasher relays, and what have you from the original wiring loom. Here it is assembled:





and then mounted back in the bike:















When I take the splashguard off for painting, I think I'll move the reg/rect and the m-Unit up about an inch, but this is fine for now. Some might say that the electrics is a little exposed on this plate, and they're right. BUT, I don't see this bike being used for long distances or in the wet. The electronics get protection from the engine, seat, and the riders aversion to riding in the wet.

I also don't really go for this current fashion of making the electrics disappear. I think the electrics are as much a part of the bike as anything else. AND, the M-Unit has such pretty flashing LEDs, I want to show them off.

Next, you can see here how I'm routing the cables from the reg/rect:







The reg/rect has a wiring loom that breaks off into two separate looms. One goes to the battery, ground, and ignition switch. I took that loom and just wrapped it around itself for now and connected it to the battery and ground of the M-unit, so that everything except the starter motor and solenoid is behind the 30 A fuseholder. The rest of the loom goes off to the alternator:








The wiring couldn't me much easier. The three yellow connectors are on the three-phase return from the stator, and any of the connectors can be connected to any of the spades. The brown wire goes to the connector labelled DF, the black to D-, and there is one connection not used.

I put the alternator cover back on, with a new split grommet on the exit hole, and also brought the Dyna-S electronic ignition cable out as well. I used cable ties to hold the loom loosely to the frame without stressing it:





Then I laid a cable from the starter solenoid to the m-Unit, and ran the oil return hose to Curtis' little bottle thingy. The wiring will be pretty much invisible once the tank is on, and I'm pretty pleased with the overall effect:









Next step is to wire up the minimum necessary tp start the engine. But it's now Beer o'clock, as the Wise say.

- Pasta








« Last Edit: June 25, 2017, 09:50:23 PM by Psychopasta »
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Chuck in Indiana

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2017, 01:13:59 PM »
Hasn't anybody told you the air nozzle trick for removing/installing grips?  :smiley: A pointed air nozzle stuck under the edge of the grip, a blast of air and push or pull, and bob's your uncle..
Nice job of documentation.  :thumb: It many times takes longer to do that than do the job.
Chuck in (Elwood) Indiana/sometimes SoCal
 
87 AeroLario
95 Skorpion tour
22 Royal Enfield Classic 3 fiddy
 "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."
Albert Einstein

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2017, 01:55:20 PM »
I tried that, but couldn't get the nozzle far into the grip because of the plastic shield. Oh well.  :grin:
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Online Mayor_of_BBQ

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #21 on: June 29, 2017, 10:44:51 AM »
Neat little monza! Just curious, if you broke it down to paint the frame and are replacing all the electrics with new mounting points... and no side covers... why not cut off all the mounting tabs?
Chad (Shadrach) in Asheville NC
1979 LeMans CX-100 (battle axe)
2007 Breva 1100 (Sport 1200 tribute)

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #22 on: June 29, 2017, 11:03:48 AM »
Inexperience, that's why  :thumb: I had this idea to not modify anything irreversibly so that it could always be converted back to a full factory resto, but I don't think that will happen, ever. If I ever need to take the top frame off again to get to the tranny I'd be tempted to detab and repaint then.

- Pasta
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Diploman

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2017, 02:23:46 PM »
Lovely work, Pasta!  (I can definitely relate to your work, because I just rolled out my own V50 II resto/mod/cafe.  Testing, tuning now.)

Your electrical makeover is very impressive - nice concept and great work!

Where did you source that gorgeous seat?  Buy, fabricate, modify?

I concur with nearly all of your modding decisions,  except perhaps the orange cylinders.  That's going to be a great looking bike!  Carry on!

1980 V50 II, lightly cafe'd, much modernized
1983 SP 1000 NT (Under Upgrade/Modification)
2015 KTM 390 Duke

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2017, 03:21:38 PM »
Thank you very much!

Having seen what Canuck has done with vapor blasting, I wish I had vapor blasted instead of painting. If I could do it all over again, that's the part I'd re-do, especially the cylinders. We live and learn  :grin:

Where are the pictures of yours?

- P
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #25 on: July 13, 2017, 03:23:37 PM »
Oops: the seat is the original Monza seatpan, modded by Rich's Custom Seats in Kingston WA. There's a bit of metalwork riveted on at the back to make the rear hump. I'll try to dig out the photos.
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline not-fishing

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2017, 12:53:17 PM »
Happened onto your "rehabilitation" of a V50 Monza.

