Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: JeffOlson on January 21, 2016, 12:06:05 PM
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If I were king...
1. Co-marketing: Moto Guzzi should team up with Triumph here in the US to market their bikes. They are complementary, and MG could benefit greatly from the expanded dealer network. I would really love to see Latus Harley-Davidson/Triumph add Moto Guzzi (and I know at least one of their salesmen who would love to see that, too, because he could then ride a Moto Guzzi to work).
2. Warehousing: Make AF1 Racing the official warehouse for Piaggio parts in the US (they already are unofficially), and fill them up with stock. No more waiting for the slow boat from Italy.
3. Training: Train some techs!
4. Focus: If the V7 line were 50% of my sales, I would focus on developing and expanding that line, including doing more of what Moto Guzzi has started to do with optional add-on parts (a la Triumph with their modern classics). Remember the 80-20 rule: 80% of your customers generate 20% of your income (and take 80% of your time), while the other 20% generate 80%.
What have you got?
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I think your points are good. I think they should do commercials; Online ads, Youtube ads, TV ads, etc. Most people never heard of the brand. I don't even think there is an ad here on this site... :wink:
I do think that being part of the Piaggio group is great already for Moto Guzzi.
They just need to make people want a guzzi, and that's done by advertising & brainwashing :afro:
Edit: My observations on people who know the brand: Typically older folks know the brand (people in their 80s), then people I work with whom range from 20-60 have never heard of the brand and I have to repeat the motorcycle brand name "s l o w l y" so they can try and remember it...
That said, whatever they did initially was working well as far as brand recognition goes, what they have been doing lately isn't all that successful.
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1. Take risks
2. Start collaborations with other companies, I.E. Tesla Guzzi electric motorcycle, Guzzi Ferrari super bike, etc.
And if they fail at both, at least it will be historical (good or bad)
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More successful ?
A new owner or company has to buy it from Piaggio
that way there won't be internal competition with Aprilias ..... 'nuff said.
and let M. Galluzzi go.....
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In the USA they could spend a few dollars and stick a few bikes in a trailer and tour the country. Pull the trailer behind a DP motorhome with full body ad art.
But first they need to acknowledge that they exist because of customers and not because they grace our presence with theirs:
1. Go the extra mile for your customers. Don't weasle on warranties. If an owner has an issue, don't make them go cross country for a claim when no dealer is local, they took the money right? Make it smooth and easy.
2. Make amends with dealers. Treat dealers right and dealers treat customers right.
3. Set a clear direction for the company. Just what is a Moto Guzzi these days, a 70s era bike or traditional bikes moving into the current century?
Moto Guzzi has everything to gain. The engines are marvelous. The owners are passionate. Support that.
Customer service doesn't have to.mean giving the store away, it means being responsive, fair, involved, helpful and interested.
Realize that buyers have choices and you can't really sell something if it isn't available.
Understand that the owners who are satisfied with a 70s, 80s or 90s and early 2000s Moto Guzzi are not the customers that keep the company afloat, it is buyers of current models. Recognize that those who contribute to the yearly bottom line are the ones to chase.
Repeat customers mean repeat revenue. A customer who buys once and then recycles the used market isn't putting money in the company's coffers.
Where is the Moto Guzzi customer loyalty program? Just because you say a MG is durable doesn't mean buying a new MGdetracts from that.
Where is the Moto Guzzicustomer satisfaction survey for owners of current models? If they aren't asking what current model owners think then what can they possibly know?
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- Keep a very limited dealer network
- Do not stock or warehouse parts in the the USA and stock no more than one of a part so it can then be on backorder for the next person
- If there is a valid warranty claim do not authorize the repair for 6 months and then let the owner know parts are backordered for 3 more months.
- Install warranty parts but make the owner pay for labor
- Deliver new model year bikes in the 4th quarter of that same year just in time for winter.
- Make very small changes from bike to bike so that they are like fingerprints
- Use names that make no sense or names people don't know how to pronunce. Or name the bike after something slow and heavy.
Do the opposite ^^^^ of what they are currently doing and never ever use the god awful tear drop shaped gas tank again!
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Guzzi just has to get bigger displacement and bolder retro designs. Especially if they're scrapping the CARC line.
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In the USA they could spend a few dollars and stick a few bikes in a trailer and tour the country.
They used to have that........ until the MN group "sunk" it at the Nationals in 2007. It now rests in a field south of Money Creek.
(http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f82/juturtle/IMGP4071_zpsk1oppyr9.jpg) (http://s45.photobucket.com/user/juturtle/media/IMGP4071_zpsk1oppyr9.jpg.html)
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Hell, all they need is a decent business plan and long-term commitment.
They could probably copy large parts of Ducati's and Triumph's business plans, they both came back from obscurity and got decent market shares.
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they need to work on the dealer network. Perhaps co market with Aprillia. It might work, actually Yamaha made a Star Brand to differentiate Yamaha. But more dealers and better service.
Marketing should leverage around the Rallies and Message Board. They've a got a loyal fan base but you'd never know it since they don't seem to communicate here. (probably liability adverse)
as for products:
Moto Guzzi needs a 1200-1400 Sporting Bike, not a full on track bike- probably a naked Sport to replace the Griso and a new LeMans (half fairing). They need to expand the Cal 1400 into something like a Beemer RT or an RS (new Norge), not another Custom Cruiser Clone- they've already got it covered. And update the Stelvio. Finally, a retro big block standard.
Looks like they've got the small blocks covered with products.
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Hell, all they need is a decent business plan and long-term commitment.
They could probably copy large parts of Ducati's and Triumph's business plans, they both came back from obscurity and got decent market shares.
But Ducati and Triumph went after a younger demographic with "sporty" bikes.
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they need to work on the dealer network. Perhaps co market with Aprillia. It might work, actually Yamaha made a Star Brand to differentiate Yamaha. But more dealers and better service.
Marketing should leverage around the Rallies and Message Board. They've a got a loyal fan base but you'd never know it since they don't seem to communicate here. (probably liability adverse)
as for products:
Moto Guzzi needs a 1200-1400 Sporting Bike, not a full on track bike- probably a naked Sport to replace the Griso and a new LeMans (half fairing). They need to expand the Cal 1400 into something like a Beemer RT or an RS (new Norge), not another Custom Cruiser Clone- they've already got it covered. And update the Stelvio. Finally, a retro big block standard.
Looks like they've got the small blocks covered with products.
They could at least pay some of the bills here :laugh:
I agree with what John is suggesting re models and marketing . Not holding my breath for any of these changes , but maybe at least the mothership could implement a couple of these ideas .
Take a :bow: John .
Dusty
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Define "successful." Really. Because the most traditionally "successful" motorcycle company in the USA is basically a t-shirt company that happens to sell motorcycles. Harleys have become really good (though vastly overpriced), but I'm not sure that's what I'd want Guzzi to become. I happen to LIKE being the only person I'll see all summer on a Guzzi.
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there is a simple, proven formula. I have owned and or been associated with at least 6 different successful wholesale distribution business. most selling Stihl (German) products. selling to full service retail accounts just like the Guzzi dealers we have now.
first the distributor has to own the business so he has his personal money tied up and has to be successful. factory owned will never be successful because they just want to do the minimum to stay employed.
next you need 2 things. #1 a foundation of dealers who care about the product more than money. Guzzi has had a lot of these and has screwed most of them until they gave up. #2 is parts inventory. Distributors have to have all parts in stock and the order needs to be shipped to the dealer in NO MORE THAN 24hours! units need to ship in 48 max.
this is called a foundation and just like building a house or skyscraper the foundation is where you have to start.
lots of things come next like total warranty support, additional dealers that have room to grow etc.
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They used to have that........ until the MN group "sunk" it at the Nationals in 2007. It now rests in a field south of Money Creek.
(http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f82/juturtle/IMGP4071_zpsk1oppyr9.jpg) (http://s45.photobucket.com/user/juturtle/media/IMGP4071_zpsk1oppyr9.jpg.html)
Brilliant marketing. Hmmmm, no graphics or pictures, just a name. So only about ninetyyyyyyyfive percent of people who saw it had no idea what a "Moto Guzzi" is.
Yep, advertising is what is needed. Product placement in movies, TV and ads. In a word, awareness. Oh yeah, product to back it up.
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Getting publicity isn't all that hard, gotta have something behind it or some press is worse than no press.
We have it all wrong. Moto Guzzi knows what needs to be done, they aren't ignorant of good business practices.
The people running the company know exactly what they are doing and why. It is just that we don't know, nor are we likely to know, ever.
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In sports, there are teams that usually win and those that have a formula for NEVER winning.
Example: Cleveland Browns (football), Chicago Cubs (baseball). The New England Patriots turned it around because MANAGEMENT CARED and decided to invest the money. There are other businesses and teams that generally make good decisions and others that seem to always manage to make the wrong decisions. They snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. They do the same things expecting different results. That's insanity.
I get the impression from reading 1000's of posts that we the MG owners feel like they don't listen to us and don't really care about what we think. Harley Davidson on the other hand is a great success story because they care about their owners, they listen to them, and they invest the money.
Until that happens with Moto Guzzi... Good Luck!
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Draft Pete Roper to Mandello as chief of quality control and warranty claims approval. But, don't tell him I said so.
Ralph
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Define "successful." Really. Because the most traditionally "successful" motorcycle company in the USA is basically a t-shirt company that happens to sell motorcycles. Harleys have become really good (though vastly overpriced), but I'm not sure that's what I'd want Guzzi to become. I happen to LIKE being the only person I'll see all summer on a Guzzi.
Agreed ............ In the world of suits and yes men,You all might want to be careful what you wish for.
Ducati is a perfect Italian example.......... you cant have it both ways unfortunately.
Ciao. As you were gentlemen. :cool:
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its all about the customer ,guzzi dealers can only do so much when a three month old bike has issues and it will take two weeks to get the parts is not acceptable.Ihave an 2002 guzzi with an outstanding recall and nothing ever got gone dealer did all he could but no help called guzzi my self all i got we will call you back but nothing again.How about participating in the motorcycle show,last few years the guzzi dealer put up a display him self at show which just does not seem fair.They are going to have to reach in their pockets and advertise .Most people out there don't even know what a moto guzzi is.just my opinion.
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Maybe Fiat should buy Moto Guzzi. We all know how good the Dealer network and part supply for them is here in the USA.
Dean
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If good customer service, a good dealer network and parts and service availability means having it both ways, yes, it is possible and the way it should be.
I wonder if the HD bike owner frets over not being exclusive when they need a part and its available, when there is an entire aftermarket industry that can and does make virtually anything imaginable for every HD ever made so that the most common HD can be made into something no else has.
Oldest trick in the book, telling someone that to get something you need to give up something unrelated.
How does seeing someone else riding a Moto Guzzi diminish the one you have?
Want exclusivity and want to be unique? At the next rally, instead of eating some great BBQ, sit at the table with a glass of nonfat milk and a bowl of kale salad without dressing and a burlap napkin.
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You won't get a better dealer network until the factory stops screwing the dealers.
Remember when Guzzi started adding dealers? They put them almost next door to existing ones. Then they ignored both.
It's easy to say the dealers should care more aboutthe bikes than money when it's your bike and their money.
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700-800 bikes sold per year in the U.S., and a fair amount of those deeply discounted, is never going to maintain a robust dealer network. Nor is it worth any kind of serious advertising investment. Even if MG somehow miraculously doubled sales worldwide, this still wouldn't translate to more than several hundred more units stateside, just a balance sheet error for any of the larger manufacturers whose dealership ubiquity we envy.
We in the U.S. love a tiny, niche, eccentric little brand, of which we are a miniscule 10% of sales. MG doesn't compete on horsepower or the latest electronic doo-dads, so good luck ever grabbing a significantly larger piece of market share.
I'm just thankful they're still shipping bikes over the pond.
Alright then, recommence with gnashing of teeth, etc. (http://wildguzzi.com/forum/Smileys/default/popcorn.gif)
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Additionally, they need to go back to bold stick logo :grin:
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/68/Moto_Guzzi_Logo_SEIMM.png)
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Make the equivalent of the Thruxton and they will get plenty of free press.
(http://www.motoplanete.com/triumph/zoom-700px/Triumph-1200-Thruxton-R-2016-700px.jpg)
The last time MG received some exciting free press was when they showed the MGS01 and then they crapped out.
(https://s.yimg.com/fz/api/res/1.2/dn2HQ9YrzRV1Q05ZSUQdsw--/YXBwaWQ9c3JjaGRkO2g9NTA0O3E9OTU7dz03NTA-/http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/Gallery%20%20A/Moto%20Guzzi%20MGS-01%20Pro.jpg)
Is there any buzz on this bike......not really.
(https://cdn.rideapart.com/wp-content/uploads/2015%2F12%2Fmg1.jpg)
Good dealer network would be great but they need to build the bikes based on the fact that the vast majority of the dealers don't know shit about how to service the bikes. In my case, the local dealer's head mechanic hates MG,(BMW snob) so why would i ever bring my bike there.
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Perhaps if BMW bought MG? Better dealer network and customer service, parts availability, etc. Seems BMW supports their dealers ...
Maybe not, just a thought.
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Build big block standards, similar to the V7 line. That is, modern versions of the T3, Mille GT, etc., and keep them light with good performance, fuel economy, and range.
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Perhaps a small delegation of WG members with a knack for diplomacy, persuasion and technical skill could fly to Mandello this year for the 95th anniversary and enjoy the time there to visit and share concern about the current state of affairs of Guzzi N.A.
I'm sure we can find a few of the head chieftains at Guzzi with whom to have a conversation and provide some feedback on how Guzzi Italy and Piaggio N.A. are managing the relationship with Dealers/Customers etc.
