Relay Kit for Stelvio Headlight Circuit, Yay or Nay?

[Bonaventure]

Anyone installed one of these:

https://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/Wiring_Kits/H4_Kits/h4_kits.html

It's a kit to put a relay into the headlight circuit which seems like it might make life easier on the little blue headlight switch, but by sending more wattage to the bulbs this could cause more heat build-up in the headlight bucket, yes? 

[pyoungbl]

I never had an issue with the Stelvio headlight circuit, nor have I heard of any other Stelvio owners experiencing same.  OTOH, lots of us had issues with the starting circuit.  I'd put my efforts in that direction before fixing something that ain't broken.  The same goes for greasing swingarm bearings, fuzing the aux lights, and installing an extra ground.  These are known issues.

Peter Y.

[Kiwi_Roy]

I think Peter Y is right those Beaver kits are fine for old Guzzis
You could also upgrade to an LED headlight bulb, that would drop the current also.

[ITSec]

Anyone installed one of these:

https://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/Wiring_Kits/H4_Kits/h4_kits.html

It's a kit to put a relay into the headlight circuit which seems like it might make life easier on the little blue headlight switch, but by sending more wattage to the bulbs this could cause more heat build-up in the headlight bucket, yes?

I think what's being addressed is the situation where the bulb is inadequately supported by the existing wiring - much as the way the starter is on most Guzzis. The kit you linked to wouldn't increase the voltage over what was intended in design, it would allow the bulb to operate at the full 55w or whatever it was intended to. In other words, losses due to inadequate or aging wiring and switches would be eliminated.

The kit could also be used to support installation of an over-powered bulb, such as some of the 100w PIAA units, but that would be a bad choice.

[rbm]

Adding an Eastern Beaver headlight relay kit to any motorcycle that uses halogen or incandescent headlighting is a good idea.  It protects the switchgear on the bike from long term damage and results in a brighter light output for a given wattage of lamp.  The kit is probably not compatible with CANbus equipped bikes but traditional wired bikes are OK.

[Kiwi_Roy]

Adding an Eastern Beaver headlight relay kit to any motorcycle that uses halogen or incandescent headlighting is a good idea.  It protects the switchgear on the bike from long term damage and results in a brighter light output for a given wattage of lamp.  The kit is probably not compatible with CANbus equipped bikes but traditional wired bikes are OK.

While I don't disagree with that, Voltage has a power of 5 effect on incandescent brightness the Stelvio wiring is a bit more robust.
If you go with LEDs however you can afford to loose several Volts because the LED deliberately drops Voltage before it gets to the lamp, if you look at a typical spec it will say something like 9 - 32 Volts, feeding it any more than 9 doesn't make it any brighter. Boosting it up with a relay would likely have zero effect, just get a bit more Voltage to the lamp connector to be burned up in the regulator.

I'm no expert though when it comes to LED headlights, many more on here have lots of experience.
I don't think CANbus is used for lighting, more just the communications between ECU and dash.

[ITSec]

If you go with LEDs however you can afford to loose several Volts because the LED deliberately drops Voltage before it gets to the lamp, if you look at a typical spec it will say something like 9 - 32 Volts, feeding it any more than 9 doesn't make it any brighter. Boosting it up with a relay would likely have zero effect, just get a bit more Voltage to the lamp connector to be burned up in the regulator.

I don't think CANbus is used for lighting, more just the communications between ECU and dash.

There's no reason to use CANbus for the lighting, other than to signal that a bulb has burned out.

The LEDs typically are designed to operate at a nominal 5 volts (at the diode level). They are pretty tolerant of both under and over voltage conditions but since they're normally hooked up in parallel and not in series, there always has to be a drop from supply voltage (11-14 volt) down to the 5 volts they expect.

[Moto]

I don't think CANbus is used for lighting, more just the communications between ECU and dash.

I believe the CAN bus on the CARCs is composed only of a single wire pair between the ECU and dash. It's not "a CANbus bike" overall.

