V7 II Towed Home-No Change

[Jim C]

So, decide to go for a ride. Gear up, put on new lid (Nolan 87...works for me), ride about four miles, bike starts to run badly, feels like it's only running on one cylinder, but the other cylinder doesn't sound very healthy, either, as it wouldn't continue to run.

I'll check for spark on both plugs tomorrow. They're brand new plugs, installed when I did my service. Ran great before (after the service was done...thanks again, Mike), so I don't have a clue as to what's wrong now.

Jim

[oldbike54]

 Kinda sounds like the famous spark plug wire cap problem .

 Dusty

[Bill Hagan]

Kinda sounds like the famous spark plug wire cap problem .

 Dusty

Nah.

It was the helmet. 

Seriously, good luck on figuring out the problem.

Bill

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Did you try opening the gas cap? There was a guy on Facebook with a new Roamer that had similar issues, turned out to be a pinched tank vent hose and he was getting "tank suck".

[Tom H]

Without knowing what all was done.

I think your starting out right by checking the plugs themselves for spark. It's not the first time a new plug has failed. I always keep my last working set in my bike just in case a new one fails.

Also double check anything that was "serviced". Could be a wire or the like bumped out a place a bit..

I hope it's an easy fix!!
Tom

[thepittsburghguzzi]

Failed spark plug caps forced me to find a tow home just a short while ago. They're a $3 part, so pick up some good NGKs and rule out that variable 

[indian]

all of the above.  Also, I was riding a 1998 Lw Rider that was just 2 years old.  It started missing badly but I managed to get it 10mi to house.  In the mean time the tach was going nuts.  Turned out to be the battery.

[jpv7]

I updated my V7ii a few months ago.  If it helps, I used NGK XD05FP boot and CPR8EA-9 plug.  Cheap and easy mod.  I've done a few thousand miles since and no issues.

[fotoguzzi]

Test battery too.

[Jim C]

Quick update...

I've got spark on both sides....

[TimmyTheHog]

Quick update...

I've got spark on both sides....

From the sparks themselves when you do ignition test or they are now firing again while they are still inside the engine?

[Caffeineo]

So if you have good spark on both sides it should run......but then I would still suspect the plug caps and you may have improved the connection when removing them. If it does not run....I would think fuel is not getting into the cylinder.

Did you put the plugs back in and see if it runs now? I wonder if it could be something heat related????? Riding around in 90 degrees stuff gets hot and weak stuff may not work right????

[Jim C]

Fotoguzzi,
The battery is brand new as of this past spring.

TimmytheHog,
Both...I pushed the plug caps further down into the plug well to make
sure the caps were seated well against the contacts. I fired up the bike
to see what would happen. The engine ran...sort of. Spark when I pulled
the plugs out and attached the plug caps to them.

Caffeineo
As mentioned above, the bike ran, just very rough. When I pulled the plugs,
I took a look at them. The electrodes are BLACK with less than 10 miles
on them.

As far as heat-induced problems, it seems to me that an air-cooled bike,
unless it's extremely hot out, would fare just fine as long as it's moving
and not idling for 10 minutes or so, but what do I know? Hopefully a somewhat
blurry pic of the plugs below.

[TimmyTheHog]

Fotoguzzi,
The battery is brand new as of this past spring.

TimmytheHog,
Both...I pushed the plug caps further down into the plug well to make
sure the caps were seated well against the contacts. I fired up the bike
to see what would happen. The engine ran...sort of. Spark when I pulled
the plugs out and attached the plug caps to them.

Caffeineo
As mentioned above, the bike ran, just very rough. When I pulled the plugs,
I took a look at them. The electrodes are BLACK with less than 10 miles
on them.

As far as heat-induced problems, it seems to me that an air-cooled bike,
unless it's extremely hot out, would fare just fine as long as it's moving
and not idling for 10 minutes or so, but what do I know? Hopefully a somewhat
blurry pic of the plugs below.

From the sound of what you are saying, I really believe it's really your caps has gone bad.

Those plastic caps are so shitty...guess Guzzi has to cut cost somewhere...

[Vagrant]

the caps don't push on they screw on. remove the wire cut 1/8" off the end and screw them on.
it might be worth checking the air filter. it might be oil soaked. did you get the right heat range spark plug.

[Jim C]

If it helps I used NGK XD05FP boot and CPR8EA-9 plug. I've done a few thousand miles since and no issues.

jpv7,

Thanks for posting that. Ordered two of each. Here next Wednesday. Couldn't find these anywhere around me...tried O'Reilleys, AutoZone,  etc.

Vagrant,

Which caps are you referring to? The current ones? Also, why would the air filter get oil-soaked? I don't understand how that would happen. Can you enlighten me? Bear in mind that this mechanical stuff is all new to me. The plugs I got were the ones recommended in the manual, so I imagine that they would be in the same heat range.

Thanks everyone for trying to help. I appreciate it. Results next week.

[SmithSwede]

Jim, 

The air filter can become oil soaked if the engine blows back a bunch of oil into the air box through the breather system.