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Personally I think MG is the modern equivalent of the airhead that BMW abandoned. I had to work hard to get a MG. When I first started shopping MG wasn't even on my radar screen. I knew I wanted a standard or UJM, air cooled (I've since had a change of Hart), under 450 lbs, 600 to 800 cc, ABS, EI, FI, decent cruising range, comparatively long service intervals and easy maintenance, not too tall (I am only 5'8 :bike-037:") and I considered shaft drive a definite benefit. Anyway, MG was the only motorcycle I found that checked all those boxes. I probably missed some motorcycles (?) but certainly a Triumph or BMW or to my knowledge at the time a Honda could not check all those boxes. Locating a dealer was another trial. The MG website didn't tell me anything except that there is none "in my area". I was pleasantly surprised to find one "only" 200 miles away. Still they should at least provide an option of letting me select a distance range that I would consider to be within my area. Now that I own one (a V7II Stone) I think the big advantages over all other almost equivalent motorcycles are: lighter weight, shaft drive, ABS as standard, comparatively easy maintenance (esp valve adjustment and no chain and no water cooling system). Unfortunately motorcycle magazine reviews don't seem to highlight those aspects, they only seem to focus on the very subjective "how it feels attacking the twisties" with the winner going to the bike with the biggest advertisement in that particular issue.
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Sounds to me that because of the lack of dealers in the area for most enthusiasts, Moto Guzzi should just bypass the idea of physical address outlet at this point since it's a huge undertaking in making that happen at this point (unless they partner with a local retail store like Sears... wait, those are all disappearing) anyway... and sell bikes only online through Amazon using cool drone delivery service to your door; Free delivery if you are Prime member, and a 30-day money back guarantee.
Problem solved.
In regards to service, parts, and repair, meh.. who needs that. That's what YouTube, eBay, and this forum are for :popcorn:
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I have a marketing degree and would be very wealthy if I had the answer to that question
At 66 I'm no longer in a "growth" demographic but those damned kids (the youth market) is the long term solution
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In sports, there are teams that usually win and those that have a formula for NEVER winning.
Example: Cleveland Browns (football), Chicago Cubs (baseball).
Sports team economics gets weird. The Houston Astros were famously the most profitable team in baseball, even as they had the worst record. The Cubs sell out every single year, and are century-long underachievers (though they were good last year, and should be better in 2016).
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In the USA they could spend a few dollars and stick a few bikes in a trailer and tour the country. Pull the trailer behind a DP motorhome with full body ad art.
But first they need to acknowledge that they exist because of customers and not because they grace our presence with theirs:
1. Go the extra mile for your customers. Don't weasle on warranties. If an owner has an issue, don't make them go cross country for a claim when no dealer is local, they took the money right? Make it smooth and easy.
2. Make amends with dealers. Treat dealers right and dealers treat customers right.
3. Set a clear direction for the company. Just what is a Moto Guzzi these days, a 70s era bike or traditional bikes moving into the current century?
Moto Guzzi has everything to gain. The engines are marvelous. The owners are passionate. Support that.
Customer service doesn't have to.mean giving the store away, it means being responsive, fair, involved, helpful and interested.
Realize that buyers have choices and you can't really sell something if it isn't available.
Understand that the owners who are satisfied with a 70s, 80s or 90s and early 2000s Moto Guzzi are not the customers that keep the company afloat, it is buyers of current models. Recognize that those who contribute to the yearly bottom line are the ones to chase.
Repeat customers mean repeat revenue. A customer who buys once and then recycles the used market isn't putting money in the company's coffers.
Where is the Moto Guzzi customer loyalty program? Just because you say a MG is durable doesn't mean buying a new MGdetracts from that.
Where is the Moto Guzzicustomer satisfaction survey for owners of current models? If they aren't asking what current model owners think then what can they possibly know?
This sounds just like the Tom Cruise movie "Jerry McGuire ", just replace football players with Moto Guzzi. :evil:
All are good sound ideas that will sadly never see the light of day.
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Sports team economics gets weird. The Houston Astros were famously the most profitable team in baseball, even as they had the worst record. The Cubs sell out every single year, and are century-long underachievers (though they were good last year, and should be better in 2016).
".... the total regular season home attendance of the Cleveland Browns franchise of the National Football League from 2006 to 2015. In 2006, the regular season home attendance of the franchise was 578,672."
It was less this year but the town supports the team. Too bad they suck, but it is a tradition to say there is always next year.
It is the same with the Indians though in the 1970's they were not supported by the fans; I could walk into the stadium after the 2nd inning and have great seats behind home base for free because they just wanted bodies to fill up that enormous stadium.
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SUPER BOWL AD
:lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed:
)that would just about break the whole company)
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wow ! USA Guzzisti must have a really sad dealer network.
My advice to Guzzi...... become Honda. Sell more bikes, get more dealer support. How? LISTEN TO WHAT WE WANT!
Guzzi hit the mark with the V7 range. Selling well from where I'm looking. But what about producing bikes we want? THe MGS01 was an awesome machine. Make some more! The Bellagio woud have sold like hotckaes in the USA, seemed made for the US market, but never sold there ! Why? Did they think they'd lose market share to the california range? HELLO ! If someone buys one Guzzi in favour of another Guzzi,..... They're still selling a Guzzi ! D'oh !
(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/P1020108_zps9tcqrjtw.jpg)
and then,.......... a ton of people have been making said Bellagio into a cafe racer A'la V7 style.
(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/Bellagio%20936%20CR%2002_zps1thy44cv.jpg)
hmmmm what an idea,............ using one frame/engine style - Bellagio and making a cafe racer out of a cruiser. Does that work?
and if they brought back the Daytona 1000, (or an updated engine in that guise,... ) I'd buy one!
Unfortunately for Guzzi, I have to buy an old bike and make for myself what they should be producing.
(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/P1020153_zps3elkps5m.jpg)
I'm even thinking, since the bellagio is such a fantastic bike, to buy another one, so I have one that looks like the half way between cruiser and V7 clone. Looks to me like the perfect Guzzi answer to the Ducati Monster.
and it's a parts bin special.
(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/P1020126_zpsrf4ngrhi.jpg)
WhAT AN IDIOT DECISION NOT TO SELL THE bELLAGIO IN THE us. i CAN IMAGINE THE AWESOME BIKES YOU yANKS WOULD HAVE MADE FROM IT......... wHAT gUZZI COULDA, sHOULDA DONE.
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OK. iVE HAd A FEW BEERS,.... MY EXCUSE TO RANT. nEXT(wOOPS CAPPSLOCK!)
My next Guzzi is probably a daytona/sport 100
(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/silversport_zpsjo7xhxzc.jpg)
or a Griso, made to look like the old Sport 1100/ daytona a'la Ipothesys.
(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/Moto_Guzzi_Ipothesys_Aria_V12_020.jpg.2041103_zpsqtrlo8ew.jpg)
Quick poll, who'd buy a Guzzi lie this?
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(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/Bellagio%20936%20CR%2002_zps1thy44cv.jpg)
Yeah, you get press with this bike.
The bat mobile, gets bupkis....ok,maybe a little more than bupkis but based on the wet fart reception it got when I was at the Guzzi dealer unveiling, I'd say not much more.
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Even better, bring this contractor in house and replace the Griso with this bike. Offer an optional Ohlins equipped bike.
(http://www.ipothesys.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Ipothesys-3.jpg)
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(http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad304/Calijackalbob/Bellagio%20936%20CR%2002_zps1thy44cv.jpg)
Yeah, you get press with this bike.
The bat mobile, gets bupkis....ok,maybe a little more than bupkis but based on the wet fart reception it got when I was at the Guzzi dealer unveiling, I'd say not much more.
urrrrhhhh,What's a bupkis?Is that english or what?
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urrrrhhhh,What's a bupkis?Is that english or what?
bup·kis
ˈbo͝opkis,ˈbəp-/
nounUSinformal
nothing at all.
"you know bupkis about fundraising"
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I tried to write an ad for MG..
If a motorcycle doesn't have to be an extension of your manhood.
Either you have it or you don't. No amount of bulging chrome, 100cu between the legs or overhead cams has ever turned a milksop into Attila the Hun. The Moto Guzzi V7 is for you because you don't need a crutch. It is, simply and stubbornly, an intelligent well-made motorcycle. It delivers a very efficient 50+ miles a gallon, tops 0-60 in around 5 seconds, and has a top speed of over 100 mph. Enough for anybody who isn't trying to prove something. It's also got ABS and traction control to protect you from the guys who are. Besides it out-handles and out corners a lot of fancy-price fantasy bikes. Our price is a mere $8990 but for another 3000 bucks you can choose from one of our exclusive Guzzi Garage extension packs because lets face it we've been kidding our selves up to now and so far you've been reading something Luigi senior wrote in 1965 but the world changed. Luigi senior died a long time ago, God rest his soul. Your changing and we want to change with you and help you change. Lets face it these days we all have sexual inadequacies. We know your only considering a motorcycle because of that mid life crisis your currently going through! Go on, and spend that extra $3000 on a garage pack to boot. You know you want it, we know that too and your friends know you need it from the stupid posts you pin on your face book wall. Make the next post 'I bought a Moto Guzzi'! Make that a proud post, buy a Garage pack because your an individual and you demand exclusivity. It's a tough world out there and you need to stand out from the crowd.
but as you can see - half way through I tried to give it a modern spin and it all went horribly wrong :(
I conclude Guzzi should pay me to review the competition
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The underlying assumption here is that Moto Guzzi isn't successful or, if it is, that it could significantly improve its success by ...?
Does anyone actually know how successful Moto Guzzi is in Italy? Rest of Europe? Asia? South America? Africa? Is the North American market (Canada, Mexico, the U.S) significant?
From a North American centric view, I'd say:
Come out with a V7 with more horsepower.
Make better use of your apparently small marketing budget. Start by either dropping the Ewan McGregor association or doing something with it that isn't embarrassing. I dare say Billy Joel would be more effective.
Stop looking like you're playing catch-up with Ducati.
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Rob , MG's total production is about 8,000 units a year , tiny compared to any other real MC company.
Dusty
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Rob , MG's total production is about 8,000 units a year , tiny compared to any other real MC company.
Dusty
But that has nothing to do with whether the company is financially successful.
Leica's production of cameras is insignificant compared to Canon and Nikon, but my rather well-connected camera dealer told me recently that the big names are bleeding money whereas Leica is making money. And yes, this is a New York dealer that works almost exclusively with professionals and Leicas are a very small part of its sales.
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Change your image and substance.
Stodgy Volvo managed to do it
From this to this
(http://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/gallery/volvo-240-turns-40-photo-gallery_1.jpg)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-7BjMQ4uQ2OE/VqEq2_GzXkI/AAAAAAABTAA/ju1kCckDuMY/s1600/2017-Volvo-S90-R-Design-105.jpg)
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Moto Guzzi has two choices. It can be a mass market brand or a niche brand. Both are completely legitimate business models. So far, it's the latter, and there's no reason to believe that that is about to change. Nor is it obvious why it should change. I would include, in niche, the company's express interest in fleet sales.
As a niche brand, I think the only issue is the demographics of its buyers in its key markets, wherever those markets are and whatever the demographics. North Americans who extrapolate what they know about local Piaggio demographics, mostly anecdotal anyway, to Europe, are way offside the reality.
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Make better use of your apparently small marketing budget. Start by either dropping the Ewan McGregor association or doing something with it that isn't embarrassing. I dare say Billy Joel would be more effective.
I should perhaps clarify this. The reference to Billy Joel is not a crack. He is a big Moto Guzzi fan, who has a space on Long Island, open to the public on weekends, that houses his collection of Moto Guzzi and other bikes. There is also a fairly amusing video on You Tube about him riding Sonny Bono to a rented house on Long Island, the only problem being that Bono didn't know where the house was.
Info here: http://www.20thcenturycycles.com/
There are some news articles on the site about why he created 20th Century Cycles.
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Billy Joel ? Wonder how many folks under the age age of 50 even know who that guy is ? :shocked: :shocked: :grin:
Dusty
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Billy Joel ? Wonder how many folks under the age age of 50 even know who that guy is ? :shocked: :shocked: :grin:
Dusty
Just might be why I said "I dare say Billy Joel might be more effective". I guess the wry tone didn't come across. That said, young people do know Billy Joel's music. I'd be surprised if there hasn't been a discussion, although if there has, nothing has come of it.
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1. Recognize it's a lifestyle brand. They're not competing for the biggest hp, highest top speed, latest tech. So, if they're not, then like Harley, Royal Enfield, etc., they're selling an experience. For some, it's theatre. This does not have to denigrate their engineering, merely figure out where the emphasis should be. Dave over at Moto International said that the same designers do Aprilia & Moto Guzzi. Aprilia is based on tech & performance. Guzzi is in some ways harder, an experience.
2. If it's a lifestyle/experience brand, then start using social media more to help create and communicate the image.
3. Sounds odd, but work on getting product placement in the right movie(s). Worked for diamonds. Diamonds were not originally valued (and to this day are an artificial market; there are enough diamonds in storage that they could make diamonds no more valuable than cut glass if they were allowed into the market).
4. If it's a lifestyle, then start working on more options for the bikes that let owners play with or develop that image.
Frankly, I think most of you don't want Moto Guzzi to become too successful. If "everyone" starts riding one, how interesting would it be? If popularity goes up, the only way to keep production at reasonable levels is to raise the price. Then (like older Porsche owners) you can sit around, over beers, and bemoan how you used to get a new Porsche for $5-6k.
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2. If it's a lifestyle/experience brand, then start using social media more to help create and communicate the image.
Moto Guzzi clearly has a very limited marketing budget, but being more active on social media is not a big drain.
Three weeks ago, I sent an e-mail to the press address of Moto Guzzi North America asking for high resolution versions of their current public relations photos of the V7 II Special Rosso. I told them that I intend to make some YouTube videos about the bike, and that the photos might be helpful.
One might think I'd get a download code immediately, given that the whole point of these photos is to get them widely seen.
Three weeks later, I have no response. Not yes, not no, nothing.
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Just might be why I said "I dare say Billy Joel might be more effective". I guess the wry tone didn't come across. That said, young people do know Billy Joel's music. I'd be surprised if there hasn't been a discussion, although if there has, nothing has come of it.
Might be on to something here if it were Billy Joel AND Christie Brinkley featured in the first ad...you know, Old Guy has nice looking, well preserved wife just a few years younger, then flash forward to Billy Joel riding with his 3rd wife, a chick 1/2 his age, now that would make Guzzi sell like Viagra and Hotcakes in a heartbeat, and voila...Piano Man becomes Uomo di Guzzi!