[Bonaventure]

I only like LED's if the entire bucket and reflector is designed as an LED application.  Have seen many cars and trucks where the owner just pulls the OEM halogens out and porks an LED bulb in.  bad glare, poor cut off, and  more.  Especially annoying if it's one of the lifted bro trucks ... might as well have his high beams locked on 24/7 for the effect it has on approaching drivers. 

Don't know if putting an LED into a halogen setup on a bike is quite as bad but I've cussed so many bro trucks and suv's around here as they whizz by blinding me, that I can't bring myself to do it on my new bike.

[ridingron]

The Eastern Beaver kit will let your head light be all it can be. Full battery voltage straight to the head light.

[Kiwi_Roy]

I would like to go on record as saying the Eastern Beaver kits look well made and good value.

[ITSec]

I would like to go on record as saying the Eastern Beaver kits look well made and good value.

I've used Eastern Beaver fuse block sets on several bikes - I agree with Roy's view.

[Wayne Orwig]

I have heard a couple of people have the headlight switch fail due to heat. So in that respect, the relay kit would be good.
Plus the relay kit will get you a bit more light.

I had the plastic inside the headlight damaged by heat on my Stelvio. I worked second shift and used the high beam a lot. So I upgraded to 35 watt HID bulbs. Those had the relay built in and didn't cost much more than the relay kit. And you got a lot more light.

For what that info is worth.

[Lannis]

I never had an issue with the Stelvio headlight circuit, nor have I heard of any other Stelvio owners experiencing same. 
Peter Y.

Well, I'm fixing to change your life!

I always thought it was so silly that only ONE of my American-spec Stelvio's headlights would come on with the high beam, as opposed to Canadian-spec ones where BOTH lights would come on with the high beam.

So, acting on the advice of "several", I made a simple jumper from the H4 connector that had a high beam over to the other one that didn't, and Eh Voila!  both headlights came on with the high beam.

Until one day, in the dusk, rolling down Afton Mountain well behind a T-bucket hotrod, Fay said "Is that that hotrod ahead of us I'm smelling?"  And I said "Yep, smells like a burning electrical connection, probably didn't wire it right, silly lad!".    And then an amazing coincidence, my high beam went out.

The stupid design sends all the current through that little plastic switch.   I don't know how the Canadian system works, but two stock H4 bulbs is too much for the switch, and I had to replace the whole handlebar unit, which in itself requires unbolting the fuel tank, which requires taking the whole fairing off, etc ....

The low-beams operate off of the engine-run relay so they don't go through a switch, but the high-beams do .... and it's marginal.

Lannis

[Bonaventure]

Lannis I think you just helped me decide !! 

I wonder how hard it is to install the EB kit for a bloke with avg skills such as myself.

[Lannis]

Lannis I think you just helped me decide !! 

I wonder how hard it is to install the EB kit for a bloke with avg skills such as myself.

I'd like to know too.   I'll wager there's nothing real expert about it, other than the ability to make good terminal connections, and to work in the limited space behind the headlights on a Stelvio.

But someone who has done it will be along momentarily I hope.

Lannis

[Kiwi_Roy]

Well, I'm fixing to change your life!

I always thought it was so silly that only ONE of my American-spec Stelvio's headlights would come on with the high beam, as opposed to Canadian-spec ones where BOTH lights would come on with the high beam.


Lannis

I puzzled over that Lannis, looking at Carl's diagram, the only Stelvio I see is Canadian spec and it's owner put LEDs in there from day 1. I just assumed a simple drawing mistake.
http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2008_Stelvio.gif
It certainly makes sense in that case to add relays (or change to LEDs which draw less)
I still haven't quite figured out the reason for the light connecting to the alternator although I understand it's to keep the light off until the engine starts.

[Wayne Orwig]

I still haven't quite figured out the reason for the light connecting to the alternator although I understand it's to keep the light off until the engine starts.

Yes, the alternator field gets power from the same circuit as the headlight. If the headlight fuse (or relay) fail, then the alternator is also dead.
It is so the field (and headlight) is not powered on until after the motor is running.

[malik]

I wonder how hard it is to install the EB kit for a bloke with avg skills such as myself.