My son and I are continuing through the "rehab" of our V50 III.  yeah we were to cheap to look for a Monza

Word to the wise, check the bevel box.  I'm having to send ours off to Harpers for a new housing because the shoulder bolts backed out at 15,000 miles.  The good news is the ring and pinion gear are fine.

I used "Condor" bars instead of clip-ons and the boy loves them.  I still have to spin the first section of brake lines because of a bad bend near the triple clamps.

I used a Dyna S system to replace the points and it works very well.

I did Patrick's revision to the starter wiring for less voltage loss.

The dash lights and stoplight are LED.

Front springs are Racetech and rear shocks are Ikons now.

We're not doing a restoration just a rehab, slight Cafe and ride job.

Mark
Griso 1100
Rosso Corsa Lemans
1/2 a V50 III (with my son)
V65 SP - Finished but the Dyna died so it's non-op'd
'75 850T with sidecar - a new project and adventure

Offline Psychopasta

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2017, 02:55:20 PM »
I did Patrick's revision to the starter wiring for less voltage loss.

What mod is that? I just have a 12V line straight from the battery to the starter, and another going to the starter solenoid.

- Pasta
V50 Monza 1981
Moto Guzzi V7 Stone Special 2023
Honda Goldwing 2019
Aprilia Tuareg 660 2023
Ancient A65 Bitsa, in pieces

Offline not-fishing

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #28 on: July 15, 2017, 03:34:39 PM »
Tech Reports from Guzzi Power

http://www.guzzipower.com/reports/

Quote
         
Small Block Starter Relay Fix

The trick is in the brown wire.  It leads from the right handlebar to the relay socket under the side cover at connector 30/51.   From there, it is joined by a small brown jumper wire from connector 30/51 over to connector 86.  Disconnect the relay from the  plastic relay socket.  Now look at the receiving side of the relay socket.  Each terminal has a slot with a small notch.  Reach  into this notch with a small jeweller's screwdriver.  Inside is a little tang on the female spade connector. You need to flatten  this tang so that you can pull the wire and spade connector out from the back of the relay socket.  We need to do this to swap  the position of the two terminals within the relay socket.

Once you have both of the brown wire terminals removed from 30/51 and 86, then cut them apart as close as possible where they  both join at the 30/51 terminal.  Now, you have the wire from the handlebar with a spade female on it and you have a short, two- inch wire with a spade female terminal.

Use your screwdriver to bend out and restore the little tang on the back of each female terminal so that it acts as a snap lock  when you insert it back into the relay socket.  Now, reinsert the two terminals into the connector block BUT swap them so that  the harness wire from the handlebar now goes directly into 86 and the shorter, two-inch wire goes into 30/51.

Now manufacture a short red wire.  Perhaps 16 gauge and ten inches long with a ring terminal at the battery end, an in-line  automotive fuse spliced into the middle and a straight crimp connector at the business end.  Splice this new jumper directly to  the two-inch brown wire dangling from the 30/51 position and install the ring terminal directly on your battery positive post.

You are all done.  Now, the 86 terminal only carries the load of the little relay electromagnet coil.  The 30/51 terminal (which  gets energized when the relay closes) has a new, fat, short routing directly from the battery, through the relay contacts to the  starter solenoid. No more CLICK, CLICK when you hit the starter, just vrooooom.

Schematic link HERE.  http://www.guzzipower.com/photos/starterrelayfix.gif

Patrick Hayes
Fremont, CA
pehayes<at>comcast.net

Today was a good day, a run down to the local Guzzi Dealer the Guzzi Semi was there for a test ride of the V9 Bobber hate forward footpegs and V7-III the boy liked the bike but not the lack of a tach

At home I was accosted by a nice postal lady with a package I had to sign for from Italy.  The Flyhammer V50 rearsets had arrived.  Beautiful work, no instructions so I'll just have to figure on doing it wrong 3 or 4 times before I get it right.  Luckily I have plenty of time because I have to ship the bevel box off for rebuild this weekend.

With the rearsets the V50 will be taken about as far as we're going to take it.

Here's the flyhammer pick

   http://www.flyhammer.it

You'll notice the mufflers are off and I figure there's where I'll have to do a little modifying of existing muffler mounting system
Griso 1100
Rosso Corsa Lemans
1/2 a V50 III (with my son)
V65 SP - Finished but the Dyna died so it's non-op'd
'75 850T with sidecar - a new project and adventure

Offline pitts12driver

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Re: My V50 Monza Rebuild
« Reply #29 on: July 17, 2017, 10:20:55 PM »
Really came out well. A thoughtful and consistent build.


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