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Might be on to something here if it were Billy Joel AND Christie Brinkley featured in the first ad...you know, Old Guy has nice looking, well preserved wife just a few years younger, then flash forward to Billy Joel riding with his 3rd wife, a chick 1/2 his age, now that would make Guzzi sell like Viagra and Hotcakes in a heartbeat, and voila...Piano Man becomes Uomo di Guzzi!
So... Paul , are you saying it was the Guzzi and not all of Billy's money at work there ? Interesting :laugh:
Dusty
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So... Paul , are you saying it was the Guzzi and not all of Billy's money at work there ? Interesting :laugh: Dusty
What better marketing than that, right? Just like the Tag Heuer...you too can be Tiger Woods if you wear one, or the Davidoff Cologne - you too can dive from a cliff and come up out of the water to a beautiful babe. They all play to every man's desire to be something bigger and better than they are...that's what sells.
Don't see why it wouldn't work for Guzzi too...and Bill Joel is sort of Italianish, so it might just work. Certainly would be more appealing than seeing Ewan McGregor riding off into the dust all by himself! :grin: :grin:
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Paul , the only one of those product names that is familiar is Tag Heuer , and that's only because there are signs with that logo around every racing circuit in the world . Tiger Woods , is he a tennis player ? :laugh:
Dusty
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Tiger Woods , is he a tennis player ? :laugh: Dusty
Only in his spare time, when he's not chasing wimmins or being pummeled with a 5 iron! :grin: :grin:
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I tried to write an ad for MG..
If a motorcycle doesn't have to be an extension of your manhood.
Either you have it or you don't. No amount of bulging chrome, 100cu between the legs or overhead cams has ever turned a milksop into Attila the Hun. The Moto Guzzi V7 is for you because you don't need a crutch. It is, simply and stubbornly, an intelligent well-made motorcycle. It delivers a very efficient 50+ miles a gallon, tops 0-60 in around 5 seconds, and has a top speed of over 100 mph. Enough for anybody who isn't trying to prove something. It's also got ABS and traction control to protect you from the guys who are. Besides it out-handles and out corners a lot of fancy-price fantasy bikes. Our price is a mere $8990 but for another 3000 bucks you can choose from one of our exclusive Guzzi Garage extension packs because lets face it we've been kidding our selves up to now and so far you've been reading something Luigi senior wrote in 1965 but the world changed a long time ago. luigi senior died a long time ago, God rest his soul. Your changing and we want to change with you and help you change. Lets face it these days we all have sexual inadequacies. We know your only considering a motorbike because of that mid life crisis your currently going through! Go on, and spend that extra $3000 on a garage pack to boot. You know you want it, we know that too and your friends know you need it from the stupid posts you pin on your face book wall. Make the next post 'I bought a Moto Guzzi'! Make that a proud post, buy a Garage pack because your an individual and you demand exclusivity. It's a tough world out there and you need to stand out from the crown.
but as you half way through I tried to give it a modern spin and as you see it all went horribly wrong :(
I conclude Guzzi should pay me to review the competition
HaHa! I like it.
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Perhaps a small delegation of WG members with a knack for diplomacy, persuasion and technical skill could fly to Mandello this year for the 95th anniversary and enjoy the time there to visit and share concern about the current state of affairs of Guzzi N.A.
I'm sure we can find a few of the head chieftains at Guzzi with whom to have a conversation and provide some feedback on how Guzzi Italy and Piaggio N.A. are managing the relationship with Dealers/Customers etc.
I'll volunteer my services! Since I will be there anyway!
Tom
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I don't think its what members want but.....
would this be a suprising strategy?
Simplify the current range by dropping the 1200 and dropping CARC.
Make all bikes with single throttle bodies, standardise on components from Piago parts bin. Keep everything simple. Ensure expensive option packs are available for the reduced two platform range.
Drop the current dealer network.
Make all Ducati and Piagio dealers also Guzzi dealers, make them buy one Guzzi a month to keep their dealership.
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They've never been perfect, and never will be- BUT they have been in business since 1921. So I think they are fine as is.
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MG is already successful. If you were MG why would you change anything? To change there must be some incentive to do so.
What incentive does MG have to change?
Increase customer loyalty? Why on earth change to get more of that when the people that own MG bikes aren't going anywhere?
Increase sales? Maybe its time to read what the company is about, find anything where it says that its customers are a priority and its goals are to be more than it is? Read any defined goals that says they want to grow through improved market penetration?
Customer satisfaction improvement? Why, when they know that no matter what they do or how they do it a philosophy of acceptance and defense of that's just the way it is exists?
MG is already successful. It got you to buy one didn't it? And from many comments posted, once you got yours do you really care if anyone else buys one unless you are trying to sells yours on the used market?
If we're honest with ourselves, we'd recognize that we are the reason why MG won't change. MG has figured out that if its customers are afraid it will close up shop that it can do what it wants in whatever manner it chooses to do so.
More proof? How many of you would be willing to put your name on a letter demanding that MG improve it's customer service operations? I think almost none. There are quite a few members of this forum, who among you would actually stand up and be willing to ask MG to do better?
Pretty sure the answer is nearly none. That isn't a bad or negative thing, it is just the way it is.
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NP , what the heck are you doing up at 4:28 PST ? :laugh: We are gonna have to find you a job to burn off some of that energy :grin:
Dusty
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I realize that MG is not alone, but it is concerning to see dealers offering "new" bikes that are 2-3 model years old. Even as someone who likes them, it's a bit disconcerting.
If they're not selling technology, they need to stress image/experience.
I can remember the first time I ever saw a MG. Springfield, Ohio, mid 60's. Riding in a car with my dad, a motorcycle pulled up beside us. Amazing to see the cylinders sticking out like that. Dad said it was a Moto Guzzi. A somewhat rare, well made motorcycle that was the choice of experienced riders. They could do more to push that image.
That image works today.
Moto Guzzi: The choice of experienced riders.
(crap -- it's even reasonably accurate....)
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You might as well go with Fabio. He collects motorcycles and is even Italian.
(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c327/triplejim/Misc/misc_motorcycle_photos/fabio_collection_zpshhgr4iky.jpg)
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Fabio ? Who the heck is he ? My vote is for the Texas Turnip , he can just scare folks into buying a Guzzi :evil:
Wait , is that Fabio guy the bass player in some version of BS&T , there have been like 150 different members .
Dusty
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Yep, advertising is what is needed. Product placement in movies, TV and ads. In a word, awareness.
I have been doing just that.
As a film production designer, I am responsible for the "look" and for setting the scene, and I recently got 4 brand new bikes for a big commercial shoot: California, Audace, Eldorado and a V7.
I got all black ones, for a group of bikers in a crowd scene. The actors were real Harley guys, but they really liked the MG's, as did everyone else. They looked really amazing all lined up, and were a better choice than Harleys, as the well known ad campaign is about being unique.
People have heard of Moto Guzzi, but they never actually see one, and when they do they are impressive. I don't even like cruisers but I want the Audace.
Look for it soon. I will post it as soon as it airs...
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If they pulled Fabio in he could do double duty, a little dirt on his face and open helmet, sell the Griso, a pony tail, sell the Roamer.
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As long as Guzzi is stuck with Aprilia it will not be allowed the spread it's wings.
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Sorry, but knowbuddy under 40 gives two cents about Billy joel.
Have you seen what he looks like latley? Picture Micky Rooney in his later years!
Ewan is a far better spokesman if you want to reach a non gray customer.
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Usually, a company will spend far more dollars trying to get new customers than they will taking care of the customers they have. This is a mistake in my thinking. Unfortunately, it seems Moto Guzzi spends money on neither.
Example:
Here I sit with a 2010 Stelvio that I really like as my sidecar tug. But, with a pending flat tappet problem looming what do I do? My local dealer just dropped Moto Guzzi and can no longer help with any warrantee, although I know they will help anyway they can. So, I guess I call Moto International and hope out of the kindness of their hearts they will try and help? That's a hell of an expectation to place on a shop that I didn't even buy the bike from. Plus, my maintenance records are only the dates and work performed by me. That was one of Guzzi's selling points that the owner could work on it. Now it may prevent any $ assistance.
I can't blame my dealer for dropping Guzzi either. They haven't been able to sell much of anything in the Moto Guzzi line the last year, and with the new Triumph models coming out they feel there is just no point anymore of having both.
Highly unlikely I will buy another Guzzi in the near future which is a real shame. I like them. A lot in fact. Since I bought my first one in 2008 I have had a Norge, Stelvio, Griso, and V7.
But, I also like BMW, Triumph, Ducati, KTM etc. I am not brand loyal. There are so many great bikes out there to try, why make it difficult? If MG can't keep me happy, maybe others can. That is why last summer I bought a BMW R1200RS. MG had nothing comparable to offer. If they can't keep their dealers or their customers happy, it is a remote chance that they will see much growth in the line, no matter how nice the bikes are.
It makes me wonder what MG North America is all about. What do they do 5 days a week? Are they that lackadaisical, or is Piaggio impossible to deal with?
Far too long a rant for me. I should have gone skiing today.
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How about offering an AARP member discount? :grin:
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James' Guzzi Commercial #1.
Medium: YouTube
[FADE IN]
Before us is a perfect summer day. Beautiful country side. Light breeze.
We are looking down a country road that winds into the distance.
Blended with the sounds of the countryside, we hear the deep throated idle of a Moto Guzzi.
[Deep, calm, male voice; slow pace]
_____Riding to you isn't bench racing motorcycle stats.
_____Riding isn't seeing how many Bluetooth connections you can make.
_____Riding is a conversation you have with your motorcycle and the road.
Long pause, while we hear the engine over the view of the open road.
[Fade to black]
From the blackness
[Fade In]
Moto Guzzi logo.
Below the logo.
[Fade in]
The choice of experienced riders.
[Fade Out]
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James' Guzzi Commercial #2.
Medium: YouTube
We see a black screen and hear the deep throated sound of a Moto Guzzi idling.
From the blackness
A sationary Moto Guzzi fades in. We look straight at it from the front.
Small spot lights from the side and back emphasize the exposed engine cylinders.
[Deep, calm, male voice; slow pace]
_____You've always dreamed of having an Italian mistress.
Engine idle increases slightly.
[Fade to black]
From the blackness
[Fade In]
Moto Guzzi logo.
Below the logo.
[Fade in]
The choice of experienced riders.
[Fade Out]
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James' Guzzi Commercial #3.
Medium: YouTube
[FADE IN]
Before us is a perfect summer day. Beautiful country side. Light breeze.
We are looking down a country road that fades into the distance.
Blended with the sounds of the countryside, we hear the deep throated idle of a Moto Guzzi.
[Deep, calm, male voice; slow pace]
_____You've matured.
_____Riding is more than top speed.
_____More than wearing costumes.
_____The essence of riding matters to you.
[Fade to black]
From the blackness
[Fade In]
Moto Guzzi logo.
Below the logo.
[Fade in]
The choice of experienced riders.
[Fade Out
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How about offering an AARP member discount? :grin:
They already do.
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Define "successful." Really. Because the most traditionally "successful" motorcycle company in the USA is basically a t-shirt company that happens to sell motorcycles. Harleys have become really good (though vastly overpriced),
I think they're selling over 100,000 bikes a year. Overpriced?? Those people didn't think so. Somebody has to sell t-shirts, or how would we dress up for special events? Now if we could get Guzzi dealers to start selling red suspenders......... .......instant prosperity and fortune for all.
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Ad:
I've upped my standards...
Moto Guzzi!
.. now, Up Yours!
:boozing:
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Ad:
I've upped my standards...
Moto Guzzi!
.. now, Up Yours!
:boozing:
Hilarious. :thumb:
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James' Guzzi Commercial #2.
Medium: YouTube
We see a black screen and hear the deep throated sound of a Moto Guzzi idling.
From the blackness
A sationary Moto Guzzi fades in. We look straight at it from the front.
Small spot lights from the side and back emphasize the exposed engine cylinders.
[Deep, calm, male voice; slow pace]
_____You've always dreamed of having an Italian mistress.
Engine idle increases slightly.
[Fade to black]
From the blackness
[Fade In]
Moto Guzzi logo.
Below the logo.
[Fade in]
The choice of experienced riders.
[Fade Out]
That's is not bad. Here my attempt:
Jesse's Guzzi Commercial #1
Medium: Theaters
We see a black screen and hear the deep throated sound of a Moto Guzzi idling.
From the blackness
A stationary Moto Guzzi fades in. We look straight at it from the back. Tools lay all around the bike, and there is an open laptop on top of a old milk crate. The screen shows some kind of graph. A man is sitting on another old milk crate, his attention focused on something in the engine.
We hear hear the deep throated sound of a Moto Guzzi idling. It coughs and dies.
Man: Goddamn it. F**k.
[Deep, calm, male voice-over; slow pace]
"You've always dreamed of having an Italian mistress".
The man restarts the bikes. It dies immediately.
Man: F**k F**k F**k!
Wife pokes her head around the garage door: "How’s it going honey? Dinner is ready".
[Deep, calm, male voice-over; slow pace]
"Keep dreaming".
[Fade to black]
From the blackness
[Fade In]
Moto Guzzi logo.
Below the logo.
[Fade in]
Making mechanics out of riders since 1921.
[Fade Out]
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Hey Jesse. I fixed it for you. :smiley:
Jesse's Guzzi Commercial #2
Medium: Theaters
We see a black screen and hear the deep throated sound of a Moto Guzzi idling.
From the blackness
A stationary Moto Guzzi fades in. We look straight at it from the back. Tools lay all around the bike, and there is an open laptop on top of a old milk crate. The screen shows some kind of graph. A man is sitting on another old milk crate, his attention focused on something in the engine.
We hear the deep throated sound of a Moto Guzzi idling. It coughs and dies.
Man: Damn it.
Wife pokes her head around the garage door: "Hank! You've got a BMW in back. A Honda in the drive. Why are you messing with the Guzzi?"
Guy: "Those, I ride when I have to. This, I ride 'cause I want to."