I had no trouble putting it on the 1100 Sport (tho' changing that trapezoidal affair with a 7in round light with a decent reflector would be a better long term solution) or the Enfields (stock wiring  measured at 8.6V at the lamp). Just have to choose the harness of the appropriate length. I haven't tried it on the V7 (Breva, Nevada, GRiSO) set up - which has a junction box before the H4 prongs inside the bucket. The V7's lights are pretty good, and as I have LED spots linked to high beam, there has been no real incentive to try. Probably worth looking closer, but, with all the other accessories, it would mean wiring in a decent fuse block.

[Cage Free]

I think Peter Y is right those Beaver kits are fine for old Guzzis
You could also upgrade to an LED headlight bulb, that would drop the current also.

I tried that with my 13 Stelvio. I used the Speed metal brand sold at cycle gear, the output was really nice but after about three months one of them began to flicker. Cycle gear replaced it, a bit later the other started to flicker, Cycle gear replaced that one also. This continued to happen until both sets had been replaced 3 times and I just gave up and got a refund. I put the stock bulbs back in and its been trouble free for over a year.

[Demar]

I bought an Eastern Beaver 3-circuit solution for my Stelvio (not installed yet, but soon). I am upgrading to two horns (PIAA) and will put those on the relay along with my seat heater and a dual USB charge port near the passenger seat to charge my phone/PPS while I'm riding.

Eastern Beaver products are top shelf.

[Lannis]

I tried that with my 13 Stelvio. I used the Speed metal brand sold at cycle gear, the output was really nice but after about three months one of them began to flicker. Cycle gear replaced it, a bit later the other started to flicker, Cycle gear replaced that one also. This continued to happen until both sets had been replaced 3 times and I just gave up and got a refund. I put the stock bulbs back in and its been trouble free for over a year.

I've got a pair of the same Cycle Gear "Speedmetal" lights waiting for me to install them (which I'll probably do when I take the fork tubes out to find out where my damping went).   

If they fail like yours, I won't bother to send them back, knowing that they're just not made for the application.   If they do good, I'll report that too for another data point .....

Lannis

[Kiwi_Roy]

Yes, the alternator field gets power from the same circuit as the headlight. If the headlight fuse (or relay) fail, then the alternator is also dead.
It is so the field (and headlight) is not powered on until after the motor is running.

Thanks Wayne,
Now I've got it, I was looking at it ass backwards, I never thought they would switch the alternator off also.
Pin 28 of the dash turns on the Light Logic relay (pin 23 on other models)
 

[redhawk47]

Well, I'm fixing to change your life!

I always thought it was so silly that only ONE of my American-spec Stelvio's headlights would come on with the high beam, as opposed to Canadian-spec ones where BOTH lights would come on with the high beam.

So, acting on the advice of "several", I made a simple jumper from the H4 connector that had a high beam over to the other one that didn't, and Eh Voila!  both headlights came on with the high beam.

Until one day, in the dusk, rolling down Afton Mountain well behind a T-bucket hotrod, Fay said "Is that that hotrod ahead of us I'm smelling?"  And I said "Yep, smells like a burning electrical connection, probably didn't wire it right, silly lad!".    And then an amazing coincidence, my high beam went out.

The stupid design sends all the current through that little plastic switch.   I don't know how the Canadian system works, but two stock H4 bulbs is too much for the switch, and I had to replace the whole handlebar unit, which in itself requires unbolting the fuel tank, which requires taking the whole fairing off, etc ....

The low-beams operate off of the engine-run relay so they don't go through a switch, but the high-beams do .... and it's marginal.

Lannis

You must of had a first gen Stelvio. I am pretty sure my 2013 Stelvio always run both bulbs, low or high beam, but I may be wrong (the bike has been sold so I cannot check it). I checked a 2008 Stelvio wiring diagram and it shows wiring to only one high beam. I checked the 2011 wiring diagram and it has a relay for the high beam, but it shows wiring running to only one of the bulbs also. But we all know how well MG updates their manuals.