These engines don't like too much oil in the crankcase and they will puke out the excess into the air box.  This can soak the air filter.  The excess oil also gets sucked into the throttle bodies and generally makes a mess.  Each engine is probably different, but they all "like" a certain amount and not more. 

I tend to keep my oil level toward the lower minimum level to avoid this problem.   I check my engine oil level when the engine is dead cold, and want the oil to be right at the minimum level on the dipstick.   Once the oil gets hot, it expands in volume, and that MIN level when cold turns into about halfway between MIN and MAX.

That's why you should not take readings on a cold engine and top up the oil to the MAX line---that will be an excessive level when the oil heats up. 

If that's your issue, it will be obvious that the air filter is oil soaked.   

[jpv7]

jpv7,

Thanks for posting that. Ordered two of each. Here next Wednesday. Couldn't find these anywhere around me...tried O'Reilleys, AutoZone,  etc.

Vagrant,

Which caps are you referring to? The current ones? Also, why would the air filter get oil-soaked? I don't understand how that would happen. Can you enlighten me? Bear in mind that this mechanical stuff is all new to me. The plugs I got were the ones recommended in the manual, so I imagine that they would be in the same heat range.

Thanks everyone for trying to help. I appreciate it. Results next week.

The stock caps will unscrew from the wire.  On the end of the wire you will find a crimped on male screw thread pin.  The replacement boots don't use this, so snip them off as close to the crimp as possible, so you don't lose too much length.  The new ones will crew right on to the end of the cut wire.

[coastdude]

I had a similiar issue a few weeks ago, I checked plug caps on the side of the road thinking one may be loose, it wasn't. I limped home and checked the plugs and found one had worked its way loose, tightened it up and problem solved. Have since bought new plugs and caps.

[Dofin]

Same thing happened to me and sorry I didnt get on here sooner to pass it along. 

If you try to always fill the tank to the tippity top the over flow goes to the evaporation container.  When the charcoal gets soaked the engine sucks all that extra fuel back through the intake and TaDa fouls the plugs soaks the engine and it wont run!! Fouls the plug and makes the engine just barely run and eventually stops. You will also destroy the Catalytic converters in your exhaust pipe!!  they start turning all yellow and brown!!

Towed mine to the shop, they removed the evac container, checked her over, new plugs and it has been running great every since!  But still dont over fill the tank cause you get a gas smell when you do.  You will figure it how much to fill eventually and wont get the smell. 

Hope that is what it is for you???

[Vagrant]

The stock caps will unscrew from the wire.  On the end of the wire you will find a crimped on male screw thread pin.  The replacement boots don't use this, so snip them off as close to the crimp as possible, so you don't lose too much length.  The new ones will crew right on to the end of the cut wire.

what they said. when you get the new caps look up in where the wire goes and you will see a brass object like a sheet metal screw. I think Luigi on the assembly line just shoves the wire in. that forces the spark to jump that gap and the plug gap that is under compression too. hard to have enough energy to do that.  it needs to be threaded onto the plug wire . my 15 V7 wire on one side fell right off at the 600 mile service and the other side was about 1 turn on.
good news is I checked the new 17 V7-3 before I ever drove it and both were done right. Lucky? or are they finally getting some pride on the line. I hope it's the latter.

[Jim C]

Hope that is what it is for you???

Dofin,

Thanks for the reply. I never fill my tank beyond the bottom of the neck.
Never have. I read somewhere that it's a very bad idea.

[Jim C]

what they said. when you get the new caps look up in where the wire goes and you will see a brass object like a sheet metal screw.  it needs to be threaded onto the plug wire.

Thanks, Vagrant...do you (or anyone else reading this) have a pic of this? You know what they say...
"One picture is worth a thousand words."

Thanks again...

[redhawk47]

I had a problem with running on one cylinder - one fuel injector signal wire connector was not fully seated. The "check engine" was on when the engine was running poorly.

[Jim C]

Vagrant,

Okay, I get what you're talking about with the old plug caps. Cut 'em off right next to the crimp. The new plugs, though (CPR8EA-9) have screws on the top, so how does that work?  Do they still just get pushed on? Thanks again,

Jim

[Tom H]

The NGK caps should be designed to just push down on the threaded connection on the plug. You do not need to twist it on.

When attaching the cap to the wire, you need to screw it on to the wire.

Tom

[Jim C]

Changed the plug caps and plugs...STILL won't run right.
Thought that the rubber 'waterproof' covers might be hindering
a decent connection.  I pulled off both waterproof boots to see
if it made a difference. It didn't.

[fotoguzzi]

Did you check the air filter yet for oil?

[Jim C]

Did you check the air filter yet for oil?

Air filter is dry as a desert in the middle of a heat wave.

[fotoguzzi]

on one of my EV's it acted like that when the FI trim setting was dialed way out.

I don't know small blocks but I wonder if the ECU would reset if you disconnect the battery for a few minutes. wild stab in the dark I know..