[Fade to black]
From the blackness
[Fade In]
Moto Guzzi logo.
Below the logo.
[Fade in]
They're engaging even when they're not running.
[Fade Out]
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Just promote the MX 21 promo commercial. Apparently it's what the Phantom of the Opera would ride!
If you haven't seen it, look it up, just make sure your not eating or drinking when you watch it!
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Maybe Home Depot could start selling them, next to the tools section between welding equipment and air compressors.
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Stop desperately hanging onto the past, drop the Carc system? why? Having never owned a shaft driven motorcycle without an anti jacking system and ridden ones that don't have them I'd suggest on the higher output bikes they are needed. Compel Ducati store to take on Moto Guzzi when Ducati has no links to piaggio how the hell are you going to do that?
Basically they need to make a bike I might actually buy I have two, currently there is nothing in their range I would seriously consider not enough go not enough handling not enough wind protection the list goes on. The need to benchmark the 11 degree tettastrada motor and the 1290 KTM super duke motor and build something along those lines. A road burner thats not lost at the track, large capacity fuel tank for touring some wind protection. I'm currently looking at the KTM superduke GT when that finally hits dealer floors.
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If those who haven't bought a new Moto Guzzi in the last 10 years went out and bought one, that might help.
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Be careful what you wish for. Triumph is indeed sucessful. The owner went to the Orient to see how successful companies build motorbikes. He returned to Blighty with a fistful of dollars and a new plan. He built rugged bikes that shared many internal parts throughout the entire range. He then sold them to the Brits, Ozzies and Krauts(those who ride bikes hard) to test them for 5 years before hitting the American shores with well vetted bikes. 10 years in he started his "Classic" line of bikes, the Bonnevilles. He built them in England for 6 or 8 years, then moved production to Thailand. A lot of people are OK with that. A lot don't like it at all. Here is a recent unofficial unscientific poll on Triumphrat.net about it:
View Poll Results: Do you care if your Bonneville is made in Thailand?
I would would not (knowingly) buy a bike made in Thailand at all. 14 8.24%
I would buy a Thai made one but would prefer a UK made one even if it was more expensive. 32 18.82%
I would buy a Thai made one but would prefer a UK made one if it was the same cost. 39 22.94%
I have no problem if it was made in Thailand. 75 44.12%
I would prefer a Thailand made bike. 4 2.35%
Thailand? I thought they were made in Taiwan? Are those different? 6 3.53%
Voters: 170. You have already voted on this poll
Question: IF Guzzi found it made good business sense to seek better/cheaper Asian sources of product and labor, would it still be a "proper" Guzzi? If the bike requires the Mandello Tradition to be real does that mean things can not improve?
Many pride themselves on being resourceful enough to keep a Guzzi running. How many have thrown in the towel over a Guzzi improperly set up for sale, some niggling problems, or warranty issues? How many have we sent away from this site with the advice "If you are not willing to do ABC, you may not be one of us?" :grin:
I fear if you want to sell bikes to the modern people today, it had better work out of the box, or be within reach of someone who can fix it.
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If those who haven't bought a new Moto Guzzi in the last 10 years went out and bought one, that might help.
They haven't built anything in the last 10 years that I find attractive enough to make me spend my hard earned $$.
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As a film production designer, I am responsible for the "look" and for setting the scene, and I recently got 4 brand new bikes for a big commercial shoot: California, Audace, Eldorado and a V7.
...
I got all black ones, for a group of bikers in a crowd scene.
...
Look for it soon. I will post it as soon as it airs...
Please do. I'd love to see this.
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They haven't built anything in the last 10 years that I find attractive enough to make me spend my hard earned $$.
This the last thing I brought off Guzzi which is coming up on 10 years ago is treated by the current management as an anomaly and they'd really prefer it never existed because people keep asking about it. All the current stuff and up coming releases I have no interest in what so ever as they don't suit how I ride a motorcycle.
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They haven't built anything in the last 10 years that I find attractive enough to make me spend my hard earned $$.
Ok, but I am thinking you are an outlier by the look of what you own. The newest bike in your garage is twenty years old, why would be think you would have a pulse on what will sell?
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Be careful what you wish for. Triumph is indeed sucessful. The owner went to the Orient to see how successful companies build motorbikes. He returned to Blighty with a fistful of dollars and a new plan. He built rugged bikes that shared many internal parts throughout the entire range. He then sold them to the Brits, Ozzies and Krauts(those who ride bikes hard) to test them for 5 years before hitting the American shores with well vetted bikes. 10 years in he started his "Classic" line of bikes, the Bonnevilles. He built them in England for 6 or 8 years, then moved production to Thailand. A lot of people are OK with that. A lot don't like it at all. Here is a recent unofficial unscientific poll on Triumphrat.net about it:
View Poll Results: Do you care if your Bonneville is made in Thailand?
I would would not (knowingly) buy a bike made in Thailand at all. 14 8.24%
I would buy a Thai made one but would prefer a UK made one even if it was more expensive. 32 18.82%
I would buy a Thai made one but would prefer a UK made one if it was the same cost. 39 22.94%
I have no problem if it was made in Thailand. 75 44.12%
I would prefer a Thailand made bike. 4 2.35%
Thailand? I thought they were made in Taiwan? Are those different? 6 3.53%
Voters: 170. You have already voted on this poll
Question: IF Guzzi found it made good business sense to seek better/cheaper Asian sources of product and labor, would it still be a "proper" Guzzi? If the bike requires the Mandello Tradition to be real does that mean things can not improve?
Many pride themselves on being resourceful enough to keep a Guzzi running. How many have thrown in the towel over a Guzzi improperly set up for sale, some niggling problems, or warranty issues? How many have we sent away from this site with the advice "If you are not willing to do ABC, you may not be one of us?" :grin:
I fear if you want to sell bikes to the modern people today, it had better work out of the box, or be within reach of someone who can fix it.
Although everyone gets a welcome, there are probably as many people put off over that as those that buy in regardless.
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Cool, but who *is* making bikes that interest you?
They haven't built anything in the last 10 years that I find attractive enough to make me spend my hard earned $$.
This the last thing I brought off Guzzi which is coming up on 10 years ago is treated by the current management as an anomaly and they'd really prefer it never existed because people keep asking about it. All the current stuff and up coming releases I have no interest in what so ever as they don't suit how I ride a motorcycle.
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I got it, I got it! An action, adventure TV series (think "Then Came Bronson"). Call it OMG. Old Men on Guzzis.
Episode #1. How come I pee in Morse code?
Episode #2. My prostate is bigger than yours.
Episode #3. Suspenders don't have to be red.
Episode #4. How do you adjust the float on a throttle body?
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Cool, but who *is* making bikes that interest you?
KTM super Duke GT. Ducati 1200 monster/Multistrada monster has no wind protection multi is ugly, Aprilia is out because their fuel tanks are too small and I have one of their rotax powered machines and I don't think much of it, I don't think much of the local aprilia dealer either. Kawasaki H2 is on interest but I haven't looked into it recently and the local kawasaki dealer has recently closed its doors. A DB11 would be good but simply not playing in that end of the market.
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Ok, but I am thinking you are an outlier by the look of what you own. The newest bike in your garage is twenty years old, why would be think you would have a pulse on what will sell?
I have no illusions that I "have a pulse on what would sell", nor did I imply in any way that I do. What I wrote was in response to Norge Pilot's comment that I quoted! How you twisted that around is beyond me...
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KTM super Duke GT. Ducati 1200 monster/Multistrada monster has no wind protection multi is ugly, Aprilia is out because their fuel tanks are too small and I have one of their rotax powered machines and I don't think much of it, I don't think much of the local aprilia dealer either. Kawasaki H2 is on interest but I haven't looked into it recently and the local kawasaki dealer has recently closed its doors. A DB11 would be good but simply not playing in that end of the market.
Thanks, helps explain where you're coming from.
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I have no idea why a 175hp motorcycle would be needed for a public road, but then again it seems that the older I get the more I get confused.
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I have no idea why a 175hp motorcycle would be needed for a public road, but then again it seems that the older I get the more I get confused.
No one really needs a 50hp bike for the road let alone 175hp, but they are fun I also ride with people that own other types of motorcycles. A lot of the lower output machines make their power and torque in the very upper slither of the rev range which for road riding is annoying to say the least. The bikes I have listed all have stonking fat midranges the final output is irrelevant to me, its how its delivered. Something Guzzi did well back in the day with the like of the original 1100 sports etc. The market has moved on Guzzi seems to be shoehorned into a corner by its corporate masters desperately trying to hang onto its past.
In order to have a wider appeal they need to move with the times IMO.
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Ok, may I interject an opinion formed by living overseas, specifically North Africa? Tunisia, Libya and Egypt have a strong Mediterranean cultures imprinted by French, Italian and English imperial echoes. I had the chance to interact with locals, and many ex-pats and many European immigrants from all over the EU.
Here is the point: every culture, and associated language, has its own unique value system. Northern Italy, my friends, is not the USA. I am far from an expert on Italian culture, but I saw just enough while traveling in Europe and living/working in Tunisia/Libya that I know they march to their own drummer.
We can whine all we want here in Houston about losing our local dealer (MPH). Fact is: we are low priority for the managers in Mandello. Same on bike designs: they have their own expectations and plans that may, or may not intersect with "our" wants.
The good news: there are a hell of a lot of motorcycle options out there. Anything you want can be found, especially in a larger city. The sheer diversity is astonishing with a big increase in beginner to mid-level bikes the past few years. Yeah, they may not be traditional, or air cooled, but man alive, there are some amazing machines. I waited a while to see if Guzzi would produce a 70 hp, 400 pound sport bike. Never happened, hence I bought the long lusted after Triumph STRX 675: and I LOVE that machine (Mary Anne, aka Hot Rod). The refinement is astonishing and the engine even better: broad torque, plenty of top end, and amazing brakes and handling. Given that, I still love my V7R for the character, looks, and all around capability.
So, yeah, there you are. And for those of you who struggle with Italian: Little Goose was bantering with me yesterday, these conversations happen.
Time for poodle walk, and then meet our carpenter for planning some new house storage racks, before we move into the new Villa.
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Build a"retro" styled V12 under 500 pounds
And I'll buy it
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...Fact is: we are low priority for the managers in Mandello.
The lack of electronic cruise control supports your point.
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I may be alone here...but here goes.
Revive bikes like the Lemans ,1000S etc.. build the big blocks up, 1100, 1200 cc motors 8 valve heads ..
add top line suspensions create a performance section to compete with the other mfg ..
Guzzi I think has the potential to be the equal and more, sell the bikes based on quality , reliability, performance and tradition .
Produce the kind of bikes that stand alone in their models but cross over somewhat.
Promote them as riders bikes , free of some rider aids but keep up with what is necessary ..
Yeah I know this may sound like a dream, but what the hell its my dream :whip2:
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The Cali 1400's have cruise standard fit if I recall correctly.
Revive the 1000s lemans with 8 valve head and have a performance section to compete with other manufacturers? You can have one of those two things not both. You need a lot more than simply an 8valve head, a whole new motor water cooled ohc cam with bucket shims at the very least possibly some hybrid setup with augmented electric drive. Piaggio has been experimenting with the technology with the MP3 so its not a massive stretch.
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My vote is for a big block retro standard. 1100-1200 cc.
Start with the Bellagio chassis. Add V7 bodywork.
As for the engine, I'm liking the idea of an 1100cc engine by way of an 850 crank and 1400 top end.
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MG needs totally new bikes and engines, not rehashed designs. Just the way it is.
Let's face it, many MG owners are stuck in the past and until MG shakes them loose it isn't going anywhere.
Just go after 7% of the market, not the .007 who want but aren't really going to buy anyway.
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Guys, having seen the new 1400 line up recently, I can say the quality is top notch and the fit and finish is excellent. They may be cruisers but they are very Italian: sleek and sexy
Doesn't matter how cool they are. They are invisible. The new V7's are "popular" here in L.A., meaning I have seen maybe 3-4 (5?) of them in the past year. And I have an eye out for them.
The main problem is that people have heard the name somewhere, but have never seen one up close. My friend's eyes lit up when I told them I got a new one. They have a cachet that that is intrinsic. They are almost mythical. That is the most valuable thing that Piaggio got in the deal.
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Maybe Moto Guzzi needs to hire this guy for a model or two:
https://player.vimeo.com/video/140118844
http://www.inazumacafe.com/2015/09/the-big-block-by-venier.html
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Let's face it, many MG owners are stuck in the past and until MG shakes them loose it isn't going anywhere.
Let's face it, many owners in The USA are multiple-Guzzi owners.
You shake them off, and you lose a huge chunk of your already small sales figures.
Guzzi has to keep what it has and expand into new customer bases.
Dumping it's current enthusiastic multiple-Guzzi owners would be cutting off their nose to spite their face.
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What is this 'success'? Keeping those assembly lines running all the time? I guess.
What else can they be used for?
Walkers?
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/walking%20scooter_zpscjl9izpp.gif)
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My vote is for a big block retro standard. 1100-1200 cc.
Start with the Bellagio chassis. Add V7 bodywork.
As for the engine, I'm liking the idea of an 1100cc engine by way of an 850 crank and 1400 top end.
I just turned the big Seven Three. If they're ever going to make a big block retro standard, I wish they'd hurry it along! :clock:
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They could assemble office furniture.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/vespa%20chairs_zpsvcsnmyro.jpg)
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They could assemble office furniture.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/vespa%20chairs_zpsvcsnmyro.jpg)
I want mine in red!
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Ha Ha! Dont forget to add another 10 horsepower!
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/Bike_Furniture_Motor_chair_1_01_zpsinjeodpm.jpg)
Varroom!
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MG needs totally new bikes and engines, not rehashed designs. Just the way it is.
Let's face it, many MG owners are stuck in the past and until MG shakes them loose it isn't going anywhere.
Just go after 7% of the market, not the .007 who want but aren't really going to buy anyway.
Yes and no. Guzzi needs new bikes, yes. Shaking loose us old f*rts that have clung on all these years, no. Though John Bloor did it your way and then came back for the faithful, Guzzi doesn't have the name recognition of Triumph to start clean sheet. Besides, most of us won't live that long. Or maybe, that's your plan. :evil:
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Should add a pizza cutter and a corkscrew in every Moto Guzzi tool kit!
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/Motorcycle-Pizza-Cutter_zpsmnucinyh.jpg)
:laugh:
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Maybe Moto Guzzi needs to hire this guy for a model or two:
https://player.vimeo.com/video/140118844
http://www.inazumacafe.com/2015/09/the-big-block-by-venier.html
yep, hire him or at least as a consultant ...build bikes like that and they will come
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Yes and no. Guzzi needs new bikes, yes. Shaking loose us old f*rts that have clung on all these years, no. Though John Bloor did it your way and then came back for the faithful, Guzzi doesn't have the name recognition of Triumph to start clean sheet. Besides, most of us won't live that long. Or maybe, that's your plan. :evil:
Just MHO.
Actually, owners of old models are the some of the most valuable assets a company can have, they tie the company and its products to their origins and with evolved products, carry traditions and knowledge forward.
But motorcycling has undergone a radical change in the recent past, genres like sports bikes, ADVs , STs, Cruisers and Baggers have kept forward and more clearly defined from each other. Today, some of the segments are converging, like the ADV/ST markets.
Because MG is such a small company selling so few bikes, it can be difficult to make those changes while at the same time keeping close ties to history. There is an analogy, Microsoft and Apple. Putting aside the politics and natural conflicts between those who are fans of one or the other, there is no way to disregard what happened in one of the largest markets ever seen, Apple looked forward and took off, Microsoft kept catering to the past and what happened is obvious.Had Apple remained a servant to the past it would have remained a bit player. It simply told all its customers they are going forward together or see ya. Now Microsoft is doing the same thing even though the "traditionalists" are screaming. There is simply no other way to grow and the opposite isn't stagnation, it is going away slowly.
Moto Guzzi needs new blood badly. A larger something of an older something isn't going to do anything nor attract new customers. It might get some older customers to buy one last new bike from them but then that is just walking backwards instead if forwards.
Most new buyers don't care if they are the only ones within hundreds of miles to own the same bike, but the people making motorcycles care and that isn't what they want.
The CARC bikes were a huge mistake. Although I really like the Norge, its a stop gap me too bike. Swap the engine and its like every other ST made at the time. It has Italian flare and style but came with dismal support.
In the time the CARCS can out and adding in their development, MG could have made the leap to a combined liquid/air cooled engine ready for the future while jump starting the present. Sorry but adding a huge oil coller doesn't a liquid cooled bike make, we're kidding ourselves trying to stay relevant.
Air cooling has become the "Start"" button for traditionalist. Just the way it is.
The whole shaft vs chain/belt thing and the so called complexity of liquid cooling is just like not wanting to give up bridles and horseshoes. We need to get over it, its 2016! Moto Guzzi could make one or two traditionally themed models but there is no future building them as an only model focus.
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The CARC bikes were a huge mistake.
How can you say that? Have you been following Guzzi for more than a few years?
Guzzi was at a near all-time low in sales in the 2003-2005 time frame when the CARC bikes were first being shown.
We're talking 2000-2500 units per year low, due largely to Aprilia's mismanagement and the hydraulic lifter debacle.
Production quickly ramped up to 10,000 units in 2006/2007, thanks to Piaggio and the CARC bikes. Then the recession came. But that wasn't the fault of the CARC bikes. Production fell back to around 5000 units in 2008/2009 with lots of unsold 2007/2008 bikes languishing on the showroom floors.
Stelvio NTX and Norge 1200 8V have been partners with the V7 Classics in helping Guzzi recover from the recession over the past few years to production levels in the 7000-8000 units range.
The Cal 14 is coming along, but its sales have only recently began to be significant. V7 Classics are about 50% of current production. The CARC bikes make up a large slice of the remaining 50%. The Cal 14 a smaller slice, but coming on strong with the new models.
In the time the CARCS can out and adding in their development, MG could have made the leap to a combined liquid/air cooled engine ready for the future while jump starting the present. Sorry but adding a huge oil coller doesn't a liquid cooled bike make, we're kidding ourselves trying to stay relevant.
With the collapse of scooter sales in Italy, Aprilia had no money to sink into Guzzi in the early 2000s. And, at Guzzi's low volumes, how could they justify such an expense? That's why Piaggio ended up with Guzzi. Piaggio bought its failing scooter competitor, and Guzzi just came along for the ride. CARC was already in development at that time, the Griso having been shown in 2003.
Piaggio determined to make something of Guzzi and began pouring Euros into the facility in Mandello. They could just as easily have shuttered it, with Guzzi suffering the same fate as Laverda...
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Norge Pilot, agreed, agreed, agreed. Though your Microsoft/Apple reference is out of my ken, and I have no experience with CARC bikes I agree that MG needs totally modern, new design bikes while keeping a nod to the old. When I bought my first Guzzi ('70 Ambassador) that fact that it had only electric start was a major hurdle for me to overcome; never had a problem because of it. With emission and noise standards coupled with fuel mileage expectations, the air cooled engine is a dinosaur waiting for the meteor strike. What I want in a bike just isn't feasible these days and is why I haven't bought a new bike in almost 25 years. Yes, Guzzi needs to move forward, just throw me a bone from the design department and I'll hang in there.
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How can you say that? Have you been following Guzzi for more than a few years?
Guzzi was at a near all-time low in sales in the 2003-2005 time frame when the CARC bikes were first being shown.
We're talking 2000-2500 units per year low, due largely to Aprilia's mismanagement and the hydraulic lifter debacle.
Production quickly ramped up to 10,000 units in 2006/2007, thanks to Piaggio and the CARC bikes. Then the recession came. But that wasn't the fault of the CARC bikes. Production fell back to around 5000 units in 2008/2009 with lots of unsold 2007/2008 bikes languishing on the showroom floors.
Stelvio NTX and Norge 1200 8V have been partners with the V7 Classics in helping Guzzi recover from the recession over the past few years to production levels in the 7000-8000 units range.
The Cal 14 is coming along, but its sales have only recently began to be significant. V7 Classics are about 50% of current production. The CARC bikes make up a large slice of the remaining 50%. The Cal 14 a smaller slice, but coming on strong with the new models.
With the collapse of scooter sales in Italy, Aprilia had no money to sink into Guzzi in the early 2000s. And, at Guzzi's low volumes, how could they justify such an expense? That's why Piaggio ended up with Guzzi. Piaggio bought its failing scooter competitor, and Guzzi just came along for the ride. CARC was already in development at that time, the Griso having been shown in 2003.
Piaggio determined to make something of Guzzi and began pouring Euros into the facility in Mandello. They could just as easily have shuttered it, with Guzzi suffering the same fate as Laverda...
I'm in agreement. Whether or not Guzzi was chasing BMW with their CARC bikes, I believe these bikes are an incredible effort to bring Guzzi into parity with their major competitor, BMW. Guzzi developed CARC, which provides an anti-jacking shaft drive without infringing on BMW Paralever patents. They brought the 1151 up to hp and torque standards of (many) other bikes in their class. And with the Norge, produced a sport tourer that was quite capable, as well as being one of the loveliest machines in its class. Stelvio ..... what's wrong with that bike? A bit heavy, but a lovely Italian version of an ADV bike.
Granted, my 2v 1200 Sport didn't break sales records, but sport tourers with low fairings come and go, and come back again (witness BMW R1200RS.) This (my 1200 Sport) has been one of the sweetest bikes overall I've owned in over 62,000 miles. 500,000+ miles of saddle time, all bikes. Not a world record for high mileage for sure, but I've ridden long enough to believe I can speak with some experience.
R59 .... in total agreement with you on this issue.
Bob
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Hello,
When I was in NY over the holidays I stopped into a dealer MG dealer and was somewhat shocked to see only one single Guzzi in stock. Plenty of Duc's and others...so I asked..."why only one Guzzi?"
response
"Guzzi is impossible to deal with" "It's hard to get any bikes from them" and " I think we're done with them"
not very encouraging news at all...I believe there are always at least two sides to every story...but this is the story I heard from this particular dealer. Take it for what it's worth.
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Hello,
When I was in NY over the holidays I stopped into a dealer MG dealer and was somewhat shocked to see only one single Guzzi in stock. Plenty of Duc's and others...so I asked..."why only one Guzzi?"
response
"Guzzi is impossible to deal with" "It's hard to get any bikes from them" and " I think we're done with them"
not very encouraging news at all...I believe there are always at least two sides to every story...but this is the story I heard from this particular dealer. Take it for what it's worth.
Which dealer? If it was Gold Coast (pretty obvious that it was), it is in fact not in one of the burroughs. Gold Coast told me today that it is no longer a Moto Guzzi dealer, and also took the opportunity to say that it had "fired" Moto Guzzi. Meanwhile, it is an hour's drive from central Queens or Brooklyn, and a quite a bit longer drive from Manhattan, the Bronx and Staten Island.
The current New York City dealers are Vespa Brooklyn and the new Piaggio flagship store in Manhattan, rather more convenient and better outfitted.
"Take it for what it is worth."
I agree.
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It was "gold coast"
They were still listed as Guzzi dealership and when I called they said they were..."come on down and have a look, we have a few"
I didn't say anything about Burroughs ?? I said NY, as in state of New York.
The comments are exactly those that I got when when I visited
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It was "gold coast"
They were still listed as Guzzi dealership and when I called they said they were..."come on down and have a look, we have a few"
I didn't say anything about Burroughs ?? I said NY, as in state of New York.
The comments are exactly those that I got when when I visited
In other words, you went to an ex-Moto Guzzi dealer in the middle of Long Island and drew conclusions about Buffalo to New York City.
Hey, don't stop at Buffalo. You might as well include Corsa Meccanica in Toronto.
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What conclusions? really?
There was no opinion offered...purely a report of the last MG dealership I visited? BTW it sounds as though we got similar information.
Sorry guys...
last comment on this post.
gnite :)
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What's wrong with Buffalo? We have a good GUZZI dealer here.
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the air cooled engine is a dinosaur waiting for the meteor strike.
Back in about 1982, I really got into motorcycles. Subscribed to all the magazines. Cycle, Cycle World, Motorcyclist, etc.
One thing I remember clearly from that time, 34 years ago, is how some of the writers went on, and on, about how air-cooled motorcycles were dinosaurs and soon to be extinct.
That was 34 years ago.
Last year, Polaris gave us a new Indian Chief with an all new engine. And air-cooled engine.
Somehow, I think the extinction of air-cooled mills is still some distance in the future.
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Back in about 1982, I really got into motorcycles. Subscribed to all the magazines. Cycle, Cycle World, Motorcyclist, etc.
One thing I remember clearly from that time, 34 years ago, is how some of the writers went on, and on, about how air-cooled motorcycles were dinosaurs and soon to be extinct.
That was 34 years ago.
Last year, Polaris gave us a new Indian Chief with an all new engine. And air-cooled engine.
Somehow, I think the extinction of air-cooled mills is still some distance in the future.
yep and if they are clever like the new Triumph T120 they will even look air cooled ..
Liquid cooled motorcycle engines are ugly IMO
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Somehow, I think the extinction of air-cooled mills is still some distance in the future.
If the 1400 Aldcae I rode today is anything to go buy the sooner air cooled motors in the modern market are put out of their misery the better. I'll put up a longer spiel when I get the time.
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Speaking of younger buyers for motorcycles...
My daughters and my son, most in their twenties, are very interested in my V7 stone. In fact, my middle daughter accompanied me to the dealer when I purchased it and has 'claimed' it as hers... and I'll give it to her once she completes a safety course. She looked around at the new Italian and assorted other bikes and commented favorably on the smaller, lighter, motorcycles. She really liked the Ducati scramblers and smaller sport/naked bikes. The Carcs and 1400's didn't appeal to her at all. To her, they all looked "fat" and heavy, cumbersome. I like them myself, though I'm not sure I want to push around a 700 pound bike.
Of course, her anecdotal commentary isn't representative of the general public... but she already has friends (girls and guys) that ride. The guys tend to ride HD and the girls (smarter creatures, really) tend to gravitate toward smaller, lighter, standardish bikes... or the small sporty bikes from Honda and Kawasaki and the like.
My youngest daughter (only 20) really likes motor scooters, especially the Genuine Buddy line and the smaller Vespas. I can see one in her future.
But my son, the oldest, is hot for a Griso. The sound, viscerality, and style, and 'manliness'. He only knows about Moto Guzzi because of me. Otherwise, he would be squarely in the HD camp.
I guess my point is... to appeal to a younger generation, the smallblock V7 and V9 might be exactly what guarantees MG a future. Frankly, I'd like to see a V7/V9 developed line of bikes that might compete with the Honda 500f, 500x, etc. A V7 adventure style bike? I'd be on it. And the 1400 bikes could simply be the more 'masculine' bikes aimed at the two up touring and cruising crowd. Perhaps that is the direction they are going. Time will tell.
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I stopped at the Moto Guzzi dealer yesterday on the home from work to inquire if they had any info on the V9 Roamer. Salesman tells me he hadn't heard about any new Moto Guzzis coming any time soon. Then he takes me aside to say the dealer is probably going to drop Moto Guzzi. They sold a handful of V7s and one Cali1400 last year. They were considering dropping the whole Piaggio line to make room for more Ducatis which sell within days of coming off the truck. Then they got a letter from Moto Guzzi telling them they are in danger of losing the franchise because they don't have at least one model of all Moto Guzzi on the showroom floor or at least available for test rides. This is a BMW, Triumph, Ducati, Vespa and all Piaggio bikes. He says they will honor the warranty on my V7 and they can order any new Moto Guzzi I may want. Then I walked over to the Triumph building and got to sit on and fondle a new Street Twin. Hmm.
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I wonder rather than keeping Guzzis in the Dallas warehouse, it they'd be better off shipping them and eating some the dealer's floor plan budget?
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If younger or new to the sport riders can't walk into a showroom and see, ride and buy...guess what?
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I wonder rather than keeping Guzzis in the Dallas warehouse, it they'd be better off shipping them and eating some the dealer's floor plan budget?
I like that idea! Why not? Piaggio/Moto Guzzi are already discounting bikes thousands of dollars to move them. Why not help dealers with flooring and actually (hopefully) boost sales? You can't sell what the public can't see.
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More local dealers. What better than a cycle shopper walking into a dealer and being pleasantly surprised by the brand?
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I finally read all the remarks, after I posted my prior comment. They point to what I originally suggested, dealer network is too small and too difficult. I make a habit of stopping at any MG dealers while traveling and I hear the same, difficult, short on stock, comments. Most have a couple of bikes on the floor at most.
Living here in SoCal, I stop by http://www.socalmotorcycles.com. It's a dealer that specializes in selling anti big-four. When asked about why no MG, they comment the same as others have stated, MG makes it too difficult to become a dealer.
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Here in Chicago we have three local dealers. If you want to see a new Guzzi, one of them will have what your looking for. Its nice to have a choice here. As a buyer you can go to two out of the three and likely buy on price. Meaning they will deal on bikes big time, depending on time of year, inventory, incentives and so on. Or you can go to the third dealer, and buy a perfectly set up Guzzi, thats been gone over with a keen eye, and still get it for a very fair price, and have the lasting enjoyment of being part of a group of buyers that get the best from the best. Choices are a great thing to have! Hell, we need some good things for settling to live in northern IL!
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Can't lay all the blame on MG though, dealers too need to invest in their own businesses and that means doing things a little different when selling Moto Guzzi than say Honda's or other brands.
Most people know the Honda, HD and other prominent brands. Sitting in your are and hoping someone has an epiphany and decides to by a Moto Guzzi isn't a plan.
First, dealers have to recognize and react to the fact that MG riders are somewhat different that riders of mainstream brands. Since there are relatively few of them compared to other brands, it amazes me that some dealer hasn't figured out how to turn existing customers into ambassadors for the brand they are selling.
Does it take more than simple effort to ask existing customers if they'd be willing to provide some guidance to those thinking about buying a MG? Of course that does present a problem in itself, if owners avoid dealers for service like the plague is that someone you want to ask? Probably not.
Have a Guzzi day and put out some local advertising. Then invite MG owners who actually see a benefit of having a dealer local instead of saying they are mostly putzes because they aren't selling old models or stocking bias ply tires for their antiques. Follow the lead of some car dealers who manage to sell cars for an investment in hot dogs and drinks.
Put on a semi annual service clinic with slightly discounted common services and then have the brains to have qualified techs doing the work.
Ever see a billboard for MG bikes? Remember, I'm referring to new to motorcycling buyers or in the market buyers. Not everyone runs to the Internet or sits on Facebook but almost everyone drives down busy street, probably often.
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Back in about 1982, I really got into motorcycles. Subscribed to all the magazines. Cycle, Cycle World, Motorcyclist, etc.
One thing I remember clearly from that time, 34 years ago, is how some of the writers went on, and on, about how air-cooled motorcycles were dinosaurs and soon to be extinct.
That was 34 years ago.
Last year, Polaris gave us a new Indian Chief with an all new engine. And air-cooled engine.
Somehow, I think the extinction of air-cooled mills is still some distance in the future.
Rocker, I sure hope you're right. But if not a dinosaur, what do you call a 700# motorcycle?? :grin:
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First, dealers have to recognize and react to the fact that MG riders are somewhat different that riders of mainstream brands. Since there are relatively few of them compared to other brands, it amazes me that some dealer hasn't figured out how to turn existing customers into ambassadors for the brand they are selling.
A Victory dealer here took on Aprilia/Guzzi in 2008 at the peak of the high gas price/scooter craze here.
At an open house, we had at least a dozen Guzzisti show up. From up to 200 miles away!
They pretty much treated us with suspicion and contempt.
Several of us locals tried to do business with them for parts and accessories over the next few months, with no success.
It wasn't long before they would disappear to the back when a Guzzisti would walk through the door.
They remained a Guzzi dealer for less than a year. I'm not sure if they ever sold a new Guzzi. They did sell a used V11 Cafe Sport that they had taken on trade for a Victory. I think that was it...
Dealers can be their own worst enemies sometimes...
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Does anyone know why dealers find it difficult to work with Moto Guzzi? It's a little vague. Is it a language barrier, business culture difference, difficult to order?
Just wondering.
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Does anyone know why dealers find it difficult to work with Moto Guzzi? It's a little vague. Is it a language barrier, business culture difference, difficult to order?
Just wondering.
I think we need to look at the big picture here. Only ten percent of the bikes made by Moto Guzzi are imported to the USA. So they don't have any problem selling the ones they make. Also I don't believe they want to be like Harley Davidson/Honda/Yamaha & etc. I've heard that they sell more bikes in Germany than anywhere else does that tell you something.
Dean
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Can't lay all the blame on MG though, dealers too need to invest in their own businesses and that means doing things a little different when selling Moto Guzzi than say Honda's or other brands.
Most people know the Honda, HD and other prominent brands. Sitting in your are and hoping someone has an epiphany and decides to by a Moto Guzzi isn't a plan.
First, dealers have to recognize and react to the fact that MG riders are somewhat different that riders of mainstream brands. Since there are relatively few of them compared to other brands, it amazes me that some dealer hasn't figured out how to turn existing customers into ambassadors for the brand they are selling.
Does it take more than simple effort to ask existing customers if they'd be willing to provide some guidance to those thinking about buying a MG? Of course that does present a problem in itself, if owners avoid dealers for service like the plague is that someone you want to ask? Probably not.
Have a Guzzi day and put out some local advertising. Then invite MG owners who actually see a benefit of having a dealer local instead of saying they are mostly putzes because they aren't selling old models or stocking bias ply tires for their antiques. Follow the lead of some car dealers who manage to sell cars for an investment in hot dogs and drinks.
Put on a semi annual service clinic with slightly discounted common services and then have the brains to have qualified techs doing the work.
Ever see a billboard for MG bikes? Remember, I'm referring to new to motorcycling buyers or in the market buyers. Not everyone runs to the Internet or sits on Facebook but almost everyone drives down busy street, probably often.
I think that's a pretty important concept. Get the riders involved with dealers with events.
I know Brookside has a couple of bike shows a year with music and food. The local BMW/Ducati/Triumph store has free food on Saturdays and are generous with the test rides.
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My local dealer gives free food,test rides,etc.etc. The manager is a friend of mine but most of the salesman don't know anything about MG, as an example, if someone is interested in a Stelvio they try to up sale them to a BMW GS, Norge to an RT so basically the bikes are used as bait for higher priced sales. The only dedicated MG salesmen is the manager, so if he isn't around or dealing with something else the salesmen ignore the buyer or can't answer the questions. I don't give it much more time before MG is gone.
And the head mechanic hates Moto Guzzi, so why should I take my bike there for service?
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For many years, now, Piaggio has pretty much been making any dealer who wanted Aprilia and its scooters also take Guzzi.
What happens is you end up with lots of dealers who do not want to be Guzzi dealers, but who really just want to sell some Aprilia scooters. So, the Guzzis languish on the floor. And, anyone who is interested in Guzzi gets snubbed or upsold.
PGA should really consider only giving Guzzi dealerships to dealers who WANT them. It will reduce the number of "Dealerships", but in will increase the quality of the dealerships. And, I'll take quality over quantity anytime.
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agree Rock. There are legacy dealers and with established riders that like the brand.
They should help those guy out and build the brand from there. Hey, look what they did to our friends in Houston!
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I have been doing just that.
As a film production designer, I am responsible for the "look" and for setting the scene, and I recently got 4 brand new bikes for a big commercial shoot: California, Audace, Eldorado and a V7.
I got all black ones, for a group of bikers in a crowd scene. The actors were real Harley guys, but they really liked the MG's, as did everyone else. They looked really amazing all lined up, and were a better choice than Harleys, as the well known ad campaign is about being unique.
People have heard of Moto Guzzi, but they never actually see one, and when they do they are impressive. I don't even like cruisers but I want the Audace.
Look for it soon. I will post it as soon as it airs...
Here it is:
http://adsoftheworld.com/media/tv/dos_equis_mission_to_mars
OK, the bikes weren't featured that much but I sent it to the Piaggio rep here in CA, they should try to milk it.....why not?
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Ok it will never happen but
Better owners group with factory backing support.
Aprilias become all scooters, premium scooters are Vespas
All bikes are rebranded as Guzzis, Moto is dropped from name
You get a guzzi super bike, sport bike, sport tourer, automatic, naked hooligans, et.
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Here it is:
http://adsoftheworld.com/media/tv/dos_equis_mission_to_mars
OK, the bikes weren't featured that much but I sent it to the Piaggio rep here in CA, they should try to milk it.....why not?
That is awesome! And funny and it's great that the cast liked the bikes. Way to put your money where your mouth is. :thumb:
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Interesting thread! I've got to believe that many who have posted here are fairly new to the brand, because this is certainly not some new phenomena, and has been going on for decades, especially in the U.S. MG's are a unique niche market that mostly sells to those of us who want something different. We tend to overlook performance and value just to be a part of something we feel is special. Certainly not a business model that many companies want to invest in.
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I think it might be simple.
Moto Guzzi does not make motorcycles, it makes Moto Guzzis. What if MG polled riders of Guzzis and asked them what they would value in design and marketing and support of Moto Guzzis? Then do that. Ignore all but their niche, and exploit that niche with precision.
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I think it might be simple.
Moto Guzzi does not make motorcycles, it makes Moto Guzzis. What if MG polled riders of Guzzis and asked them what they would value in design and marketing and support of Moto Guzzis? Then do that. Ignore all but their niche, and exploit that niche with precision.
Aspie, the niche is overwhelmingly inhabited by a bunch of old guys whose first house cost less than a new Guzzi. For me, no matter what Guzzi or anyone else comes out with, spending $15-20 G's on a new motorcycle bumps up against an extreme psychological barrier. I like your idea, but just don't think it would work. To their credit, Guzzi is trying to crack the cruiser market and they have been making inroads into a younger market with the V7's. Your idea has worked for Harley but I really don't know how the youth market views Harley. If Harley or Guzzi don't tap into a younger generation, well, once us dinosaurs are gone, all that is left is an oil slick.
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Aspie, the niche is overwhelmingly inhabited by a bunch of old guys whose first house cost less than a new Guzzi. For me, no matter what Guzzi or anyone else comes out with, spending $15-20 G's on a new motorcycle bumps up against an extreme psychological barrier. I like your idea, but just don't think it would work. To their credit, Guzzi is trying to crack the cruiser market and they have been making inroads into a younger market with the V7's. Your idea has worked for Harley but I really don't know how the youth market views Harley. If Harley or Guzzi don't tap into a younger generation, well, once us dinosaurs are gone, all that is left is an oil slick.
couldn't agree more ............and get on with developing a higher performance big block like the 8 valve 1200
for those that would want to move up from the v7/ v9 ...at some point.
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Aspie, the niche is overwhelmingly inhabited by a bunch of old guys whose first house cost less than a new Guzzi. For me, no matter what Guzzi or anyone else comes out with, spending $15-20 G's on a new motorcycle bumps up against an extreme psychological barrier. I like your idea, but just don't think it would work. To their credit, Guzzi is trying to crack the cruiser market and they have been making inroads into a younger market with the V7's. Your idea has worked for Harley but I really don't know how the youth market views Harley. If Harley or Guzzi don't tap into a younger generation, well, once us dinosaurs are gone, all that is left is an oil slick.
Good point.
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If I were king...
1. Co-marketing: Moto Guzzi should team up with Triumph here in the US to market their bikes. They are complementary, and MG could benefit greatly from the expanded dealer network. I would really love to see Latus Harley-Davidson/Triumph add Moto Guzzi (and I know at least one of their salesmen who would love to see that, too, because he could then ride a Moto Guzzi to
That would suck, I don't like going into Harley dealers as it is, top it off with having Guzzi as a stepchild in the corner with people that don't know the brand turns into "Yeah we can order that" no thanks.
The Portland dealer has stepped up in a big way. He is tripling the size of his shop, has sent 2 techs to Guzzi and Aprilia training and is relocating to one of the busiest streets in Portland. Keeping it strictly Guzzi and Aprilia.
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Put a better engine in the V7 line. Dump the ugly California line. Bring back a LeMans V style bike.
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At least pretend to give two shits, about the customers that DO love you....and pretend to support their purchase with respect instead of a giant middle finger and slap in the face.
When the mother ship receptionist says quote" we only have 2 customer support people for North America you can't expect them to return contact every owner that is having a major warranty issue"
At least they are honest
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That would suck, I don't like going into Harley dealers as it is, top it off with having Guzzi as a stepchild in the corner with people that don't know the brand turns into "Yeah we can order that" no thanks.
:1: One of the problems Buell had when still associated with HD was exactly that. Go into a HD dealership and look at the Buells and you would be completely ignored. Generalization, I know, but anecdotaly quite prevalent.
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Wierd to me. I love my V7II Stone and am very pleased with my dealer. I think the V7II beats out the competition in weight, features (EI, FI, TC, ABS, shaft drive) easy 6,000 mile maintance schedule, it's air cooled, and looks and rides great and I'm probably forgetting several other positive features. Who wants to adjust 8 valves, not me. Who needs to go 120+ mph, not me. It goes plenty fast, can go 200+ miles on a tank of gas, gets decent mpg, has lots of torque, is not sheathed in plastic, doesn't look like a praying mantis, doesn't have a thousand electronic ge-gaws (sp?) - what is there not to like? It is a great motorcycle and too bad for others if they want to drive a fad. I guess I just don't get the Guzzi bashing so prevalent on this forum, maybe I haven't owned one long enough. When people ask me about my motorcycle I tell them it is a great motorcycle and I love it and don't see why anyone would want to own anything else.
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Wierd to me. I love my V7II Stone and am very pleased with my dealer. I think the V7II beats out the competition in weight, features (EI, FI, TC, ABS, shaft drive) easy 6,000 mile maintance schedule, it's air cooled, and looks and rides great and I'm probably forgetting several other positive features. Who wants to adjust 8 valves, not me. Who needs to go 120+ mph, not me. It goes plenty fast, can go 200+ miles on a tank of gas, gets decent mpg, has lots of torque, is not sheathed in plastic, doesn't look like a praying mantis, doesn't have a thousand electronic ge-gaws (sp?) - what is there not to like? It is a great motorcycle and too bad for others if they want to drive a fad. I guess I just don't get the Guzzi bashing so prevalent on this forum, maybe I haven't owned one long enough. When people ask me about my motorcycle I tell them it is a great motorcycle and I love it and don't see why anyone would want to own anything else.
:1: You and me both, and I'm missing a gear, ABS, and traction control. These V7s rock!
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Selling what people need rarely works as well as selling them what they want. The old "you don't need_______" works if you are the government, someone operating a business you are told to buy from by the government or your idea of what everyone needs is it.
Moto Guzzi doesn't sell so few bikes because they offer what people want, they sell so few bikes because so few want them. There is nothing wrong with that it just doesn't allow for more than what they are doing now. If you're happy with what they are doing, good for you.
Customers can change the direction of a company, it happens all the time.
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How about showing up at the Intl Moto Show, and exposing the Piaggio lineup to several hundred thousand potential buyers who attended in order to see "every production bike out there"?
How about a Moto Guzzi answer to the BMW R1200R? That bike has perfect ergos for a big standard.
How about offering the new Eldo in red, like elsewhere around the world? Some of us are sick of black, black, and more black bikes.
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If Ducati is to motorcycles what Ferrari is to cars then Guzzi should be Maserati. A quirky competent, muscular, yet classy motorcycle. The bread and butter should be a true gentlemans express sports tourer and a retro. There should be an Eldorado. Finally there should be a snorting, I'll mannered, fire breather which in true Italian fashion yells and waves its arms about without necessarily being fastest. It should probably be a little too expensive.
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So there's this YouTuber called Snowcat with about half a million subscribers who is important enough that Ducati last month bought back his Hypermotard rather than continue dealing with his complaints about the bike's reliability.
Today's Snowcat video features a Moto Guzzi V7 Racer (from the 40 second mark): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRZCqrsmEM8
Recently, a moderator here deleted an entire thread about Snowcat's dispute with Ducati, posted here to start a discussion about the power of social media, because he doesn't like Snowcat and likes Ducati. He suggested that Ducati was right and that Snowcat was wrong. Which doesn't explain why, a day after our moderator's deletion of the entire thread, Ducati bought the bike back.
There's nothing wrong with Moto Guzzi. There's lots wrong with the old men, which includes the genius moderator here who unilaterally deleted that thread, who purport to speak for the brand while being completely out of touch with 2016.
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Actually that isn't why that thread was deleted .
Dusty
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Actually that isn't why that thread was deleted .
Dusty
Dusty, the fact is that you went out of your way to take a run at Snowcat, you strongly suggested that Ducati was right and he was wrong, and you said that this was all BS. You were so right in your analysis that the next day Ducati caved, completely.
That thread was about the power of social media as it relates to motorcycles. What you established is that you not only know nothing about the subject, but are eager to close down discussion about it if the discussion doesn't fit with your, what, mid 70s view of the world?
Meanwhile, Snowcat's positive comments about the V7 Racer will reach hundreds of thousands of people and your comments on this site in their entirety will reach, what, a few thousand people?
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If Ducati is to motorcycles what Ferrari is to cars then Guzzi should be Maserati. A quirky competent, muscular, yet classy motorcycle. The bread and butter should be a true gentlemans express sports tourer and a retro. There should be an Eldorado. Finally there should be a snorting, I'll mannered, fire breather which in true Italian fashion yells and waves its arms about without necessarily being fastest. It should probably be a little too expensive.
Right up to the Maserati thing I was there. After the Maserati thing I'm there too.
People buying Maserati cars aren't the ordinary (comes out wrong I know) drivers who will drive it daily, turn it into something very different or stuff it full of luggage and run it down an unimproved road. There might be some but not many.
More like (ready for rocks) a Dodge. Often big, often brawny, not the fastest unless you get the nearly unobtanium ones but sort of brutish in nature. Muscle in mass, not the strongest or quickest but steadfast. Not the most fancy but
Come to think of it, maybe the Dodge of Italian motorcycles.
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Dusty, the fact is that you went out of your way to take a run at Snowcat, you strongly suggested that Ducati was right and he was wrong, and you said that this was all BS. You were so right in your analysis that the next day Ducati caved, completely.
That thread was about the power of social media as it relates to motorcycles. What you established is that you not only know nothing about the subject, but are eager to close down discussion about it if the discussion doesn't fit with your, what, mid 70s view of the world?
Interesting .
Dusty
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Interesting .
Dusty
A favourite expression of yours when you don't like what someone says. Reminds me of Dr. Strangelove.
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A favourite expression of yours when you don't like what someone says. Reminds me of Dr. Strangelove.
Also interesting .
Dusty
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Also interesting .
Dusty
Not interesting, just obvious.
Personally, I'm more interested in the fact that a YouTuber, with 450,000 subscribers, that you went out of your way to trash, gave a shout out to Moto Guzzi bikes. He's relevant on the internet, you're not.
Or do you not get that?
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Not interesting, just obvious.
Personally, I'm more interested in the fact that a YouTuber, with 450,000 subscribers, that you went out of your way to trash, gave a shout out to Moto Guzzi bikes. He's relevant on the internet, you're not.
Or do you not get that?
You seem to feel entitled to throw personal insults at me with impunity , which I find very interesting .
Dusty
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You seem to feel entitled to throw personal insults at me with impunity , which I find very interesting .
Dusty
Here we go. Your response to the Snowcat thread was to delete it, and apparently your response to my comments on this thread is to threaten me, implicitly, with being banned. Apparently because I have the temerity to disagree with you.
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Just got back from a 60 mile night ride, I had forgotten to mention the large analog speedometer and tachometer, beautiful, functional, easy to read, rock steady, perfect. What a great bike.
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OK fellas , despite what a certain misguided member believes , we are not stuck in 1975 , let's not act homophobic . Thanks .
Rob , when you continue to insult the forum and its members you must expect some blow back . My issue with you is not that you disagree with me , it is that your blatant disregard for the rules is unacceptable . As Luap would say , if you aren't happy here , no one is forcing you to stay .
Dusty
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Right up to the Maserati thing I was there. After the Maserati thing I'm there too.
People buying Maserati cars aren't the ordinary (comes out wrong I know) drivers who will drive it daily, turn it into something very different or stuff it full of luggage and run it down an unimproved road. There might be some but not many.
More like (ready for rocks) a Dodge. Often big, often brawny, not the fastest unless you get the nearly unobtanium ones but sort of brutish in nature. Muscle in mass, not the strongest or quickest but steadfast. Not the most fancy but
Come to think of it, maybe the Dodge of Italian motorcycles.
Dodge!?! You mean a questionably styled excercise in cost cutting?
I'm thinking a two wheeled Iso Rivolta, Bizziarini, De-Tomaso, Maserati.
Dodge?? (Eddie Murphy voice) get the f***k outta here;)
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Moto Guzzi should stay as an italian built bike, stay in their factory stay as a low volume manufacturer but work to sell every bike they build and keep their small workforce busy to avoid any financial instability. They should not aim to build more than 10,000 bikes a year.
Every year there should be a low volume test the water or part bin special or look this is what we can do bike that is expensive, desirable and limitted to 100 bikes. New models may be influenced on the annual special.
There should always be a small block available as custom, traditional or sport.
There should always be a similarly versatile big block.
Guzzi should use excess factory capacity, not to build more bikes the same as the ones at dealers waiting for buyers but build crate engines to order, so I work gets slack they could anounce a crate engine to upgreade aged 1970s bikes. once get 100 deposits start building.
Guzzi are roughly on the right track although the choice to release 2 bikes bobber and roamer seems more than enough when I think one custom small block would do. The V7 continuing in 750 form seems a mistake when the new engine is developed now and what has been a successful model is now dated against new Triumphs. Potential V7 buyers are now likely to wait for an 850 version or buy a non guzzi bike. The California, well its a nice enough bike but the platform lacks versatility due to the size of the motor and the frame. This means Guzzi are short of a third platform to fit between the Cali and smallbock which is a problem when really they should be working from two basic designs and not three. One possible solution would be a water cooled high output version of the new 850 which would share gearbox clutch and most auxilliarys with the aircooled variant and would fit same frame there would then be a lot of bike options available.
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Make another big Breva.
Dean
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Snowcat said something like "Moto Guzzi., nice, I like it.". So apparently Moto Guzzi's problems are solved and their sales should jump into the millions. The power of social media, and all that. Interesting.
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Maybe MG could add the following:
1. A little bit of reliability testing and improvement prior to model release
2. Improved quality assurance.
3. Improved supply chain timeliness for parts.
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Also interesting .
Dusty
Now that is "dry"! Love it! :thumb:
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I see Rob-MG has the Coldplay turned up REALLY LOUD.
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From here in Syracuse (I love snow)New York I have to travel to Buffalo (21/2 hrs)to a guzzi dealer. I have to go to the northern suburb (Bremerton) (1/2 hr)to a Triumph dealer. At 70, I'm not all that interested in wrenching except perhaps personalizing a bike. So, I guess I probably would have gone for a Triumph rather than the V7 (alas, Uncle Sam requires I poney up 2K so there goes my down payment. I think they need a dealer network, most new young buyers will want to ride first, wrench second (If at all). (There is a Fiat dealer in Syracuse- maybe they should work with them) :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu
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From here in Syracuse (I love snow)New York I have to travel to Buffalo (21/2 hrs)to a guzzi dealer. I have to go to the northern suburb (Bremerton) (1/2 hr)to a Triumph dealer. At 70, I'm not all that interested in wrenching except perhaps personalizing a bike. So, I guess I probably would have gone for a Triumph rather than the V7 (alas, Uncle Sam requires I poney up 2K so there goes my down payment. I think they need a dealer network, most new young buyers will want to ride first, wrench second (If at all). (There is a Fiat dealer in Syracuse- maybe they should work with them) :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu
There is no reason why a Guzzi can't be trouble free from the day the buyers takes it off the showroom floor until it wears out.
All it takes is dropping the nostalgia of romanticized mediocrity and the idea that being a door mat hidden by cliches of "its this or that (insert sexy Italian woman) " or the comparisons to cars costing hundreds of thousands where the owners have mechanics at beck and call to fix anything. Not even close.
It could be done and probably wouldn't cost them a thing.
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"stripped my new engine to discover that the left hand piston is the wrong way round from the factory...!
the arrow is pointing to the rear on the left hand cylinder and the arrow points to the front on the right hand cylinder"
From a current thread.
This is an example of something that should be checked before the thing is shipped or is that too an owner responsibility?
Perhaps more details will follow. Maybe if you look down and then walk backwards around to the other side everything lines up right?
No one is asking for miracles, just do it right, that would eliminate most problems new buyers experience. When buyers have confidence that the bike will be supported, they are less hesitant to buy.
Quality control pays huge dividends. The results are more buyers, a good reputation for build quality outside of the faithful on forums and that translates into sales.
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I also have to drive about 2.5 hours to a dealer and I also am not interested anymore in doing my own maintenance and I considered buying a Triumph instead of a Guzzi because they have a much closer dealer. But now I kind of look forward for the excuse to make the trip and am fortunate that my bike has run just great since day one. If one of my pistons is in backwards I can't tell it. I would also say, if your main concern is quality control, get a Honda or something built by robots in a mega-automated factory, not something assembled mostly by hand by a comparatively tiny number of workers. It's Italian, you should own it with a sense of humor and adventure, it's not a sewing machine.
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The premise of the thread being how to make MG more successful would then be limited to what? Not improving quality control because its not possible because Italians are incapable or because something isn't complete automated in manufacture quality control is something that isn't important?
What would your ideas be then? :popcorn:
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Touche, very good point. But I bought my V7II after much research of many brands because I thought it was the best bike with the best features to fit my desires and budget, so I don't start with the premise that Moto Guzzi sucks.
With your correct point in mind I would agree with more dealers (the dealer I do have has been excellent) and more color options because so far for me that has been my only difficulty and complaint.
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Quality control extends to far more than the manufacture of the motorcycles, that would be the narrow view. QC affects all operations, not just the person shoving the tanknonto the bike without regard for the resistance that is caused by it hanging up on a control cable but so what, they'll deal with it when the customer complains later.
Quality control extends to things like how customer communications are handled, insuring the right parts are shipped to dealers who have tonface the customer when the right parts don't arrive or they arrive in obvious poor condition (not from transport damage) and other aspects of performance that eventually affects customers AND dealers who are the initial point of contact with the company.
To get that one needs to buy a Honda? Just how does automation figure into what happens when the customer service interacts with the customer trying to resolve a problem?
Isn't quality control also part of insuring authorized dealers maintain the highest standards of service delivery? Does authorized dealer mean that the company just keeps hands off and does nothing to improve that?
Surely offering better training is also part of QC. Take the MG parts ordering system. How good is it, how fast reliable and is the follow through at high standards?
All these things translate into better service and with that comes increased customer satisfaction.
Funny how often it is said " they're Italians" or something similar as if Italians are somehow incapable of high standards. Seems like bigotry.
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Quality control extends to far more than the manufacture of the motorcycles, that would be the narrow view. QC affects all operations, not just the person shoving the tanknonto the bike without regard for the resistance that is caused by it hanging up on a control cable but so what, they'll deal with it when the customer complains later.
Quality control extends to things like how customer communications are handled, insuring the right parts are shipped to dealers who have tonface the customer when the right parts don't arrive or they arrive in obvious poor condition (not from transport damage) and other aspects of performance that eventually affects customers AND dealers who are the initial point of contact with the company.
To get that one needs to buy a Honda? Just how does automation figure into what happens when the customer service interacts with the customer trying to resolve a problem?
Isn't quality control also part of insuring authorized dealers maintain the highest standards of service delivery? Does authorized dealer mean that the company just keeps hands off and does nothing to improve that?
Surely offering better training is also part of QC. Take the MG parts ordering system. How good is it, how fast reliable and is the follow through at high standards?
All these things translate into better service and with that comes increased customer satisfaction.
Funny how often it is said " they're Italians" or something similar as if Italians are somehow incapable of high standards. Seems like bigotry.
Whenever I see a Guzzi it usually looks like it's holding up better cosmetically than similar Japanese products. Hell, I think they hold up at least as good as BMW's. Of course this is purely empirical on my part. Aren't we letting the teething problems on the 8v get the better of us with all this quality talk?
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I am not talented enough to phrase this properly, but I don't think it is bigotry to believe that there are cultural differences in races and nations and people. As a bicyclist I always thought that Fuji bicycles were flawless but Bianchi bicycles were works of art. Of course that is an assured generalization if looked at on a micro level, but at a macro level that is how I felt. I don't believe that motorcycles actually have souls, but I like my Italian bike because it is Italian so obviously I am a bigot because I believe that Italy has a different manufacturing culture than Japan. Now I better change my name and address and disappear from the grid. yikes!
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OK , a couple of you guys promised to ignore each other , guess that was a hollow promise :angry:
Dusty
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But you have to love this forum! No telling how far any thread might digress.
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Perhaps now would be appropriate for intermission:
In Heaven…
The mechanics are German, The chefs are French, The police are British, The lovers are Italian, And everything is organised by the Swiss.
In Hell…
The mechanics are French, The police are German, The chefs are British, The lovers are Swiss, And everything is organised by the Italians
Humour people! :grin: :grin: You can delete it if this is inappropriate, but I have to concur wholeheartedly with Swwords...
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Oh I'm gonna de... WAIT , damnit Paul , yeah humour , good job Swwords .
True hell would be if Americans were put in charge of food , can you imagine , nothing but fast food places with names like Burgers R Us , and , Well , this is sorta Pizza :laugh:
Dusty
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I am an Australian ex-Guzzi rider. I stil come here and read the posts as I have a soft spot for Guzzi and owned one for 14 years. I got the nod from my wife to purchase my first ever new bike. I wanted another Guzzi. The new California is not to my taste, to big and bulky and I don't like the tank cutouts. That is their choice to build a bike like that and I am fine with it but would have liked something like the old Jackal.
Since I was on a small block I was keen also on the v7. In Australia, Guzzi has a website and they will put you in contact with your local dealer. The dealer that I had used for parts had stopped selling new bikes (Tom at Don Newells, he was good to deal with). The website put me in contact with a dealer over 200 Km away. I spoke to the salesman and he was going on a three week holiday and was the only one at the dealer that new about Guzzi according to him. I could contact him in a month and he would try and sort something for me to have a look at a new bike.
I found out a different dealer was 50 Km away. It went to them and felt like I was intruding on the salesman valuable coffee time. He could not answer basic questions and as this was a multi brand dealer it felt like he was unhappy that a customer wanted to talk Guzzi. He could not supply the price of some of the accessories I was interested in and would get back to me next week. Next week never came. I was a cash buyer with no trade in.
I now ride a Triumph Bonneville that I purchased from Olives in Brisbane. Excellent service and one of the best business I have ever dealt with. I felt like I was a valued customer from when I walked in the door. They seemed happy that I was interested in there product. They are also a multi brand dealer. I have made one warranty claim. I went in on a Friday afternoon and they apologized that it woud not be submitted until Monday morning. One week later they rang to tell me the part was in and when did I want it fitted.
In short it became to hard to buy a Guzzi, they may be good but I should not have to beg to give them money. I am happy with the Bonneville but will probably always wonder what if.
Steve
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Isn't the idea behind this thread to come ideas on how to make the brand more successful? At least in the U.S. , it has to be a strong Dealer network? How will we get new buyers that might have some interest in MG to try the brand, if they have to travel hours to purchase one and then have it serviced? "Yeah, the bike I just bought from you last week for $15K won't start and they are some strange symbols on the display! Sure, I'll truck it down to you so you can have a look. You're only 3 hours away! "
The fact that many long time Guzzi owners are willing to do that, or do their own service on older bikes, just doesn't help the cause. I've bought 6 new Guzzi's in the past 12 years but probably won't buy new again because of the lack dealers less then 3 hours who will provide me warranty service. At this point I'd rather buy a used Guzzi at a significantly lower price and deal with local generic m/c repair shop and take my chances. At least the p/o I'm buying from has most likely sorted out the teething problems of the bike when it was new.
The problem with establishing a strong dealer network though is that MG won't support them like other manufacturers, won't pay the like other brands, and don't offer the same marketing support. Why would any respectable dealer put up with that unless it was just an add-on brand that is relegated to the back corner of the show room? Sound familiar?
Lastly, I agree with NP. In this day in age, there is absolutely no excuse for poor QC whether it's built by hand or by a robot. Wasn't there a time when "hand built" meant something?
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The dealer network is a chicken / egg situation. Moto Guzzi does not sell enough bikes in The USA to have dealers in every town. If they did that, there would be dealers out there who had never seen a Moto Guzzi. Would you trust a new dealer who had never worked on, much less seen any of the bikes.
Moto Guzzi is selling 700 +/- bikes per year in The USA. How many dealers do you think that volume can support? How many dealers can have hands-on knowledge of the machines with that low volume?
What Guzzi needs to do with the dealer network is focus on the big metro areas first. There are some glaring holes there. 4th largest city in The USA is Houston, and they just lost a long time dealer there. No replacement seems to be forthcoming.
Guzzi has the address of every new owner. It would be very easy to compile that info into a map, and work on developing the dealers where the current customers are concentrated, and working out from there. By developing the dealers, I mean support the existing dealers in those areas, not throwing additional dealers into markets that are already being served. The focus on new Guzzi dealers should be on markets that are not being served.
But, no matter what you want to believe, Guzzi is an exotic brand and will never have the saturation of Harley, Honda, Yamaha, etc. They just won't. Just like there are fewer Ferrari and Maserati dealers than there are Nissan and Acura dealers. If you own a Ferrari, Maserati, Bentley, Jaguar, Land Rover, etc., you have to expect to travel farther to a dealer than if you own a Ford, Chevrolet, Honda, Toyota...
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Or they could go in the opposite direction of more dealerships. If I were going to buy a Zero motorcycle or a SYM motorcycle or a Tesla automobile it would be a "mail order" purchase. Isn't there a SYM (or other Taiwan motorcycle) importer that sets up and ships their motorcycles to buyers for an amazingly low fee? Zero was going to have no problems shipping me a motorcycle. Sounds a little far fetched but when I was buying my MG I was thinking wouldn't it be great if I could get one from Amazon. For my cars I use an independent local mechanic that I have used for years and I have purchased a new car and never returned to the dealer for service and using an independent mechanic does not void the warranty ( at least not for a car). If I knew of a similar local trust worthy motorcycle mechanic I might do the same with my MG. Who needs a dealer anyway? Heck, maybe I should start my own mail order motorcycle sales business.
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The dealer network is a chicken / egg situation. Moto Guzzi does not sell enough bikes in The USA to have dealers in every town. If they did that, there would be dealers out there who had never seen a Moto Guzzi. Would you trust a new dealer who had never worked on, much less seen any of the bikes.
Moto Guzzi is selling 700 +/- bikes per year in The USA. How many dealers do you think that volume can support? How many dealers can have hands-on knowledge of the machines with that low volume?
What Guzzi needs to do with the dealer network is focus on the big metro areas first. There are some glaring holes there. 4th largest city in The USA is Houston, and they just lost a long time dealer there. No replacement seems to be forthcoming.
Guzzi has the address of every new owner. It would be very easy to compile that info into a map, and work on developing the dealers where the current customers are concentrated, and working out from there. By developing the dealers, I mean support the existing dealers in those areas, not throwing additional dealers into markets that are already being served. The focus on new Guzzi dealers should be on markets that are not being served.
But, no matter what you want to believe, Guzzi is an exotic brand and will never have the saturation of Harley, Honda, Yamaha, etc. They just won't. Just like there are fewer Ferrari and Maserati dealers than there are Nissan and Acura dealers. If you own a Ferrari, Maserati, Bentley, Jaguar, Land Rover, etc., you have to expect to travel farther to a dealer than if you own a Ford, Chevrolet, Honda, Toyota...
I agree! Nothing in Florida.
Did we lose MPH again?
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I think the dealer in Pensacola FL is excellent. Their showroom is worth visiting just to look at the classic motorcycles on display. They also sell BMWS and when I look at the new MGs and BMWs side by side in the showroom the MGs are better looking bikes and BMW has nothing to compare to or compete with the V7II IMO.
Maybe MG is exactly as successful as they care to be? Maybe instead of a Honda or GM model of success there is room for a more quaint business model of success? What is wrong with being a small factory by a lake satisfied with employeeing 300 or so workers, without an army of quality inspectors, or customer representatives, or excellent English translators. What is wrong with not being mainstream? Maybe the premises that selling more bikes means being more successful is faulty. Maybe the thread should incorporate ideas on what more successful means. It could mean how do you stay in business for 100 years without becoming too mainstream, then what should they do to become more successful?
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I think the dealer in Pensacola FL is excellent. Their showroom is worth visiting just to look at the classic motorcycles on display. They also sell BMWS and when I look at the new MGs and BMWs side by side in the showroom the MGs are better looking bikes and BMW has nothing to compare to or compete with the V7II IMO.
Maybe MG is exactly as successful as they care to be? Maybe instead of a Honda or GM model of success there is room for a more quaint business model of success? What is wrong with being a small factory by a lake satisfied with employeeing 300 or so workers, without an army of quality inspectors, or customer representatives, or excellent English translators. What is wrong with not being mainstream? Maybe the premises that selling more bikes means being more successful is faulty. Maybe the thread should incorporate ideas on what more successful means. It could mean how do you stay in business for 100 years without becoming too mainstream, then what should they do to become more successful?
A good example. Probably a great MG dealer, but 8 hrs away from those of us on the east coast!
Sure a botique manufacturer would be cool for us, but not an investor(s). That's why small companies get bought by big companies. You have to have access to capital to continue to do the R&D needed to stay current and remain competitive.
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I would say focus on simplifying and reducing maintenance, 12,000 mile maintenance schedule, hydraulic lifters so no valve adjustments, keep the drive shafts, keep the v-cylinders, lighter and brighter color options, flashing brake lights as standard, other safety improvements (?), other things to reduce weight and improve mpg and allow use of regular gas.
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Perhaps now would be appropriate for intermission:
In Heaven�
The mechanics are German, The chefs are French, The police are British, The lovers are Italian, And everything is organised by the Swiss.
In Hell�
The mechanics are French, The police are German, The chefs are British, The lovers are Swiss, And everything is organised by the Italians
Humour people! :grin: :grin: You can delete it if this is inappropriate, but I have to concur wholeheartedly with Swwords...
When I finally go to Hell, I might buy a Bugatti, move to Munich for the nice beer, take my Brittish mother for her nice cakes, get a Swiss Olympic Skiing girlfriend to teach me to some tricks and employ a banker from Lombardi Street to manage my assets. I'll ask myself daily, where did it all go wrong.
Edit:
The Saints amongst you may enjoy the idilic existance of driving a Trabant, eating moldy cheese and raw meat, contending with Tower Hamlets Special Police Officers, no sex before marriage and fill in Swiss tax return forms.
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4th largest city in The USA is Houston, and they just lost a long time dealer there. No replacement seems to be forthcoming.
Let me ask again, was that MPH?
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Let me ask again, was that MPH?
Yes. Sorry. I just tried to search up Mike's post, but it's been deleted.
MPH dropped Guzzi a month, or two ago. There was another post stating that the bikes were picked up and taken to the warehouse in DFW, rather than sent to another dealership in Houston, which leads all to believe that Guzzi has not yet secured a new dealership in Houston's metro.
Strange, since a few years ago another dealership near MPH in Houston fought (but lost) to get a Guzzi dealership...
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Too bad! What happened?
I know they threatened to drop the line quite a while ago, but turned it around. Sorry to hear this again. In my opinion they and MI were/are the best in the U.S.!
Its interesting that their website still talks about MG, and as of a week ago, there is a note about wanting used MG's and BMW's for consignment.
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Too bad! What happened?
I know they threatened to drop the line quite a while ago, but turned it around. Sorry to hear this again. In my opinion they and MI were/are the best in the U.S.!
Its interesting that their website still talks about MG, and as of a week ago, there is a note about wanting used MG's and BMW's for consignment.
I think Guzzi's expectations and usual issues dealing with them, plus Houston metro being particularly hurt by the drop in oil/gas prices combined to bring MPH's Guzzi dealership to an end.
MPH is still in business. Just not selling new Guzzis.
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Still an active service center for Guzzi's...just dropped off my Norge this morning to get the regular service and install a Wilber's rear shock.
Unfortunately Piaggio NA had unrealistic expectations and were too rigid in their demands is what I gather...makes it difficult to do business that way.
Keep supporting your local dealership!! :thumb: :thumb:
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Maybe MG could add the following:
. Improved supply chain timeliness for parts.
I hear you. I rang my local (singapore) Guzzi dealer asking for V7 tank badges and was told, "The spares guy is busy. Can he call you back?" I said ok. left my number and after 3 hours rang back. I spoke to someone who told me that it would take 3 months for the badges to arrive. I
I bought a set from AF1 Racing, online and they were delivered, (Cheaper than the Singapore Guzzi Dealers price) in about 10 days.
The lesson to be learned here is that you are better off buying parts online from AFI Racing, Harpers Moto Guzzi, TLM in the netherlands, Stein Dinse in germany or off ebay. They arrive quickly and usually at ag ood or better price than parts from the local Guzzi dealer.
I sincerely hope some Guzzi bigwig is reading this.
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Condense the thread into the salient points, draft a letter and get it signed.
Wait for it...
Can't
Won't
Wouldn't
Shouldn't
Impossible
Useless
Worthless
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Norge pilot
I have to ask.. what do you like/love about Moto Guzzi and their motorcycles ..??
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Norge pilot
I have to ask.. what do you like/love about Moto Guzzi and their motorcycles ..??
All the problems they have and the things they don't do???
"Running for the door!"... :grin: :grin: